Pacific Rim - Guillermo del Toro - Page 4 - AVS Forum
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post #91 of 321 Old 07-10-2013, 06:58 PM
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Is this why I yearn for TV shows involving hand puppets and ventriloquists?
Or that documentary about the McMartin pre-school.

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post #92 of 321 Old 07-10-2013, 08:47 PM
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Oh I think there are those who like it without even having seen it. Part of that built-in audience is going to see it because it reminds them of movies they enjoyed as kids.

Funny, you just described the business model of green lighting a film these days. I doubt the "As Kids" statement,
and propose it has more to do with cross market I.D. to China and other "East" markets.

American viewers fail to see why things seem out of place when they have nothing to do with
a specific perception and more to do with capturing a world wide audience for profit.
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post #93 of 321 Old 07-10-2013, 10:13 PM
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No, not "profit"! Say it ain't so. The film business concerned with profit?

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post #94 of 321 Old 07-11-2013, 07:08 AM
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LOL, exactly what my wife and I think....except the opinions are reversed.
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post #95 of 321 Old 07-11-2013, 10:50 AM
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interesting to see which s.f. flick does better this summer, this or elysium.

Or which does worse.

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post #96 of 321 Old 07-11-2013, 11:15 AM
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Well, it was hard-earned for me. Might have been easier for others more gifted, or lucky. wink.gif
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post #97 of 321 Old 07-11-2013, 11:16 AM
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Or which does worse.
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post #98 of 321 Old 07-11-2013, 09:16 PM
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Was an awesome movie. Even better that Studio Grill turned the LFE all the way up.

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post #99 of 321 Old 07-12-2013, 02:47 PM
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Saw this at the 10am Irvine Imax showing.

I'm gonna preface my comments by saying I absolutely love everything Del Toros done, I love the entire giant monster genre and am pretty forgiving about ever the crappier ones like the 70's Godzillas and the first 3 60's Gamera flicks. Thus, I can easily buy into a movie with giant robots that need a crew to operate them from inside fighting 250 foot tall monsters from another dimension.

That said, this movie disappointed in some pretty significant ways which I'll mention below. But that said, this is in no way some crappy, soulless Michael Bay/Transformers flick. It only has a couple or three "ugh" moments of dumbass humor, everything is played pretty straight. Probably the biggest jaw dropper was one key scene late in the film when one robot is shut down by a Kaiju's "magnetic pulse" but the older robot can still function because the 1st gens were "analog" while the newer ones are "digital" (wtf? So those CG displays should have been crt tvs?!?). Most of the characters are pretty much by the numbers but at least none of them are offensively obnoxious like most major studio flicks are these days. The female "Mako" character was probably the best developed and acted of the film and even that said, she seemed like a rip-off of several characters in the post Y2K Godzilla vs MechaGodzilla films.

The movie is absolutely meant to be seen on the biggest screen possible - much of the epic battle stuff especially the Hong Kong battle sequence which is the highlight of the film looked incredible on that giant IMAX screen. Plus, at least at my showing, the 3D works better than most movies to really pull you in to the movie. On the down side of the showing I caught, the sound was just maxed out to the point of near-distortion. I've seen Motorhead and Killing Joke shows with more sonic subtlety and easier on the ears.

I really thought there was a lot of dry narrative exposition in the first 15 minutes that could have been handled better (think Starship Troopers). The opening San Francisco Kaiju attack isn't really much more than what's shown in the trailers and it's really just a flashback. There's a *lot* of the quirky Del Toro touches anyone familiar with his films will catch, particularly the whole "black market monster parts" angle. I know there's some valid complaints about the major monster sequences occurring at night in rain but there are several other Kaiju attacks in broad daylight in the first 3rd of the movie - unfortunately they all are from mostly flashback tv footage. So yeah, things really ramp up on a spectacular scale after about the halfway mark, but it's either night and raining or under the sea in rather lackluster CGI background setups (you get no real sense the final act is happening several thousand feet underwater with the robot vs monster battles - it could be the surface of the Moon the way it looks.

