Official Comcast 6412 w/ iGuide Discussion - Page 31 - AVS Forum
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post #901 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 12:43 PM
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I had tivo, loved it, then got rid of it when I got HD. 6208 and now the 6412. The 6412 is as close as you can get to tivo, some search options missing but I never used them anyway. Comparing $120 a year to $1000 out of the pocket its a no brainer. If Tivo would come down to $300 or less, then they would have the market back. Probably in a year or two the way the electronics world works.
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post #902 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 01:03 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by easycruise


3. Your TV watching calculations (record 6 hours daily and watch 3 daily) ignore the weeks of the year when you go on vacation. You come back from a week's vacation and you missed a lot of your shows because the 6412 has such limited HD space. It's even worse if you go on a 2 week vacation.

4. Let's face it, HD viewing is "not ready for prime time". Since we are in the days of commercial skipping (who wants to go back?), the lack of a good HD recorder is a big limitation.

5. I'll take the "grainy SD", as you say, and be able to skip the commercials rather than watch HD and have to watch those commercials. I guess I'm just not an "early adopter" and I'll wait for, as Tivo says, "TV my way".

6. It might not be that long of a wait. Rumors are that Tivo is working on a HD recorder to work with the CableCard, so you won't need to mess with that antenna on top of your house. We'll see at the CES convention next month.


I just recently got into HD, and while it isn't perfect, it is so incredible to watch that I will gladly tolerate some hiccups. I was satisfied with SD before I got HD...let's just say that is *not* the case anymore.

Personally, I have the 6208...I'm anxiously awaiting getting the 6412 when it becomes available in my area. And while the box I currently have pales in comparison to my ReplayTVs (functionality is basically that of a VCR), I am very glad to be able to record HD, at all. I have only 2/3 the capacity of the 6412 (the same as your TiVo), but I haven't run into much trouble there, even when I was out of town for a couple of days. Almost everything I record on the 6208 is also recorded on a RTV, so I have a safety net there.

I am very bummed that D&M has basically ceased development on the ReplayTV platform for all practical purposes, so my hopes of getting a Replay-branded HD-PVR are pretty much nil. I'd buy one in a heartbeat if they would make it...even if were still a single-tuner box! Anyway, if there were a CableCard-based, multi-tuner TiVo, I would certainly look at it. The Sony CC-based units sounded intriguing (pretty good storage, actually), but once I found out they are single tuner offerings, I lost some interest. Not to mention the questions around the guide. Anyway, until there is a serious, non-satellite, HD-capable, multi-tuner PVR available on the market, I'll just stand by anxiously awaiting the availability of the 6412 in my area. To each his/her own!

-Randy

Randy
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post #903 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 01:19 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by dwk
crossbeaux

Looks like I have the same condition. Were you able to resolve yours, or did you swap the box.

After I powered down and powered back up, everything seems to be working fine, as long as I keep away from that pesky little item in my recorded programs list that says it was recorded in 1989. It may be magical thinking on my part, but I think when I attempted to watch or delete that item, that's when the problems began.
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post #904 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 02:10 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by crossbeaux
After I powered down and powered back up, everything seems to be working fine, as long as I keep away from that pesky little item in my recorded programs list that says it was recorded in 1989. It may be magical thinking on my part, but I think when I attempted to watch or delete that item, that's when the problems began.


Mine is also back to normal. What a scare!!
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post #905 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 02:28 PM
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Just got my 6212 yesterday, I have a mapping problem my program guide for the majority of my analog channels does not match the actual program shown on channel. For example Guide says Channel 26 espn, but is actually Cspan. Channel 44 is espn but is listed as AMC. Former box before 6212 listed channel 44 in guide as espn and broadcast as espn. Call to CSR for Comcast was unable to change guide after several attempts. Anyone have similar problem or idea
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post #906 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 02:53 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by earletp
I'm cracking up watching easycruise attempting to justify his decision to avoid HD and HD-DVR's while completely ignoring that the 6412 with its "limited disk space" actually has a 50% larger hard drive than his Tivo, can record 50% more SD programming than his Tivo, can record 15 hours of HD material against 0 hours for his Tivo and does in fact support a 30 second commercial skip.

