Channel Master DVR+ Owners Thread - Page 134 - AVS Forum

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HDTV Recorders

ReaperWA's Avatar ReaperWA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyB1966 View Post
I read through the manual, and with respect to my earlier question on the organization of recordings, like into folders:

ReaperWA, as long as the AVR has HDMI pass through, I find that solution good as well. The vast majority of time I watch programming, I don't feel the need to drive the sound system as the TV's speaker will suffice for watching the news, etc... If the AVR passes the HDMI signal onward, all is good. That said, I generally prefer fewer connection points, but that is a nice trade-off...

With respect to the TabloTV, it sounds like you are saying that with a Roku attached, which has a remote, that can be used to select OTA channels on the TabloTV. Not sure how that is done, but I'll take your word for it... Looks like some Rokus have HDMI, so that can be used to get TabloTV (OTA) sound to an AVR, like in the way you explained. I just found the TabloTV thread. looks like there are some quirky issues with Rokus. One the beauties of OTA is that it's not compressed. It would seem that aspect is lost when using a TabloTV. I'll stop with the TabloTV talk here, promise - sorry everyone.
Yes, my receiver has HDMI pass through. In my setup, the receiver uses the audio and the TV uses the video. Theoretically, the audio is also passed to the TV - but I've never checked it. I always use my receiver for audio and only use my TV as a monitor.

Like the Simple.tv, the Tablo TV doesn't connect directly to the Roku with a wired connection. Instead, it connects using the WiFi network. I do this with PLEX and it works great.

Interesting re the PQ issues being reported on the Tablo TV. I remember the Simple.tv reportedly having the same issues at launch.

And I think a little tangential discussion on alternative products is useful, provided that it doesn't take over the thread of course.

Speaking of Roku, yesterday I swapped out my Roku XS for a Roku 3. Wow! What a difference! I had no idea that they had improved channels/apps like Netflix and Amazon Prime to the extent that they have. I bought the original Roku back in '09, and it's been a lonnnng time since I've been this excited by a Roku.
TonyB1966's Avatar TonyB1966
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Tangential is fine by me, but not sure all would agree. As a prospective owner of DVR+, at these stages, I'm considering other options of course, so I find it healthy and imagine other would also. And since you have experience with both...

Let me ask this way... With the Roku remote control (along with TabloTV), are you able to perform all the navigation and perform all the functions with TabloTV as folks would on their handheld devices, as designed by TabloTV? If so, then one with remote control, such as the Harmony 1, could then incorporate that too, and there would be zero need to have a phone or tablet in addition to a remote control...
ReaperWA's Avatar ReaperWA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyB1966 View Post
Tangential is fine by me, but not sure all would agree. As a prospective owner of DVR+, at these stages, I'm considering other options of course, so I find it healthy and imagine other would also. And since you have experience with both...

Let me ask this way... With the Roku remote control (along with TabloTV), are you able to perform all the navigation and perform all the functions with TabloTV as folks would on their handheld devices, as designed by TabloTV? If so, then one with remote control, such as the Harmony 1, could then incorporate that too, and there would be zero need to have a phone or tablet in addition to a remote control...
I haven't used a Tablo TV or a Simple.tv Tony, I just like to be in the know.

I think that the answer to your question about Tablo TV on the Roku is, "Yes." I think. There's a video here showing what the Tablo TV channel/app looks like on the Roku. I think it looks like they've done a nice job.

And yes regarding the Harmony remotes. I have two, a Harmony One for my TV room (where all my AV equipment is), and a harmony 900 with RF in my bedroom (I use an HDMI splitter to mirror the signal from my TV room to my bedroom, and control my equipment from my bedroom with the RF remote when watching TV there). These Harmony remotes are the only remotes that I use.

I like the DVR+ because I like the traditional viewing experience, and no subscription fees. I will admit an attraction to Tablo TV or Simple.tv though because I use my Roku for viewing a LOT of content (Netflix, Amazon Instant, Plex, Vudu, and Funimation), and it would be convenient to use one less device.
DrDon's Avatar DrDon
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Bickering removed. Any additional bickering or using quotes out of context will result in being suspended and/or banned from the thread.
ReaperWA's Avatar ReaperWA
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*Comment removed consistent with DrDon's request.*

Thank you DrDon, sincerely! (I wish I had a super mod to settle disputes between my ex-wife and I, and to make it seem like they never happened. )
DrDon's Avatar DrDon
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I treat both the same way. In fact, my wife is currently suspended. Too many infractions.
ReaperWA's Avatar ReaperWA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDon View Post
I treat both the same way. In fact, my wife is currently suspended. Too many infractions.
Hahaha!
TonyB1966's Avatar TonyB1966
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Looks like I missed some excitement of sorts... but in time for the group hug though! Glad all is good.
ReaperWA's Avatar ReaperWA
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My earlier exchange with TonyB inspired me to write up the following...

