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HDTV Recorders

JHBrandt's Avatar JHBrandt
03:04 PM Liked: 211
post #18241 of 18560
07-17-2014 | Posts: 2,003
Joined: Apr 2008
Anant, unfortunately I believe the answer is no. The TV and VCR buttons are hard-coded for those device types; AFAIK there's no way to program them to control Dish-type devices like the Pals But if anyone knows of a workaround, please post it; I'd be happy to be wrong about this

BTW I just noticed the new forum software interprets "# 1" as a Twitter-style hash tag. You can click on it to search for other "# 1's" Kind of neat, but they probably should have excluded # followed by an actual number from recognition as a hash tag.
happy2Lurk's Avatar happy2Lurk
03:38 PM Liked: 23
post #18242 of 18560
07-17-2014 | Posts: 129
Joined: Sep 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by bernieoc View Post
A question that has probably been answered - but hard to find.
I have three units each with external hard drive in a their dock.
Can I take a drive from one unit and put it in another unit - and have it think it belongs and access recordings in the normal manner?
Yes, as long as you follow the drive swap steps ...

--- To Swap Drives ---

1. Pal to standby / OFF - then unplug / kill power

2. turn dock - OFF / power down drive - allow for spin-down

3. swap drives

4. turn dock - ON

5. plug Pal in / power on - loading please wait screen, then going into standby screen

6. Power ON Pal with remote / ready for use
--------------------------------------

I messed-up once and the pal reformatted my drive.
happy2Lurk's Avatar happy2Lurk
04:03 PM Liked: 23
post #18243 of 18560
07-17-2014 | Posts: 129
Joined: Sep 2009
I was flipping between channels today, watching coverage of the downed plane. Around 1pm Pacific Time, ABC was black screen for 10 seconds or more before tuning in. I could see the HDD had no activity (external dock) until just before the picture appeared. Repeated this several times.

I then tried my Mediasonic HomeWorX HW150PVR - it tuned ABC quickly. Tried WMC using SiliconDust HDHomeRun Dual HDHR3-US - would not tune. My TV also would not tune ABC.

Used the, "Hdmomerun Signal Meter," to check signal - normal signal strength/Quality - but no channel or call letters.

Sent an email to the station and problem now corrected.

Not a pal issue but interesting that the cheap Hmwrx had no problem, while the pal tuned eventually - but HDHomeRun QuickTV and WMC would not tune at all.
bernieoc's Avatar bernieoc
04:23 PM Liked: 19
post #18244 of 18560
07-17-2014 | Posts: 191
Joined: Aug 2004
[QUOTE=happy2Lurk;25827361]Yes, as long as you follow the drive swap steps ...

--- To Swap Drives ---
Thanks for that warning
I am thinking of it for the rare times two tuners is limiting - I can have Kitchen or bedroom record the extra tuner show and later move it to main TV.
I see that the CM DVR+ has moved there hard drive back inside the unit - not sure I would prefer it that way. I am thinking being outside has been helping my units long life (I have them from day 1).
P Smith's Avatar P Smith
08:36 PM Liked: 135
post #18245 of 18560
07-17-2014 | Posts: 2,075
Joined: Apr 2003
it was inside from beginning of original HDT-610R model ... then US version [K77] came in two flavors: with 750 GB inside and current DVR+ with 16 GB internal NAND storage - did you follow that thread from beginning ?
"moved" ? sorta wishful action ...
ed_in_tx's Avatar ed_in_tx
08:39 AM Liked: 60
post #18246 of 18560
07-19-2014 | Posts: 1,063
Joined: May 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
it was inside from beginning of original HDT-610R model ... then US version [K77] came in two flavors: with 750 GB inside and current DVR+ with 16 GB internal NAND storage - did you follow that thread from beginning ?
"moved" ? sorta wishful action ...
What is a "K77"?
P Smith's Avatar P Smith
09:08 AM Liked: 135
post #18247 of 18560
07-19-2014 | Posts: 2,075
Joined: Apr 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by ed_in_tx View Post
What is a "K77"?
see appropriate thread [DVR+]
Chuck44's Avatar Chuck44
05:19 PM Liked: 44
post #18248 of 18560
07-23-2014 | Posts: 2,192
Joined: Feb 2007
I just purchased a new 1080P smart TV. All but two of my local channels are in 720P.
Anybody have thoughts on whether to set the Pal DVR for 720P or 1080i?

