Mitsubishi HD-HM2000U & Firewire - Page 2 - AVS Forum
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post #31 of 87 Old 02-27-2011, 06:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by tabrech View Post
p.s. I currently do not subscribe to any DVR service. I just have a Comcast HD cable box.
What does this mean? It isn't a DVR? You can only watch Live TV?


Yes, only live TV. No DVR.

But that's a great lead on the Moto boxes...

I had a pretty good experience (described in a previous post) with Comcast that proved they indeed do not know dick about firewire.

I tried to record off a Motorola 6400 that said the firewire was "enabled=yes", "active=no" I followed the instructions for the 2000U and made a test recording onto D-VHS. But when I tried to play it back through the T165, there was nothing. Comcast has since replaced that box with a Pace model RGN-110 box... tried to record off it and it didn't work.

Some guys also told me the Mitsubishi won't work with a firewire cable boxes.
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post #32 of 87 Old 02-27-2011, 07:13 PM - Thread Starter
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For the outdoor antenna, I am on the top floor of a 5-story building that is only 2 miles north of the chicago transmitters. It seems like the signal should be strong enough for the Samsung T165.

I guess the only option is to try an bigger outdoor antenna if I want it to work.

Maybe the recommended Motorola DCH3416 will solve all my woes, and that shouldn't cost me anything more than a bit more annoyance with comcast, so I'll try that next.

If that doesn't work, I'll have to look into better antennas for the T165, but would rather take that antenna money and put it toward a JVC DT100 or LG LST 3410 at that point, and sell the T165.
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post #33 of 87 Old 02-27-2011, 07:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

I tried to record off a Motorola 6400 that said the firewire was "enabled=yes", "active=no"

That's the expected status. It'll work, provided that the DVHS VCR is tuned to the correct input (D-1, or D-2, or D-3, etc) and the 5c flag isn't set to Copy-Once or Copy-Never. (PC's and the Mits DVHS VCRs can't record Copy-Once material) active=no just means that it wasn't in use at that moment.

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Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

I followed the instructions for the 2000U and made a test recording onto D-VHS. But when I tried to play it back through the T165, there was nothing. Comcast has since replaced that box with a Pace model RGN-110 box... tried to record off it and it didn't work.

There's any number of mistakes that could have occurred here...You need to monitor the output of the firewire in realtime, to make sure that the DVHS is getting anything at all. Have one firewire cable going from the cable box to the DVHS VCR, and another firewire cable going from the DVHS VCR to the T165. Connect the T165 to your TV (tune the T165 to view the DVHS). This will let you know if a signal is reaching the DVHS.



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Some guys also told me the Mitsubishi won't work with a firewire cable boxes.

I've used the Mits 1100u quite a few times with my Motorola DCH3416. I can't recall if I've tried to use my Mits 2000u with my cable box, but I'd be really surprised if it didn't also work flawlessly (I'll try to run a test in the next day or so). The Mits DVHS VCR's are not 5c compliant, so you can only record material which is flagged Copy-Freely. The JVC DVHS VCR's are 5c compliant and let you record anything flagged Copy-Freely or Copy-Once.
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post #34 of 87 Old 02-28-2011, 06:43 PM - Thread Starter
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Are you saying that you are able to record off of your Motorola DHC3416 cable box using a Mitsubishi D-VHS?

I have contacted Comcast, and I have begun the process of obtaining a Motorola DCH3416...
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post #35 of 87 Old 02-28-2011, 06:46 PM - Thread Starter
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Once I get a box with firewire enabled, I will run that test of checking to see if the D-VHS is getting a signal in real time by connecting it to both the Comcast box and the T165.

If I only wanted to record NBC, FOX, CBS, and maybe ESPN, do I need to worry about the 5C flag?
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post #36 of 87 Old 02-28-2011, 07:50 PM - Thread Starter
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Another question related to John's earlier comment:

Do you control the Mitsubishi with your DCH3412? Or can you just control the DCH3412 box with its remote and the Mits with its remote?
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post #37 of 87 Old 02-28-2011, 08:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

Another question related to John's earlier comment:

Do you control the Mitsubishi with your DCH3412? Or can you just control the DCH3412 box with its remote and the Mits with its remote?

No control of the mits through the moto. Use the mits remote control.
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post #38 of 87 Old 02-28-2011, 08:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

Once I get a box with firewire enabled, I will run that test of checking to see if the D-VHS is getting a signal in real time by connecting it to both the Comcast box and the T165.

If I only wanted to record NBC, FOX, CBS, and maybe ESPN, do I need to worry about the 5C flag?

