The Official AVS Dish DTVPal DVR Topic! - Page 5 - AVS Forum
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post #121 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 05:22 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ccrider2 View Post

I might be off-base here, but I have a Sony SXRD, and it will only output PCM audio ....IRC. Might see if the Pal can send the audio as PCM and not Dolby.

Just a thought.

As already noted, the DTVPal DVR can send either DD or PCM, via a menu selection.

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post #122 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 05:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OhMyTVC15 View Post

Would be curious about the PQ if anyone out there is using an analog TV and the composite or coaxial outputs of the DVR...

The PQ should be as good as your analog TV is capable of displaying.

.

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Originally Posted by FRANK43 View Post

... The local CBS station just was bought by a new owner after bankruptcy so the don't even use PSIP.

The FCC requires them to use PSIP.
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post #123 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 05:43 PM
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I have been wanting this thing since it was introduced in the beginning of the year so as soon as it was up for pre-order I ordered it.
Hooked and set it all up downloaded the update, it was a fast download.
OH and mind had the batteries included.
This thing picks up the OTA HD signal better that my internal HD tuner on the TV does a much sharper and clearer picture quality.
And the Dolby sounds better too.
I am doing a test recording in HD now I have not played it back still recording.
I hope to be as happy with the PQ on the playback as I am with the live tv signal beautiful.
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post #124 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 05:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arxaw View Post

The PQ should be as good as your analog TV is capable of displaying.


I just know this thing is going to make me wanna go out and buy a new HDTV. Maybe Santa will be good to me this year. Nope, nothing that big under the tree. Merry Xmas
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post #125 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 05:54 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlhoppe View Post

Anyone have any idea what the "smart card" is for? I assume it's for future features. Network based features? Movie downloads?

I haven't hooked mine up yet, but will tonight. Just wondering if anyone tried removing the card to see what happens.

IDK either nothing on the manual about it, or what the USB will be used for either.

I don't know I removed it for a moment while watching TV nothing happened so I just slid it back in.
Wonder what its for
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post #126 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 05:55 PM
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Originally Posted by autobot View Post

I am doing a test recording in HD now I have not played it back still recording.

Can't you go back and start watching the program after it starts recording it?
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post #127 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 06:07 PM
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I set my to record a several half shows this afternoon (on PBS, one from the HD channel, the others from one of two SD sub-channels), plus some shows tonight. A few of these were 0:38 and 0:39 minutes recorded. It seams to be starting the recording earlier than it's suppose to. Any one else noticing this? I set my default options to 0 minutes early/late. Also both 8:00pm shows tonight started recording about 13 minutes early. Weird. (I did update mine to F202.)
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post #128 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 06:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arxaw View Post

Can't you go back and start watching the program after it starts recording it?

Yes you can.
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post #129 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nolim2873 View Post

I just tried what you asked because mine is currently recording two shows. I had to turn off the DTVPal (it was still recording, just the output was turned off), but once off, I could watch a third channel on the TV.

Or simply split your signal and send your antenna coax to both the DTVPal DVR and your TV, then you can watch TV on your television whenever you like, regardless of what the DTVPal is doing at the time. Just beware that this cuts your signal by more than half (due to loss) so be sure you either have plenty of signal or have added a preamp to establish your noise figure prior to the splitter. Otherwise, you may make your reception poor.

Also, I advise you to purchase one of the splitters which is rated for satellite operation up to 3000 MHz. While this bandwidth is not required for television, you will likely have less loss at the upper end of the TV band.

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post #130 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 06:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nolim2873 View Post

I set my to record a several half shows this afternoon (on PBS, one from the HD channel, the others from one of two SD sub-channels), plus some shows tonight. A few of these were 0:38 and 0:39 minutes recorded. It seams to be starting the recording earlier than it's suppose to. Any one else noticing this? I set my default options to 0 minutes early/late. Also both 8:00pm shows tonight started recording about 13 minutes early. Weird. (I did update mine to F202.)

Are you getting TVGOS data ? If not - I'll bet your local stations' PSIP time is not all in sync.

