Star Wars the phantom menace. I don't mind it. - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 69 Old 06-29-2014, 02:26 AM - Thread Starter
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Talking Star Wars the phantom menace. I don't mind it.

I watched Star Wars The Phantom Menace for the first time in ages this past weekend, i actually found myself enjoying it somewhat.
Off to the doctors i go!!!!!! Lol!!
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post #2 of 69 Old 06-29-2014, 09:58 AM
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Its a movie I want to enjoy, but it always let me down.

But I can always pretend its a fanmade movie and watch them in the appropriate order.
4 5 2 3 6.
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post #3 of 69 Old 06-29-2014, 11:54 AM
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Bought it just for the pod race.
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post #4 of 69 Old 06-29-2014, 12:03 PM
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I love them all. My top 3 are Empire,Revenge of the Sith then A New Hope.
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post #5 of 69 Old 06-29-2014, 05:32 PM
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Bought it just for the pod race.
Yes.

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Chances are very good that I was drinking when I posted the above.

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post #6 of 69 Old 06-29-2014, 05:47 PM
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post #7 of 69 Old 06-30-2014, 07:36 AM
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I have it in my collection as well. Will watch again one day.

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post #8 of 69 Old 07-01-2014, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Laserblair View Post
I watched Star Wars The Phantom Menace for the first time in ages this past weekend, i actually found myself enjoying it somewhat.
Off to the doctors i go!!!!!! Lol!!
Good on you, man! Speak your mind and let it out. Don't allow yourself to be swayed by the nerd hipster crowd.

Phantom Menace was great and the best of the prequels.

It was also a Star Wars movie! The other two were just student films made with some help from George Lucas and Co.

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post #9 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 04:18 AM
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Somewhere out there there's a fan edit of the movie that got it down to about 35 minutes. I think that might eliminate all the really bad scenes in it.

The central problem for me is that the kid just cannot act. Unfortunately, about 75% of the movie hangs on his ability, and without that, nobody can buy into it. I think the movie has moments, and I think the effects, sound mix, and cinematography are very good, but it's a very empty, addlebrained kind of movie where you go "whaaaaaa?"
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post #10 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 04:28 AM
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I have always liked all 6 films with Sith getting a slight edge over Hope
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post #11 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 04:35 AM
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A "must see" companion to Phantom Menace is the documentary The People vs. George Lucas, which is a hilarious complaint about people who hate Episodes 1-3 and also dislike Lucas going back and re-editing the other movies.

What impresses the hell out of me is that Lucas was understanding enough to allow the film to be released, plus allow them to use clips from his movies and even use John Williams' music throughout the whole thing. You can criticize Lucas if you want, but I thought that was pretty classy for him to at least allow the film to come out in the first place.

I don't agree with 100% of the documentary, but I think it raises some excellent points. And they have some excellent interviews with some die hard fans who were in shock by how bad Phantom Menace was, the day it came out in 1999. The doc actually shows them saying, "the movie can't have been that bad! Let's go back and see it again to make sure we got this right!" And they go back again, and yes, the film really was that bad.

Phantom Menace is very high on my list of "awful movies that are very, very well made." I think the #1 film on that list for me is Michael Bay's Bad Boys, which plays like the slickest music video you've ever seen, with an awful story and horrible dialogue. I think Phantom Menace would've been much improved if Lucas had hired five expensive Hollywood writers to actually write the thing, which is how several of his previous films were done.
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post #12 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 03:37 PM
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Originally Posted by Marc Wielage View Post
I think Phantom Menace would've been much improved if Lucas had hired five expensive Hollywood writers to actually write the thing, which is how several of his previous films were done.
I always thought he was a better writer than director, though. When he directs, it feels like he gives each scene one take, and that's the one that's used. No matter how bad. I think he's impatient and lacks attention to detail. And seems to be a horrible decision maker at times. Also seems to have no idea how his work is seen by others. Ok, he's an idiot. That's so wizard, Annie.

But my god the pod race sounds so good.

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Chances are very good that I was drinking when I posted the above.