No except maybe ESPN, though it likely will be Copy Freely.
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post #39 of 87 Old 02-28-2011, 08:50 PM
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Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

Are you saying that you are able to record off of your Motorola DHC3416 cable box using a Mitsubishi D-VHS?

I have contacted Comcast, and I have begun the process of obtaining a Motorola DCH3416...

Yes, and my Mac Pro, and PC.
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post #40 of 87 Old 02-28-2011, 09:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

Are you saying that you are able to record off of your Motorola DHC3416 cable box using a Mitsubishi D-VHS?

Yes, that is exactly what I am saying.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

If I only wanted to record NBC, FOX, CBS, and maybe ESPN, do I need to worry about the 5C flag?

I doubt it, but you should check. You can type a code into the DCH3416 remote and have it display a bunch of stats about the current channel (Signal strength, 5c flag, etc). I'll have to look up how to do it and get back to you.

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Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

Another question related to John's earlier comment:
Do you control the Mitsubishi with your DCH3412? Or can you just control the DCH3412 box with its remote and the Mits with its remote?

I control the Mitsubishi DVHS using its remote, and the DCH3416 using the Motorola remote. It's just like using an old-school VCR: Have the DCH3416 playing the channel or DVR'd show that you want to record, make sure the Mitsubishi DVHS is tuned to the appropriate input (D-1, D-2, D-3, D-4, etc), and press "Rec" on the Mitsubishi DVHS.
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post #41 of 87 Old 02-28-2011, 10:47 PM - Thread Starter
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Dudes,

That is really encouraging news! That is the best news of the day. To make this Mitsubishi work like an old school VCR in HD is exactly what I've been trying to do this entire time!

I wonder why Comcast keeps telling me "no, no, no, you can't do that with our box." That's what they told me again tonight. I can't help but think their employees are trained to tell you No. In fact, Comcast pretty much has a monopoly in Chicago. There is U-verse, but not available to me and there is RCN, who I already had a horrible experience with. Back in the early 2000s, before DSL internet, I had a dial up modem with RCN with the same area code as my home phone number. They charged me per minute I was on the internet. I contested the bill but they wouldn't give me the benefit of the doubt, so I will NEVER give RCN another dime in my life. Direct TV is not available to me either. So it's pretty much Comcast or nothing. But so far their price hasn't been too bad I should confess. Their technical support has sucked though.

Anyway, I am going with the recommendation to obtain a DCH3416 box. I was able to verify that Comcast still uses all 4 of those boxes... DCH3412/3416 and DCT 6412/6416. "All" I have to do is go to one of their offices and turn in my existing box for a Motorola (and hope they have it)! I can't really pre-arrange it, because Comcast classifies their boxes as "HD" or not. An "HD" box can be one of several models... but I'll call the local office tomorrow and see if I can set it up in advance.

Thank you guys, I have hope again!
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post #42 of 87 Old 02-28-2011, 11:39 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

I wonder why Comcast keeps telling me "no, no, no, you can't do that with our box." That's what they told me again tonight. I can't help but think their employees are trained to tell you No.

I asked my cat a bunch of astrophysics questions today. All he said was "meow, meow, meow, purr, meow"

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Anyway, I am going with the recommendation to obtain a DCH3416 box. I was able to verify that Comcast still uses all 4 of those boxes... DCH3412/3416 and DCT 6412/6416. "All" I have to do is go to one of their offices and turn in my existing box for a Motorola (and hope they have it)! I can't really pre-arrange it, because Comcast classifies their boxes as "HD" or not. An "HD" box can be one of several models... but I'll call the local office tomorrow and see if I can set it up in advance.

I wouldn't bother trying to call in advance...I've never had luck with that. Just disconnect your current cable box and take it to any of the Comcast locations. If it's anything like here in Cali, there will be a machine in the front which dispenses tickets. Take your ticket (it has a number on it, such as B47) and pay attention to the "Now Serving" display...it'll let you know when you're up and which customer service window to go to.

It's actually a very painless process. I don't think I've ever had to wait for more than 45 minutes and I've always spent less than 5 minutes with the customer service rep (I've done this kind of a lot...I once exchanged 3 different DCH3416 within 2 days...I thought there was a physical defect with the box, but it turned out to be a firmware bug that impacted *all* DCH3416's...it's a long story).
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post #43 of 87 Old 03-01-2011, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by tabrech View Post

p.s. I currently do not subscribe to any DVR service. I just have a Comcast HD cable box.