And surprisingly, it's often tough to get a decent idea of what many of the monsters look like - they mostly are drably colored and textured with multiple tails and large hammer or blade shaped heads. They don't even have cool, distinctive roars like the Toho Godzilla monsters had - in fact, it sounds like Del Toro recycled roars from several of his two Hellboy film's monsters.

The two scientist nerds really bugged the **** outta me. Everything about them, the way their dialog was written, the way the actors handled the roles - like fingernails on chalkboard. I liked the whole idea of "Mind melding" (aka "Drifting") with the monster brains to discover their origins but that whole reveal was a great big "Meh." I get that Del Toro wanted to leave some mystery about who or what they were (even though there was a whole exposition about their motives once that was discovered) but the big (non)reveal seemed half baked and almost like an afterthought, very similar to the aliens in "Independence Day" (they're prepping our planet to harvest it's resources like locusts). Ron Perlman's character has some of the best moments but it's such a knock-off small part, even the comedic bit he gets during the credits role has little impact.

The movie score was utterly generic, forgettable and about the weakest thing about this movie. Anyone who thinks the film music was any good has dung in their ears.'Nuff said.

At the end of the day though, I think this is Del Toro's weakest film. I would also be shocked if it does well even this opening weekend, it really has such a limited appeal and has been so poorly marketed. There was maybe 20 people in the theater for my showing. Ultimately, it's hard to explain why I felt let down by this movie with all the money and talent going into it but to put this in perspective, when I saw the US premier of "Gamera 3: Awakening of Irys" at the Egyptian in Los Angeles about 12 years ago, the audience literally erupted in applause at the end and I felt like I'd just seen the most fully realized giant monster movie made to that point. It was like "they took the stupidest giant monster concept ever conceived (a flying rocket propelled turtle) and made not just a great giant monster flick but a great MOVIE with just a few million bucks and a whole lotta imagination and originality." Not so, here.

I'll buy the 3D Blu-ray when it comes out and skip through about 2/3rds of the movie to the good parts. It will almost certainly be demo material. Hopefully it will have a *lot* more Kaiju footage in the bonus features/cut footage.
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post #100 of 321 Old 07-12-2013, 05:06 PM
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I liked it much more than I thought I would (but then I'm a big anime fan, so the movie is probably tailor made for me). The only thing was it was a bit too loud for me, I couldn't understand some of the dialogue. Other than that I enjoyed the movie.

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post #101 of 321 Old 07-12-2013, 07:20 PM
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Originally Posted by Partyslammer View Post


this is in no way some crappy, soulless Michael Bay/Transformers flick.

And yet it looks like the very same thing from a distance (i.e. if you're not in the target audience demo)

I'm a fan of some Del Toro work, but I get the impression this is just a Godzilla flick with
a big budget. Wrong?
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post #102 of 321 Old 07-12-2013, 07:53 PM
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I saw Pacific Rim today too and was a little disappointed. Some of that may be more on me than del Toro. I don't think I will get much argument over the proposition that Pacific Rim is not in the same world with the brilliant and moving Pan's Labyrinth. Although Pacific Rim has a wonderful cast and is fairly consistently exciting, and less consistently either funny or moving, it is very uneven.

First the good stuff. Charlie Hunnam was wonderful, the best thing in the film. Hunnam has both a speech pattern and walk that are unique, in a class with John Wayne. Better yet, Hunnam can even act. There was a wonderful sight gag in the film showing the giant robot Hunnam was piloting walking down the street with the same gait Hunnam has. The young Japanese actress who plays Hunnam's sidekick Mako, Rinko Kikuchi, was very good too, as were Idris Elba and Ron Perlman. I thought the exposition showing how the young Mako came to be raised by Idris Elba's character was moving.

On the down side, the Big Battles between the robots and the gigantic, evil, whatever they were, made my eyes glaze. over. Although I saw the film in a first class theater with a giant screen and excellent audio, I was mostly bored by that stuff. Even worse was the painfully bad grade school comedy with the two nerdy scientists.

