If 2001: A Space Odyssey was released today critic's would trash it - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 04:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Critics have changed. Your thoughts?

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post #2 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 06:41 AM
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I hate to say it, but you're probably right.

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post #3 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 07:57 AM
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I don't know if I agree with that premise. The movie was revolutionary at the time, no doubt, and there still hasn't been anything like it done since. 'Gravity' came the closest I guess, but that was more of a slam-bang action/adventure film than a thoughtful exploration of the "deep subjects" 2001 explored.

I think its genius would still be recognized. It's such a great film on multiple levels. Of course, all the scale model work would now be done with CGI, which wouldn't necessarily make it better.
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post #4 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 08:09 AM
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Originally Posted by archiguy View Post

Of course, all the scale model work would now be done with CGI, which wouldn't necessarily make it better.

Knowing Kubrick's MO, I'm not sure he would rely on CGI even in 2014 wink.gif
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post #5 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 08:12 AM
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I'm under the impression this thread is a direct consequence of the Transcendence critical and commercial failure... "Am I wrong? Am I wrong?"
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post #6 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 09:35 AM
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I is a cinematic milestone. Thats why it will Always be on the list , just like Citizen Cane.
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post #7 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 11:35 AM
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Critics trashed 2001 in its day. The film wasn't widely recognized as a masterpiece until years later.

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post #8 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 12:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

Critics trashed 2001 in its day. The film wasn't widely recognized as a masterpiece until years later.
They didn't "get it" then and I doubt most of today's critics would either.wink.gif

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post #9 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 01:50 PM
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Today it would have to be "2001 : A Space Blowin Up Real Good Odyssey", I imagine. Either that or each ticket would have to include a special dot on it that you lick before watching the movie.

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post #10 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 02:38 PM
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I'm not sure what this thread is getting at. Is it:

Is there a rise of young newcomer critics who dislike 2001: A Space Odyssey?

or

Have there been a recent crop of masterpieces released in the last few years that have been rejected by critics?

[oink]They didn't "get it" then and I doubt most of today's critics would either.wink.gif[/oink]

The movie has a 95% rating on Rotten Tomatoes from various reviews dating from the BD release to the 1968 theatrical release. Couple different generations of critics, same consensus.
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post #11 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 02:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Dean Roddey View Post

Today it would have to be "2001 : A Space Blowin Up Real Good Odyssey", I imagine.

Is that why critics love Michael Bay? wink.gif
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post #12 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 02:57 PM
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I'm not sure what this thread is getting at.

I think tenthplanet used 2001 only as an example: slow-paced, intelligent and thought-provoking science-fiction is what he meant. These are very rare these days. I'm not sure critics have changed, but the demand has changed. Today's audiences (read the most important of the bunch: teenagers) expect lots of action and mind-blowing 3D with impossible camera angles... Different times though...
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post #13 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 03:47 PM
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Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post

I think tenthplanet used 2001 only as an example: slow-paced, intelligent and thought-provoking science-fiction is what he meant. These are very rare these days. I'm not sure critics have changed, but the demand has changed. Today's audiences (read the most important of the bunch: teenagers) expect lots of action and mind-blowing 3D with impossible camera angles... Different times though...

It's a chicken-in-the-egg scenario. A Hollywood studio would never green-light 2001 today because of perceived audience demand. Or if it did, it would be a modestly-budgeted film and have no distribution. Audiences aren't given the chance to see movies with that form of aesthetic because the studios refuse to make them.

I don't doubt that the audience reaction to a film like that would be mostly negative to toxic (see: Tree of Life), but the opportunity isn't even given for the audiences to experience such a film.

Either, way, none of this has to do with the taste of modern film critics. Which is what tenthplanet was getting act, and what I'm particularly interested in his reasoning on.
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post #14 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 05:18 PM
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Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post

I'm under the impression this thread is a direct consequence of the Transcendence critical and commercial failure... "Am I wrong? Am I wrong?"

My first thought when I saw the thread title.
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post #15 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 06:02 PM - Thread Starter
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My first thought when I saw the thread title.
It was the straw that broke the camel's back...But I've been thinking about it for awhile. A lot of the movies we like from the 80's on up would be be savaged today. Alien and Aliens would not be spared.

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post #16 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by tenthplanet View Post

It was the straw that broke the camel's back...But I've been thinking about it for awhile. A lot of the movies we like from the 80's on up would be be savaged today. Alien and Aliens would not be spared.

OK, so your thesis is more about Transcendence being a masterpiece while the reviewers thought it was an incoherent mess. Why do you think then critics missed the boat on it? What do you think makes it comparable to 2001, Alien, and Aliens?
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post #17 of 140 Old 04-24-2014, 09:22 PM
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If 2001: A Space Odyssey was released today, then today would be January 1, 1968. End of story.
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post #18 of 140 Old 04-25-2014, 11:11 AM
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If 2001: A Space Odyssey was released today, then today would be January 1, 1968. End of story.

+1.
A movie (or any work of art) is a product of its time. It doesn't make sense to displace it from its own context.
Cinema has evolved and critics have followed.
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post #19 of 140 Old 04-25-2014, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by tenthplanet View Post

It was the straw that broke the camel's back...But I've been thinking about it for awhile. A lot of the movies we like from the 80's on up would be be savaged today. Alien and Aliens would not be spared.