The Samsung SIR T165, although it appears to be a crappy OTA receiver, does in fact allow me to playback D-VHS from my Mitsubishi 2000U via firewire. Unfortunately, the only channel I can record OTA through the T165 is ABC.

If I could go back and renew my fight with Comcast for a firewire enabled box, there may be hope for me. But short of spending $500 on a JVC D-VHS or LG LST 3410, I have pretty much tried everything I can think of.

I have a Samsung SIR-T165 and a couple of DVHS decks (which I am inclined to get rid of because I never use them anymore). You are correct that the T165 is not that great of a tuner. Its one of the earlier STB tuners available on the market. It doesn't handle any interference well at all. But it is one of the few devices that record/playback to/from DVHS decks. I also have a TV w/cablecard and firewire output/input that worked well until TWC decided to go to SDV and the TV Guide service stopped working. A shame.

Would have thought that firewire blu-ray recorders would have been here by now, but apparently everyone is happy with DVRs (until the HD crashes).
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post #44 of 87 Old 03-01-2011, 09:20 PM - Thread Starter
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I went to the Comcast office today to get a Motorola DCH3416. Of course, they didn't have it and they sent me home with a Motorola DCX3200.

I haven't had a chance to test it yet because I didn't have enough cables. For some reason, the Samsung T165 doesn't like the DVI cable I have so now I have to get some more cables... and learn how to access the menu for the DCX 3200...
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post #45 of 87 Old 03-01-2011, 09:48 PM
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I went to the Comcast office today to get a Motorola DCH3416. Of course, they didn't have it and they sent me home with a Motorola DCX3200.

I haven't had a chance to test it yet because I didn't have enough cables. For some reason, the Samsung T165 doesn't like the DVI cable I have so now I have to get some more cables... and learn how to access the menu for the DCX 3200...
My understanding is that the 3200 isn't a DVR. Other than that, it should be nearly identical to the 3416. If you want a 3416, take the 3200 back to a different Comcast office and get there when they open. Keep pestering them and eventually they'll make sure you get one just to get you out of their hair.

Is it really a DCX3200? I hope you meant DCH3200. It appears that all DCX boxes have completely broken firewire.
*The easiest way to tell whether the firewire will work is to look at the rear panel and count the number of firewire (IEEE 1394) ports. Cable boxes with 2 firewire ports will work, but cable boxes with only 1 firewire port will fail. Motorola has thus far not been able to code working firewire firmware for the 1-port cable boxes.

If your cable box has only 1 firewire IEEE1394 port, you will need to return it and get a unit with 2 ports. The DCT6412, DCT6416, DCH3412, and DCH3416 all have 2 firewire ports and will work. My understanding is that the DCH3200 also has 2 firewire ports and will also work (I have no first-hand experience with the DCH3200).
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post #46 of 87 Old 03-01-2011, 09:51 PM
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Would have thought that firewire blu-ray recorders would have been here by now, but apparently everyone is happy with DVRs (until the HD crashes).
No company is looking forward to getting sued out of existence by the Hollywood cartel. And some electronics companies are owned by parent companies that also own media companies and won't be designing such a device.

If Hollywood didn't put such pressure on companies (and if the licensing for Blu-ray were more reasonable), we'd see such devices on the market.
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post #47 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 09:01 AM - Thread Starter
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Yep, it failed alright. DCX3200, small black sleek looking box. Only 1 firewire port. Fail.

The menu said that the IEEE1394 was "Enabled = Yes" but when I hooked up to the Mitsubishi, the Mits didn't even recognize it. My next tuner will get me up to D-5. The Samsung T165 is D-4 and is the only tuner currently recognized. I will have to go back to Comcast - my favorite thing! But it will be worth it if and when I get this solved!

Thanks dude!
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post #48 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 10:29 AM
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Yep, it failed alright. DCX3200, small black sleek looking box. Only 1 firewire port. Fail.

The menu said that the IEEE1394 was "Enabled = Yes" but when I hooked up to the Mitsubishi, the Mits didn't even recognize it.
Well I thought it would at least recognize it...my understanding is that it should recognize the DCX but, as soon as you try recording, the DCX will freak out and start Fast-Forwarding the video and going all stuttery. But I've never used a DCX box myself; I'm just going on stuff I've read here.

*Update: That was the DCX3400 DVR cable box I was thinking of...of course there's no way for the 3200 to fast forward, as it isn't a DVR.
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post #49 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 10:40 AM - Thread Starter
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The DCH3416... is that a DVR box? I'm going in again today to try to get one.

But I don't subscribe to DVR service because I don't want to pay extra for it.

My goal is to use the D-VHS like an old school VCR recording cable TV in real time off the cable box via firewire.

