Sony DHG-HDD250/500: Official Thread - Page 980 - AVS | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #29371 of 29387 Old 01-20-2015, 10:51 AM
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Originally Posted by mickinct View Post
I'm in CT
Figured that from your location. My zipcode is under my name. See if it's worth it. If they were smaller or I had the original boxes I would mail them. They aren't exactly PO friendly.
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post #29372 of 29387 Old 01-20-2015, 10:57 AM
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Mine 06118 I had 6 of these I sold them for 500-600$ just before TVGOS went out, I only have 1 now 250gb unit for OTA rec. Funny thing I found out is that the HDMI output is NOT protected from recording, because I use a hauppauge colossus card with HDMI input and no problems, full 1080i in surround sound.

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post #29373 of 29387 Old 01-26-2015, 05:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Ray1938 View Post
An RCA Compact RF Modulator (CRF907R) can be attached to any DVD player that has Video/Audio jacks to get the Ch3/Ch4 RF signal format. Amazon sells this device for about $10.
This works quite well.

I was looking for a alternate use for another of my Sonys, now I’ve found one.

Not exactly sure what I’ll use it for, but you can copy DVD’s, VHS tapes, ....I even connected my ROKU and copied some Netflix stuff to the Sony harddrive !

Just playin’ around with it now, .......maybe I’ll think of another use.
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post #29374 of 29387 Old 02-08-2015, 11:15 AM
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I think I will sell mine. I know it functions properly; the former owner’s recordings are fabulous. The problem is, with indoor antennas, connected to my TV direct is far better, and more stable, and I never figured out how to get it to record beyond 30 minutes. For someone who does not know much about these units, it is a big pain.
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post #29375 of 29387 Old 02-08-2015, 11:53 AM
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Originally Posted by InfinityBob View Post
I think I will sell mine. I know it functions properly; the former owner’s recordings are fabulous. The problem is, with indoor antennas, connected to my TV direct is far better, and more stable, and I never figured out how to get it to record beyond 30 minutes. For someone who does not know much about these units, it is a big pain.
If you still have it. The red button held down brings up a panel with a thirty minute default. You can change the end time to tomorrow if you want.
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post #29376 of 29387 Old 02-08-2015, 01:30 PM
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Thanks, I will try it. The main thing, my simple indoor antennas work better with the TV tuner in both my Samsung and LG tvs. My health is too bad to try putting up an outdoor antenna, and here in Dothan, all you get is 7 to 9 broadcast channels.

Mainly, I buy blurays, several a week, and play several movies each day.
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post #29377 of 29387 Old 02-09-2015, 07:50 PM
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Thanks, I will try it. The main thing, my simple indoor antennas work better with the TV tuner in both my Samsung and LG tvs. My health is too bad to try putting up an outdoor antenna, and here in Dothan, all you get is 7 to 9 broadcast channels.

Mainly, I buy blurays, several a week, and play several movies each day.

Unfortuantely, the digital tuners in many HDTV recorders such as the Sony, are not as sensitive as the tuners in most TV sets. Some people buy outdoor antennas and install them in their attic or second floor, rather than on the roof of the home. Depending on how far you are from the transmitters, it may improve the reception of a typical broadcast channels in your area
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post #29378 of 29387 Old 02-15-2015, 08:51 AM
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I have problems on a few local stations with multipath. The tuner in my DHG500 delivers flawless PQ. My TiVo Premier XL is a total mess on ABC and too broken up to watch a few other stations. Score one for 9-year old technology over modern cost-cutting.

"Most people would die sooner than think, in fact they do so."  Bertrand Russell The ABC of Relativity, 1925

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post #29379 of 29387 Old 02-15-2015, 06:55 PM
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Originally Posted by joecass View Post

Unfortunately, the digital tuners in many HDTV recorders such as the Sony,

are not as sensitive as the tuners in most TV sets.


Yeah, I noticed this with my DHG250 versus my Vizio M401i-A3 (2013). I did a test with indoor rabbit ears antenna hung upside down from the ceiling to test the two tuners. The Sony tuner is crap. Only picked up a handful of stations while the Vizio nearly got all my locals!


.

- Pj
Win7 Pro and FireFox 35.x.x on Desktop. 2013 Vizio M-Series M401i-A3 (40-inch) TV. My Firmware: V1.34.44.0080. The M401i-A3 Thread. My Latest Settings (For the A3 Panel).
The Vizio M-Series Razor Thread covers all Models 2013 & 2014. I have a ClearStream-4 connected to DTX9950 to Composite-In of Philips 3576H; local Cable to RF-In.
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post #29380 of 29387 Old 02-15-2015, 09:15 PM
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Originally Posted by CleCakYngMfd View Post
Yeah, I noticed this with my DHG250 versus my Vizio M401i-A3 (2013). I did a test with indoor rabbit ears antenna hung upside down from the ceiling to test the two tuners. The Sony tuner is crap. Only picked up a handful of stations while the Vizio nearly got all my locals!


