The Official AVS TiVo "Series4" Premiere topic - Page 22 - AVS Forum
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post #631 of 3380 Old 10-05-2010, 08:37 PM
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Originally Posted by ncted View Post

Well, I have tried out 2 Premiers for the past week or so. I am generally happy running the SDUI. I have only had 1 freeze on a single unit. Comparatively, the Cisco 8640 from TWC refuses to record The Daily Show, is very non-intuitive, and is horribly sluggish. I will probably add a 3rd Tivo in the future and drop the Cisco box. I also plan to try out the Slider remote, primarily due to bluetooth. I'd rate the Tivo/TWC experience about as good as Dish Network with the 722 DVR. The 722 is a bit snappier when responding to input, but other than that, I prefer the Tivo.

Ted

According to some peeps at TCF or Tivo Community Forum, the slide remote is getting mixed reviews, some are having laggy response while others are having the time of their lives. I think your gonna like the new software released in the next few weeks and months, perhaps even to the point of HDUI. Let me know how everything goes.

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post #632 of 3380 Old 10-06-2010, 05:41 AM
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Has the program grid been updated with the new HD GUI yet?

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post #633 of 3380 Old 10-06-2010, 06:08 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dawn Gordon View Post

Has the program grid been updated with the new HD GUI yet?

Nope -- the overlays are still scaled SD.
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post #634 of 3380 Old 10-06-2010, 01:18 PM
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Not sure if this is old news but I hear Hulu+ will be popping up on premiere soon. I wonder if original hulu will be too. Also I don't think the guide will ever be in HD because of the fact that there are still some who aren't using a widescreen HDTV.

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post #635 of 3380 Old 10-06-2010, 11:42 PM
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The lack of a wide-screen guide is killing me. I recently upgraded to this from an LG DVR (that was built into the tv!) - its user interface was great.
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post #636 of 3380 Old 10-07-2010, 12:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caseybea View Post

The lack of a wide-screen guide is killing me. I recently upgraded to this from an LG DVR (that was built into the tv!) - its user interface was great.

Can I ask why its killing you?

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post #637 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 08:26 AM
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Because the Tivo is not making effective use of the screen's real estate.
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post #638 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 08:49 AM
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I agree, the guide is a major piece, it should've been one of the first things updated.
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post #639 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 08:55 AM
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So- a while back, I gave up on my old DVR. It was built into my LG television - but kept dying with power supply problems. Having had "enough", I opted to get a Tivo. (Note, this was a difficult decision for me, since I've been depending on free OTA guides for years). For other reasons, I finally decided to dive in. I was waffling between the Channelmaster HD DVR (aka "DTVPal DVR") and the Tivo.

My first impressions:
For what I primarily need it for (OTA recorder) - it seems to do very well. The two tuners is a huge bonus I didn't have before - and the season pass feature is quite handy. The internet access tie-in to manage my recording schedule is nifty.

MENUS: I'm a huge fan of good user interfaces-- here, the Premiere needs help. The "HD" menus really appear to be a mix of "hd" and "sd" menus. It certainly looks like they shoved in new interfaces into an old code base. It's a kludge at best. I'm hoping this gets addressed in future updates....

HDMI: Not ready for prime time. Specifically, if I use Netflix or Youtube, I don't get any audio 90% of the time. [lots of other threads about this topic, still unresolved]. I was forced to switch to connecting my tv with component inputs and set the HDMI aside - which solves the issue. A stupid and messy workaround. I have serious doubts this will ever get fixed.

REMOTE: As a new Tivo user, I am finding the lack of a "stop" or "back" (or "return") button annoying. I have found the "left" on the navigation pad does this mostly, but that's just silly.

SPEED: Why does the unit have a second processor core if it's not used? What a waste. I am certain the entire user experience would be snappier if they took advantage
of the processors. I am _assuming_ we'll see this in a future update...

As for the fees, I paid for the lifetime - so I'm definitely in this for the long haul, and am putting blind faith that TiVo updates will fix much above as we move forward!
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post #640 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 09:11 AM
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I think the reason why the second core isn't enabled is because of instability with the linux OS which was not forseen. A workaround to this is to use the SDUI which you will find much "snappier" in the meantime until the software is tested and updated, which is anyones guess.

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post #641 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 09:23 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caseybea View Post

REMOTE: As a new Tivo user, I am finding the lack of a "stop" or "back" (or "return") button annoying. I have found the "left" on the navigation pad does this mostly, but that's just silly.

This seems to throw most new users, but it's there in three flavors: the pause button "stops" the playback, the left goes back (as you noted) and the TiVo button at the top takes you to the main menu.

And don't forget the clear button for deleting too. I believe with TiVo, the concept of "stop" isn't really an accurate term for operating the device.
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post #642 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 09:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Wolf View Post

Casey, we're well aware of everything you've pointed out,...

Hi Mike,

First, I'd like to state how much I appreciate your knowledgeable postings, and professional perspective.