Like me, I suspect that many cable cutters are interested in saving money on their AV setup without sacrificing having a whoop ass system. I have some information that I think might help some, and that's how to have all your AV equipment in one room and "mirror" the signal to a second. Also, how to reduce costs and clutter by minimizing cables to only HDMI ones.

Before I met my now ex-wife, I had one AV setup in my TV room and a second in my bedroom. This meant duplication in that I had two Dish receivers and two 500-disc DVD changers(!). When she moved in, she insisted that I get rid of the bedroom AV system, and like a lovesick newb husband, I did.

Fast forward to several years later and, after she moved out, I wanted my bedroom AV system back. The problem was cost - because the system in my TV room had grown to include a Blu-ray player, a Roku and an Apple TV. But then I thought, why not just use an HDMI splitter and mirror the HDMI signal to my bedroom, and use a RF Harmony remote to control all my components, and so I did - and it worked like a charm!

One of the beautiful things about my setup is that I can add any new video component to my TV room, setup my remotes, and - BAM! - enjoy the new component in both rooms.

Re the cables, several years ago I bought an AV receiver with HDMI pass through. This allowed me to get rid of my digital audio and optical cables, and an audio switch.

Below is an HDMI wiring diagram showing my setup.

Monoprice is an excellent place to buy inexpensive HDMI switches, splitters and cables.

This post might be a little off-topic perhaps, but the image does have a DVR+ in it.
Attached: Reaper's AV Diagram.png (109.2 KB) 
slprp1's Avatar slprp1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyB1966 View Post
Eye-balling the WD My Passport Ultra 1TB. Seems from this thread to work well, and the price is right too...
Not to mention the fact that the WD will automatically spin down after 30 minutes of idle time (right out of the package). Whereas the Seagate will spin 24/7 (without supposedly making adjustments to the drive on a PC to alter this setting).
Firstly, these "portable" drives aren't as reliable (long term) as full size drives, so the spin down option makes sense in this application.
Secondly, the WD "portable" drives have a better overall reputation (in the industry) for reliability.
The WD is a good choice but you may want to consider the 2TB. You'll be surprised as to how fast these drives fill up!
TonyB1966's Avatar TonyB1966
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slprp1 View Post
Not to mention the fact that the WD will automatically spin down after 30 minutes of idle time (right out of the package). Whereas the Seagate will spin 24/7 (without supposedly making adjustments to the drive on a PC to alter this setting).
Firstly, these "portable" drives aren't as reliable (long term) as full size drives, so the spin down option makes sense in this application.
Secondly, the WD "portable" drives have a better overall reputation (in the industry) for reliability.
The WD is a good choice but you may want to consider the 2TB. You'll be surprised as to how fast these drives fill up!
Thanks for chiming-in slprp1. My browsing of the thread did see the spin down info, so that made me feel good.

With just limited OTA channels I have a hard time imagining that we'll be recording a lot, and maybe archiving just a small portion of those...

So, the only items on such a hard drive, in that capacity (connected to the DVR+), would be from OTA, right? I imagine that I'll be streaming online content, like through Chromecast, but that wouldn't find its way onto the box...

For 50 bucks more one can get the 2 TB model. Hmmm...
ReaperWA's Avatar ReaperWA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyB1966 View Post
With just limited OTA channels I have a hard time imagining that we'll be recording a lot, and maybe archiving just a small portion of those...

So, the only items on such a hard drive, in that capacity (connected to the DVR+), would be from OTA, right? I imagine that I'll be streaming online content, like through Chromecast, but that wouldn't find its way onto the box...
It really is about intended use TonyB. For those planning to use their external hard drive as an archive, bigger is definitely better. It sounds like you're more in my boat though; I watch and delete TV recordings. If I want to view shows again, I do so when they come to Netflix or Amazon Prime. So for my intended use, the 500 GB EHD that I had laying around is more than enough. If in doubt though, go bigger. I've seen 2 TB EHD's that only cost 2x as much as a 500 GB one, and that's kind of hard to argue with...
slprp1's Avatar slprp1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyB1966 View Post
Thanks for chiming-in slprp1. My browsing of the thread did see the spin down info, so that made me feel good.

