Channel Master TV CM 7400 HD DVR - OTA, Clear QAM, Internet Content - Page 10 - AVS Forum
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post #271 of 1996 Old 11-19-2011, 10:23 AM
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Originally Posted by dclark View Post

I am on day four with my $99 Tivo Premiere. Got it with the $10 a month for service promotion.
I was surprised by the quality of the ota performance as my DISH box ota, Samsung tv ota tuners would glitch when it would get windy (and my old Direct TV 10-250 would be unwatchable).
If you didn't hear the news, the city near me, Reno, NV, was hit with 40mph + winds with gusts up 80mph and had a huge fire that took out 20 houses.
My Tivo gave flawless, glitch free ota reception.
Now, why am I talking up the TIVO? Because i looked into and researched the CM box. If it had the same streaming abilities (c'mon, it shouldn't be that hard to let it get HULU and Netflix!) as the Tivo Premiere,I would have waited for the CM. The other unknown is the quality of the ota in the CM box. If any CM marketing people should wonder why the box didn't sell and see this post, give the next version of it Hulu, Netflix, and a few others and you just might sell me (and others) a box.

I guess you won't be waiting for the first units to ship.

OTA? Is that Other Than Acceptable? Just kidding. Why is there a 7400? To replace the 7000, or offer us cable people a piece of the action? Who knows? But there shouldn't be a monthly fee. At least I hope not. You never know. When it ships we will know. Until then it is one big guess.

My Blu-ray and TV get Hulu+ and Netflix but not VUDU. My AVR gets Pandora and IP radio, but not HULU or VUDU. It's a mixed up crazy world.
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post #272 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 07:30 AM
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Why are you waiting for one to ship, when you just saw a positive post for a far superior box that will not cost you much more? Remember that Tivo will let you transfer shows to a PC, the CM will not. Some people really care about this.
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post #273 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 07:53 AM
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Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

Why are you waiting for one to ship, when you just saw a positive post for a far superior box that will not cost you much more? Remember that Tivo will let you transfer shows to a PC, the CM will not. Some people really care about this.

It's a choice. If I could avoid cable I would drop it. But Tivo doesn't work without a cable card since raw QAM varies by zipcode. Perhaps in the future I will move back to a major metro area and go back to OTA. Then I will decide if I should look at different options. I would love to have a Tivo or Moxi or HTPC, but nothing beats free. Who knows, the 7400 may turn out to be a really bad idea for cable. I have eight DVR units now, five active. The 7400 is a toy I haven't had time to play with yet. I like new stuff. Sometimes there is a happy ending, sometimes not so much.
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post #274 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 09:16 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

It's a choice. If I could avoid cable I would drop it. But Tivo doesn't work without a cable card since raw QAM varies by zipcode. Perhaps in the future I will move back to a major metro area and go back to OTA. Then I will decide if I should look at different options.

If you don't live in an area where ota is practical, then there is little point of even considering the CM. Afterall, isn't its biggest draw the ability to record ota with a limited guide so you don't have to pay fees?
Another feature that tivo has (haven't tried it yet) is the ability to send its programming to a laptop/phone. I know some will say "why would you want to watch tv on an iphone?" but next month we travel, I welcome being able to watch stuff while I sit in airports.In fact, if I was so inclined, I could use the free wifi on the beach in Barbados to watch the local news (I'll be there next month).
For value ( isn't that the reason why one would want a fee free box like the CM?), the cost of running a CM and a Tivo premiere (assuming you go the $10 a month plan) are the same for the first 2.5 years of ownership. Only until that point is reached, will you start to see savings and these savings could be a wash if the unit craps out. In television, two years for anything is pretty old. Tivo gives the savings up front, with far, far better service and features tossed into the bargain.
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post #275 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 09:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dclark View Post

If you don't live in an area where ota is practical, then there is little point of even considering the CM. Afterall, isn't its biggest draw the ability to record ota with a limited guide so you don't have to pay fees?

Well, if CM is right and the 7400 has a clear QAM tuner, I should get 120+ digital channels which includes 12 in HD/DD5.1. I get that now with my Sony TV and DHG DVR. I tend to time shift seasons, and the Sony isn't expandable but has a great HD ability. For basic digital cable SD, like USA & TNT, I use a Magnavox 515H. I never record analog/vsb even though I get 26 channels.

The CM-7400 doesn't mention NTSC, so assume it can't tune it. But what does the rf output supply? Either passive pass through or slaved channel 3/4? They don't cover that in the docs. I'm betting a slaved channel 3/4 since the quick setup manual shows how to connect it. Speculation.