TIA
phildaant's Avatar phildaant
05:22 PM Liked: 128
post #18249 of 18560
07-23-2014 | Posts: 2,948
Joined: Nov 2005
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck44 View Post
I just purchased a new 1080P smart TV. All but two of my local channels are in 720P.
Anybody have thoughts on whether to set the Pal DVR for 720P or 1080i?

TIA
Not all stations are in 1080i. Some are 720p, some are 1080i, some are 480SD, etc.
P Smith's Avatar P Smith
05:41 PM Liked: 135
post #18250 of 18560
07-23-2014 | Posts: 2,075
Joined: Apr 2003
try both settings on both types, see if you'll notice any difference; choose what is better for your TV and your eyes
Chuck44's Avatar Chuck44
05:45 PM Liked: 44
post #18251 of 18560
07-23-2014 | Posts: 2,192
Joined: Feb 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by phildaant View Post
Not all stations are in 1080i. Some are 720p, some are 1080i, some are 480SD, etc.
Yes, I should have said only two of my stations are in 1080i.
Chuck44's Avatar Chuck44
05:47 PM Liked: 44
post #18252 of 18560
07-23-2014 | Posts: 2,192
Joined: Feb 2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
try both settings on both types, see if you'll notice any difference; choose what is better for your TV and your eyes
Yes, I've done that, and don't really see much, if any difference.
I just wondered if there is a technical reason to use one or the other.
P Smith's Avatar P Smith
06:08 PM Liked: 135
post #18253 of 18560
07-23-2014 | Posts: 2,075
Joined: Apr 2003
nope, I would set to 1080i... at least it match pixels of your TV
Aleron Ives's Avatar Aleron Ives
06:14 PM Liked: 442
post #18254 of 18560
07-23-2014 | Posts: 3,110
Joined: Oct 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by P Smith View Post
nope, I would set to 1080i... at least it match pixels of your TV
This would be my vote. If you set to output 1080, 720 channels will get upscaled, and 1080 channels will be shown unscaled. If you set it to 720, 720 channels will get sent to the TV as 720 and then the TV will upscale to 1080, while 1080 channels would get downscaled to 720, sent to the TV, and then upscaled back to 1080, which wouldn't make much sense. You should always output the maximum resolution your TV supports, assuming you don't have an "Auto" option (which is pretty rare for most DVRs).
Chuck44's Avatar Chuck44
07:23 PM Liked: 44
post #18255 of 18560
07-23-2014 | Posts: 2,192
Joined: Feb 2007
Thanks guys, for your advice. I set it to 1080.
Hankw69's Avatar Hankw69
01:21 PM Liked: 26
post #18256 of 18560
07-26-2014 | Posts: 33
Joined: Sep 2007
I was having similar issues with the unit locking up with pixelating video and audio drop outs. I had just seen a "hard drive error" message so I took the unit to work where I have access to an air compressor and gave it a good BJ... (pun intended) ;-) At home I disconnected the hard drive and noted the model number of the drive in case I wanted to upgrade/see if the drive was the cause of the problems. In reconnecting the drive, I made several connect/reconnects, reseating is a better word, of the SATA and power cable-both ends- to insure good electrical contact. I cleaned the fan blades and gently placed the cover back on the unit, not locking, just to keep the airflow moving left to right to keep things cool. I am now on the second day of operation after the cleaning/reseating and have not noticed any problems. I believe that my main issue was with a dirty SATA cable connection which would explain the pixel and freezing issue. Since all video/audio data is buffered thru the hard drive - enabling pausing of live tv, it kinda of made sense that my issue was a drive issue or bad connections. Hopefully the contact cleaning did the trick....
P Smith's Avatar P Smith
02:34 PM Liked: 135
post #18257 of 18560
07-26-2014 | Posts: 2,075
Joined: Apr 2003
No,it never been that way, no disk involvement into viewing on TV OUTPUTS.
Somebody weird guess become urban legend
Also, nil chance your SATA cable's external dirt influenced to pixelation, most likely it was overheating of components and ineffective dirty fan.
Hankw69's Avatar Hankw69
09:56 AM Liked: 26
post #18258 of 18560
07-27-2014 | Posts: 33
Joined: Sep 2007
1. READ CAREFULLY: SATA cable connections... NOT dirt on the cable EXTERIOR Give me a break.....
2. If I understand that the system memory is 128-256 Megs, In order to store up to an HOUR of video for pausing live tv. then system memory would have to be in the order of GIGS....
SO... NOW tell me again that the hard drive has NO utilization in delivering the video/audio we pause for any reason, including common sense breaks.....................
P Smith's Avatar P Smith
12:42 PM Liked: 135
post #18259 of 18560
07-27-2014 | Posts: 2,075
Joined: Apr 2003
well, then read the thread from beginning ... perhaps it will reveal to you something what you are concern
visualsensation's Avatar visualsensation
08:04 AM Liked: 11
post #18260 of 18560
07-28-2014 | Posts: 234
Joined: Mar 2008
My DTVPal has suddenly become a real headache. A few months ago it began receiving fringe channels, sometimes 20 at a time, which corrupted the timers and caused them all to skip. In order to get it to work again, I'd have to reset to factory defaults to clear out all of the channels, and then it would work again for a few days until it picked up all of the fringe channels again and skipped all timer recordings. I've reset it probably 7 times since the middle of May, and it seems the amount/frequency of fringe channels its picking up has finally decreased considerably. However, now it is often refusing to record anything unless I do a soft reboot. Even if I hit the record button while watching live TV, the red light will go on, then go off 5 seconds later without recording anything. The daily schedule shows "skipped" like any other missed timer. I've checked all of the diagnostics which show nothing out of the ordinary. Any suggestions?
Chuck44's Avatar Chuck44
09:23 AM Liked: 44
post #18261 of 18560
07-28-2014 | Posts: 2,192
Joined: Feb 2007
Try formatting the HDD.
P Smith's Avatar P Smith
11:41 AM Liked: 135
post #18262 of 18560
07-28-2014 | Posts: 2,075
Joined: Apr 2003
well, it would be harsh solution