The DCH3416 will work even if I don't subscribe to DVR service right?
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post #50 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by tabrech View Post
The DCH3416... is that a DVR box? I'm going in again today to try to get one.

But I don't subscribe to DVR service because I don't want to pay extra for it.

My goal is to use the D-VHS like an old school VCR recording cable TV in real time off the cable box via firewire.

The DCH3416 will work even if I don't subscribe to DVR service right?
I don't think they'll give you a DVR box unless you subscribe to the DVR service.
Yes, the DCH3416 is a DVR box. The non-DVR version is the DCH3200.

I have no hands-on experience with the DCH3200, but there are others here who record via firewire using the DCH3200.
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post #51 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 03:04 PM - Thread Starter
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Almost ready to test new setup.

I went into Comcast again today and spoke to the woman, and she is going to get me a Motorola DCH3416 from the warehouse, I should be receiving it tomorrow...
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post #52 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 05:32 PM
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I went into Comcast again today and spoke to the woman, and she is going to get me a Motorola DCH3416 from the warehouse, I should be receiving it tomorrow...

Cool, so they're willing to get you a DCH3416, despite the fact that you aren't going to subscribe to the DVR service?

I just finished testing my Mitsubishi HS-HD2000U with my Motorola DCH3416. It worked, but it was initially a bit picky. In order to get it to recognize the DCH3416, I had to power off the cable box and power-cycle the Mits DVHS. But once I did that, I was able to use the Mits DVHS remote control to tune to the d-1 input. I recorded my local PBS HD channel for about half an hour and then played it back, using the MPEG2 decoder in my JVC HM-DH30000U DVHS VCR (I used the Mits DVHS to actually play the tape back, but it has no MPEG2 decoder, so I had to use another Firewire cable to hook it to my JVC DVHS VCR). My JVC DVHS VCR was connected to my TV via Component video. I didn't bother with sound, as I only have 1 Toslink optical cable and was unwilling to disconnect it from my Hauppauge HD-PVR. I tuned my JVC DVHS VCR to what it calls the I-5 input (the Mits DVHS VCR) and it showed what I had recorded from PBS HD.

So when you hook this up, be patient. It may be a little fussy at first. Put your cable box into Standby before hooking the firewire cable to your Mits DVHS VCR. And power-cycle (don't just put it into Standby, remove the power cord) your Mits DVHS VCR if you're having trouble getting it to show the d-# input. One thing I did not need to do was power-cycle my DCH3416 (thankfully, as doing that would lose the TV Guide data).

*One thing that pleasantly surprised me was that I could not get my DCH3416 to reboot, even when I intentionally plugged and unplugged the firewire cable without first putting the DCH3416 into standby. I had heard that, like PC's, plugging or unplugging DVHS VCR's cause the cable box to crash (ever since the A28 update). This appears to be false. I even checked my firmware version and software version and nothing has changed in quite a few months.

This discovery makes me wonder if a Mac computer would cause the cable box to reboot. I kind of doubt that it would...I'm now thinking that whatever change went into the A28 update is irritated by something specific in the Windows driver. I still mostly blame the A28 update for it, b/c those Windows drivers haven't changed in several years and they worked trouble-free until the A28 update hit.
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post #53 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 07:26 PM
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Both the brand new Panny PV-HD1000 and the Mits HS-HD1100U arrived today, so tonight I get to play with these 2 new toys.
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post #54 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 07:38 PM
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Both the brand new Panny PV-HD1000 and the Mits HS-HD1100U arrived today, so tonight I get to play with these 2 new toys.

Cool! Please let us know what you think (Particularly your thoughts on the Panny, as I've never used it).
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post #55 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 07:53 PM
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Cool! Please let us know what you think (Particularly your thoughts on the Panny, as I've never used it).

Me neither. The panny showed up last sat on fleabay for 150 bucks NIB, and I jumped on it immediately. Made in japan 4/1999 and sat in a box for 11 years. They list Japanese Engineering on the top tag.

Tonight I ordered a Dune Duo. http://store.duneplayer.com/shop/category.aspx?catid=13
to supplement my Dune Base 3.0 for the other room.
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post #56 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 09:02 PM
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Just picked up a Mitsu HS-HD2000U on ebay and is en-route. My primary use is going to be using it as a really nice VHS/SVHS playback deck for DVD transfers (this unit has an excellent built-in TBC/DNR system), but its coming with 50 tapes worth of HD video. Problem is I don't have any Firewire enabled TVs around here. Has anyone tried this deck with Windows 7 x64 to see if the built in drivers work with this VCR? I know the cable boxes aren't working, but I can't find any info about DVHS VCRs.