Critics sometimes miss the boat on important movies, but they don't always miss the boat. I have no reason to doubt that Alien and Aliens would be received very well today.

No offense, but it sure sounds like you're just feeling butt-hurt that a movie you liked got poor reviews. Sometimes you just have to accept that you're in a minority opinion.

My favorite movie was trashed by critics in its day. Roger Ebert called it the worst movie of the year. I will defend the film to the end, but I can accept that it's not for everyone.

2001 was ahead of its time when it was released, and audiences of the day didn't know what to make of it. Is that also the case with Transcendence? I haven't seen it, but I'll be honest with you, the trailers make it look like it was made about 20 years too late. Does it have any thoughts or ideas or philosophical themes that weren't already covered better in Ghost in the Shell?
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post #20 of 140 Old 04-25-2014, 11:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post

My favorite movie was trashed by critics in its day. Roger Ebert called it the worst movie of the year. I will defend the film to the end, but I can accept that it's not for everyone.
As do I.

Quote:
2001 was ahead of its time when it was released, and audiences of the day didn't know what to make of it.
This is true.
I can recall seeing it during its initial release and it had already established a reputation as being unfathomable.
For me at least, this was true.
Of course, the adult pharmaceuticals and herbal enhancements had something to do with that too.

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post #21 of 140 Old 04-25-2014, 11:41 PM
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As do I.
This is true.
I can recall seeing it during its initial release and it had already established a reputation as being unfathomable.
For me at least, this was true.
Of course, the adult pharmaceuticals and herbal enhancements had something to do with that too.




yes someone mentioned something to me about pharmaceuticals and the "light show" sequence


my guess is 2001 would fail miserably at the box today unless they re-wrote it to include some avengers

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post #22 of 140 Old 04-26-2014, 12:44 AM
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my guess is 2001 would fail miserably at the box today unless they re-wrote it to include some avengers
Or hobbits...

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post #23 of 140 Old 04-26-2014, 07:22 AM
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The Space Odyssey thing is for the most part an attempt to make a realistic looking space movie. That is very much alike Gravity. In fact, i would say that Gravity is todays Space Odyssey (without the killer computer HAL - build by humans - and the monolith stuff - build by aliens -).
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post #24 of 140 Old 04-26-2014, 09:06 AM
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The Space Odyssey thing is for the most part an attempt to make a realistic looking space movie. That is very much alike Gravity. In fact, i would say that Gravity is todays Space Odyssey (without the killer computer HAL - build by humans - and the monolith stuff - build by aliens -).
IMO, the 2 movies only share a story told mostly off planet.wink.gif

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post #25 of 140 Old 04-26-2014, 10:00 AM
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Originally Posted by oink 
IMO, the 2 movies only share a story told mostly off planet.wink.gif
a story told mostly off planet.. in a real world-ish space environment, using real world-ish spacecraft. That was the point i was trying to make..


There is also stuff like Apollo13 but that is based on real worlds events. Not quite the same.
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post #26 of 140 Old 04-26-2014, 11:13 AM
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a story told mostly off planet.. in a real world-ish space environment, using real world-ish spacecraft. That was the point i was trying to make..


There is also stuff like Apollo13 but that is based on real worlds events. Not quite the same.

Although it gets a bad rap, I always felt that STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE was trying for that thoughtful 2001 vibe. Of course, it suffered the same criticisms as 2001...too slow, poorly-paced, etc. But I still prefer it over some of the sequels.
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post #27 of 140 Old 04-26-2014, 12:53 PM
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Star Trek The Motion Picture also suffers from some pretty awful writing and acting.
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post #28 of 140 Old 04-26-2014, 04:40 PM
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2001: A Space Odyssey is one of a number of films that I watch at least once a year. I attribute my love of cinema to seeing this film for the first time at a drive-in at the age of 11, about 5 years after it was released. It blew my poor little impressionable young mind. Over the years after watching it at least 30 or 40 times, it never fails to astonish me.

Stanley Kubrick, and Arthur C Clarke attempted to describe man's place in the universe.... in a movie. What balls!

To all those people who find it boring, or outdated, or whatever, you're entitled to your opinion of course. I, however, am delighted to live in on a planet in a universe where this film exists.
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post #29 of 140 Old 04-26-2014, 05:12 PM
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Originally Posted by Kilgore View Post

2001: A Space Odyssey is one of a number of films that I watch at least once a year. I attribute my love of cinema to seeing this film for the first time at a drive-in at the age of 11, about 5 years after it was released. It blew my poor little impressionable young mind. Over the years after watching it at least 30 or 40 times, it never fails to astonish me.

Stanley Kubrick, and Arthur C Clarke attempted to describe man's place in the universe.... in a movie. What balls!

To all those people who find it boring, or outdated, or whatever, you're entitled to your opinion of course. I, however, am delighted to live in on a planet in a universe where this film exists.
Dude, you are on a roll today....cool.gif

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post #30 of 140 Old 04-26-2014, 08:02 PM
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I watched it again a while back. I have to admit that, without the pharmaceutical enhancement that it got when I watched it days of yore, it wasn't quite as engrossing. Still very good, and it completely embarrasses most modern flicks in terms of taking risks, and not being fearful that there might be some small thing that one person in the Midwest might not understand. It's so obvious how much more movies 'teach to the test' these days than back then when directors were given more leeway to create unique works. And the same problem eats away at the other end as well, i.e. really realistic, non-hyped human dramas.
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