.

Well, you have to figure most newer TV's are almost 10 yrs ahead of the Sony's 2004 tuner technology, None of my recorders from various manufacturers are as good as my flat screen TV sets. Also have a few standalone HD tuners from that era, they're not as good either. Only unit that comes close is a Zenith DTT900 Digital Converter Box from around 2008, when the digital transition was happening....
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post #29381 of 29387 Old Yesterday, 07:14 AM
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The tuner thing is funny.

I have OTA using a Radio Shack "fringe" antenna on the roof. It splits to four TV outlets, with no amplifier, and one FM tuner.

My HDD-250, Tivo Premiere, Tivo Series 3, and a Sony HDTV (first generation rear projection) all get the major channels from NYC, with 70-90 on the feedback. No difference or issues.

We have three low power stations. RF 3 is stable on all sets, partly because I have that old school "fringe" antenna with vhf lo elements. RF 2 is a translator of a long island station, and I'm out of the range. My HDD will see this and sometimes lock a picture, some times not.
The Tivos don't see this at all, but the Sony TV will.
Channel 50.1, a NJ public TV station which is off axis, comes in on the Tivo units, but NOT the Sony units. (RF 50)

So, the Sony units are more sensitive on VHF Lo, but the Tivos do better on UHF.

After the whole "digital transition", here in NY we still have RF 2, 3, 7, and 13.

In Vienna we sit, in late night cafe. Straight Connection, on T.E.E.
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post #29382 of 29387 Old Yesterday, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by speedlaw View Post
The tuner thing is funny.

I have OTA using a Radio Shack "fringe" antenna on the roof. It splits to four TV outlets, with no amplifier, and one FM tuner.

My HDD-250, Tivo Premiere, Tivo Series 3, and a Sony HDTV (first generation rear projection) all get the major channels from NYC, with 70-90 on the feedback. No difference or issues.

We have three low power stations. RF 3 is stable on all sets, partly because I have that old school "fringe" antenna with vhf lo elements. RF 2 is a translator of a long island station, and I'm out of the range. My HDD will see this and sometimes lock a picture, some times not.
The Tivos don't see this at all, but the Sony TV will.
Channel 50.1, a NJ public TV station which is off axis, comes in on the Tivo units, but NOT the Sony units. (RF 50)

So, the Sony units are more sensitive on VHF Lo, but the Tivos do better on UHF.

After the whole "digital transition", here in NY we still have RF 2, 3, 7, and 13.

I live in NYC itself, there are no analog RF stations left that I know of. Also have an older-type roof antenna, but my OTA reception is hindered by a huge public park that goes up a steep incline. I'm only 12 miles from the transmitters in Manhattan, seems like you get better reception from 40 miles away than I do. But.... I use several amplifiers in multiple setups, my 2010 Sony Bravia is less sensitive than a 2008 Samsung LCD set. The Samsung gets most OTA stations under less-than-ideal conditions, whereas the Sony does not.
If you go into the Menus on the DHG recorder, you can see which frequency each station is tuned to. VHF-low is fairly good, but VHF-Hi and UHF seem to be problematic for my system. Other than getting free broadcast HDTV channels, I don't see any advantage to digital technology. There were never any problems with the old analog broadcast system, where the picture was pixellated or went out entirely like it does now.
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post #29383 of 29387 Old Yesterday, 01:59 PM
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I'm a few hundred feet up and my antenna points directly down river, so I'm clearly benefitting from the natural waveguide that is the Hudson River Valley. I am line of sight, almost, with the ESB, 45 or so air miles off. Pretty direct, and I don't get much RF from any other direction. I accidentally discovered this when someone gave me a small outdoor TV antenna. I was awestruck how much better the OTA picture was over the cable TV picture...this in the days of analog only and the CATV company not caring much about noise or other interference. Since then, I've always had an antenna.

You are only catching knife edge reflections...a much tougher place to be and with a much higher overall signal strength in your area, mulitpath isn't your friend. Have you tried, or can you, move the antenna ? At these frequencies, a few feet, or ten, can make all the difference in the world.

Analog was way past its due date....it had to die, although possibly DVB-T on the VHF low and VHF high band was a better idea. That is a dispute for another time, but HDTV in some form was due.

The bigger danger to OTA viewing is that TV stations are currently being "re packed" so that the upper UHF can be sold to cell phone interests....some will be bought out, others will share on one RF channel a subchannel-Congress is raising money by selling channels...

