Prometheus *PLOT SPOILERS* discussion - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 472 Old 06-08-2012, 07:34 PM - Thread Starter
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This thread is completely filled with untagged spoilers. You've been warned if you haven't seen it. The unspoiled Prometheus thread can be found here.

~~~~

Wow. I avoided all previews and info on Ridley Scott's latest release Prometheus (the prequel to some of my childhood favorite movies Alien & Aliens), so I had no idea what it was about. Now that I've seen it, I can say the direction they took the story was completely unexpected. I still haven't read any reviews so I don't know how it is being received.

Despite the nods given to various classic plot elements of the earlier films (basketball playing from A4, an android which is from all the movies, small drop ship landing filled with a team from A2, "gut wrenching" terror scene from A1, ship filled with pods from A1 & A2, etc.), Prometheus is a movie that definitely stands on its own. While A3 was criticized in part for being a remake of A1, and A4 for being too much like A2 (I didn't like either of those films), I doubt fans of the series make those claims here.

What struck me most about this rather slow paced, barely-actiony movie is how it turns out to be not an origin story about the aliens but an origin story about the human race. Not only does it try to be a bit more cerebral than most science-fiction films, but more spiritual as well. Sure, anyone who has seen 2001 will right away see its influence on the overall narrative, but the film makers clearly took the concept in its own direction.

There were quite a few philosophical / religious / social issues and questions that were implied or directly brought up in this movie, including: Christianity vs. science. A brief intelligent design debate. The origins of man. The existence of God and an afterlife. Comments on the existence of souls (in humans) as well as the lack thereof (in androids). The lack of ability for non-sentiment beings like an android to desire anything, including "life". The quest for immortality. What to do with unborn life when it is known to be evil.

Interesting stuff that is a notch beyond the typical monsters-hunting-humans movie. As a result, I can see how it wouldn't have mass appeal. To be honest, I'm still not sure how I would rate the film other than to say I liked it enough to be glad I saw it at least once. I can appreciate the effort that went into making an a-typical summer popcorn flick.

It is a bit surprising that thought-provoking angles aren't explored more often in sci-fi movies. The golden age of sci-fi storytelling (roughly 1940s - 1960s) often delved into topics brought up in Prometheus, including stuff written by Asimov, Clark, and Bradbury (R.I.P.!). For instance, check out two excellent examples here and also here. If this movie gets a sequel, no doubt it'll go even deeper in addressing a lot of its ideas, particularly since the main character (living) and android (non-living) are still looking for the fundamental origins of life at the end.

Strictly viewed as a movie, Prometheus had a few plot issues and it takes a lot of time to say what it wants to say. But overall it kept my interest and still has me thinking over a couple of concepts it brought up. For that reason I'd give it a thumbs up; it is worth checking out.

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post #2 of 472 Old 06-09-2012, 12:13 PM
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Thank god, now we can go here kick your feet up and open discuss anything we like without having to worry about spoilers. That said, I just loved those space jockeys or "engineers" whatever they are called. I mean that was some crazy shite that went down from them and they were probably my favorite aspect and addition to the alien universe.

That scene in the end when David warns Shaw, "RUN, hes coming for you"...BAM that crazy fetus who is now this massive face hugger attacks the space jockey who himself is no puny mortal but a super hero specimen,..yet he was over whelmed and completely at the mercy of the face hugger who of course gives birth to the baby Xeno. I had no idea where he came from so that was a total surprise and the way it was choreographed and directed was really nothing short of phenomenal and something I've never seen that's so mesmerizing beautiful, majestic and horrific at the same time. Seriously, don't you think these space jockeys can be spin off to their own movie like another super hero franchise.

And like I mentioned briefly in the original thread about the "operation" scene which was another incredible signature RS directed scene was another heart pounding moment. Right away it reminded me exactly like the 5th element where LeeLoo was having her body analyzed by the robot in that glass chamber almost naked with just the white cloth straps the same way Shaw was trying to that monster out of her stomach. And when she broke loose, she looked just like LeeLoo as she was running from the authorities. The only diff that I saw was the orange hair, other than that RS managed to masterfully used that for his scene.

