Channel Master TV CM 7400 HD DVR - OTA, Clear QAM, Internet Content - Page 67 - AVS Forum
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post #1981 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 11:05 AM
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This is the response that I got back from ChannelMaster tech support about the discontinuation of the premium guide:
Quote:
I apologize however it wasn't our decision to discontinue the premium guide. We did not supply the guide, we only sold it to customers. I apologize for the confusion. Thank you and have a great day.

Maybe not directly under their control, but still their product was designed for it so some provision should have been made up front for a minimum commitment of service beyond just two years. The end result is the same--I still end up with not much more than a door stop in just two years. If nothing else, then a firmware upgrade could be released that would use the same extended guide as the new DVR+ unit. I think I am heading toward a WMC PC for a replacement based on the info I have so far.
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post #1982 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 11:28 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcnetwrx View Post

This is the response that I got back from ChannelMaster tech support about the discontinuation of the premium guide:
Quote:
I apologize however it wasn't our decision to discontinue the premium guide. We did not supply the guide, we only sold it to customers. I apologize for the confusion. Thank you and have a great day.

Sounds like they had somebody from Sony write their response. smile.gif
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post #1983 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 12:22 PM
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I wonder who did supply the CM-7400 paid guide? Probably Tribune or Rovi. (Either way I'm betting they cut the CM-7400 off because of the free DVR+ guide.) If it was Tribune, CM should have gone the Schedules Direct route when they ordered the CM-7400 from Entone. S.D. would've been cheaper for the consumer and would still exist.

Edit: I've since learned that S.D. was never an option; their TOS allows its use with "non-commercial software" only.
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post #1984 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 02:25 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pcnetwrx View Post

This is the response that I got back from ChannelMaster tech support about the discontinuation of the premium guide:
Maybe not directly under their control, but still their product was designed for it so some provision should have been made up front for a minimum commitment of service beyond just two years. The end result is the same--I still end up with not much more than a door stop in just two years. If nothing else, then a firmware upgrade could be released that would use the same extended guide as the new DVR+ unit. I think I am heading toward a WMC PC for a replacement based on the info I have so far.
that's right; CM must be honest company and settle the EPG issue by itself as a merchant of the CM-7400. See? It's named as CM product!
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post #1985 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 02:39 PM
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that's right; CM must be honest company and settle the EPG issue by itself as a merchant of the CM-7400. See? It's named as CM product!
I could not agree more. I would be super pi$$ed if I paid $400 for a DVR, knowing it only had full functionality if i paid for the guide, only to find that the guide came from some anonymous company that decided to pull the plug in less than two yrs. This is a real black mark on CM.

People have to ask themselves what will happen to the Rovi guide in the CM-7500 if the box doesn't make it in the market and is dropped in year like the others were.

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post #1986 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 02:45 PM
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there is second black mark on CM - they're allowed slip out of agreement with ROVI and left CM-7000PAL DVR without 2 weeks EPG . frown.gif

Now we see same pair on a market: CM-7500 and ROVI's 14 days EPG (via Inet) ! What we should expect in two years ?
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post #1987 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 03:49 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post

People have to ask themselves what will happen to the Rovi guide in the CM-7500 if the box doesn't make it in the market and is dropped in year like the others were.
I suspect Rovi's Internet guide will still exist since it's also used by several TVs, but I have a nagging suspicion that in about a year it'll get a lot shorter. Maybe Rovi will let you pay to keep the 2-week guide, if they can talk CM into putting out an update to let you enter your subscription info. Maybe I'm being too cynical, but a free 2-week DVR guide has always seemed too good to be true, even though WMC has one.
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post #1988 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 04:23 PM
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Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post

I suspect Rovi's Internet guide will still exist since it's also used by several TVs,
Yes the guide will exist, but that doesn't mean they will keep supplying it free to CM-7500 users if CM abandons the units like they did the others. As far as a firmware update for a pay option -- heck, isn't that what the CM-7400 had? And that's now dead. You know the guide data had to be coming from one of the majors but who is the distributer who actually runs the server that the DVR's are hard coded to contact. Apparently CM-7400 business wasn't worth their trouble to keep the site going.

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post #1989 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 06:06 PM
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Originally Posted by pcnetwrx View Post

I still end up with not much more than a door stop in just two years.

That's quite an exaggeration. You can still set the clock, you can still set timers to record your shows, and you can still use the PSIP guide to have some idea of what's airing soon. The DHG is "not much more than a doorstop" without its guide, but the CM 7400 still has significant functionality, even if using it is less convenient now than it was in the past.
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post #1990 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 07:02 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aleron Ives View Post

That's quite an exaggeration. You can still set the clock, you can still set timers to record your shows, and you can still use the PSIP guide to have some idea of what's airing soon. The DHG is "not much more than a doorstop" without its guide, but the CM 7400 still has significant functionality, even if using it is less convenient now than it was in the past.