However, I would also like to respectfully ask that you refrain from deterring rookie TiVo owners from posting their observations as well. Many of us are very interested in accessing the overall user experience before pulling the trigger on these new Premiere TiVos. Redundant observations are very helpful for those of us trying to get a rough idea as to how pervasive the various problems are. For example, I have currently have the TiVo HD and I have problems with HDMI issues and I was hoping this would be resolved with the new models. It appears, at least for some owners, this problem persists.

Thanks.

Larry
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post #643 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 10:26 AM
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I don't know what HDMI issues people are referring to - I've never had any issues between two Tivos, two receivers, and two TVs - just in the living room alone.
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post #644 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 10:52 AM
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I haven't had one HDMI issue either.

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post #645 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 11:26 AM
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Neither have I, in fact, this is the first time I've even heard about HDMI problems with TiVos. It's probably the destination device that's causing any HDMI issues, not the TiVo.
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post #646 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 12:38 PM
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The HDMI issue to which I am referring to this this:

When accessing web-based videos from the Tivo (Netflix and/or Youtube) - there is a high probability that the audio channel will be silent. This is an issue as to how thw Tivo device presents (or encodes/decodes, however you want to call it) the HDMI audio channel - and the result is that it's either being refused by the TV, or not sent to to the TV in the first place. Either way, the result is the same.

it's been observed that when you're accessing web-based SD content, the chances of the no-audio behavior are higher.

It's been observed that "sometimes" in the above scenareo- the audio is fine. But more often than not, it's silent.

I note that when using the Tivo (HDMI) for ALL other purposes-- OTA broadcast reception, recorded show playback, etc-- I have absolutely no issue.

Thie above issue however, is enough of an HDMI deal-killer to make me rip out the HDMI and go with component cables. For a box that cost $300 and a lifetime subscription ($400) - I really expected better.
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post #647 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 12:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Wolf View Post

Casey, we're well aware of everything you've pointed out, especially the processor, as is TiVo. The reason why the second core isn't enabled is because of instability with the linux OS which was not forseen. A workaround to this is to use the SDUI which you will find much "snappier" in the meantime until the software is tested and updated, which is anyones guess.

The point of my post was to first offer my impressions, but also to point out that issues that have affected other users are affecting me as well. This is important for other people out there considering purchasing this unit.

Lastly, having to revert back to the SDUI is annoying. As in my previous post-- for the cost of this unit and subscription, this really should be working better. If I wanted to stick to the SDUI, I would have snagged an old TivoHD off of ebay.

I hope that the forthcoming updates address all this. I have to admit I'm a little disappointed in some of the issues.
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post #648 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 12:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caseybea View Post

Thie above issue however, is enough of an HDMI deal-killer to make me rip out the HDMI and go with component cables. For a box that cost $300 and a lifetime subscription ($400) - I really expected better.

I have 5 DVRs and I use Component Cables on ALL OF THEM.

WHY?

Because Channel Changes force a HDMI handshake.
Nothing is 1080p from Tivo and there is NO HD-AUDIO.

The QUALITY of video and audio will be the same and NO Headaches
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post #649 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 12:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

I have 5 DVRs and I use Component Cables on ALL OF THEM.

WHY?

Because Channel Changes force a HDMI handshake.
Nothing is 1080p from Tivo and there is NO HD-AUDIO.

The QUALITY of video and audio will be the same and NO Headaches

The Premiere is capable of 1080p though, and I wouldn't think some sort of content is too far off. you do Optical too I assume.
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post #650 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 12:48 PM
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Originally Posted by b_scott View Post

I don't know what HDMI issues people are referring to - I've never had any issues between two Tivos, two receivers, and two TVs - just in the living room alone.

Hi,

Admittedly HDMI issues have a lot of potential for confusion due to the added complexity of handshakes with other devices.

Perhaps Casey can also provide links to the threads that he mentions to get an idea of how widespread the issue is.

In addition, I did a quick search over at the TiVo Community Forums and found a thread that discusses what appears to be confirmed by Margret Schmidt at TiVo regarding an HDMI issue whereby the output format selection resets to a default when receivers connected to the TiVo are placed on standby or powered down. I believe TiVo is still working on the issue.

Video Outputs Don't Stick

Here's the same problem documented in the TiVo Help forum.

Tivo Forgets Video Output Format

Quote:


This error you are experiencing with the Premiere box is a known software problem that our developers are hard at work trying to fix. We hope to have it fixed within the next update or two. As of right now, we do not have a work around to resolve your issue.

100907-004636 is the reference number for this inquiry. Please refer to this number if you choose to contact us again regarding this request. In order to respond to this email, please log into your account at www.tivo.com/mysupport. Replies directly to this email will not be received.


Sincerely,
Jay

TiVo Customer Support Representative

Obviously, this is not the problem that Casey reported, but it does show that there are some documented problems that affect the HDMI outputs.

Larry
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post #651 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 12:50 PM
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ah yes. I've also heard of Slingbox users having that issue.
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post #652 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 02:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LarryChanin View Post

Hi,

Admittedly HDMI issues have a lot of potential for confusion due to the added complexity of handshakes with other devices.

Perhaps Casey can also provide links to the threads that he mentions to get an idea of how widespread the issue is.

