Using Panasonic HDTV recording system to record Standard Definition - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 24 Old 07-23-2001, 06:21 PM - Thread Starter
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Hi Everyone,

I am new to the forum and have some a basic recording question. Is the above possible? How is it accomlished? Does Dish Network transmit Standard definition in Dolby Digital? Can I record 6 hours on one tape? Can I use S-VHS tapes? If so do they have to be modified in some way? If I need D-VHS tapes, what is a good source?

Thanks,

Dave
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post #2 of 24 Old 07-23-2001, 07:42 PM
 
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Alot of ?s

1) You can record with SVHS

2) You can not record 480i dish

3) You can record OTA 480i
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post #3 of 24 Old 07-23-2001, 08:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by rodmanbra:

2) You can not record 480i dish
Not quite true, Bra. The Dish channels with Dolby Digital are recordable. The basic requirement for the Panny combo is MPEG-2 video + AC-3 audio.

RDave, if you record SDTV from Dish you will not be able to record reliably in STD mode; only HS will work properly. Therefore you will be limited to about 4hours record time on a DF480 tape.

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post #4 of 24 Old 07-24-2001, 09:54 PM
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You can also record SDTV/EDTV from your local DTV stations, in addition to any HDTV they offer.

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post #5 of 24 Old 07-25-2001, 12:50 PM - Thread Starter
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I read in a previous post that the Dish 5000+modulator only outputs the HDTV HBO and Showtime channels. How would you access the Standard Definition channels bitstream to record it including the 5.1 Dolby Digital bitstream?

Thanks,

Dave

[This message has been edited by RDave (edited 07-25-2001).]
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post #6 of 24 Old 07-25-2001, 02:26 PM
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The HD modulator will also output a few Dish channels that have Dolby Digital audio, an example is the standard Showtime East channel.

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post #7 of 24 Old 07-26-2001, 10:05 AM
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Dave,

Sorry I didn't make myself clear enough. Ken H is right; if you tune to Showtime East or one of the PPV channels with Dolby Digital, the 8-VSB modulator will transmit it on channel 3 or 4 and the Panasonic tuner can pick it up. There are other Dish channels which will give you video through the TU-DST5x, but if the Dish channel doesn't have AC-3 audio you will not get sound through the Panasonic tuner.
As I said before, the Panasonic only likes channels with MPEG-2 video and AC-3 audio, as that's what the ATSC spec requires.

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post #8 of 24 Old 07-27-2001, 12:17 AM - Thread Starter
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Have many of the forum members with Panasonic setups been able to record very many Standard Definition movies from the Dish Network (I realize that HDTV is preferable)? I read in another post that someone recorded 800 movies in Standard Definition (and I'm assuming 5.1 audio) with a Hughes Platinum/Hitachi 205 D-VHS system off of DirecTV.
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post #9 of 24 Old 07-27-2001, 05:54 AM
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The Hughes DVHS recorder is different than the Panasonic, in that it will only record standard definition.

In addition to Hughes, RCA & I think Hitachi also offered the same unit under their brands, for use with DirecTV. The DVHS unit connected to the DirecTV receiver via a data cable (DB-9 or DB-15?).

Dish Network had their DVHS unit made by JVC, it was an all in one box (receiver & DVHS) solution.

The DirecTV boxes never really took off, Dish was more successful, until their Dishplayer units were introduced.

I don't think very many people use the Panasonic to record standard definition programming. It does not come up as a topic here at AVS.

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post #10 of 24 Old 07-28-2001, 07:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Can anyone tell me exactly All of the programing that is accessible through the HDTV port of the Dish 5000 modulator?

Thanks,

Dave
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post #11 of 24 Old 07-28-2001, 02:03 PM - Thread Starter
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Ken K,

Thanks for your response. I guess I would not absolutly have to put up 2 more dishes (-WAF + I am keeping DirecTV). I could get away with only the 61.5 dish if I am only interested in HDTV and SD with 5.1 audio, though the remainder if the HBO/Showtime package that I would be paying for would go unreceived. I have to keep DirecTV because it is very Family user friendly (S-linked to my Sony system with 2 UHF remotes). Is there any other solution?

Dave
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post #12 of 24 Old 07-28-2001, 03:22 PM
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But Dave, again if you only put a dish up at 61.5 you will NOT get the SD DD5.1 channels of HBO, Show, or Starz. Only the HD channels. You're probably confusing what Ken said about the 5000 and modulators' ability to pass SD 5.1 channels along, with the fact that he meant of course, if you had a dish pointing to the satellites that those channels are on to begin with... which is not 61.5

Yes, you're correct about foregoing the rest of the Showtime, HBO SD channels if you only point at 61.5..but that includes foregoing the SD 5.1 ones as well.

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post #13 of 24 Old 07-28-2001, 07:38 PM - Thread Starter
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Dan,

thanks for clearing that point up. Now I am considering also gettng a Dish 6000 (in addition to the 5000/Panasonic recording system) for the family to use, and dumping DirecTV. I am sure other Forum members have done this.
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post #14 of 24 Old 07-28-2001, 09:00 PM
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Exactly? No, but here's what I know.