I've must have read hundreds of complaints about how she was able to run around like a spring chicken after having Cesarian before seeing it so this was one the things I was worried about but after seeing it myself now I can say it's total rubbish and stupid nit picking if anything. If you seen it, you see she's not running around like nothing happened. She was delirious, full of adrenalin and in so much pain and hunched over like a injured animal trying to stay alive. 2nd, if you recall she had that anesthesiology given in that chamber god who knows in the future is exponentially more advance that what medical has today which was residual and partially allowed her to stumble away. By no means she was strolling in the park like some posters have mentioned in IMDB which NOW in retrospect to me were either plants or TDK fan boys trying to under mine this great film. This was among many plot holes and complaints I've read before seeing it that I'm glad have answered for myself were mostly uncalled for.
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post #3 of 472 Old 06-10-2012, 05:18 PM
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I myself was on blackout for this movie also. No reviews or threads and having just left the other thread I'm glad this one is here.

Give this a read:
http://cavalorn.livejournal.com/584135.html

I personally wish the movie went further into the themes than it did and I thought a couple of things were out of place but it was quite enjoyable. Multiple viewings will happen. I have to say the visual quality of the movie was outstanding at my theater and not once was I taken out due to an effect.
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post #4 of 472 Old 06-10-2012, 07:13 PM
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Originally Posted by zoey67 View Post

in so much pain and hunched over like a injured animal trying to stay alive. 2nd, if you recall she had that anesthesiology given in that chamber god who knows in the future is exponentially more advance that what medical has today which was residual and partially allowed her to stumble away. By no means she was strolling in the park like some posters have mentioned in IMDB which NOW in retrospect to me were either plants or TDK fan boys trying to under mine this great film.
There must be some kind of instant muscle fiber reconnecting chemical in the future because there is no way she can even stand up after having her abdomen muscle cut across like that. It's biochemically not doable. eek.gif
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post #5 of 472 Old 06-11-2012, 04:40 AM
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There must be some kind of instant muscle fiber reconnecting chemical in the future because there is no way she can even stand up after having her abdomen muscle cut across like that. It's biochemically not doable. eek.gif
It's freaking space man.
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post #6 of 472 Old 06-11-2012, 01:29 PM
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This movie rocked my socks. I loved how the enemy kept evolving throughout the whole movie, it kept things interesting. I've read a lot of critical reviews but I haven't seen a movie stir up so much conversation/debate like this in a while so it must have done something right.
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post #7 of 472 Old 06-11-2012, 04:53 PM - Thread Starter
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I think that dichotomy exists because the filmmakers did a great job of coming up with an intriguing story that wasn't rooted in generic sci-fi pew pew pew action while delivering it with some highly suspect character actions and plot decisions.

Sometimes strange stuff happens in this movie and it makes you go, "hmmmm". That's generally a good thing. Other times strange stuff happens and it makes you go, "HUH?!?!" That's generally a bad thing.

One of the biggest HUH?!?! moments for me was when the two Jr. scientists want to leave the main group inside of the alien ship and go back to the home ship because they are creeped out and scared by the ancient stuff being discovered. Ironically, the team ends up getting back to the home ship first because the scientists get lost somehow. OK, I'm fine with that.

So they discover a weird pod room with alien serpent creatures swimming around. Despite all of the recorded death scenes they saw earlier that scared them to head back to base, are they scared of these alien snakes? Naaah.

In fact, one of the scientists treats 'em like a cuddly poodle despite the fact they have no fur, no eyes and its face opens up to attack. That made no sense whatsoever! Needless to say, they both were attacked in that scene.

There were way too many HUH?!?!? moments for a movie that wants to be taken as seriously as this one obviously does. The people in this flick make way too many non-sensical decisions.
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post #8 of 472 Old 06-11-2012, 06:25 PM
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I think that dichotomy exists because the filmmakers did a great job of coming up with an intriguing story that wasn't rooted in generic sci-fi pew pew pew action while delivering it with some highly suspect character actions and plot decisions.
Sometimes strange stuff happens in this movie and it makes you go, "hmmmm". That's generally a good thing. Other times strange stuff happens and it makes you go, "HUH?!?!" That's generally a bad thing.
