Panny HD1000 + DST51 tips? - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 34 Old 04-24-2001, 01:51 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi fellow owners of this combo. I'll be getting my set within 2 days. I'm getting excited just thinking about setting it all up & recording HD programs http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/biggrin.gif.

Do you guys have any tips/suggestions for me?

For starters, the seller told me that the HD1000 will only properly record if I use the menu in the DST51 to control things. Can I then use the HD1000's remote to pause, resume recording, etc.?

What about tapes? I'm planning on using Fuji ST-120 & 160 tapes? Are they good enough?

I'd appreciate any comments, suggestions, warnings, etc.

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post #2 of 34 Old 04-24-2001, 04:18 PM
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I do timer recordings with the TU-DST51, but you can use the VCR remote to manually start recording as well as control playback. The vrc controls in the stb menu are less convenient than the vcr remote. After a timer recording, the timer stays in the record mode--be sure to cancel this so that it won't come on a week later--it records by day of the week, not date--and record over a tape you may have left in the vcr for viewing. I use DVHS tapes, but many use svhs--do a forum search and you will find much discussion of this topic. Have fun!
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post #3 of 34 Old 04-24-2001, 05:32 PM
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The best tapes I've found are TDK and Fuji S-VHS tapes (T-120 and T-160). For T-180, I use Maxell's ST-182BQ broadcast tape. For anything over three hours, some people say regular T-210 S-VHS is OK. I splurge and get the JVC DF420 D-VHS.
For the lowest dropout rate, use a regular VCR to do a one-pass on the tape. This repacks the tape and removes particles that can cause dropouts. I had a very bad experience with Panasonic D-VHS tapes. They shed so much out of the box that the first ten minutes of my recordings had tons of dropouts. I re-recorded on the same tapes and the dropouts disappeared. I've been able to repeat this trend on other tapes, so I know my heads aren't clogged. Now I run every tape once through a regular VCR. No more dropouts.
Although I haven't needed to yet, it is possible to record up to four hours on DF480 tape; but I haven't seen this length for sale in the U.S.

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post #4 of 34 Old 04-24-2001, 06:03 PM
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Welcome Brajesh. You have an interesting website.

I agree with Dylan that a single pass on a new tape can reduce dropouts, provided it's done in a good quality machine. I don't recommend any of the $20 rewinders. It's strictly anecdotal but I had a bad experience with one.

You'll see lots of warnings about keeping these devices cool, particularly the STB. Mine are currently out in the open. When I place them in a cabinet I'll mount a fan somewhere.

Another warning: once you start watching HD, DVD's won't look so good anymore. http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/smile.gif

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post #5 of 34 Old 04-25-2001, 06:53 AM
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I was unable to get my setup to record properly when using the record button on the HD1000 remote. The recording would start, and the DST-51 would display D-VHS RECORDING on the screen, but on playback it was blank (no video no sound). Repeating the process using the DST-51 menu to initiate the recording worked great.

Has anyone else experienced this? Is there something in the HD1000 I have to set up?

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post #6 of 34 Old 04-25-2001, 07:29 AM
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A question and a remark.

The question, for those of you who are advocating that tapes be given a pass through a regular VCR before using them for D-VHS recording: do you simply mean tensioning the tape, i.e. fast-forwarding to the end and rewinding? Or do you mean there might be some particle-cleaning benefit to actually making a throw-away recording on the tape before using it for real?

The remark: I've had no problem using the PV-HD1000's timer for scheduling recordings. Usually I'll program the STB since I can also change channels this way. But the two-timer limitation in the STB is sometimes a problem. So if I need to make several recordings from the same HD channel (such as the Dish 5000's modulator output) and someone will be there to change tapes, I'll set up the programs on the PV-HD1000 (it has eight timers), leave the STB on, and leave a schedule of times that new tapes should be put into the VCR.

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post #7 of 34 Old 04-25-2001, 08:54 AM
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Ron,

If you fast-forward to the end and rewind, you'll repack the tape. This is good. If you do a throw away recording, this is better. You will remove more particulate this way.

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Dylan

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post #8 of 34 Old 04-25-2001, 03:13 PM
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I just FF and rewind on my JVC DH30000. The problem is that most of us here are working with limited data. I have three recorders and have made about 50 successful recordings on a variety of tapes from Fuji and TDK ST120 to JVC DF480 (only available in Japan). I had one failure on Fuji 120 when I used a cheap rewinder. Consequently I favor TDK and I bad mouth cheap rewinders!

There are others here who have made many hundreds of recordings, and speak from greater experience.

www.tapewarehouse.com has JVC ST210 tape as well as DVHS tapes up to DF420.

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post #9 of 34 Old 04-25-2001, 09:24 PM - Thread Starter
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Guys, thanks much for all your replies! Buddy, thanks again for the Panny combo itself! You were a pleasure to deal with.

Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">For anything over three hours, some people say regular T-210 S-VHS is OK.</font>
Where do you buy this tape? I've only found 120's & 160's.

Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">You have an interesting website...once you start watching HD, DVD's won't look so good anymore.</font>
Thanks...I'm already spoiled by HD; I've been using a DTC100 for a few months. DVHS is a good solution until we have HD-DVD.

Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">The question, for those of you who are advocating that tapes be given a pass through a regular VCR before using them for D-VHS recording: do you simply mean tensioning the tape, i.e. fast-forwarding to the end and rewinding?</font>
Wondering the same thing myself. Is it good enough to just fast-fwd a blank/new tape all the way to the end & rewind to beginning before recording on it?

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post #10 of 34 Old 04-26-2001, 12:34 AM
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I am using the HD1000 and DST50 combo here, driven by a DISH 5000/modulator. I also found that the record button on the 1000 remote cannot be relied upon. And that keeping the units cool is absolutely necessary; I had them stacked for a short time and was having problems.

I have not been pre-processing my Panasonic DF300 tapes. I find it wise to skip the first minute or so before recording, as the worst oxide problems are at the ends of the tape. This was always the case with VHS.

It took awhile, but I finally received a service manual for the 1000.
There is not much available for the 50.

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post #11 of 34 Old 04-26-2001, 01:56 AM
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I have no problems using the recorder's remote (and find it much easier than the STB menu). One thing you have to insure is that the VCR is set to the digital input. It defaults to analog. I think using the STB may activate the digital input, then return it to analog afterward. Use the INPUT button on your VCR remote to cycle through until "d" appears in the LED display on the VCR.

I start my recordings about a minute into the tape. Before recording, I "black-track" about the first 2 minutes of each tape. This ensures that on playback I can pre-roll the tape to get past the "DVHS-Playing" and channel ID graphics which the 50/51 insist on displaying whenever you hit play.

I "black-track" by setting the 5000 to the AUX input. The modulator is still throwing a carrier, just no MPEG stream. I record a couple of minutes of this, then I rewind back to about the 1 minute mark. When the program is about to begin, I start by hitting record, then immediately hitting pause. This allows me to come out of pause at just the right moment to (usually) cleanly hit the start of the show. For HBO & Showtime, I can usually hit this if I come out of pause just after the second ratings screen comes up.

I know this sounds like a lot of work, but the effect is worth it when you can start a film in the Home Theater the way it would look in a commercial theater.

Now, if only I could figure out how to get timer recordings to begin this cleanly... http://www.avsforum.com/ubb/wink.gif

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post #12 of 34 Old 04-26-2001, 06:31 AM
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Hi Buddy, I have the same problem with HD recorder it's not recording but it is playing back old recordings I tried second VCR with the same problem.
So I think it is related to tuner DST51. Any suggestions ?
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post #13 of 34 Old 04-26-2001, 11:17 AM
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I've had no problem using the HD1000's remote to start recordings, and that's with 3 different recorders and both a 50 and a 51 STB. As Peter has noted, make sure the recorder's input is set to iLink. If it isn't set that way it will still playback properly and the STB will still throw up messages like "DVHS Recording" etc., but recording will be black.

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post #14 of 34 Old 04-26-2001, 12:38 PM
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As mentioned above KEEP THE DST51 COOL. Here is what I did. Radio Shack sells a side exiting 12v blower. I bought that and a plug-in power supply that has a voltage adjust switch. I velcro'ed the fan to the top of the DST51 air vent holes and run it on 6 volts to quite it down. This keeps the DST51 cool.

The DST51 does have better internal cooling than the DST50 but still not good enough for prolonged life.

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post #15 of 34 Old 04-26-2001, 01:39 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks for all the cool tips.

Re: the blower, I assume it sucks hot air out as opposed to blowing room air in?

Also, how would I clean the HD1000's heads when they get dirty? The same way as with VHS/SVHS decks (using cleaning tape or soft cloth & clear alcohol)? I guess I'd see more dropouts when it nears time to clean.

[This message has been edited by Brajesh (edited 04-26-2001).]

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post #16 of 34 Old 04-26-2001, 03:26 PM
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I've had good luck with the JVC DFC-2A DVHS Cleaning Tape. A couple of 15 second passes with this tape has made it possible for all three of my machines to read each others tapes without dropouts.

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post #17 of 34 Old 04-26-2001, 09:26 PM
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Thanks a lot, I don't have a manual for it. and the second just arrived and I never think about looking for it.
I have both at work and will check it on monday.
best regards Artur.
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post #18 of 34 Old 04-26-2001, 09:52 PM
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Artur -

Did you check the input on the HD1000? See my previous post in this thread.

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post #19 of 34 Old 04-27-2001, 08:06 AM - Thread Starter
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gridleak, can you tell me where I can buy the DVHS cleaning tape you wrote about. Thanks. I called Tape World & they had no idea DVHS cleaning tapes even existed.