It's like watching someone pee into the wind and looking for the rain clouds.

Something may not be ready for primetime, but it's not HD...


I'm cracking up at your faulty logic. I'm buying a HDTV to watch HD, not SD. Who cares if the 6412 has 50% more SD space than my Tivo! In fact, it's been mentioned countless times on the AVS Forum Plasma threads that SD looks worse on a HD or ED Plasma than the old CRT TV. But, I'm willing to live with that downgrade in SD picture quality for the opportunity to watch HD shows on a HD TV.

If I spend many thousands on a brand new HDTV, I want to watch HD programming. But it seems that you now have to watch the commercials except for the few shows that you can record in HD, due to the limited disk space on the 6412. I just don't want to give up the Tivo 80 hour recording space to downgrade to 15 hours with HD on the 6412.

To summarize, a old Tivo user like me going to HD has to make some serious tradeoffs. Shell out a lot of money for a new TV, increase your monthly cost with Comcast, give up a lot of Tivo-like storage capacity, crucial when going on vacation. But, I must admit, in return you get that absolutely gorgeous HD picture, except now you have to watch most of the commercials. I'm spoiled by Tivo, I guess.

The only partial solution I see is to have both the Tivo and the 6412, but that, dare I say, is a joke, because you now have two remotes, and two programming guides to program and deal with. My wife would hate that setup

Like I said, it doesn't seem ready for prime time. An 80 hour HD recorder and all problems are solved! Don't mention DirectTV, everybody that I know that had it had nothing but problems, either with weather, programming, inside setup, etc.
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post #907 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 03:04 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by IFLYSWA
The Sony CC-based units sounded intriguing (pretty good storage, actually), but once I found out they are single tuner offerings, I lost some interest. Not to mention the questions around the guide. Anyway, until there is a serious, non-satellite, HD-capable, multi-tuner PVR available on the market, I'll just stand by anxiously awaiting the availability of the 6412 in my area. To each his/her own!

-Randy

We found that it really wasn't that often that we would want to watch two shows that were on at the same time. But, with the Tivo "standby mode", even though it's a single tuner, you can still watch one show (with commercials) and record the other at the same time.
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post #908 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 03:04 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by easycruise
Like I said, it doesn't seem ready for prime time. An 80 hour HD recorder and all problems are solved!

Yep...just 600-800 GB of disk space and you are home free!

-Randy

Randy
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post #909 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 03:12 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by easycruise
We found that it really wasn't that often that we would want to watch two shows that were on at the same time. But, with the Tivo "standby mode", even though it's a single tuner, you can still watch one show (with commercials) and record the other at the same time.

Unfortunately that is not the case for me...and there are even times when I want to watch/record three shows that are on simultaneously...and at least once that I wanted four! A lot of it stems from wanting to record some prime time show(s) while watching a game of some sort live...

Since I have two RTVs, a 6208 and OTA capabilities now, it seldom is an issue...I just sometimes have to settle for SD if there are two or more HD shows on at the same time and I am not home to watch one of them live. The 6412 will help a bunch there. And make no mistake...I was spoiled, too. But again, I am willing to take some hits in the convenience department for the PQ. This would definitely qualify as a YMMV situation...

-Randy

Randy
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post #910 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 03:41 PM
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easycruise says: "To summarize, a old Tivo user like me going to HD has to make some serious tradeoffs."

Most of us agree there are tradeoffs. I'm also an "old TiVo user." So much so that I'd often say I'd rather watch a 19-inch black and white TV with TiVo instead of an HDTV without TiVo. But the 6412 is plenty good enough.