No, OTA is not an option. People here have cable or satellite. Since my small cable company is pretty nice, those who have gone dish usually switch back.
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post #276 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 03:45 PM
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Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

It's a choice. If I could avoid cable I would drop it. But Tivo doesn't work without a cable card since raw QAM varies by zipcode.

Well, since you are willing to throw away the money, I'll be curious to read your report. It will be interesting to see if the CM-7400 is more than just a CM-7000 with the QAM tuner enabled and some new firmware. I know you want to use it for cable, but does your cable co even transmit PSIP? Many (most) don't because they have no use for it. Let's hope you don't have the funai problem of morphing QAM channel numbers every time the cable co gets an itch to rearrange things. And let's also hope that the state of firmware at release is not comparable to the release state of the CM-7000 when it was the Pal DVR.

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post #277 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 03:58 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

Why are you waiting for one to ship, when you just saw a positive post for a far superior box that will not cost you much more? Remember that Tivo will let you transfer shows to a PC, the CM will not. Some people really care about this.

A feature like that is especially useful for people that like to time-shift entire seasons. There is just too much to watch during the regular season -- unless you are a devoted couch potato -- to keep up with all the shows of interest. I also find that time-shifting a season has saved me from wasting time getting invested in a new series that gets canceled after 6 or so episodes.

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post #278 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 04:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

Well, since you are willing to throw away the money, I'll be curious to read your report. It will be interesting to see if the CM-7400 is more than just a CM-7000 with the QAM tuner enabled and some new firmware. I know you want to use it for cable, but does your cable co even transmit PSIP? Many (most) don't because they have no use for it. Let's hope you don't have the funai problem of morphing QAM channel numbers every time the cable co gets an itch to rearrange things. And let's also hope that the state of firmware at release is not comparable to the release state of the CM-7000 when it was the Pal DVR.

Sorry, no PSIP here. Sometimes I think some SCTE-127 squeeks in to mess with me. I also hope it's more than a 7000 with a QAM tuner. However, I have zero experience with the 7000, so that's not a really fair statement. Comparisons between any two items can be tricky.

My cable feed is pretty good right now, but that is subject to change without notice. My 515H handles some channels differently than my Sony TV and DVR, but it's a constant that I can live with.

I know that any guide will be a waste of time for me unless it comes from the internet, and then I doubt I can get more than an accurate clock. Raw QAM (no cable card) means no point and shoot recording. I am used to that with the DHG. I don't mind slumming it a little. The BV-980H is/was really bad. I expect better from CM.
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post #279 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 04:49 PM
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Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

Sorry, no PSIP here.

If no PSIP, then no guide at all. You will have to set recordings manually -- can they be titled? And I wonder about setting the clock. The time usually comes from PSIP. Unless there is the ability for manual setting, the unit will be a brick. Good luck, make sure you can return it.

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post #280 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 05:01 PM
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Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

If no PSIP, then no guide at all. You will have to set recordings manually -- can they be titled? And I wonder about setting the clock. The time usually comes from PSIP. Unless there is the ability for manual setting, the unit will be a brick. Good luck, make sure you can return it.

Many questions. There is a reference to manual recordings in the user manual, and manual clock settings. I'm ok with manual recordings and schedules. It would be nice if Walmart sells the unit since they have a great return policy.

Should I lose TVGOS, I will have four bricks. With the 7400 my worst case should require me spending the $50 for an advanced internet guide to get a clock. I hope it doesn't come to that.

Does the CM-7000 let you set the clock manually?
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post #281 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 05:33 PM
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Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

Does the CM-7000 let you set the clock manually?

Only until it acquires the time from TVGOS. Once it does you cannot manually set the time.
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post #282 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 05:46 PM
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Only until it acquires the time from TVGOS. Once it does you cannot manually set the time.

I see. My TVGOS data is injected into an NTSC/analog channel, and the CM-7000 and CM-7400 don't know analog (I think). This should be interesting.

As for naming titles, I'm used to using date, time and channel with the DHG. All my recording are manual. I'm used to it. The 515H is great, but not HD. I love them both.

Let me clarify why I bother with the CM-7400. It has internet connectivity. It has external expansion. It has me curious, so their marketing people did their job. It's really just that simple. If it works.
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post #283 of 1996 Old 11-20-2011, 11:53 PM
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I have never used guide based reocrdings. I am perfectly content to set time and channel in the VCR-like manner. That is the way my 513 works. The only reason I would want a 7400 is for the ability to record in HD. And also the fact that I will likely fill up the hard drive on my 513 by early 2013, unless Scripps takes The Cool Tv off of KERO.