I don't think it's much of an exaggeration at all! The PSIP data is nearly useless unless I personally turn on the unit and run the channels each day just before any recording starts. And if I just use timers, then I have a bunch of shows with no names to sort through to find what I might want to watch! If I am gone on a trip, which I am 4 or 5 times a year, then pretty much forget about anything identifiable being recorded. In any case, it's not what I signed up for. And it's my opinion that counts as far as whether I got value for what I paid for, and I didn't get enough value for my investment. You're welcome to make me an offer for the dregs of this thing once I have my replacement built and in place, which will be in March sometime after the guide expires. Or maybe you don't think it's worth much at this point either?
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post #1991 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 07:12 PM
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Whether it has a guide is irrelevant to me; the CM 7400's lack of an open filesystem and networking to facilitate the transfer of recordings automatically disqualified it from being useful in my eyes.
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post #1992 of 2005 Old 01-09-2014, 08:34 PM
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I went through a similar transition with the CM-7000 Pal when Rovi discontinued TVGoS. I even set up this PC in case I found the Pal unusable without TVGoS.

Certainly it's not as easy to schedule recordings on the Pal now as it was a year ago when TVGoS was still working, and I do use WMC on this PC to record shows now. But I also found I could, and do, still use the Pal. (I didn't lose a DVR - I gained a hobby.)

Of course it's not exactly the same - the Pal's feature of scanning channels in the background and keeping its guide updated makes PSIP about as good as PSIP can be. The CM-7400 doesn't do that, so it'll be more of a hassle. Also, the CM-7400 has name-based recording, which depends much more on good guide info. But the Pal never had that to begin with and it was still useful, so I'd bet the CM-7400 will remain useful to some as well.

For a while, someone sold Entone's "generic" versions of the CM-7400 without the guide. (To be fair, they did add one nice improvement: a fan to keep the darn thing cool.) So some may not find the CM-7400 useful any more, but others will. That's why God created eBay wink.gif
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post #1993 of 2005 Old 01-11-2014, 01:43 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post

I went through a similar transition with the CM-7000 Pal when Rovi discontinued TVGoS. I even set up this PC in case I found the Pal unusable without TVGoS.

Certainly it's not as easy to schedule recordings on the Pal now as it was a year ago when TVGoS was still working, and I do use WMC on this PC to record shows now. But I also found I could, and do, still use the Pal. (I didn't lose a DVR - I gained a hobby.)

Of course it's not exactly the same - the Pal's feature of scanning channels in the background and keeping its guide updated makes PSIP about as good as PSIP can be. The CM-7400 doesn't do that, so it'll be more of a hassle. Also, the CM-7400 has name-based recording, which depends much more on good guide info. But the Pal never had that to begin with and it was still useful, so I'd bet the CM-7400 will remain useful to some as well.

For a while, someone sold Entone's "generic" versions of the CM-7400 without the guide. (To be fair, they did add one nice improvement: a fan to keep the darn thing cool.) So some may not find the CM-7400 useful any more, but others will. That's why God created eBay wink.gif

I found out quite a while back as long as you are using firmware version 1.0.97 and don't put the 7400 in standby mode that it keeps the PSIP guide up to date on all the channels without having to change thru the channels to catch the guide. So it must be using the second tuner to keep the data up to date with this firmware version. This makes it a lot better with named based recordings. However it will not do this if it is in standby mode.
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post #1994 of 2005 Old 01-11-2014, 08:09 PM
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Originally Posted by Satmann View Post

I found out quite a while back as long as you are using firmware version 1.0.97 and don't put the 7400 in standby mode that it keeps the PSIP guide up to date on all the channels without having to change thru the channels to catch the guide. So it must be using the second tuner to keep the data up to date with this firmware version. This makes it a lot better with named based recordings. However it will not do this if it is in standby mode.

I can't use 1.0.97 because it wrecks the tuner sensitivity for fringe areas, like where I am. I end up losing half my channels and the clock goes crazy because it can't get a good sync signal. But when my guide expires in March, I will try the same technique to see if it also works for 1.0.81.

As a side note, I use a MediaCenter PC on another TV in the house and I just discovered how to access the recorded TV shows on that PC from any computer in the house that also has MediaCenter on it. Nice!
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post #1995 of 2005 Old 01-12-2014, 05:40 PM
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Originally Posted by pcnetwrx View Post

I can't use 1.0.97 because it wrecks the tuner sensitivity for fringe areas, like where I am. I end up losing half my channels and the clock goes crazy because it can't get a good sync signal.
I wish I could afford one of every box on the market, but I can't, so I never bought a CM-7400; mostly because of the reported tuner issues but also due to the PSIP guide not staying up-to-date. I'm surprised a DVR with Internet connectivity doesn't offer the ability to sync to an Internet time source eek.gif