You CAN put antennas on your owned and/or controlled property...
http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html

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post #131 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 07:00 PM
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Ok, I just did the initialize and some channel surfing. I have it connected to a "virgin" HDMI input (all settings stock flame mode) and the PQ looks very good. I can imagine how nice it's going to look after I dial things in. Once I do that, I'll be able to do some A/B comparisons to my Sony.

Other observations; Very responsive (compared to the Sony). Easy to setup. Tuner is very sensitive. Menu system intuitive. Initial PSIP guide data loaded very fast and actually is pretty accurate (kudos to the local stations on that).

Haven't done any recording yet, nor have I scheduled any. The unit is currently turned off until tomorrow so the guide data will load. I will give it a more thorough "look-see" and give updates then.
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post #132 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 07:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nolim2873 View Post

Sorry, I was confused what you were asking. I thought you meant the output of the DTVPal through the coax - that will only give to SD on channel 3 or 4.

I just tried what you asked because mine is currently recording two shows. I had to turn off the DTVPal (it was still recording, just the output was turned off), but once off, I could watch a third channel on the TV.

The TV's ATSC tuner will not pick up the output from the DTVpal DVR (or the output of anything else for that matter). You would still need a separate connection from the DVR to the TV such as an HDMI or Component cable. You are best off just to split the signal and forget the coax output is even there.

The Coax output is basically for ancient TV's that don't have video jacks. Sometimes the coax out could be used to feed an SDTV in another room while only having to run one cable. You would still need to get an IR repeater to send the remote signal though.
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post #133 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 07:49 PM
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see what happens if you set for 1min early
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post #134 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 08:04 PM
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I have two questions on this unit:

1) Will it send the native resolution of broadcast? Or do you have to choose a resolution to send during setup? Or are you simply choosing the max resolution your TV can support?

2) You have to choose between PCM and DD for audio, right? If you choose DD, will it send whatever the broadcast is sending? Am I correct in thinking that not all stations send audio in DD?

Looks very promosing though!!!
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post #135 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 08:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arxaw View Post

Can't you go back and start watching the program after it starts recording it?

You can not just tune to the channel to go back and start watching from the beginning. You have to access it from 'My Recordings' to start watching it and it will continue to record the full program as you watch.
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post #136 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 08:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woody777 View Post

1) Will it send the native resolution of broadcast? Or do you have to choose a resolution to send during setup? Or are you simply choosing the max resolution your TV can support?

You have to choose the output format you want in the menu, and the unit converts all output to that format. The choices for HD are 720p or 1080i. Try both to see which looks best on your HDTV.

Quote:


2) You have to choose between PCM and DD for audio, right? If you choose DD, will it send whatever the broadcast is sending? Am I correct in thinking that not all stations send audio in DD?

No, all DTV stations use Dolby Digital audio, but it may not be full 5.1. DD audio can be anywhere from 1 to 6 channels, almost always either 2.0 or 5.1.

As already noted, the problem can be with the Dolby encoding hardware local stations use. If they get a 2.0 signal from the network and have the 5.1 flag set on the encoder, some audio processors (AV receiver, AV preamp, etc.) will only be able to deliver audio out of the 2 main left & right channels. When the DTVPal DVR is in PCM mode, it will allow the audio processor to use matrix decoding like ProLogic II or Circle Surround, for a simulated surround experence.

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post #137 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 08:48 PM
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I'm pretty much ready to order the DTVPal DVR. About the only reason I'm waiting is to get some early reviews on the picture quality.

Specifically (assuming you watch on an HDTV...and not an older analog TV):
1) Does the live picture quality coming through the DTVPAL DVR look pretty much as good (or fairly close to) the picture quality from the HDTV alone?

2) Does the recorded playback picture quality from the DTVPal DVR look pretty much as good (or fairly close to) the picture quality as a live broadcast? (Does there seem to be any degradation in the quality from being recorded and then played back?)

Any comments would be appreciated. Thanks.
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post #138 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken H View Post

You have to choose the output format you want in the menu, and the unit converts all output to that format. The choices for HD are 720p or 1080i. Try both to see which looks best on your HDTV.