With just limited OTA channels I have a hard time imagining that we'll be recording a lot, and maybe archiving just a small portion of those...

So, the only items on such a hard drive, in that capacity (connected to the DVR+), would be from OTA, right? I imagine that I'll be streaming online content, like through Chromecast, but that wouldn't find its way onto the box...

For 50 bucks more one can get the 2 TB model. Hmmm...
I find that it's not always convenient (or even possible) to watch recorded shows and that the 1GB fills up faster than I originally anticipated (especially after the summer when the majority of shows are new vs. repeats).
In general, it's nice to have the flexibility from the outset.
Here's a potential option you may want to consider. The build quality appears to be better and the metal casing may also assist with heat dissipation.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00EO3031A/ref=mp_s_a_1_1?qid=1403224453&sr=8-1&pi=SX200_QL40
ReaperWA's Avatar ReaperWA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slprp1 View Post
I find that it's not always convenient (or even possible) to watch recorded shows and that the 1GB fills up faster than I originally anticipated (especially after the summer when the majority of shows are new vs. repeats).
In general, it's nice to have the flexibility from the outset.
Here's a potential option you may want to consider. The build quality appears to be better and the metal casing may also assist with heat dissipation.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/B00EO3...&pi=SX200_QL40
It's really good to see you being so positive and helpful slprp1. No offense intended.

I've only used 7% max of my 500 GB EHD so far, but I haven't used it during the fall yet, and you make a very good point regarding that. Vacations may be another thing to consider - if you're away from home for a couple weeks during high TV season, a lot of storage might be eaten up...
slprp1's Avatar slprp1
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Did anyone else notice this??......
The other day, when programming recordings, I noticed that it suddenly became unnecessary to have the entire show title on the screen in order to see the red indicator. For example, as you're advancing the guide from left to right, I'm in the habit of pressing record as soon as I see the first part of the title. It's always been annoying that you wouldn't be able to see the red confirmation until you advanced further (to the point when the entire title is visible). All of a sudden, I noticed that the red indicator would be visible even with a portion of the title showing (it actually showed up In the middle of the title)!
I thought that this was a real advantage and was really impressed!
Well.....guess what?.....it's gone!!
It seemed to have disappeared with the next Rovi update (this is an assumption).
I'm truly hoping that someone else noticed this!.....trust me, I wouldn't be discussing this here if it were my imagination!
Could it be possible that features (such as this) could be manipulated during guide updates? Was this merely a test?
......since the FW version hasn't changed, what other explanation could there possibly be?......any thoughts??
It's really disappointing that it was so short lived!......and why??
slprp1's Avatar slprp1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaperWA View Post
It's really good to see you being so positive and helpful slprp1. No offense intended.

I've only used 7% max of my 500 GB EHD so far, but I haven't used it during the fall yet, and you make a very good point regarding that. Vacations may be another thing to consider - if you're away from home for a couple weeks during high TV season, a lot of storage might be eaten up...
Thanks!.....no offense taken.
However, it's difficult to maintain a positive outlook when stuff like this happens (see above). ⬆
Kelson's Avatar Kelson
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaperWA View Post
I've only used 7% max of my 500 GB EHD so far, but I haven't used it during the fall yet, and you make a very good point regarding that. Vacations may be another thing to consider - if you're away from home for a couple weeks during high TV season, a lot of storage might be eaten up...
One of the advantages of a large HDD is that you can elect to collect an entire series you may not have time to watch during the regular season. You are then able to watch it at your own pace during the summer re-run time. I typically collect 6 or more complete seasons of shows for delayed watching. This is especially true for new shows -- if it gets canceled halfway through the season I don't waste any of my time on it and flush it from storage. I also typically collect serialized shows because nothing is worse for viewing a serial show than having a 2-3 month hiatus in the middle of the season.

A DVR with a lot of storage allows you to get creative in how you approach TV watching.

The only thing equally better than lot of storage is more tuners.
TonyB1966's Avatar TonyB1966
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ReaperWA View Post
My earlier exchange with TonyB inspired me to write up the following...

Like me, I suspect that many cable cutters are interested in saving money on their AV setup without sacrificing having a whoop ass system. I have some information that I think might help some, and that's how to have all your AV equipment in one room and "mirror" the signal to a second. Also, how to reduce costs and clutter by minimizing cables to only HDMI ones.