Any way you look at it, though, the OTA viewer will lose. Less choice, or three blurry channels on one frequency ; yea, just what we were promised with HDTV....

In Vienna we sit, in late night cafe. Straight Connection, on T.E.E.
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post #29384 of 29387 Old Yesterday, 07:00 PM
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Originally Posted by speedlaw View Post
I'm a few hundred feet up and my antenna points directly down river, so I'm clearly benefitting from the natural waveguide that is the Hudson River Valley. I am line of sight, almost, with the ESB, 45 or so air miles off. Pretty direct, and I don't get much RF from any other direction. I accidentally discovered this when someone gave me a small outdoor TV antenna. I was awestruck how much better the OTA picture was over the cable TV picture...this in the days of analog only and the CATV company not caring much about noise or other interference. Since then, I've always had an antenna.

You are only catching knife edge reflections...a much tougher place to be and with a much higher overall signal strength in your area, mulitpath isn't your friend. Have you tried, or can you, move the antenna ? At these frequencies, a few feet, or ten, can make all the difference in the world.

Analog was way past its due date....it had to die, although possibly DVB-T on the VHF low and VHF high band was a better idea. That is a dispute for another time, but HDTV in some form was due.

The bigger danger to OTA viewing is that TV stations are currently being "re packed" so that the upper UHF can be sold to cell phone interests....some will be bought out, others will share on one RF channel a subchannel-Congress is raising money by selling channels...

Any way you look at it, though, the OTA viewer will lose. Less choice, or three blurry channels on one frequency ; yea, just what we were promised with HDTV....

Besides multipath, my problem is not having access to the antenna, as I'm just a tenant. I asked the homeowner many years ago if I could put up a new roof antenna (preferably with a rotator and amplifier) but the answer was "no". It's a crappy old antenna to begin with. I've tried indoor antennas, but they get one or two channels at most. If I had line-of-sight, I'd get much better reception. So, with the current weather trend, my OTA signals are marginal at best. I never watch live TV, I record everything using my extensive arsenal of digital recorders.


Didn't understand from the beginning of the DTV transition, why the OTA channels here were split between VHF and UHF. In the analog days, VHF was 2 - 13, UHF was 14 - 69. It should have stayed that way, basically I don't care about what's on 14 - 69, as they are mostly foreign language channels and other junk like Home Shopping Network or NYC.gov programming.
CBS HD, OTA Ch 2.1, is broadcast on RF33. If I do an OTA channel scan, there is no Ch 2 in the channel list.


Years ago when I first bought my Sony DHG, things were perfect, as I had OTA and QAM cable. Now QAM cable is gone, my cableco doesn't support cable cards for the Sony, and there is no more TV Guide. That's what I call..... PROGRESS !
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post #29385 of 29387 Old Yesterday, 08:56 PM
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The split of channels is a historical oddity. The first set, VHF lo and high, were pretty much at the limits of consumer electronics. Recall how expensive a TV set was...it was a big deal. I recall my grandparents had COLOR....that was a big, fat hairy deal.... 56- 200 mhz....

UHF was relegated to novelty because a UHF tuner wasn't very stable at the time, and the frequencies, again, were at the leading edge of stability for consumer electronics. It is also a lot more expensive to broadcast at UHF, you need way more power, and the frequencies are more line of sight (which is your current problem). The VHF channels were a bit better with hilly terrain, and the VHF low better still. This is why the networks wanted the low channels, in the beginning. UHF was trash with the tech of the 50's to 70's-pretty much until the microchip showed up and TV went from 'cranky, call the TV shop again to peak the circuits" to mostly indestructible.

I'm a ham, and recall one hill on a particular highway, about 60 miles from NYC. I could get the FM sound channels from 2, 4 5 and 7, but interestingly, at different points as I went down the hill-clearly the frequencies bent differently over the hills between my car and the NYC transmitters. I recall channel 4/5 was the winner, by a large margin, for coverage. Likewise, 6 from Albany could be heard before any of the other Albany stations, when going north. (sadly, this too was lost in digital transition)

I'm sorry to hear that you can't do much with the antenna. The QAM scam is "sell them a signal, then force rent them a box to descramble it". We had that in my area, they went fully digital, then scrambled everything. The reason was to monetize all those bedroom and kitchen TV sets. Oh, there was discussion about how it was about piracy, but not really....Interestingly, in my area broadcast channels are still in the clear....although I understand that in NYC that is not the case. (Cable co's fought the FCC on this one, and this was the accommodation)

They gave you a box "free" for a year, then it became a perpetual $8 per month/$96.00 per year fee. Between scrambling everything to make me rent a box, being hiked to "full price" with no break unless I actually ported (not just threatened to) my phone numbers to fios, and finally, charging a $5 per month "sports fee" for a non sports household, I cut the cord.....the cable co still charged me "more" for internet than if a "triple play", but at the end, phone is way cheaper still, and even paying for Hulu and Netflix, I'm very much ahead.