At the end of the day, I decided there was enough good in the film to give it 7 Stars out of 10. Be warned, though, that I was feeling generous today.
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post #103 of 321 Old 07-12-2013, 08:40 PM
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I decided there was enough good in the film to give it 7 Stars out of 10.
Aren't you breaking your own rule by rating a movie after just one viewing? eek.gif
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post #104 of 321 Old 07-12-2013, 10:16 PM
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Originally Posted by thedeskE View Post

I'm a fan of some Del Toro work, but I get the impression this is just a Godzilla flick with a big budget. Wrong?

Well, in the most basic, superficial; ways, yes that pretty much describes it. But digging just a bit deeper, it's miles better than the '98 US remake of Godzilla and has far more soul, creativity and entertainment value than the Transformers or any recent big alien invasion movies. Think of it this way - say your a huge fan of the 50's sci-fi classic "War Of The Worlds" and waited much of your adult life for Hollywood to do a modern, giant budgeted take on the same theme.... and you got "Independance Day" ... or the Spielberg WotW remake.
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post #105 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 04:13 AM
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Anyone saw this in dolby atmos yet? It is said to be mixed in atmos. I want check it out in atmos but my theater is doing 2 showings with atmos and other showings in IMAX. This is retarded.
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post #106 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 07:04 AM
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Aren't you breaking your own rule by rating a movie after just one viewing? eek.gif

To the contrary, I grade most movies based on only one viewing. I'm pretty sure that a second viewing of Pacific Rim wouldn't change my opinion of the film. After all, when you've seen one big robots versus aliens CGI battle, you have pretty much seen them all.smile.gif On a few occasions, I have changed my opinion of a film, usually because some of you have convinced me that I underestimated it the first time through. Drive comes to mind.
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post #107 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 08:53 AM
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I'm not a huge Del Toro fan, but I was still quite disappointed with this film. Corny character beats, murky action, silly premise, terrible acting led to a pretty lousy movie going experience for me...

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post #108 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by benes View Post

Question for those who have seen it:

I didn't understand how they were planning to Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
close the breach when they never could before. A character even asked this question at one point but never got an answer.
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
The 2 nerd scientists explained how it could be achieved after their mind-meld with the newborn Kaiju. Only at the source of the breach.
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post #109 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 09:28 AM
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Question for those who have seen it:

I didn't understand how they were planning to Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
close the breach when they never could before. A character even asked this question at one point but never got an answer.

Beeeecause.......
Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
The two goofy scientists after "drifting" together with the dead kaiju brain discovered that the only way to get the nuke through the breach was to do it by fooling the breach into thinking a Jaeger was a Kaiju. If they tried to drop it through with just a robot, it would have not allowed the foreign object to pass all the way into the alien dimension.
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post #110 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 10:48 AM
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From what I remember their plan was Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
to drop a nuke into the breach. One of the scientists was showing a schematic of how the tunnel would collapse. So I guess the question is why didn't they think of this before? How were they attacking the breach prior to this?

From what I gather Warning: Spoiler! (Click to show)
It had something to do with the number of Kaiju coming through the rift. Once it hit 3, the rift would be stable enough for a Jaeger to go through and drop a nuke into it (or something to that effect)

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post #111 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 12:21 PM
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I saw this yesterday in a Dolby Atmos theater. The first thing I noticed was the sound level coming from the front was very loud. Even though the theater was full of sound, most was coming from the front. The fronts were so loud they pretty much overwhelmed the surrounds. While watching the movie, all I could think about the movie was I was watching Real Steel vs Godzilla with a little bit of Independence Day through in.
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post #112 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 02:22 PM
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Yeah I didn't quite follow that part. The fact that most of the dialogue was hard to hear didn't help.

Interesting that you say that. I thought in my theater it was the worst dialogue sound quality I can remember experiencing, I blamed the theater for this but I wonder if it really was that bad...

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post #113 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 08:58 PM
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Interesting that you say that. I thought in my theater it was the worst dialogue sound quality I can remember experiencing, I blamed the theater for this but I wonder if it really was that bad...

Saw it yesterday in Dolby Atmos. Had the same issues with the poor dialogue sound quality, especially during the opening sections of the film. I was ready to blame the theater as well, but now I'm not so sure.
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post #114 of 321 Old 07-13-2013, 11:06 PM
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Yeah I didn't quite follow that part. The fact that most of the dialogue was hard to hear didn't help.