Before I met my now ex-wife, I had one AV setup in my TV room and a second in my bedroom. This meant duplication in that I had two Dish receivers and two 500-disc DVD changers(!). When she moved in, she insisted that I get rid of the bedroom AV system, and like a lovesick newb husband, I did.

Fast forward to several years later and, after she moved out, I wanted my bedroom AV system back. The problem was cost - because the system in my TV room had grown to include a Blu-ray player, a Roku and an Apple TV. But then I thought, why not just use an HDMI splitter and mirror the HDMI signal to my bedroom, and use a RF Harmony remote to control all my components, and so I did - and it worked like a charm!

One of the beautiful things about my setup is that I can add any new video component to my TV room, setup my remotes, and - BAM! - enjoy the new component in both rooms.

Re the cables, several years ago I bought an AV receiver with HDMI pass through. This allowed me to get rid of my digital audio and optical cables, and an audio switch.

Below is an HDMI wiring diagram showing my setup.

Monoprice is an excellent place to buy inexpensive HDMI switches, splitters and cables.

This post might be a little off-topic perhaps, but the image does have a DVR+ in it.
I somehow missed this post. Thank you ReaperWA.

I have an HDMI switch, but it's not connected just yet. I forgot the the name, but something like Kinivo. This particular TV has just two HDMI inputs, so it's needed for that purpose, auto-switching, which I hope works as anticipated. Some devices that don't completely turn off, apparently like AppleTV, can be problematic with such a switch.

If I do indeed get the DVR+, it's HDMI out would go through this HDMI switch. I'm currently setting-up antennas now in a rather poor reception area, but it does seem that I can get a sufficient number of channels, with decent enough signal, to merit moving forward with cord-cutting at the new house... I don't want to buy a DVR, HDD, wifi etc until I can be certain there will be programming to record...
slprp1's Avatar slprp1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kelson View Post
A DVR with a lot of storage allows you to get creative in how you approach TV watching.
The only thing equally better than lot of storage is more tuners.
True.....but with more tuners, more storage would tend to be a necessity.
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I'm not sure where this info that Seagate drives don't spin down came from, but it's not true. I have a 1TB Seagate Backup Plus that I bought a couple weeks ago. It has never been connected to a computer. It went straight from the package to my DVR+. If I put my hand on the drive while I start up my DVR I can feel it spin up.
artisticimaging's Avatar artisticimaging
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Originally Posted by jakep_82 View Post
I'm not sure where this info that Seagate drives don't spin down came from, but it's not true. I have a 1TB Seagate Backup Plus that I bought a couple weeks ago. It has never been connected to a computer. It went straight from the package to my DVR+. If I put my hand on the drive while I start up my DVR I can feel it spin up.
How long for spin down?
Chuck Tribolet's Avatar Chuck Tribolet
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You can't say that all WD drives spin down, or that all Seagate drives don't spin down. It's a firmware option bit, and it will start out set however the drives were ordered from the manufacturer.

Chuck
jakep_82's Avatar jakep_82
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Originally Posted by artisticimaging View Post
How long for spin down?
I have no idea. The drive is too quiet to hear, so the only way to tell if it's spinning is by touching it.
ReaperWA's Avatar ReaperWA
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TonyB1966 View Post
I somehow missed this post. Thank you ReaperWA.

I have an HDMI switch, but it's not connected just yet. I forgot the the name, but something like Kinivo. This particular TV has just two HDMI inputs, so it's needed for that purpose, auto-switching, which I hope works as anticipated. Some devices that don't completely turn off, apparently like AppleTV, can be problematic with such a switch.

If I do indeed get the DVR+, it's HDMI out would go through this HDMI switch. I'm currently setting-up antennas now in a rather poor reception area, but it does seem that I can get a sufficient number of channels, with decent enough signal, to merit moving forward with cord-cutting at the new house... I don't want to buy a DVR, HDD, wifi etc until I can be certain there will be programming to record...
You're welcome TonyB1966. (BTW, I was born in '66. Good year. )

Regarding HDMI switches, depending on your devices, I wouldn't expect auto-switching to work. For example, a Roku is always powered on.

If you have a Harmony remote, and if your switch has a remote control, you can add the switch to your Harmony "activities". For instance, when I press the Watch TV activity, my (TV room) Harmony remote sends signals to four devices, my TV, DVR+, HDMI switch, and AV receiver, turning them all on and setting them to the correct inputs.