Sounds like firmware version 1.0.81 fixes one issue while 1.0.97 fixes the other - but there's no firmware to fix both rolleyes.gif
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post #1996 of 2005 Old 01-12-2014, 07:33 PM
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Originally Posted by JHBrandt View Post

I wish I could afford one of every box on the market, but I can't, so I never bought a CM-7400; mostly because of the reported tuner issues but also due to the PSIP guide not staying up-to-date, I'm surprised a DVR with Internet connectivity doesn't offer the ability to sync to an Internet time source eek.gif

Sounds like firmware version 1.0.81 fixes one issue while 1.0.97 fixes the other - but there's no firmware to fix both rolleyes.gif

I have three CM-7400s connected to the internet and they sync the time daily. One still has the premium guide which expires in august and the other two use PSIP data. When the one with the premium guide expires I will miss the record new episodes only option. I'll just have to deal with it by setting it not to record certain episodes when I know they are repeats or by deleting the episode if I forget. That's what I do on the other two. As for the tuner sensitivity I have one channel out of 46 that is problematic with either firmware. But the same channel has issues on my three tv's and multiple other tuners also.
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post #1997 of 2005 Old 11-05-2014, 07:29 AM
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I realize this is an old thread but I'm curious.

Has the subscription guide for the CM-7400 been canceled this past summer as was predicted?

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post #1998 of 2005 Old 11-17-2014, 07:29 PM
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Likewise jumping on the zombie thread…

Looks like with the guide issues, this product might not be recommended now. Anyone still stand by this product? I spotted it a couple of days ago and was thinking about giving it a go. Now I'm not too sure. If not, is there another one you all could recommend for OTA channels without having to pay Tivo's ransom?
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post #1999 of 2005 Old 11-17-2014, 09:19 PM
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CM has a newer DVR+ model that they're selling instead of this one. Check out the DVR+ thread for more information.
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post #2000 of 2005 Old 11-18-2014, 07:31 AM
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is there another one you all could recommend for OTA channels without having to pay Tivo's ransom?
There are multiple choices, but the old saying comes to mind -- "pay me now or pay me later".

Depends on whether you want a DVR that you don't have to think about and that just works year after year -- or one which requires you to make a career out of maintaining it. "Ransoms" are not always monetary -- your choice.
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post #2001 of 2005 Old 11-19-2014, 10:53 PM
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I was using the CM-7400 until last week, dealing with the poor PSIP data after the EPG expired this summer. I started losing channels about a month ago, first NBC then PBS then ABC, and adjusting the antenna did nothing to fix that. The CM-7400 finally died on me last week, when it went into an endless loop of rebooting. I owned the CM-7400 for just under 3 years, having purchased it in January 2012.

I took the plunge and ordered the DVR+. I received it today and upon setting it up (not changing the positioning of anything), I have all of my network channels back.
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post #2002 of 2005 Old 11-20-2014, 06:25 AM
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I was using the CM-7400 until last week, dealing with the poor PSIP data after the EPG expired this summer.
Thanks. That was the information I was looking for.
Channel Master is now 2 out of 3 for selling DVR's that eventually lose their guide data.

Good luck with the DVR+.

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post #2003 of 2005 Old 11-20-2014, 03:12 PM
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The eventual fate of the DVR+ guide is a legit concern, but in CM's defense, I don't think they can be blamed for the loss of the CM-7000Pal guide, any more than Sony can be blamed for their well-regarded DVRs being essentially bricked. It was a unilateral decision by Rovi to end TVGoS. CM can hardly be blamed for not ordering a major firmware upgrade for a product they were no longer selling.

The CM-7400 is another matter. If the subscription guide was becoming unprofitable, CM should have raised the fee instead of just pulling the plug.

In the long run, raising the fee might have had the same result, as more CM-7400 owners would opt to go PSIP-only instead of paying the higher fee, causing CM to raise the fee even more in a "death spiral." But at least folks would've been gradually priced out, instead of just being curtly informed that they would be PSIP-only within a year even if they might have been willing to pay more.
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post #2004 of 2005 Old 11-20-2014, 04:52 PM
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I don't really see the big deal. If you buy any device that uses a subscription service, you know going in that it won't last forever and chose to take the risk that the service wouldn't end before you got your money's worth out of the device.
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post #2005 of 2005 Old 11-29-2014, 03:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sbuntyn View Post
I was using the CM-7400 until last week, dealing with the poor PSIP data after the EPG expired this summer. I started losing channels about a month ago, first NBC then PBS then ABC, and adjusting the antenna did nothing to fix that. The CM-7400 finally died on me last week, when it went into an endless loop of rebooting. I owned the CM-7400 for just under 3 years, having purchased it in January 2012.

I took the plunge and ordered the DVR+. I received it today and upon setting it up (not changing the positioning of anything), I have all of my network channels back.

If you don't mind me asking, what did you do with the CM 7400 ?
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