One of the biggest HUH?!?! moments for me was when the two Jr. scientists want to leave the main group inside of the alien ship and go back to the home ship because they are creeped out and scared by the ancient stuff being discovered. Ironically, the team ends up getting back to the home ship first because the scientists get lost somehow. OK, I'm fine with that.

Don't forget that one of the scientist was in charge of those homing devices thingy so he should have had some common knowledge on how to track his way out that place, Lol I leaned over to my gal and said HE got lost???
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So they discover a weird pod room with alien serpent creatures swimming around. Despite all of the recorded death scenes they saw earlier that scared them to head back to base, are they scared of these alien snakes? Naaah.
In fact, one of the scientists treats 'em like a cuddly poodle despite the fact they have no fur, no eyes and its face opens up to attack. That made no sense whatsoever! Needless to say, they both were attacked in that scene.
There were way too many HUH?!?!? moments for a movie that wants to be taken as seriously as this one obviously does. The people in this flick make way too many non-sensical decisions.


Lol..I couldn't believe they where roaming around, being so scared in the first place let alone start petting an alien king cobras..Well it was written(pun intended ), and they meet their demise..
Btw Did the worm morph to those serpentine creatures? I didn't get why the worms didn't read as life in the first place ?



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post #9 of 472 Old 06-11-2012, 07:36 PM
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Lol..I couldn't believe they where roaming around, being so scared in the first place let alone start petting an alien king cobras..Well it was written(pun intended ), and they meet their demise..l
Good thing that part and those two characters play minor roles in this movie. If you edited out those scenes, I don't think this movie would change much at all.
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post #10 of 472 Old 06-11-2012, 07:56 PM
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I myself was on blackout for this movie also. No reviews or threads and having just left the other thread I'm glad this one is here.
Give this a read:
http://cavalorn.livejournal.com/584135.html
I personally wish the movie went further into the themes than it did and I thought a couple of things were out of place but it was quite enjoyable. Multiple viewings will happen. I have to say the visual quality of the movie was outstanding at my theater and not once was I taken out due to an effect.

I enjoyed Cavalorn's reviews and comments, quite insightful and intriguing. Thanks.
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post #11 of 472 Old 06-11-2012, 08:42 PM
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Did the worm morph to those serpentine creatures? I didn't get why the worms didn't read as life in the first place ?

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My thought exactly when I saw this last night. In the original films and the AvPs the creature takes on some aspect of the host's form; in Alien 3 it resembled the dog. My guess is the worms and the alien slime combined to make the king cobras as you put it. When it infected the remaining engineer, we get the beginnings of the alien we know and love. biggrin.gif Not sure where the elongated head came from.

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post #12 of 472 Old 06-11-2012, 10:29 PM
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There must be some kind of instant muscle fiber reconnecting chemical in the future because there is no way she can even stand up after having her abdomen muscle cut across like that. It's biochemically not doable. eek.gif
I know where you're coming from and this also seems to be one of the things people can't wrapped their head around. Remember she was full on in freak out survival mode with adrenalin in full bursts. I myself had gall bladder surgery and hours later they kicked me out of my bed and said get dressed and go home. I couldn't believe it either but I did it walked out of there and I wasn't freaking out or giving birth to a alien fetus.

Lastly, have you or anyone watched that show I survived on A & E? Then you would know people have been mauled my bears with their brains and guts hanging out of their stomachs and yet they had the will to run and fight. This lady had been shot 3 times blank range in the head and survived. Another pregnant woman had her stomach cut open with a box cutter with her intestines falling out in her hands because her crazy neighbor wanted to steal her baby yet she was able to fight her and escape. If you watched any of the episodes then you know there are many, many instances just like this or worst. When you're under immense duress of survival mode your body is capable of things you couldn't fathom.
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post #13 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 01:16 AM
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Btw Did the worm morph to those serpentine creatures? I didn't get why the worms didn't read as life in the first place ?

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The device was calibrated for something that's never been recorded? The black stuff on top of the containers looked organic as well.
Stuff in the room started moving after a certain amount of time. None of it registered.