For me, the 6412 with a 50 inch HDTV is much much better than my previous setup of 2 TiVos with a 32 inch Sony XBR. Yes, Michael Powell was right when he said TiVo is so incredible that it is "God's Machine." Yes, the 6412 is missing lots of TiVo features, most importantly wishlists and HMO. And yes, the 6412 has some bugs, as are well documented in this forum.

But the HDTV picture, plus the 5.1 sound, is well worth it. For me.
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post #911 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 04:05 PM
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I don't understand why easycruise is concerned about the 1 or 2 week vacation period during which he would not be able to capture enough HD on the 6412. I do appreciate the desire to enjoy the expensive equipment to view HD to the fullest. But when you're catching up on programming over the long haul, what's more important - FF thru everything so you're current or sitting back satisfying the HD crave? I'd record it off the SD side if I was afraid it would overflow the drive while I was gone.

Unless you've got no other life entirely, how would one ever catch up if (s)he were able to record the 80+ hours of HD that easycruise thinks he would miss during a vacation (is there really that much "must see TV" HD in a week?) because of the 6412's 120 GB drive? I think this is a theoretical limitation easycruise is beating himself with rather than a practical one. Now if you're talking about archiving HD, that's another matter and different equipment.

Bob
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post #912 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 04:28 PM
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Well I've had my 6412 now for 3 or 4 weeks now. I have had no problems, it was flawless, until tonight. I put the tv and 6412 on to watch some tv and no picture! I switched tuners and the same thing. I could get the channel menu on the bottom but other than that, a black screen. I remembered reading about this before. I played a recorded show and it played fine. Then I tried live tv and it worked again. I powered off and then the same thing happened, no picture! Once again played a recorded show and like magic the live tv starts working again. It was working fine yesterday and I did nothing to move any settings or access any diagnostic menus. I unpugged it from the wall for 30 seconds and turned it back on and all is back to normal. I don't know what could have caused this and hope it doesn't happen again.

Jim
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post #913 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 04:58 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by BullittMustang
...I put the tv and 6412 on to watch some tv and no picture! I switched tuners and the same thing. I could get the channel menu on the bottom but other than that, a black screen...

It's becoming clear through this issue and the "mute" issue that the unit is meant to be left on. Power on / Power Off causes instability in these types of devices. The TiVo has no power button, and takes a few minutes to boot after power is cut / resupplied.

An interesting experiment for someone continually having this problem would be to change their "Switched Power" setting (I remember seeing it but not where I saw it) and see if that clears it up. Maybe there is a synch signal or some other piece of information in the cable signal every so often it's not getting while it's off (talking out of my you know what here), and it takes a while to find that again. If you use it before it's resynched, it becomes unstable.

Then again, maybe it is a power supply issue.

Is anyone having this problem who does not turn off / on the unit?
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post #914 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 05:46 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by BullittMustang
Well I've had my 6412 now for 3 or 4 weeks now. I have had no problems, it was flawless, until tonight. I put the tv and 6412 on to watch some tv and no picture! I switched tuners and the same thing. I could get the channel menu on the bottom but other than that, a black screen. I remembered reading about this before. I played a recorded show and it played fine. Then I tried live tv and it worked again. I powered off and then the same thing happened, no picture! Once again played a recorded show and like magic the live tv starts working again. It was working fine yesterday and I did nothing to move any settings or access any diagnostic menus. I unpugged it from the wall for 30 seconds and turned it back on and all is back to normal. I don't know what could have caused this and hope it doesn't happen again.

The same thing happened to me this morning. My DVR is on all the time. So I turned it off (still plugged in) and when I turned it back on everything went back to normal.

Rich N.
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post #915 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 06:41 PM
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easycruise, if you are expecting a seamless transition from SD to HD then I agree with you, you are better off waiting. Even if your desires for the hardware are realized, the majority of programming is still SD at this time and I'm sure you'll end up being disappointed. It will be sometime before it's an all or nothing situation. There's a good chance (I didn't look it up) that at this time you may even have trouble getting all the network stations in HD since only CBS and one Independent station are broadcasting a digital signal in your area.