How can we say "the digital transition is complete" when thousands of low power stations are still broadcasting in analog?
LOW POWER ANALOG NEEDS TO DIE NOW!!!
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post #284 of 1996 Old 11-21-2011, 05:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Desert Hawk View Post

I have never used guide based reocrdings. I am perfectly content to set time and channel in the VCR-like manner. That is the way my 513 works. The only reason I would want a 7400 is for the ability to record in HD. And also the fact that I will likely fill up the hard drive on my 513 by early 2013, unless Scripps takes The Cool Tv off of KERO.

You're in good shape. By 2013 you can buy another 513H or buy another HDD. The 7400 should be a known item and either be an eBay memory or have a dozen firmware updates. We live in interesting times.
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post #285 of 1996 Old 11-21-2011, 08:14 AM
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How much does your cableCo charge for a Cablecard every month?

Even if all you want is clear QAM, an HTPC would be a much better choice than the CM. No guide fees, tons more features, etc. You do know that a Tivo can act as a manual recorder for clear QAM channels just like the CM, right?
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post #286 of 1996 Old 11-21-2011, 08:59 AM
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Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

How much does your cableCo charge for a Cablecard every month?

Even if all you want is clear QAM, an HTPC would be a much better choice than the CM. No guide fees, tons more features, etc. You do know that a Tivo can act as a manual recorder for clear QAM channels just like the CM, right?

Four cable card devices at $3 each. I don't wan't another PC. I have a desktop with XP and a laptop which was Vista and I changed it to Win7. I have dipped my toe in the water with a Hauppage 950, 950Q, and 1950.

I was unaware that a Tivo could do manual recordings and not require a cable card. All those ads saying "service required" are wrong? A guide without a cable card is less useful than going to tvguide.com and titantv.com, which I use to see what is new. TitanTV even permits mapping my clear QAM channel numbers. Since 99% of my viewing is on 12 channels, a guide is low on my priority list. I like it, but I don't need it.

So, I should go over to eBay, find a used Tivo, and it will work? Any special model? WiFi would be nice. All my newer stuff is networked.
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post #287 of 1996 Old 11-21-2011, 10:55 AM
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Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

Four cable card devices at $3 each. I don't wan't another PC. I have a desktop with XP and a laptop which was Vista and I changed it to Win7. I have dipped my toe in the water with a Hauppage 950, 950Q, and 1950.

I was unaware that a Tivo could do manual recordings and not require a cable card. All those ads saying "service required" are wrong? A guide without a cable card is less useful than going to tvguide.com and titantv.com, which I use to see what is new. TitanTV even permits mapping my clear QAM channel numbers. Since 99% of my viewing is on 12 channels, a guide is low on my priority list. I like it, but I don't need it.

So, I should go over to eBay, find a used Tivo, and it will work? Any special model? WiFi would be nice. All my newer stuff is networked.

TiVo service (monthly or lifetime) is required for a TiVo to record anything (or stream Internet content or transfer content between TiVos on your LAN), period. A TiVo requires a cable card only to translate channel numbers to match those in the guide. If you don't mind recording everything by specifying a channel number and start/stop times, you should be able to limp along without a cable card, but you would be paying for TiVo's guide service and then not using it. If you don't intend to use TiVo's guide, it makes more sense to get the Channel Master.
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post #288 of 1996 Old 11-21-2011, 11:37 AM
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Originally Posted by L David Matheny View Post

TiVo service (monthly or lifetime) is required for a TiVo to record anything (or stream Internet content or transfer content between TiVos on your LAN), period. A TiVo requires a cable card only to translate channel numbers to match those in the guide. If you don't mind recording everything by specifying a channel number and start/stop times, you should be able to limp along without a cable card, but you would be paying for TiVo's guide service and then not using it. If you don't intend to use TiVo's guide, it makes more sense to get the Channel Master.

Thank you. Perfect explanation.
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post #289 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 06:12 AM
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But if your cableCo only charges $3/mo. for a card, I still don't see why you don't get a Tivo and use Cablecard. That's a cheap rental compared to many systems.
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post #290 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 06:15 AM
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Originally Posted by L David Matheny View Post

TiVo service (monthly or lifetime) is required for a TiVo to record anything (or stream Internet content or transfer content between TiVos on your LAN), period. A TiVo requires a cable card only to translate channel numbers to match those in the guide. If you don't mind recording everything by specifying a channel number and start/stop times, you should be able to limp along without a cable card, but you would be paying for TiVo's guide service and then not using it. If you don't intend to use TiVo's guide, it makes more sense to get the Channel Master.