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post #14 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 05:01 AM
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Give this a read:
http://cavalorn.livejournal.com/584135.html

And to somewhat complement this, here's an interview with Ridley Scott, "The director on Prometheus, what he thinks about God (not so pleasant) and aliens (a little more so), and his next movie" (Esquire)



Ridley Scott: [...]And the biggest source of evil is of course religion.
interviewer: All religions?
RS: Can you think of a good one? A just and kind and tolerant religion?
interviewer: Not off the top of my head, no.
RS: Everyone is tearing each other apart in the name of their personal god. And the irony is, by definition, they're probably worshipping the same god.

Interview here: http://www.esquire.com/the-side/qa/spitznagel/ridley-scott-prometheus-interview-9423167
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post #15 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 07:57 AM
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I know where you're coming from and this also seems to be one of the things people can't wrapped their head around. Remember she was full on in freak out survival mode with adrenalin in full bursts. I myself had gall bladder surgery and hours later they kicked me out of my bed and said get dressed and go home. I couldn't believe it either but I did it walked out of there and I wasn't freaking out or giving birth to a alien fetus.
Lastly, have you or anyone watched that show I survived on A & E? Then you would know people have been mauled my bears with their brains and guts hanging out of their stomachs and yet they had the will to run and fight. This lady had been shot 3 times blank range in the head and survived. Another pregnant woman had her stomach cut open with a box cutter with her intestines falling out in her hands because her crazy neighbor wanted to steal her baby yet she was able to fight her and escape. If you watched any of the episodes then you know there are many, many instances just like this or worst. When you're under immense duress of survival mode your body is capable of things you couldn't fathom.


Love that show biggrin.gif I think I saw the one with the crazy neighbor eek.gif, what I thought was a little primitive was the staples, my gal was cut open and a human being was ripped out her smile.gif Anyway the put tape over her wound closed up nicely, I would think they would have some chemical jel/foamy compound by then.
Lets not forget that she keeped on pumping drugs as well to kill the pain, she did that twice as far as I counted.

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post #16 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 08:03 AM
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My thought exactly when I saw this last night. In the original films and the AvPs the creature takes on some aspect of the host's form; in Alien 3 it resembled the dog. My guess is the worms and the alien slime combined to make the king cobras as you put it. When it infected the remaining engineer, we get the beginnings of the alien we know and love. biggrin.gif Not sure where the elongated head came from.


Yeah that last alien look smooth and streamlined, almost shark like very cool.

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post #17 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 08:43 AM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post

And to somewhat complement this, here's an interview with Ridley Scott, "The director on Prometheus, what he thinks about God (not so pleasant) and aliens (a little more so), and his next movie" (Esquire)
Ridley Scott: [...]And the biggest source of evil is of course religion.
interviewer: All religions?
RS: Can you think of a good one? A just and kind and tolerant religion?
interviewer: Not off the top of my head, no.
RS: Everyone is tearing each other apart in the name of their personal god. And the irony is, by definition, they're probably worshipping the same god.
Interview here: http://www.esquire.com/the-side/qa/spitznagel/ridley-scott-prometheus-interview-9423167

So this whole prequel series is likely just an excuse for him to criticize religion/Christianity in the grand finale? If true, boooor-ing. I was hoping for an original sci-fi outcome that wasn't so rooted in modern day ideological fights. What a waste.

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post #18 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 08:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post

And to somewhat complement this, here's an interview with Ridley Scott, "The director on Prometheus, what he thinks about God (not so pleasant) and aliens (a little more so), and his next movie" (Esquire)
Ridley Scott: [...]And the biggest source of evil is of course religion.
interviewer: All religions?
RS: Can you think of a good one? A just and kind and tolerant religion?
interviewer: Not off the top of my head, no.
RS: Everyone is tearing each other apart in the name of their personal god. And the irony is, by definition, they're probably worshipping the same god.
Interview here: http://www.esquire.com/the-side/qa/spitznagel/ridley-scott-prometheus-interview-9423167
As I suspected... frown.gif http://www.avsforum.com/t/1155877/alien-prequel-prometheus/630#post_21852446
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post #19 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 08:55 AM
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So this whole prequel series is likely just an excuse for him to criticize religion/Christianity in the grand finale?