I've seen same behavior here, perfect HDD, perfect signal, just the KQED not allow to start recording of current program, but next others will be recorded OK
sometimes it's a symptom of bad tuner (second)
Hankw69's Avatar Hankw69
03:52 PM Liked: 26
post #18263 of 18560
08-02-2014 | Posts: 33
Joined: Sep 2007
Update time..../ WITH CROW :-)
As I posted earlier of bad connections causing pixilation and freezing, apologies to P. Smith, the apparent fix of a connection issue was not the cause of these problems. Seemed that the time the unit was powered off for the re-seats let the unit cool to work. I have since then discovered some bad caps, not by a scientific test of actual measurement, but, buy that of some caps that were failed or in the process of failing by their bulging tops.... I ordered replacement caps form Newark.com (they have an excellent selection grid and have no minimum order requirement, my four were $8.50 including 2 day USPS priority shipping). Today they came in and have just been replaced. (Remember to check ALL caps, even the two that are UNDER the ~2" square metal shielding cover in the front left) (I replaced the two under this cover).... As of now the pal has been powered on over three hours and, cross my fingers) the unit is still up and running. I am with great hope that MY issues were with these four bad caps and time will tell. The other members issues may or may not be the result of a bad cap issue, but, in my case I am hopeful that this issue has been resolved. I will keep you'all updated as to the longevity of this apparent fix and maybe it will help others with similar issues caused by bad caps. P.S. If you find yourselves R&R'ing any bad parts, I have found that using a higher iron temperature for a shorter amount of time(~700 tip temp), works best, since the multi layered PC board likes to dissipate the de-soldering heat. AND be sure to use a "rosin containing wick" to help remove & clean the solder mounting holes. If you have a stubborn solder pad that won't clear, apply a bit more solder to help in the wicking process. I missed the features of my pal when it was down and maybe my thoughts of replacing with the DVR+ from Channel Master were picked up by my stubborn pal....
JHBrandt's Avatar JHBrandt
12:13 PM Liked: 211
post #18264 of 18560
08-04-2014 | Posts: 2,003
Joined: Apr 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by visualsensation View Post
My DTVPal has suddenly become a real headache. A few months ago it began receiving fringe channels, sometimes 20 at a time, which corrupted the timers and caused them all to skip. In order to get it to work again, I'd have to reset to factory defaults to clear out all of the channels, and then it would work again for a few days until it picked up all of the fringe channels again and skipped all timer recordings. I've reset it probably 7 times since the middle of May, and it seems the amount/frequency of fringe channels its picking up has finally decreased considerably. However, now it is often refusing to record anything unless I do a soft reboot. Even if I hit the record button while watching live TV, the red light will go on, then go off 5 seconds later without recording anything. The daily schedule shows "skipped" like any other missed timer. I've checked all of the diagnostics which show nothing out of the ordinary. Any suggestions?
On your current problem, I don't have a good answer. You might just be experiencing trouble with the HDD, which can be replaced; if not, though, you'll probably need to have someone like P Smith look at it.

