LG LST-3410A Review and Discussion - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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Old 03-04-2004, 04:37 PM
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With apologies if this has been already discussed in this long thread, but, how have the results been in using the 3410 with D-VHS decks over the FireWire inputs and the DVI outputs.

In particular, how have the results been with the 169Time HDVR/AVX-1 and the JVC 30K/40K when played through the 3410 to the DVI output?

Does the unit display D-VHS tapes glitch-free over DVI?

Murray Kerdman
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Old 03-04-2004, 04:43 PM
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I have both a 30000 and a 40000 connected through firewire. I am able to watch either but I cannot archive to the 40000. This is true even if the 40000 is the only unit on the chain. The manual does state that the only model "recommended" is the 30000.


Jim
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Old 03-04-2004, 04:52 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by sweeney
I have both a 30000 and a 40000 connected through firewire. I am able to watch either but I cannot archive to the 40000. This is true even if the 40000 is the only unit on the chain. The manual does state that the only model "recommended" is the 30000.


Jim

Jim,

Can you play a D-Theater tape throught the 3410's DVI ouputs?

What D-VHS related functions have you tried with your 30000 (i.e. record to/from archive/restore to/from? Are they artifact free?

Murray Kerdman
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Old 03-04-2004, 04:53 PM
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When put in the Time Shift Mode, how long is the buffer and can you drag, pause, and navigate to any part of the buffer?

Can you change channels while in the Time Shift Mode?

Also, can you save the buffer?

Murray Kerdman
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Old 03-04-2004, 04:53 PM
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Interesting on the 40000.
My Mits 2000U works perfect with it. Not sure on DVI though - I don't have anything to test on.

Paul
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Old 03-04-2004, 04:59 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by protsch
Interesting on the 40000.
My Mits 2000U works perfect with it. Not sure on DVI though - I don't have anything to test on.

Paul

Paul

I have been testing a friends 40K with 169Time 1394 STB and it produces some glitches.

I am getting a 30K to test tomorrow and from what I hear I may have better luck.

The 30K was built around the original JVC D-VHS Tape driver and seems to have been the one deck used by LG and others in their development of FireWire compatibility.

JVC changed something in the 40K that throws off equipment that identifies it as a 30K.

I hear the Mits plays back flawlessly.

Murray Kerdman
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Old 03-04-2004, 11:25 PM
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I've had mine for a week, now. It's recorded one out of five shows that I've scheduled, and I have yet to see more than a couple of days of guide data at a time. Until turning on to record a show, earlier tonight, it had been off for two days (because it sure as hell didn't record the show scheduled for Wednesday night...), and I still don't have guide data for Saturday. I'm not sure if sporadic guide data is the issue (i.e. losing the guide data, so not recording a favorite), or what. Earlier tonight, it was supposed to record two shows back to back, and recorded only the second (the first show I've actually seen it record!). Other shows that I've designated for weekly recording have failed to record.

Others here seem to be having better luck, so I don't know if it's a subtly defective unit, a bad guide feed in my area, favorites vs. explicit time/date recording, or what, but for $999, I don't expect it to be too arcane. I was prepared to live with the limitations of a first to market device (QAM is the key, in my case), but I did expect it to work as advertised.

I'm so angry, I can barely type. I will be contacting the vendor to seek a refund.

--Mike
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Old 03-05-2004, 06:01 AM
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Llamas,

I have had trouble with favorites recording as well. Try just setting up a recording without using favorites. That has worked perfectly for me.
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Old 03-05-2004, 06:49 AM
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I am puzzled by favorites. What exactly are favorites? How are they different than shows you wish to record? We're not told anything useful about them in the user guide, and the guide never tells you anywhere that it will actually record favorites.

I have found that the easiest way by far to record anything is to use the VCR+ button and enter the number that appears in the TV Guide.
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Old 03-05-2004, 07:22 AM
 
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I've been away from this thread for a little while but now am reading from Mike that this unit doesn't do favorite recording either?

Can I look at the guide, read the show details and simply hit the remote's record button to get that program scheduled to record?

Finally, since this unit is dependent on using the locally transmitted guide data for recording, does LG have a full refund return policy for those of us who buy this unit and find that our local guide data is missing, wrong, or incomplete?
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Old 03-05-2004, 08:02 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by merc

Finally, since this unit is dependent on using the locally transmitted guide data for recording, does LG have a full refund return policy for those of us who buy this unit and find that our local guide data is missing, wrong, or incomplete?

merc,

Actually you can use the "VCR Plus+" button to setup manual future recordings. No guide data is needed to do these. Timeshift will still work with no guide data. Also, you can push the "rec/edit" button and start recording anytime without guide data.
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Old 03-05-2004, 08:08 AM
 
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Actually you can use the "VCR Plus+" button to setup manual future recordings. No guide data is needed to do these. Also, time shift will still work with no guide data.