Never mind...found it @ tapewarehouse.com.

[This message has been edited by Brajesh (edited 04-27-2001).]

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post #20 of 34 Old 04-27-2001, 12:34 PM
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Brajesh,

Tape Warehouse has them. I didn't see any on the web site, but I was just in there the other day and saw them on the shelf. Give them a call at 1-800-659-TAPE (8273).

Buddy

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post #21 of 34 Old 04-27-2001, 12:41 PM
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OK, I did find it on the web site after all.

Shop the online store: Category is "A/V Accessories", Product Line is "Cleaning & Maint Supplies". The item is about halfway down, and is called "JVC DFC-2A DVHS Cleaning Tape [#4683800523]".




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post #22 of 34 Old 04-28-2001, 09:53 PM - Thread Starter
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Buddy, thanks, ordered the cleaning tape online. The Panny DST51 & HD1000 combo work great btw. Thanks much again. I'm taping a few things to test & I'm happy with the results so far.

Couple of notes though...
1. My TV can't do 720p (only 480p & 1080i), so the DST51 downconverts to 480p right? I wish it upconverted to 1080i like the DTC100, but oh well
2. When a digital channel has sub-channels, the HD1000 records all subchannels, which I'm not too fond of, but again, that's not a big deal

I can't really complain because the recording features outweight these small drawbacks. I feel so privileged to be able to record HD.

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post #23 of 34 Old 04-30-2001, 05:06 AM - Thread Starter
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Is there a way to clear the timer on the DST51? I setup Timer 1 to program something, but can't seem to find a way to clear the date/time/channel fields.

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post #24 of 34 Old 04-30-2001, 05:10 AM
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I've never found a way, apart from powering the box off for (literally) weeks or months.

I just change the mode from "Record" to "Off" to be safe. As others have noted, if you don't do this, the timer will run again at the same time a week later.

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post #25 of 34 Old 04-30-2001, 11:42 AM
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cymro -

Has your replaced 50 ever behaved in a way which would confirm the suspicion about copy protection?

Seems like lot of folks here (myself included) share the suspicion that Panasonic would take the opportunity to add copy protection to any repaired units. But I wonder whether there's any way to prove this?

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post #26 of 34 Old 04-30-2001, 11:53 AM
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Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Originally posted by cymro:
I have two 50's. In both units, the timer automatically reverts to the OFF state after a recording is complete; however the original timing data is still displayed until I change it.
</font>
It's interesting that different units behave differently in this regard. I have a 50 and a 51, both upgraded by Panasonic, and both remain in the "Record" state after a timer has run. Only by programming a change in the data can I cancel the timer. If I cared more, I might suggest we try to narrow down the difference to a particular manufacturing date or model number or EPROM id or something.

My units also exhibit a nasty behavior that may be a consequence of the failure to cancel the timer after the programmed time has passed. If I program the STB timer so that the tape runs out (rather than programming it to stop recording just before the end of the tape), then the next time I insert a new tape in the machine the STB starts recording on it immediately and can only be stopped via the STOP button.

I have damaged more than one recording this way and for this reason I usually try to program the STB to record until just before the end of the tape (by contrast with ordinary S-VHS recording on my JVC decks, in which I usually just program it to run the tape out completely, and then eject it).

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post #27 of 34 Old 04-30-2001, 11:58 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
<font face="Verdana, Arial" size="2">Seems like lot of folks here (myself included) share the suspicion that Panasonic would take the opportunity to add copy protection to any repaired units.</font>
Does this even matter? The 5C copy protection was never adopted & even it was later, I'm not sure it'd do the job properly with what I've read is an unfinalized version on the STBs in question.

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post #28 of 34 Old 04-30-2001, 12:41 PM
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Ron,

I have the identical problem with my rig. If I either run out of tape or stop recording manually, before the timer off time, it starts recording as soon as I turn it on (with a recordable tape in it) the next time.

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post #29 of 34 Old 04-30-2001, 09:16 PM
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Re Timers,

I have two 50's. In both units, the timer automatically reverts to the OFF state after a recording is complete; however the original timing data is still displayed until I change it.

Re Heat,

Even without anything stacked on it, my first 50 exhibited the famous blue sparklies after being on for only fifteen minutes. Panasonic replaced it with another 50 which has no problems. I suspect the replacement has copy protection.

My second 50 exhibited a lesser case of blue sparklies after a few hours. I cured this with a fan.
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post #30 of 34 Old 05-01-2001, 10:21 AM - Thread Starter
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All this talk about anomalies/problems got me thinking...what's one to do if the Panny HD1000 or DST50/51 become defective. Will Panasonic even repair them now (since they're not making them anymore), & what happens to many of us who bought these used (with no warranty/card)?

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