Larry

Here's a few threads-- I'm sure there's more.

http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...d.php?t=412704
http://forums.tivo.com/pe/action/for...ie=x#e10434188
http://forums.tivo.com/pe/action/for...ie=x#e10473070
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post #653 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 02:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

I have 5 DVRs and I use Component Cables on ALL OF THEM.

WHY?

Because Channel Changes force a HDMI handshake.
Nothing is 1080p from Tivo and there is NO HD-AUDIO.

The QUALITY of video and audio will be the same and NO Headaches

True. But now I'm dealing with 5 cables to the back of my TV instead of 1.
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post #654 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 03:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caseybea View Post

The point of my post was to first offer my impressions, but also to point out that issues that have affected other users are affecting me as well. This is important for other people out there considering purchasing this unit.

Lastly, having to revert back to the SDUI is annoying. As in my previous post-- for the cost of this unit and subscription, this really should be working better. If I wanted to stick to the SDUI, I would have snagged an old TivoHD off of ebay.

I hope that the forthcoming updates address all this. I have to admit I'm a little disappointed in some of the issues.

oh sure, i wasn't trying to discourage you or anything, was simply trying to offer suggestions to help out I completely understand how you feel. I just see the benefits of the premiere are more then just the HD interface. I like to think of the half finished HD interface as something to look forward to? lol

CNET actually made a comment on their review that " ...it is, in many ways, a tale of two TiVos. Or, more specifically, two sets of prospective TiVo customers. TiVo newbies--those who have suffered with "generic" DVRs from their cable providers and are coming to a real TiVo for the first time--will find themselves getting an all-in-one digital box that's an easy-to-use and elegant gateway to a wide range of TV and online video and audio entertainment. Meanwhile, TiVo die-hards are likely to be disappointed: the TiVo Premiere is merely an evolutionary step-up from previous Series3 and TiVo HD models, not the sort of game-changing product that the original TiVo was. It adds an updated, high-def user interface, universal search option, and faster operation--and not too much else. " (copyright goes to CNET Networks)

Anyway I applogize if I upset you.

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post #655 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 03:30 PM
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Hey Larry, no problem, as I explained in my post to Casey, it wasn't my intention nor was I aware that I was doing that. Sorry I'll try to be more careful in the future

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post #656 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 03:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

I have 5 DVRs and I use Component Cables on ALL OF THEM.

WHY?

Because Channel Changes force a HDMI handshake.
Nothing is 1080p from Tivo and there is NO HD-AUDIO.

The QUALITY of video and audio will be the same and NO Headaches

I'm not sure what you ment that nothing from tivo was in 1080p, cause I read somewhere that amazon on demand had videos streaming at 1080p.
Aside from that I'm completely lost

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post #657 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 04:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mike Wolf View Post

I'm not sure what you ment that nothing from tivo was in 1080p, cause I read somewhere that amazon on demand had videos streaming at 1080p.
Aside from that I'm completely lost

NO TV is 1080p.

Streaming video is not HDCP compliant. It can't be.
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post #658 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 06:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drhankz View Post

NO TV is 1080p.

Streaming video is not HDCP compliant. It can't be.

I think you might be getting confused HDCP with DRM.
HDCP does not allow copying permitted by fair use laws. The system is meant to stop HDCP-encrypted content from being played on devices that do not support HDCP or which have been modified to copy HDCP content. Before sending data, a transmitting device checks that the receiver is authorized to receive it. If so, the transmitter encrypts the data to prevent eavesdropping as it flows to the receiver.

Digital rights management (DRM) is a generic term for access control technologies that can be used by hardware manufacturers, publishers, copyright holders and individuals to limit the usage of digital content and devices. The term is used to describe any technology that inhibits uses of digital content not desired or intended by the content provider. The term does not generally refer to other forms of copy protection which can be circumvented without modifying the file or device, such as serial numbers or keyfiles. It can also refer to restrictions associated with specific instances of digital works or devices. Digital rights management is used by companies such as Sony, Amazon, Apple Inc., Microsoft, AOL and the BBC.

I just got off the phone with amazons on demand tech support, and he confirmed that streaming the content is displayed at 720p but if you rent or purchase a video and it’s downloaded to the TiVo that the content is displayed at 1080p. Also he confirmed that the copyright protection is that you can’t transfer the video off the TiVo to another device.

I know that there is no broadcast channel with 1080p content, but what I was pointing out was that there are online sources that do.

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post #659 of 3380 Old 10-08-2010, 09:19 PM
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Update, I downloaded a few videos marked HD from Amazon's on demand and am currently watching them in 1080p at 24p and wow it looks great.

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post #660 of 3380 Old 10-09-2010, 11:55 AM
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The 2nd core issue is with Flash on the box, not the Linux OS. Linux has been SMP/multi-core enabled for many years now.

I have never seen an HDMI issue with Tivo, either with web-based video, Netflix, or TV. But I run both of mine straight to the TV with fixed 1080i output to keep from having the annoying delay on resolution changes (Tivo HDs, not Premieres).

People should be wary of folks that show up out of the blue and start posting a bunch of junk as if they were an expert. Anyone can google or call companies to see what's going on, but you're not always going to get a straight answer from a CSR, or any answer for that matter.
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