But I would like to explain what was causing those "fringe" channels to appear and how to deal with them. It's an atmospheric phenomenon often called "tropo," which can bring in channels overnight from 100 miles away or more. Wikipedia says tropo is worst during the summer and fall, but it depends on where you live: for me, it's usually worst in the springtime, as you experienced.

A factory defaults reset is the wrong solution to this problem. This erases all memory of the fringe channels from the Pal, causing it to add them back again during the next tropo episode. A better solution is simply to delete the unwanted channels, but this doesn't always work: if a deleted channel isn't received for some time, the Pal will eventually "forget" about it; then during the next tropo episode, it once again gets added back.

The best known solution to banish fringe channels is to lock the system (menu option 3 then 1), choose an easy-to-remember password (I use 9999), then use menu option 3 then 4 to hide the fringe channels rather than deleting them. Select the fringe channels in order to lock them, and be sure to set the "hide locked channels" option to Yes. This will prevent them from reappearing, at least until another factory defaults reset or channel scan. (One drawback: you'll have to enter your password in order to protect or unprotect a recording.)
visualsensation's Avatar visualsensation
12:51 PM Liked: 11
post #18265 of 18560
08-04-2014 | Posts: 234
Joined: Mar 2008
Thanks for the suggestions. Formatting is out of the question right now due to the number of recordings. By experimentation, I have found that reset to factory defaults, followed by a soft reboot after configuration, followed by a daily soft reboot seems to be most reliable. Also, my problem is not with the fringe channels reappearing after I delete them. It seems like once the unit hits a certain threshold of (deleted + undeleted) channels in its memory (somewhere in the 100-150 range), it refuses to record any more timers, necessitating a reset to defaults to get the total number of (deleted + undeleted) channels in the memory back to a lower level. Probably something a firmware update would have addressed a loooooong time ago if they still cared.
JHBrandt's Avatar JHBrandt
09:23 AM Liked: 211
post #18266 of 18560
08-05-2014 | Posts: 2,003
Joined: Apr 2008
That may be a new, unreported bug. Over 100 subchannels? That's impressive (if it weren't causing you problems).

It sounds as if the Pal is storing so many channels it's actually running out of flash memory to store timers. Milwaukee may be an especially tough case because you'll get Chicago's stations and possibly others as well during tropo.

If that's the case, the only solution that comes to mind is to prevent the fringe channels from being received at all. Otherwise they'll take up memory even if you hide or delete them, and they'll eventually come back and fill up your memory again even after a factory defaults reset.