True, but you can pick up used Tivo HDs w/lifetime service for $350 or so on fleabay, and still have a much better box than the CM will ever be. With no yearly fees.
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post #291 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 06:46 AM
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Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

But if your cableCo only charges $3/mo. for a card, I still don't see why you don't get a Tivo and use Cablecard. That's a cheap rental compared to many systems.

I might. If the CM-7400 sucks and I lose TVGOS and it's less than the HD DVR from my cable company. I'll see how that goes.

"CM will ever be"?
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post #292 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 08:08 AM
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One would hope that CM will update firmware to fix the inevitable bugs and add something other than Vudu (e.g., Netflix), that's all.
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post #293 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

True, but you can pick up used Tivo HDs w/lifetime service for $350 or so on fleabay, and still have a much better box than the CM will ever be. With no yearly fees.

I agree completely. I have a TiVo HD and a Premiere, both with lifetime service. I don't need a cable card (or cable service) because I'm OTA only.
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post #294 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 09:43 AM
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Originally Posted by slowbiscuit View Post

One would hope that CM will update firmware to fix the inevitable bugs and add something other than Vudu (e.g., Netflix), that's all.

I hope so too. I already have Pandora, Hulu+, Amazon & Netflix. I may not even go for the CM-7400 until I see a firmware update. It's a trust issue. Nobody releases a perfect product. Not even .....
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post #295 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 11:10 AM
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I can't think of anyone in recent times who has ever "fixed" them entirely, other than TiVo, at least up through the HD.
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post #296 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 11:27 AM
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I can't think of anyone in recent times who has ever "fixed" them eventually, other than TiVo, at least up through the HD.

I'm not sure if I understand. But in the loss column I put the LG LST-3410a and BV-980H. In the win column I put the Sony DHG-HDD250/500. The LST-3410a doesn't like my V8 TVGOS and the Sony needs my V8 TVGOS. To give it props, the BV-980H did make me learn about how the content can affect storage. I never noticed that before.
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post #297 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 11:51 AM
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One would hope that CM will update firmware to fix the inevitable bugs and add something . . .

Yes, just like they did for the CM-7000 . . .

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post #298 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 12:45 PM
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Yes, just like they did for the CM-7000 . . .

. . . or the Pal, or the Brite-view.

I wasn't even referring to older models like the LG and Sony. Just the newer, cheaper-made models.

But as far as those two, I'd reverse that, for the general population of owners. The Sony is nothing but headaches for many now, and completely worthless for others (and also, if you have the very first software version, it can't be upgraded to handle four QAM numbers) - even if the unit itself works fine, the digital TVGOS signal is often spotty or dodgy - but at least the LG has manual time and timer setting, and can still dependably be used that way.
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post #299 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 01:11 PM
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. . . or the Pal, or the Brite-view.

I wasn't even referring to older models like the LG and Sony. Just the newer, cheaper-made models.

But as far as those two, I'd reverse that, for the general population of owners. The Sony is nothing but headaches for many now (and also, I have the first software version, which can't be upgraded to handle four QAM numbers), and at least the LG has manual time and timer setting, and can still dependably be used that way.

I only included "HD" because that was in your post. I don't know of any other fee-free HD DVR units. As for being current, yes, even though I would consider an active used market still a market. I cut the cap on my LST and only put it in the box when I got a good price on a DHG. Last week eight were sold on eBay.

I'm lucky to have a good TVGOS signal and almost everything on clear QAM. It is sad that a channel over 1023 is off the grid. Since I record only manual raw QAM, that's not an issue for me. I can't wait to see what the CM-7400 thinks about my cable signal. My Fox HD is 107.1301 at 720p. Will it keep all four decimal places or just use the last one or two like the Mag 515H? I'll have to wait. Waiting is hard.

I find it awesome that an item nobody has used or held has over 300 posts. You can buy the BV-980H for $200 and it doesn't have that many posts.

When I bought my Sony TV and Blu-ray, they needed an update for Hulu+ and 3D. My Yamaha AVR needed an update to get Pandora. No updates for the Brite-view yet.
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post #300 of 1996 Old 11-22-2011, 02:38 PM
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Originally Posted by JoeKustra View Post

I don't know of any other fee-free HD DVR units.

DIVCO TVIX M6620N Plus. Two ATSC/Qam tuners.
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