Also, when I sit down to watch TV, I usually watch live TV, at least at first, so I plugged the HDMI cable from the DVR+ into the first switch port, because the switch defaults to the first input when it powers on. Doing this in conjunction with setting up the Harmony remotes to control the HDMI switch eliminated any switching problems.
slprp1's Avatar slprp1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jakep_82 View Post
I'm not sure where this info that Seagate drives don't spin down came from, but it's not true. I have a 1TB Seagate Backup Plus that I bought a couple weeks ago. It has never been connected to a computer. It went straight from the package to my DVR+. If I put my hand on the drive while I start up my DVR I can feel it spin up.
My post was based upon my own (and a friend's) experience with the exact same drive that you're using. I also verified it with Seagate. Unless they made some recent changes (since your drive is brand new), it spins 24/7 (unless the settings are modified on a PC.....supposedly).
Since these drives are super quiet and basically vibration free while idling, you may feel some vibration when touching it (when you first power up the DVR+). This would be due to additional vibrations upon start up and while in actual use (as the drive is far more functional when the DVR+ is powered on).
Unless they made some recent change (which would be unlikely), it's best to assume that the drive is spinning 24/7.
Chuck Tribolet's Avatar Chuck Tribolet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slprp1 View Post
Unless they made some recent change (which would be unlikely), it's best to assume that the drive is spinning 24/7.
No, it depends on how the drive was ordered. It's an option, just like ordering a car.

Chuck
slprp1's Avatar slprp1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Tribolet View Post
No, it depends on how the drive was ordered. It's an option, just like ordering a car.

Chuck
Sorry!.....don't know where your information is originating from (or perhaps it's an assumption). Regardless, it's not at all true!
There's no "ordering" involved here. This drive is a purely generic, off the shelf "portable" model that is designed and built only one way. There are no "options". The only way to (supposedly, as I've never tested this) change "sleep" settings would be on a PC prior to using it with the DVR+.
Chuck Tribolet's Avatar Chuck Tribolet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slprp1 View Post
Sorry!.....don't know where your information is originating from (or perhaps it's an assumption). Regardless, it's not at all true!
There's no "ordering" involved here. This drive is a purely generic, off the shelf "portable" model that is designed and built only one way. There are no "options". The only way to (supposedly, as I've never tested this) change "sleep" settings would be on a PC prior to using it with the DVR+.
It's not an assumption. I spent 12 years at IBM Research Division working on hard drive and storage subsystem firmware and performance.

Folks were saying that Seagates don't spin down and WDs do. That's what I was responding to, not a specific retail-packaged drive.

If you are ordering wholesale (say 10,000 drives or more), the drive makers will configure the drive however you want. Firmware level, options like spin down and head acceleration (drives for the DVR market typically have low head accelerations to keep them quiet at 2am in the bedroom), all of that is on the table.

And somebody had a counter example of a Seagate that did spin down, out of the box.
TonyB1966's Avatar TonyB1966
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This thread is a good one, even the tangential discussions...

For those with a DVR+, can you confirm the width of 13 some odd inches? I've had posted specs fail me before...

To not sidetrack this thread, if someone has a link to equipment stacking options, please do share. The DVR+ will go into some wooden cabinets (not enclosed), and there will need to be a couple more pieces of equipment in there. Nothing huge, with a PS3 being the biggest unit in that cabinet opening. I don't want to stack equipment on the DVR+, especially since it doesn't look all that beefy...
slprp1's Avatar slprp1
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuck Tribolet View Post
It's not an assumption. I spent 12 years at IBM Research Division working on hard drive and storage subsystem firmware and performance.

Folks were saying that Seagates don't spin down and WDs do. That's what I was responding to, not a specific retail-packaged drive.

If you are ordering wholesale (say 10,000 drives or more), the drive makers will configure the drive however you want. Firmware level, options like spin down and head acceleration (drives for the DVR market typically have low head accelerations to keep them quiet at 2am in the bedroom), all of that is on the table.

And somebody had a counter example of a Seagate that did spin down, out of the box.
Understood.....
However, to put this into proper perspective, the specific drive that was being discussed here is a low end corner drugstore model that's very simple and straightforward. Not Seagate drives in general (sometimes it's best not to generalize). Not a special order situation. No options available (other than what might possibly be adjusted on a PC by the user).
Insofar as my (and various others) experiences with this particular drive, it doesn't spin down as packaged. The lack of vibration and noise while idling can fool you into thinking that it stopped spinning.
The equivalent WD does spin down after 30 minutes of idle time (out of the package), making it a (potentially) better choice, since these are more vulnerable "portable" drives.
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