No, all DTV stations use Dolby Digital audio, but it may not be full 5.1. DD audio can be anywhere from 1 to 6 channels, almost always either 2.0 or 5.1.

As already noted, the problem can be with the Dolby encoding hardware local stations use. If they get a 2.0 signal from the network and have the 5.1 flag set on the encoder, some audio processors (AV receiver, AV preamp, etc.) will only be able to deliver audio out of the 2 main left & right channels. When the DTVPal DVR is in PCM mode, it will allow the audio processor to use matrix decoding like ProLogic II or Circle Surround, for a simulated surround experence.

Thanks! Nobody broadcasts anything past 1080i, correct?
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post #139 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nolim2873 View Post

I set my to record a several half shows this afternoon (on PBS, one from the HD channel, the others from one of two SD sub-channels), plus some shows tonight. A few of these were 0:38 and 0:39 minutes recorded. It seams to be starting the recording earlier than it's suppose to. Any one else noticing this? I set my default options to 0 minutes early/late. Also both 8:00pm shows tonight started recording about 13 minutes early. Weird. (I did update mine to F202.)

Is the clock on the unit correct? Check it against your cell phone.
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post #140 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:08 PM
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I had the unit paused while on the phone and at 8:58 PM the dish logo comes on and then a guide update screen. The guide updated and the pal returned to live tv without any buffer to run back to where I was.
I have the time,zip and pacific zone configured right. I wasn't recording at the time so I don't know if it would stop the recording like it did last night.
Any thoughts or help? I checked the update default time and it is set for 1 AM.
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post #141 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthDallasGuy View Post

I'm pretty much ready to order the DTVPal DVR. About the only reason I'm waiting is to get some early reviews on the picture quality.

Specifically (assuming you watch on an HDTV...and not an older analog TV):
1) Does the live picture quality coming through the DTVPAL DVR look pretty much as good (or fairly close to) the picture quality from the HDTV alone?

2) Does the recorded playback picture quality from the DTVPal DVR look pretty much as good (or fairly close to) the picture quality as a live broadcast? (Does there seem to be any degradation in the quality from being recorded and then played back?)

Any comments would be appreciated. Thanks.

Haven't watched any recorded material yet other than pause and follow, but I'm a little concerned about something I'm seeing in the picture. During both monologues for Jay Leno and Dave Letterman, the decoration lights in the background (tree on Leno, and bridge on Letterman) were kind of flickering or pulsating in a seemingly random frequency. I was doing A/B tests to compare to the Sony and that was really standing out on the DTVPAL DVR. The Sony picture was rock solid. The pulsating almost seems like it coincides with audio spikes, but I can't be certain about that. In any case, it's not good. Otherwise the picture is clean and sharp. Very much on par with the Sony and the internal TV tuner (Toshiba DLP 1080p).

More to follow as I spend more time...
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post #142 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woody777 View Post

Thanks! Nobody broadcasts anything past 1080i, correct?

That correct's. ...And 1080"p" output is typically from BluRay players to TV's that can support it.
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post #143 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iwnt1 View Post

I had the unit paused while on the phone and at 8:58 PM the dish logo comes on and then a guide update screen. The guide updated and the pal returned to live tv without any buffer to run back to where I was.
I have the time,zip and pacific zone configured right. I wasn't recording at the time so I don't know if it would stop the recording like it did last night.
Any thoughts or help? I checked the update default time and it is set for 1 AM.

Same thing just happened to me. Strange. Hopefully it's not a common occurance. I was watching CBS at the time. I was thinking that maybe it recognized the guide data stream and had to reset to save the "host" channel. Obviously only a guess at this point.
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post #144 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:22 PM
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It happened again. I checked my recording program I forgot about and my 2hr Nova recording is now 3 separate recorded segments and I lost my short buffer. Bummer, I don't think there will be anybody at dish that can help. May be this is what they were disclaiming in their disclaimer.
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post #145 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by NorthDallasGuy View Post

I'm pretty much ready to order the DTVPal DVR. About the only reason I'm waiting is to get some early reviews on the picture quality.

Specifically (assuming you watch on an HDTV...and not an older analog TV):
1) Does the live picture quality coming through the DTVPAL DVR look pretty much as good (or fairly close to) the picture quality from the HDTV alone?