Anyway this movie is not about the plot. But if they wanted a better sense of scale they shouldn't have used so many close-ups and quick cuts. That just made it seem like a people fight.

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Interesting that you say that. I thought in my theater it was the worst dialogue sound quality I can remember experiencing, I blamed the theater for this but I wonder if it really was that bad...

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Saw it yesterday in Dolby Atmos. Had the same issues with the poor dialogue sound quality, especially during the opening sections of the film. I was ready to blame the theater as well, but now I'm not so sure.

Saw this in RealD 3D and Atmos yesterday, and can confirm that I had difficulty understanding the dialog as well. Atmos format made absolutely no discernible difference to the audio presentation, but it didn't help that the theater turned up the volume levels to eleven.
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post #115 of 321 Old 07-14-2013, 12:55 AM
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Man, that sucks some of you seem to have had dialog issues. My 16yo son and I saw this movie today and we both thought it was awesome! I can't say that I noticed any dialog issues like some of you are reporting. But we saw it in IMAX 3D at the Boeing IMAX theater at Pacific Science Center in Seattle and not in Dolby Atmos. The sound in IMAX was fantastic and I have no doubts this will be demoed to death when it comes out on bluray. Not only was there tons of deep bass that will make the most diehard bassheads happy biggrin.gif , the sound effects throughout the film were prodigious and very well executed. I will admit, though, that at one point I wanted to yell at a fellow movie goer for not silencing their cell phone. LUCKILY, I kept my mouth shut because it was the ring tone they used in the movie for one of their videoconferencing devices tongue.gif . How embarrassing would that have been. The 3D for the most part was quit excellent I thought and I am not much of a 3D enthusiast. I fall into the camp that most 3D is used for gimmicks and a really good cinematographer can make a 3D like image with 2D if they know what they are doing. IIRC, Del Toro had no intentions of making this film in 3D to begin with and used some high quality 2D cameras. After filming was complete, he decided (for whatever reason) to go ahead and make it 3D, so he worked with some guys from ILM and painstakingly converted 2D to 3D. It is apparent he was highly involved in the conversion process and I for one am glad he did it. The "gimmicky" effects were left out and the 3D really added to the epic size of the film. The tagline for the movie is "Go big or go extinct!" and he certainly went BIG eek.gif ! One of my favorite scenes that I think really benefitted from 3D (* small spoiler * sorry, I don't know how to hide text like some of you were doing above) was towards the beginning when the hero was doing construction on a super massive wall that is to span from Alaska to California and is several hundred feet high. Our man is standing out on an I beam surveying the work in progress and holy crap if I didn't almost get vertigo from it. It was awesome! I will definitely have to compare the 2D and 3D versions of that scene when I get the bluray. Unfortunately, I did notice some ghosting, mainly in interior shots. It would happen mostly from what I noticed when the scene had a large light fixture visible. The scenery immediately surrounding the light fixture would put out ghosts. Don't know how to explain it. Luckily, I am not nearly as critical about video as I am audio, so this didn't really bother me too much. That's not to say that I don't enjoy a well filmed scene with great color and contrast and crisp sharpness on a properly calibrated display mind you. I just don't have to spend as much money as some of the more hard core videophiles out there to get the same level of enjoyment smile.gif