Not sure of the best way to do that, but a very directional antenna might help. Could you post a radar plot for your address from tvfool.com so we can all see what you're dealing with?
FRANK43's Avatar FRANK43
10:41 AM Liked: 14
post #18267 of 18560
08-05-2014 | Posts: 673
Joined: Mar 2006
I use a very small antenna (basically made it from an old antenna) have it in the attic, because I am so close to the Mexican border and picked them all up. That messed up the PSIP time. Still get all the major network stations plus some others I don't watch and my time is only off about 40 seconds early which actually is good since CBS always seems to start early.
Hankw69's Avatar Hankw69
05:42 PM Liked: 26
post #18268 of 18560
08-05-2014 | Posts: 33
Joined: Sep 2007
UPDATE ON FREEZING / PIXELATING....

After replacing the four electrolytic capacitors that had bulging tops, I am glad to report that their replacement DID SOLVE my problem of the title line.... The cap that was mounted under the front left metal shield was, I believe, the main culprit as this cap's job was to filter the power to the LSI (Large Scale Integration) chip.... As I do not have a schematic, (Would buy much beer for a copy), this chip has just short of a gazillion transistor equavalents under its hood. The functions of this massive chip would probably have been responsible for my issues. (NO, not the x wife issue :-)).... Anyway, I have attached a .txt file and if it does not "take" send me a PM and I will shoot you a parts listing of most(all) the caps used - WITH Newark p/n's , your welcome.... I am about to receive $19.73 (including shipping) of caps to rejuvenate this buddy I call PAL for another 8 years or so. Except for the mechanical parts of most any electronic gear, it is the vulnerable electrolytic caps that dry out and fail and most times they are the cause of the other component failures. For the parts, I have pasted the caps, most if not all with quantities below. I know, it is a mess, but, you'll get thru it.... (NOT meaning to "promote" Newark.com, but they really have their sh!t together with their selection grid AND NO minimum) Plus GREAT PRICES....... Beeee Gooood


NEWARK P/N Description Manufacturer Part Number Quantity Unit Price Line Total
23T5809 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 820UF, 20%, 6.3V" PANASONIC EEU-FC0J821L 1 USD 0.567 USD 0.57
25M9193 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 1200UF, 35V" PANASONIC EEU-FC1V122 1 USD 1.48 USD 1.48
23T5808 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 1200UF, 20%, 6.3V" PANASONIC EEU-FC0J122L 1 USD 0.497 USD 0.5
65R2740 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 2200UF, 10V" NICHICON UVR1A222MPD1TD 4 USD 0.198 USD 0.79
18M6640 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC 220UF, 25V" NICHICON UVR1E221MPD1TD 1 USD 0.299 USD 0.3
65R2750 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 470UF, 10V" NICHICON UVR1A471MED1TD 1 USD 0.336 USD 0.34
39T8647 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 330UF, 200V" RUBYCON 200KXW330MEFC18X30 1 USD 1.73 USD 1.73
23T5837 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 680UF, 20%, 50V" PANASONIC EEU-FC1H681L 1 USD 1.25 USD 1.25
23T5810 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 100UF, 20%, 10V" PANASONIC EEU-FC1A101S 14 USD 0.159 USD 2.23
17T5069 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 220UF, 20%, 10V" PANASONIC EEU-FC1A221S 3 USD 0.407 USD 1.22
23T5828 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 10UF, 20%, 50V" PANASONIC EEU-FC1H100L 3 USD 0.341 USD 1.02
69K8262 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC 68UF, 50V" ILLINOIS CAPACITOR 686KXM050M 1 USD 0.064 USD 0.06
55K2066 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC 100UF, 16V" NICHICON UVR1C101MDD1TD 1 USD 0.259 USD 0.26
23T5838 "CAPACITOR ALUM ELEC, 820UF, 20%, 50V" PANASONIC EEU-FC1H821L 1 USD 1.62 USD 1.62
Attached: PAL CAPS.txt (1.3 KB) 
Donald1800's Avatar Donald1800
11:53 PM Liked: 35
post #18269 of 18560
08-05-2014 | Posts: 167
Joined: Nov 2008
Much appreciated. Thank you.
Hankw69's Avatar Hankw69
01:18 PM Liked: 26
post #18270 of 18560
08-06-2014 | Posts: 33
Joined: Sep 2007
You are very welcome.... P.S. The pasted and .txt file has ALL the electrolytic caps used. I ordered ALL of them again, including the previous four I had replaced, just because I could....

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