2) Does the recorded playback picture quality from the DTVPal DVR look pretty much as good (or fairly close to) the picture quality as a live broadcast? (Does there seem to be any degradation in the quality from being recorded and then played back?)

Any comments would be appreciated. Thanks.

1) My HD monitor does not have an internal tuner, so I can't answer directly, but how these compare will depend on the scaler & de-interlacing capbilities of the particular HDTV and what format conversions are being performed. I suspect any differences would be quite subtle.

2) As should be true for all DVRs when recording a digital source, there is no difference when playing back a recording vs. watching live.

Mark
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post #146 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by woody777 View Post

Thanks! Nobody broadcasts anything past 1080i, correct?

Not over-the-air DTV, no. Both Dish Network & DirecTV have 1080p HD PPV, along with Blu-ray.

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post #147 of 18294 Old 12-23-2008, 09:54 PM
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iwnt1, did you get the newest firmware by connecting to an ethernet cable? Maybe that would solve your problem??
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post #148 of 18294 Old 12-24-2008, 03:01 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iwnt1 View Post

I had the unit paused while on the phone and at 8:58 PM the dish logo comes on and then a guide update screen. The guide updated and the pal returned to live tv without any buffer to run back to where I was.
I have the time,zip and pacific zone configured right. I wasn't recording at the time so I don't know if it would stop the recording like it did last night.
Any thoughts or help? I checked the update default time and it is set for 1 AM.

I don't have the unit yet but am suppose to get it today. The DTVPal converter does this update guide crap as well (why it can't do it in the background is beyond me). I am thinking that once all these DVR units get TVGOS data, it won't have to do that update guide stuff anymore. But if you are only getting PSIP data then the update guide data will happen now and then. I'm speculating here so maybe someone with the actual unit can give better info. And i believe the update default time is for software updates, not guides. Again speculation. Have you done the update to f202?
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post #149 of 18294 Old 12-24-2008, 03:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dlhoppe View Post

Ok, I just did the initialize and some channel surfing. I have it connected to a "virgin" HDMI input (all settings stock flame mode) and the PQ looks very good. I can imagine how nice it's going to look after I dial things in. Once I do that, I'll be able to do some A/B comparisons to my Sony.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dlhoppe View Post

Haven't watched any recorded material yet other than pause and follow, but I'm a little concerned about something I'm seeing in the picture. During both monologues for Jay Leno and Dave Letterman, the decoration lights in the background (tree on Leno, and bridge on Letterman) were kind of flickering or pulsating in a seemingly random frequency. I was doing A/B tests to compare to the Sony and that was really standing out on the DTVPAL DVR. The Sony picture was rock solid. The pulsating almost seems like it coincides with audio spikes, but I can't be certain about that. In any case, it's not good. Otherwise the picture is clean and sharp. Very much on par with the Sony and the internal TV tuner (Toshiba DLP 1080p).

Thanks for the detailed testing!

A couple of thoughts on this:

1) Is your DTVPal DVR outputting the the same resolution that the stations were broadcasting? If not, that is the likely cause of the problem.
2) One test might be to swap the two HDMI inputs on the TV to see if that makes any difference.
3) Another test might be to try swapping the two HDMI cables to see if that has any effect.
4) If it's coincident with sound, I'm also wondering if muting might make any difference. (Muting on the DTVPal DVR, if possible, but maybe muting somewhere else, like the TV or amplifier, might also be worth trying.

Thoughts?

Reg
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post #150 of 18294 Old 12-24-2008, 05:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Scooper View Post

Are you getting TVGOS data ? If not - I'll bet your local stations' PSIP time is not all in sync.

Overnight it did not get TVGOS data, so I set it to the Alternate zip code for Baltimore, MD since that is the CBS station that I am receiving and it's suppose to have TVGOS data; and not my actual zip code, which is in the Harrisburg, PA DMA, but I am far from Harrisburg (I'm in PA, but close to the MD border).

If the PSIP time is not in sync than at least two stations are off (PBS and CW) by the exact amount of time (which appears 8 or 9 minutes).
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