I think all my VCRs have VCR plus, but I don't think I've ever used it? Where do I go to see what episodes are on in order to use this VCR+? I already have a DVHS/T165 combo and so I can always record using the manual timer settings.

What I need is a ReplayTV type HD DVR which allows me and my wife to look at the guide, read the show details, and simply hit the record button in order to set the timer to record. Can you do that with the VCR+?
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Old 03-05-2004, 08:15 AM
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I could be wrong, but I believe that your favorite list has nothing to do with what you wish to record. The user manual didn't explain what favorites are, but I do not think it says it will record them. I believe it will just find them when they appear in the guide and mark them for you. The 3410A lets you then decide if you want to record them.

The benefit of this is that everytime Masterpiece Theater shows up when you download the guide it will be marked with a big red heart in the listing. This makes it easy to spot and decide if you want to record it.

I suspect everyone who has trouble with the way LG implmented recording has to forget what TIVO and ReplayTV do and think of this box as a VCR. I'm not a TIVO user (actually I rather dislike it), so I find the basic operation of the 3410A does make sense.
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Old 03-05-2004, 08:22 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Hyrax
I am puzzled by favorites. What exactly are favorites? How are they different than shows you wish to record? We're not told anything useful about them in the user guide, and the guide never tells you anywhere that it will actually record favorites.

I have found that the easiest way by far to record anything is to use the VCR+ button and enter the number that appears in the TV Guide.

From what I can tell the favorites do not record but just tune to that station at that time. Favorites look to be different to me then record a
weekly program. From what I tested it would only turn on the unit and
set the station to the favorite, I guess so that if you are home you do not
forget the show. Dose not look like it records it. Must set the record to
record to harddrive.
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Old 03-05-2004, 08:25 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by mkerdman
When put in the Time Shift Mode, how long is the buffer and can you drag, pause, and navigate to any part of the buffer?

Can you change channels while in the Time Shift Mode?

Also, can you save the buffer?

From what I was able to to do you can pause, drag forward or back to any spot in the time line and also skip forward or back by content. I like the
drag because if you hit the drag+ down and up it will move about 1 minute
along the timeline.

You should be able to fill the hard drive with timeshift program but I think it brecks it up into 1 hour segements.
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Old 03-05-2004, 08:34 AM
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Hyrax said:"think of this box as a VCR"

This seems to be correct. I was scheduled to record a "Star Trek", but was concerned because it was preceeded by a basketball game. My experience is that sporting events often run over. I was assured by the dealer that the 3410 would compensate, because it is Program Guide based. Not so! The game ran over and the box recorded only the scheduled hour; ths included the end of the game and it cut off that amount of time at the end of "Star Trek". Beware! I could not have added time at the end to ensure getting what I wanted, because I had another recording scheduled at the end of the first. It just occured to me that, perhaps, the first recording was cut because of the second being scheduled, rather than the time. However, the first idea is the more plausible.

Dan
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Old 03-05-2004, 09:43 AM
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Dan -
Quote:


I was assured by the dealer that the 3410 would compensate...

The 3410A is definitely a time based recording device and is not a 'show' based device. It would have stopped before the end of Star Trek even if you didn't have another show to record afterwards. The fact that the guide looks a bit like a Tivo seems to have confused people into thinking that it works like a Tivo.

It is an unfortunate fact that dealers don't always know their product. I was assured that the 3410A would output SD over the S-Video while recording HD. It doesn't. I had to decide if it was worth returning based on that incorrect info - and, although disappointed, I'm keeping it.
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Old 03-05-2004, 09:51 AM
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I went back and did more research before coming to work, this morning. I found what a few have posted above.

Favorites have NOTHING to do with recording. The box will change the channel automatically to WATCH a favorite, but recording is not part of the equation. A pointless and confusing feature on a DVR, but perhaps I'm just upset because it took me a week to figure this out.

Recording supports the same additional options that favorites does, so the frequency can be set to once, regularly (daily), and weekly.

The fact that favorites involves a frequency led me to believe that the record function was for one-off recording. Bad assumption on my part.

I knew the limitations of the box when I bought it, namely can't playback while recording. I found out about a few when the unit was already on its way to me; specifically the two power issues, power has to be off to receive guide data, and if you power off during a record, it kills the recording. And now I get to deal with steaming pile that is the Gemstar guide software. The power issues, when combined, are a major hassle. They may not have broken the deal for me, though, had I known. After all, I thought I had zero other choices for recording HD (I cannot receive OTA). The software just kills it for me, though. Other PVR/DVR manufacturers have had better solutions (full text search, first run/rerun filtering, etc.) for years, yet we get stuck with this crap on a $1000 piece of equipment. On a $5-$10/mo cable box, where I make no capital outlay, perhaps, but not on a retail device at this price point.