As for the movie itself, IMHO this movie kicked ass! I'm sorry some of you felt disappointed, but it was pretty much everything I was expecting since seeing the very first trailer. Yes, there is not much backstory on the characters, I didn't care. From what I've read, Del Toro did this on purpose. I can also understand the argument that "this material feels familiar". Yup! This is pretty much why I went to see this movie. This was a movie designed to pay tribute to monster movies of yesteryear but in near future times without being a remake of any one story. Mission accomplished I say! The way the monsters invade earth was pretty creative and original I thought. I also liked the fact that the movie played out on a global scale instead of being limited to just the U.S.of A. I'm kind of a sucker for monster movies and movies where people band together for a common purpose (in this case, the survival of the human race). This is exactly what this movie is all about. I wanted a blockbuster full of action and mayhem without the obligatory long drawn out shots of skyscapers taking forever to fall. I wanted a movie that was designed to be a thrill ride, have fun and not take itself too seriously. Check, check, and check. I will admit that some of the dialog could be tedious at times and the requisite comic reliefs actually got on my nerves rather quickly, but there was always another epic battle around the corner to bring the real fun back. Idris Elba was excellent as well. I read somewhere that at one point Tom Cruise was being considered for the role of Stacker Pentecost instead of Elba and all I have to say to that is they clearly made the right choice by picking Idris Elba instead. The creatures in this movie are all excellent and have Del Toro's style all over them. They are unique, they are massive, and they are awesome. I only wish you could see more of them. Bottom line, if you are a fan of the old school "Creature Feature", IMHO you MUST see this movie! Highly recommended.

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post #116 of 321 Old 07-14-2013, 01:50 AM
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So I just actually read Partyslammers review and I have to say that even though we have some similar comments (I swear I wasn't copying you tongue.gif ) I think it is obvious that some of the things that irked him about this movie are some of what I liked about Pacific Rim. Although I will completely agree with him about the two scientists and how they annoyed the crap outta me. While I get why these characters exist, I was very annoyed by the way these characters were implemented into the story. This was my only real big complaint about this movie. I also agree that seeing it in IMAX, if you are able, is a must. The Boeing IMAX in Seattle has a 60ft x 80ft screen and as close as we sat to the screen I swear I could almost reach out and touch the monsters or robots or they were going to eat me eek.gif ! I want to do a comparison now with another great theater in Seattle, the Cinerama. That one has a 68ft wide screen but obviously will be a different scope than IMAX. Couple that with the fact that you sit further away from the screen and the grandeur of scale is not as great as IMAX, but it is a quality theater and the comparison would be pretty interesting I think. But I chose IMAX first based on sheer size and I was not disappointed biggrin.gif .

Here are some links to the tech specs of the theaters I am talking about if anyone is interested:

http://www.pacificsciencecenter.org/IMAX-Theaters/Shows/imax (click on the "about the theaters" link on the right side)

http://seattlecinerama.com/the-experience/technical/

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post #117 of 321 Old 07-14-2013, 02:04 PM
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...this will be demoed to death when it comes out on bluray. Not only was there tons of deep bass that will make the most diehard bassheads happy biggrin.gif , the sound effects throughout the film were prodigious and very well executed. ... Bottom line, if you are a fan of the old school "Creature Feature", IMHO you MUST see this movie! Highly recommended.

Sounds like a definate blind buy for me. smile.gif

Took the family to the theater last night and my oldest daughter wanted Man of Steel. I wanted World War Z or this and my seven year old wanted Despicable me 2. The wife chose Despicable Me...

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post #118 of 321 Old 07-14-2013, 11:00 PM
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Went today all I could think of was Zords and Mighty Morphin Power Rangers. I'm going back to art-house movies for a change of pace from the frenetic genre of 2013
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post #119 of 321 Old 07-15-2013, 06:53 AM
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My comparison would be Voltron vs Godzilla, everyone has their reference point. Saw it yesterday. Sound was toned down too much in the theater and although the picture aspect ratio is listed at 1.85:1 it looked strangely squarish. Bad presentation.

The movie turned out about as expected a CGI-fest with a minimum of acting. A little disappointed with Mr. Del Toro on this one but it's something he wanted to make so there it is. People have already reviewed in this in detail so I won't bother. Will I buy this on Blu-ray? Possibly - I have many popcorn movies in my collection. 7/10.

Something I didn't expect is that it would be out grossed by two sequels. Grownups 2 and Despicable Me 2.

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post #120 of 321 Old 07-15-2013, 08:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mr.G View Post

Something I didn't expect is that it would be out grossed by two sequels. Grownups 2 and Despicable Me 2.

There's probably a good amount of viewer fatigue with these endless numbers of huge CGI blockbusters. At some point the law of diminishing returns sets in. I know I have no interest in seeing this one in a theater, but will likely Netflix the BD when it becomes available - probably in a couple of weeks the way the window keeps shortening.
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