Also if you want to record the Super Bowl, just get a $50 ATSC USB stick and use your computer.... alot less hassle and its a modern tuner. ATSC receivers improved ALOT since the Samsung SIR-T165 came out.
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post #57 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 09:47 PM
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Me neither. The panny showed up last sat on fleabay for 150 bucks NIB, and I jumped on it immediately. Made in japan 4/1999 and sat in a box for 11 years. They list Japanese Engineering on the top tag.

Good get!

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Tonight I ordered a Dune Duo. http://store.duneplayer.com/shop/category.aspx?catid=13
to supplement my Dune Base 3.0 for the other room.

I hadn't heard of that...I was checking out the specs and it sounds really cool! It sounds a lot like a TViX, but it looks much nicer/sturdy.
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post #58 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 10:00 PM
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Originally Posted by NJRoadfan View Post

Just picked up a Mitsu HS-HD2000U on ebay and is en-route. My primary use is going to be using it as a really nice VHS/SVHS playback deck for DVD transfers (this unit has an excellent built-in TBC/DNR system), but its coming with 50 tapes worth of HD video. Problem is I don't have any Firewire enabled TVs around here. Has anyone tried this deck with Windows 7 x64 to see if the built in drivers work with this VCR? I know the cable boxes aren't working, but I can't find any info about DVHS VCRs.

I have had no luck at this, but I've spent maybe 15 minutes screwing around with it. I'll have another crack at it, but I don't expect it to work.
I actually have been unable to even get 32-bit Windows to recognize my Mits 2000U (though no problems with my Mits 1100U)...The plug-and-play wouldn't even notice when I plugged it in. But, again, I wasn't really trying (it was unrelated to what I was testing at the time).

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Originally Posted by qz3fwd View Post

Also if you want to record the Super Bowl, just get a $50 ATSC USB stick and use your computer.... alot less hassle and its a modern tuner. ATSC receivers improved ALOT since the Samsung SIR-T165 came out.

This may not be a bad idea, assuming the recording is bit-for-bit identical to the broadcast, is unencrypted, and also assuming that it's able to pull in the signal reliably. I've never tried any of those devices, so I can't speak to their quality.
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post #59 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 10:07 PM - Thread Starter
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I just ran a test using the Motorola DCX3200 - FAIL

After power cycling the Mitsubishi, I was able to get it to "connect" to the Motorola DCX3200. I renumbered and it came up as D-2 Connecting Now. I followed the instructions on Page 12 of the Mits instruction manual and recorded about 2 minutes of ESPN in HD. Looked like it was working.

Then I connected the Mits to the Samsung T165. The T165 came up as D-3 Connecting Now. Using the T165 remote, I told the Mits to play the recording I made from the DCX3200. It did not work. I got nothing but a blank black screen.

Not only did I have a blank black screen, but the Mitsubishi VCR started freaking out. The D-VHS green light flashed on and off, and the display changed back and forth from D-VHS (with the green light on the left of the front panel lit up) to S-VHS (with the green D-VHS light on the left of the front panel off). Lights on the Mitsubishi front panel came on and off and the display was a blank black screen.

I think it's safe to conclude that recording from the Motorola DCX3200 via firewire was most unsuccessful.

Just to double check the Mitsubishi D-VHS, I went back and recorded some ABC from the T165, using the T165 to control the Mitsubishi. Worked like a charm. Therefore, there is nothing wrong with the Mitsubishi.

It definitely doesn't like it when I try to play a tape with crap on it from Comcast cable boxes though. The results from tonight were duplicated from a previous test using the Comcast Pace RCN-110 cable box. Followed Mitsubishi Owner's manual instructions for recording from a IEEE 1394 enabled set top box that does NOT control the Mitsubishi, try to play recording through Samsung T165, blank black screen and the Mitsubishi lights start flashing on and off. Consistency.

Man, I hope that friggin DCH3416 works. If it doesn't, you guys are going to find a Mitsubishi 2000U and a Samsung T165 on eBay. To get the DCH3416, I am going to subscribe to DVR service. It is an extra $8 a month, which is nothing after all the time and effort I have invested into this. I don't think they will give me the box without subscribing to DVR. They asked me if I wanted that particular box in order to record, and I answered "YES." I will figure out the rest after I get the box in my possession and run my final test... Man oh man.
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post #60 of 87 Old 03-02-2011, 10:12 PM - Thread Starter
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Followed Mitsubishi instructions for recording on Page 26, not page 12.
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