This will likely be the last LG product I buy, and without a doubt the last thing I buy that uses Gemstar.

--Mike
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Old 03-05-2004, 09:56 AM
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quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
I was assured by the dealer that the 3410 would compensate...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------


I don't have one yet, but your assessment is also bolstered by the fact that the guide is downloaded nightly, not updated on every event, according to other posts.

I would guess, based on this, that planned changes to the schedule are accomodated by the prior night's download of the guide. But unplanned changes, such as sporting event overruns, are not accomodated as you have learned.
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Old 03-06-2004, 11:17 AM
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I have been enjoying my 3410a for more than a week now. I find the EPG (Gemstart guide) very easy to use, and since I turn my unit off while I am sleeping, I have no problem with the method used to download the data. Maybe my happiness is because I came from a VCR instead of a TiVo, and so find this a big step step up. For the channels that do not show up in the guide (such as HD-Net Movies), I find it very easy to set the channel/date/time/duration for the recording; just press the VCR Plus+ button and set the data.

I did run into one "gotcha" related to the EPG data download though. When I changed the guide setup so that it mapped my local PBS station listing to my OTA digital signal instead of the cable analog signal, I lost the ability to receive the guide data. Seems kind of strange since it could still receive the cable analog signal, it just was no longer mapped to the guide PBS listing. No big deal for me though; I just reset the guide listing back to the analog signal. Of course this might have been coincidental.

One other comment on heat: This unit gets a bit warm (not hot) after running for a while. I noticed that it has vent slots in the bottom of the case, but air flow to those vents is poor since the unit's feet are so short. So I cut some 1" by 1" blocks of 3/4" wood, painted them black (to match my shelf), and placed one under each foot. This seems to have reduced the temperature (as felt on the top of the case) quite a bit. Might be worth a try for those seeing heat related problems.

Steve

Steve
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Old 03-06-2004, 01:19 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by fp4me
When I changed the guide setup so that it mapped my local PBS station listing to my OTA digital signal instead of the cable analog signal, I lost the ability to receive the guide data. Steve

Steve

Do, you need basic cable at a minimum to get EPG data, or, can you get the EPG data from an antenna receiving PBS Over the air?

Is PBS the sole re-transmitter of the TVGuide data stream?

Murray Kerdman
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Old 03-06-2004, 02:45 PM
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PBS is not the sole transmitter og Gemstar. In fact, in most cities ABC will be the main carrier.
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Old 03-06-2004, 02:51 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by mkerdman
Steve

Do, you need basic cable at a minimum to get EPG data, or, can you get the EPG data from an antenna receiving PBS Over the air?

Is PBS the sole re-transmitter of the TVGuide data stream?

If I indicate that I only have OTA, then it picks up the EPG data from one of my OTA stations. But then the guide listing only shows the OTA digital and OTA analog stations, and the cable input is disabled. If I indicate that I have cable (without a cable box), then it only seems to get data from a cable station. In this case, the guide listing shows the cable stations (digital and analog) as well as the digital OTA stations.

Steve
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Old 03-06-2004, 02:53 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by KornerKlub
PBS is not the sole transmitter og Gemstar. In fact, in most cities ABC will be the main carrier.

Interesting. Do you know how to find out which stations are transmitting the guide data?

Steve
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Old 03-06-2004, 03:02 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by fp4me
Interesting. Do you know how to find out which stations are transmitting the guide data?

fp4me

Do the ATSC ABC stations also carry the EPG data?

Murray Kerdman
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Old 03-06-2004, 03:07 PM
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Quote:


Do the ATSC ABC stations also carry the EPG data?

Gemstar is carried on NTSC.
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Old 03-06-2004, 03:25 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by fp4me
If I indicate that I only have OTA, then it picks up the EPG data from one of my OTA stations. But then the guide listing only shows the OTA digital and OTA analog stations, and the cable input is disabled.

fp4me

Have you tested this by completely disconnecting the cable co. connection?

Murray Kerdman
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Old 03-06-2004, 03:43 PM
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Can the 3410A act to control a D-VHS deck over FireWire by means of a scheduled timer recording of an "I" (iLink) input on the D-VHS deck rather than any channel from the 3410A itself?

Murray Kerdman
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Old 03-06-2004, 03:55 PM
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I noticed that when I set the unit to record on the HD, it powers on when it is time to record but stays on after it is scheduled to finish recording and does not power off. Did I miss something on setting up to record, I'd hate to plan to record a week's of programming when I'm away for a week and leave the unit powered on continuously for 7 days. Any thoughts on this?
joe
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Old 03-06-2004, 03:56 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by mkerdman
fp4me

Have you tested this by completely disconnecting the cable co. connection?

Yes I have.

Steve
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