Each of us has different priorities and ours are markedly different.

I still doubt you'll gain much traction for your views in an HD forum.
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post #916 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 07:09 PM
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Especially when most of us are routinely doing all the things easycruise says our equipment is incapable of doing ;>)

He's trying hard to talk himself out of jumping into HD. Let's just allow him to win his argument with himself, even if he has to use pretzel logic to do it.
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post #917 of 10358 Old 12-11-2004, 11:44 PM
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I love the 6412, but it seems that whenever I try to access the menu system while watching a DVR program that I've recorded (along with a few other seemingly random times), the box resets itself...anyone else having this problem?
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post #918 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 06:08 AM
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Nope. There were reports of random resets on some early models that had to do with marginal power supplies. A box swap cured it. There's more info in the earlier parts of the thread.
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post #919 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 06:28 AM
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I've had the new box for just over a week now and we're doing a month of "parallel testing" between it and the DirecTivo, of which I've had for two years.

So far, while the HD DVR doesn't have all the features I'd like, it's basically going to replace the DirecTivo. The one feature that I'd actually want to have added is the search by title. Adding in shows for the series recording was a bit awkward in having to go find them and then set them up but it got done.

Since I've got two young children (2 and 5), we record a lot of kids shows during the day. Still haven't gone over 50% in filling up the drive between that and the couple of primetime HD shows we watch. Those who watch a ton of stuff may have problems or record a lot of movies (I'm big on DVD as is) but for me this box is a winner.
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post #920 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 06:35 AM
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Chris,

Maybe I'm missing something in your explanation, but what's wrong with the search by title function? Once you find a single episode of any show, it's a snap to set up a series record.
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post #921 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 06:53 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by kellewa
Wondering if anyone else has experienced this problem w/ the 6412.

I have set up series recording for several shows, among them NYPD Blue, Lost and the West Wing to record first run only. Monday night I checked the recording schedule for the week and all three shows were scheduled to record. When I checked the box last night, I discovered it had not recorded NYPD Blue, even though it was new episode. I also saw that it was also now not scheduled to record Lost or the West Wing, again even though both are new episodes. Any thoughts on whether this could be a box problem or a problem with Iguide?


I have had problems using series recordings that are similar to yours. And I think the problem is the way NBC and recently ABC fiddle around with their schedules to have 59 and 61 min shows.

Guessing here, but my theory is you can't even program series if at any future time in the guide data there will be a conflict on at least one of the tuners. If you do get series programmed, then as new (future) data causes a conflict, it just skips a recording. ReplayTV does the same thing.
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post #922 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 07:22 AM
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I just had the 6412 installed and I love the dual tuner feaure. I did not receive the new remote, so I'm using my 6208 remote which, I guess works okay. I do have one problem though. When I scroll through the menu or through anything using the < > buttons, it scrolls through every channel. Same thing if I just press the channel up/down button. It's like those buttons are on some kind of quick search mode. Any on have any idea about this problem???? Please help!!!!
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post #923 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 07:41 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by frankz1
An interesting experiment for someone continually having this problem would be to change their "Switched Power" setting (I remember seeing it but not where I saw it) and see if that clears it up. Maybe there is a synch signal or some other piece of information in the cable signal every so often it's not getting while it's off (talking out of my you know what here), and it takes a while to find that again. If you use it before it's resynched, it becomes unstable.

Then again, maybe it is a power supply issue.

Is anyone having this problem who does not turn off / on the unit?

Comcast NJ - Union/Verona

The "switched/unswithched power" setting is for the outlet on the back of the 6412. I leave mine set to unswitched and have my TV plugged into it.