The 4 HDTV channels:
HBO 9440
Showtime 9430
PPV Movies 9428
Demo Loop 9443

The SD PPV Movies that have Dolby Digital audio. This changes as the roster of movies changes:
Channels between 500 & 600.

SD premium channels:
HBO-E 300
Showtime-E 318
Showtime-W 319
Showtime-E is normally available, HBO-E can change depending on if a DD audio track is available. Not sure about Showtime-W, but it was on this morning.

Their may be others, for example, I don't subscribe to Startz from Dish, so I don't know about them.

Again, not too much interest in this on the HDTV Forum.


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[This message has been edited by Ken H (edited 07-28-2001).]

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post #15 of 24 Old 07-31-2001, 07:08 PM
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For ideas on how to use less dishes and get more programming, see:
http://www.geocities.com/dbs_tech/

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post #16 of 24 Old 08-27-2001, 10:37 PM
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Can SD DVHS tapes, that were made on the Hughes deck or the JVC combo, be played back on our PV HD1000's? Anybody tried this?

Thanks,

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post #17 of 24 Old 08-28-2001, 05:55 AM
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Don't know, perhaps someone has tried it.

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post #18 of 24 Old 08-28-2001, 08:36 AM
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The answer is no. The Hughes/Hitachi/RCA D-VHS decks use a proprietary format on the tape. It records guide information and, I believe the data is encrypted on the tape, as an access card is required to watch the tapes on the Hughes E45.
Even if the data were not encrypted, the audio standards on most of the DirecTV channels are incompatible (the TU-DST5x is expecting AC-3 audio data).

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post #19 of 24 Old 08-28-2001, 11:53 AM
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No also for the JVC combo Dish reciever/recorder.

Mark
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post #20 of 24 Old 09-01-2001, 07:41 PM
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Does anyone have a pointer to how exactly to hook up/configure the Dish 5000/HDTV modulator with the panny system? I haven't been able to get the standard def stuff except through the composite video port.

Also, could someone point me to where I could find out how (or even if) I can record from other sources onto the pany DVHS machine? I've tried a DSR-20 firewire out into it, but have been unable to figure it out. Maybe I'm missing something basic here?

Thanks so much.

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post #21 of 24 Old 09-01-2001, 08:08 PM
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The config for the Dish 5000 & Panasonic DVHS/DTV tuner is as follows:

61.5 or 148 satellite location for HDTV from Dish Network, into the 5000 satellite input, on coax.

5000 HD Modulator 8VSB output, on coax, into the DTV RF input of the Panasonic DTV tuner.

IEEE1394 link between Panasonic DTV tuner & DVHS VCR.

That's it, unless you want to also get local OTA DTV into the system. Then you can use an a/b switch or combine the local DTV 8VSB RF with the 5000 8VSB RF and run both into the Panasonic DTV tuner. If combining, you have to be lucky enough to live in an area that does not have a DTV station on or near ch 3 or 4, or better yet, all your DTV stations are on the UHF band. Then you can strip the VHF off and run both into the DTV tuner on one coax.

As far as I know, there is no other way to record with the Panasonic DVHS unit, other than from the DTV tuner. The Panasonic equipment uses a proprietary IEEE1394 communication protocol.



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post #22 of 24 Old 09-01-2001, 08:22 PM
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Thanks Ken. I really appreciate the help. I think I have most of the HD stuff together. I'm now trying to figure out how to do the SD besides through composite. Is there another way that anyone knows of?

Bummer about the proprietary protocol on the HD1000. Very disappointing. It's too bad nobody has come up with a way around that.

Thanks again :-)


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Just when you think it's safe, your teenager gets busted for decrypting rot-13.

I think that I will never see
A sight as lovely as HD
Now if my panny STB
Would just record DirecTV
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post #23 of 24 Old 09-01-2001, 08:52 PM
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If you read the earlier parts of this topic, it will explain what the standard programing is, that can be recorded with the system in question.

If you want to digitally tape all the standard channels from Dish, the JVC unit is the only way.

If you want to digitally tape all the standard channels from DirecTV, the other DVHS units from RCA, Hughes & Hitachi, along with one of the receivers mentioned is the only way.

If you want digital standard DBS, why not use a PVR?

In any event, I don't recommend using the Panasonic/Dish HDTV rig for standard digital recording of any type. It's simply too valuable.

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post #24 of 24 Old 09-02-2001, 12:57 PM
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I would use a PVR if I could get the data off to archive in a good, high quality format. I'm not hardware oriented enough to be able to put an ethernet card into my TIVO, and the S Video out isn't quite what I'd hoped for. I'd really like to be able to output directly onto MiniDV for later editing.

I'm off to the TIVO forum to see if anyone else has ideas on getting the standard def stuff off the TIVO. Thanks :-)

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Just when you think it's safe, your teenager gets busted for decrypting rot-13.

I think that I will never see
A sight as lovely as HD
Now if my panny STB
Would just record DirecTV
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