Nope, we don't miss cable.... at all...but I don't watch sports, and my kids migrated to on demand streaming years ago. Everything you might want is covered by streaming, mostly legally, and if you don't care, then everything is out there somewhere.

In Vienna we sit, in late night cafe. Straight Connection, on T.E.E.

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post #29386 of 29387 Old Today, 07:37 AM
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Yes, it's all true.... I remember buying my parents a Zenith 25" console TV around 1980 that cost me $1000.... big bucks in those days. My Dad was enamored with the Zenith "Space Command" remote control that enabled him to zoom the picture. All he needed was a rabbit ears antenna to get reception. UHF was something we didn't bother with until later on in the 80's.

My cableco (TWC-NYC) gave me free Cisco "digital transport adapters" for a year, then the fee beginning 2015 was $.99 each. Somehow the fee has increased to $2.75 per month.
I'm keeping cable for the time being, with this crazy weather my OTA is very unstable. I have a system where I can record 480i directly from the cable box into a variety of DVD recorders using the S-Video output. It's not HD, but it's better than nothing. Also, the Ciscos have an RF Ch3 output which can be fed into any type of recorder with a tuner. While the pic is quite unspectacular, again it's better than no recordings at all.

Not that it's important, but I'm curious as to what the USB port is for on the Sony DHG machines, the manual states "for future use", I guess that never came to pass. I'd also like to know where the Sony factory software resides (presumably in RAM memory?) because, reading the manual, it states the software is largely GNU free license variations of Linux.
If there were some method of accessing the software from a computer, perhaps the correct time and date could be set without the need of the defunct TV Guide system. I know I've mentioned this quite a few times here, it just bugs the hell out of me that the Sony apparently can't be hacked.
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post #29387 of 29387 Old Today, 07:46 AM
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Yes, it's all true.... I remember buying my parents a Zenith 25" console TV around 1980 that cost me $1000.... big bucks in those days. My Dad was enamored with the Zenith "Space Command" remote control that enabled him to zoom the picture. All he needed was a rabbit ears antenna to get reception. UHF was something we didn't bother with until later on in the 80's.

My cableco (TWC-NYC) gave me free Cisco "digital transport adapters" for a year, then the fee beginning 2015 was $.99 each. Somehow the fee has increased to $2.75 per month.
I'm keeping cable for the time being, with this crazy weather my OTA is very unstable. I have a system where I can record 480i directly from the cable box into a variety of DVD recorders using the S-Video output. It's not HD, but it's better than nothing. Also, the Ciscos have an RF Ch3 output which can be fed into any type of recorder with a tuner. While the pic is quite unspectacular, again it's better than no recordings at all.

Not that it's important, but I'm curious as to what the USB port is for on the Sony DHG machines, the manual states "for future use", I guess that never came to pass. I'd also like to know where the Sony factory software resides (presumably in RAM memory?) because, reading the manual, it states the software is largely GNU free license variations of Linux.
If there were some method of accessing the software from a computer, perhaps the correct time and date could be set without the need of the defunct TV Guide system. I know I've mentioned this quite a few times here, it just bugs the hell out of me that the Sony apparently can't be hacked.
The USB port was used to update the firmware-when things went digital, the TVGOS, which was embedded in the blanking pulse of the NTSC signal, had to find a new home. It was encoded in the CBS Network signals when ATSC began to be used. Don't think in this closed machine that it has any use other than that allowed by the CableCard Labs or the nice folks who gave us HDCP.

Also, hacking the HDD is sort of a moot point. You can easier put together a Home Theater PC system for OTA channels, and as far as piracy goes, the current standards only make it inconvenient for the casual user. Hook your PC up to the TV set, and you can stream or torrent anything. This was less of an option when the HDD was fresh....

There had to be a definite contract between TVGOS and Sony, as they released the updated firmware without any announcement, and to great surprise here. It was almost ten years to the day when TVGOS went away. I think one of the issues was that the HDD box was not individually addressable-not that we get to see the confidential agreements between content holders, but it is clear that if you have a cablecard, you need cableLabs certification, and if you use HDMI, you must accomodate the HDCP protocols. The second one is easy, now as the chips are all so designed (at least in the US market-there are others outside the US), but the HDD boxes were never tied, really to a mother ship. Even TiVo relies on permission from the mother ship to live......

Note this is why most, if not all, of the aftermarket DVR units don't bother with a cablecard.

In Vienna we sit, in late night cafe. Straight Connection, on T.E.E.

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