The 6412's that randomly reboot have a power supply issue. Just get it swapped out for another.
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post #924 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 10:01 AM
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(Series programming)
Perhaps the iGuide is the culprit for series recording problems. Compare its listings manually with what your DVR does automatically. Does the iGuide say a show is a repeat or new?
I give this possible hint because of my iGuide problem showing it isn't programmed well. For example, a theatrical film editing down for viewing on TV (from, say, R to TV-PG) only shows as "R" in the iGuide. So parental controls on the DVR think it's an "R" movie and not a "TV-PG" movie. And iGuide doesn't even list S, L, V, D, or FV.
The same may go for 59 and 61-minute shows. Does the iGuide list them as 59 or 61 minutes or is it just not a good TV guide from the Gemstar people (who are 51% owned by Comcast)?
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post #925 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 10:16 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by nielloeb
(Series programming)
Perhaps the iGuide is the culprit for series recording problems. Compare its listings manually with what your DVR does automatically. Does the iGuide say a show is a repeat or new?
I give this possible hint because of my iGuide problem showing it isn't programmed well. For example, a theatrical film editing down for viewing on TV (from, say, R to TV-PG) only shows as "R" in the iGuide. So parental controls on the DVR think it's an "R" movie and not a "TV-PG" movie. And iGuide doesn't even list S, L, V, D, or FV.
The same may go for 59 and 61-minute shows. Does the iGuide list them as 59 or 61 minutes or is it just not a good TV guide from the Gemstar people (who are 51% owned by Comcast)?

Comcast NJ - Union/Verona

TV Guide is certainly the culprit. They need to provide more complete and accurate data more like the way ZapToIt does with ReplayTV. Once TV Guide does this, many "Series Recordings" problems go away. The problem is, is TV Guide listening???
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post #926 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 10:33 AM
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Has anyone else had this issue or been able to resolve:

Watching live TV (an HD channel in this instance if it matters). "Info" shows correct guide / show information and pressing "Play" shows correct show duration information on progress meter. Then Pause program. "Info" goes to "To Be Announced" and show progress meter goes to full two hour block. Switch channels and then back again refreshes correct "Info" display.

UPDATE: Occurs with any keypress (FF, RW, Play, Pause). Hitting "Play" to bring up the progress meter even causes "To Be Announced"
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post #927 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 12:42 PM
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Is there a simple way of skipping to the start of the program buffer other than rewinding?
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post #928 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 12:45 PM
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Pause Live TV and Viewing Previously Recordings differences are curious.

For Pause Live TV, we read that 40min SD/15min HD buffers limit how far you can be "behind". Mikef5 notes that if you are going to fall too far behind (say, you have to leave and pick up later where you left off), that you can simply convert to recording and it will include the pause buffer contents as well. Very nice.

My question is this. If I Schedule a Recording, can I start to watch it before it has completed?

Note that this is a way to avoid any 40min SD/15min HD Pause Buffer limitation :-). Indeed, I regularly watch TV this way. I have no idea - at the time I schedule a recording - whether I'll be able to watch it at that time or not. But if I am, I don't want to have to wait 'til it has completed to start watching it.

Can any of you lucky 6412 w/iGuide users try this out for me?
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post #929 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 12:54 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by edmc
My question is this. If I Schedule a Recording, can I start to watch it before it has completed?

Note that this is a way to avoid any 40min SD/15min HD Pause Buffer limitation :-). Indeed, I regularly watch TV this way. I have no idea - at the time I schedule a recording - whether I'll be able to watch it at that time or not. But if I am, I don't want to have to wait 'til it has completed to start watching it.

Can any of you lucky 6412 w/iGuide users try this out for me?

I've done it already ... yes, it works. It's excellent for programs on commercial TV ... record a show, say an hour-long drama. Start watching the recording about 15 minutes in, fast-forward through the ads, and you'll catch up to the recording about 59 minutes in.
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post #930 of 10358 Old 12-12-2004, 12:58 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by edmc
My question is this. If I Schedule a Recording, can I start to watch it before it has completed?

That's pretty much the only way we watch TV in this house. That's the chief beauty of DVR over taping.
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