I guess we'll have to wait and see what's in store in the next installments... as far as I'm concerned, I'm fine with questioning its relevance.
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post #20 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 08:58 AM
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oh, I forgot about that one smile.gif ...But so far the movie hasn't flopped wink.gif
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post #21 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 11:40 AM - Thread Starter
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I guess we'll have to wait and see what's in store in the next installments... as far as I'm concerned, I'm fine with questioning its relevance.

Whether it is bashing or advocating, either way I say boooor-ing. The Alien franchise shouldn't primarily be used to prop up ideology one way or the other. If this is what he is doing (taking the long way to simply say he hates religion/Christianity) I'd rather he use another vehicle for it.

One problem is that it no longer becomes a story that organically unfolds itself for us to get lost in, but instead simply becomes just Scott's punch line to a three-picture-long joke that he is telling.

People pre-disposed to one side or the other will love it/hate it, but ultimately it is a shallow approach to sci-fi film making that does little for the imagination. Thumbs down.

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post #22 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 11:58 AM
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Lets not forget that she keeped on pumping drugs as well to kill the pain, she did that twice as far as I counted.
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Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
This why the last act is so weird. It's a dream Shaw is having in stasis and that David is watching.
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post #23 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 12:27 PM
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Whether it is bashing or advocating, either way I say boooor-ing. The Alien franchise shouldn't primarily be used to prop up ideology one way or the other. If this is what he is doing (taking the long way to simply say he hates religion/Christianity) I'd rather he use another vehicle for it.
One problem is that it no longer becomes a story that organically unfolds itself for us to get lost in, but instead simply becomes just Scott's punch line to a three-picture-long joke that he is telling.
People pre-disposed to one side or the other will love it/hate it, but ultimately it is a shallow approach to sci-fi film making that does little for the imagination. Thumbs down.
Well said. Agenda is a great killer of entertainment unfortunately.

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post #24 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 01:02 PM
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Don't know if this has been a discussed before at the other thread or not, but I definitely want a copy of this with the extended \ Directors cut. Time to pre-order.


http://www.complex.com/pop-culture/2012/06/ridley-scott-says-there-will-be-an-extended-cut-of-prometheus-on-blu-ray

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post #25 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 01:09 PM
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Well said. Agenda is a great killer of entertainment unfortunately.


I just watched The Grey, on blu ray a few days ago, and they go into the whole religion thing, and after life discussion, and later there's the whole subject of faith and what not. lets dissatisfied at the ending, while the credit scrolling up I see Ridley Scott's company logo, I was hm that explain a few things! Either way I thought it was just standard jargon of todays Hollywood plots, and story line.

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post #26 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 01:09 PM
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Originally Posted by joeblow View Post

I think that dichotomy exists because the filmmakers did a great job of coming up with an intriguing story
That's odd, I thought I was watching a remake of Mission to Mars. I loved the opening sequence. Which caught me totally blindsided about how awful the cave discovery scene was. Then scene after scene of Mission to Mars with new people ....
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that wasn't rooted in generic sci-fi pew pew pew action while delivering it with some highly suspect character actions and plot decisions.
I thought the pretty pictures and pew pew were the only thing that made the movie bearable.

Just goes to show, different strokes.
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post #27 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 01:40 PM
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Originally Posted by JMCecil View Post

I thought I was watching a remake of Mission to Mars.
http://www.avsforum.com/t/1155877/alien-prequel-prometheus/1260#post_22118825

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post #28 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 01:47 PM
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lol, I missed that post. Awesome. At least I'm not the only one.
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post #29 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 01:53 PM
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I saw Mission to Mars (2000) right after Prometheus. Other than the pristine space walk scenes (it's glorius with the JVC black contrasting with the white space suits), the movie was such a trite but I do see similarities in both. It's also coincidental that Gary Sinise who was the astronaut in Apollo 13 (1995) not making the trip initially. Mars at least is a lot more benevalent.
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post #30 of 472 Old 06-12-2012, 03:20 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by darthrsg View Post

Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
This why the last act is so weird. It's a dream Shaw is having in stasis and that David is watching.

Pro tip... spoiler tags aren't needed in this thread when discussing the movie. wink.gif

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