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post #13 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 05:48 PM
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Originally Posted by Marc Wielage View Post
The central problem for me is that the kid just cannot act. Unfortunately, about 75% of the movie hangs on his ability, and without that, nobody can buy into it.
I agree with that. Jake Lloyd was the absolute worst child actor I've ever seen. To my knowledge, he's had no career since then either - not surprising. He had no clue, and they really needed a "natural" for that role. He was way too young to be believable as well; needed to be 4 or 5 years older. Just an stunningly bad casting decision and it really hurt the movie. Wonder how much George had to do with that selection? Professional Hollywood casting directors don't normally make those kinds of mistakes.

It's hard to believe that with the incredibly high profile that movie had they couldn't have found a kid that was button-cute and could act. Many movies and TV shows are lousy with 'em.
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post #14 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 06:05 PM
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I agree with that. Jake Lloyd was the absolute worst child actor I've ever seen. To my knowledge, he's had no career since then either - not surprising. He had no clue, and they really needed a "natural" for that role. He was way too young to be believable as well; needed to be 4 or 5 years older. Just an stunningly bad casting decision and it really hurt the movie. Wonder how much George had to do with that selection? Professional Hollywood casting directors don't normally make those kinds of mistakes.

It's hard to believe that with the incredibly high profile that movie had they couldn't have found a kid that was button-cute and could act. Many movies and TV shows are lousy with 'em.
And this falls inline with my post above. It's amazing how smart I am. I'm in awe of myself.

Stephen.

Chances are very good that I was drinking when I posted the above.

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post #15 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 06:22 PM
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Originally Posted by archiguy View Post
I agree with that. Jake Lloyd was the absolute worst child actor I've ever seen. To my knowledge, he's had no career since then either - not surprising. He had no clue, and they really needed a "natural" for that role. He was way too young to be believable as well; needed to be 4 or 5 years older. Just an stunningly bad casting decision and it really hurt the movie. Wonder how much George had to do with that selection? Professional Hollywood casting directors don't normally make those kinds of mistakes.
I remember watching some featurette about ep. 1 ages ago regarding the casting... George was the culprit iirc... Nobody could/would say no anyway.
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post #16 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 07:07 PM
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I agree with that. Jake Lloyd was the absolute worst child actor I've ever seen. To my knowledge, he's had no career since then either - not surprising. He had no clue, and they really needed a "natural" for that role. He was way too young to be believable as well; needed to be 4 or 5 years older.
Lucas talked about that in the making of doc. Originally, the character of Anakin Skywalker was written to be 12 or 13, and you figure that would work for somebody capable of putting together C3P0 from spare parts and flying landspeeders at 250 MPH.

However, he wanted to have a tearful separation between the mother and son, and he figures if the kid had been 13, he would've thought, "wow, going off to become a Jedi and have adventures... see ya, Ma!" There's a big difference when an 8-year-old child is separated from his mother. (Don't get me started on the whole issue of Skype phone calls and emails.) But that's what Lucas ultimately wanted. Lucas also hired the kid actor who looked the best for the role, but admitted on camera the kid had the worst audition. Two of the actors he didn't hire, including Hayley Joel Osment, went on to bigger and better things.

There are also huge problems with the age of the characters, since Darth Vader without his helmet in Jedi looked like he was in his 70s... and actor Sebastian Shaw was about 78 when he played that role. In truth, Anakin Skywalker would only have been about 40, assuming he had been married around the time he was 20 and 20 years passed.

Discrepancies like this are covered in great detail in the book The Secret History of Star Wars, and basically it's a lot of mistakes and off-the-cuff storytelling by Lucas that ultimately didn't quite add up in the final movies.
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post #17 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 10:21 PM
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Yes, the casting of Jake Lloyd was awful. Yes, the decision to put in the Jar Jar character was awful. Yes, the overall story/writing was poorly done. It seems that everyone who likes/defends the film does so on a purely technical level: "But the sound is whammo/socko!", etc. The film is just another example of what's wrong with Hollywood blockbusters, where almost all the effort is spent on sound and visual effects. In the final analysis, it seems that's what really mattered to Lucas, and not much more.

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post #18 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 10:46 PM
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never understood all the antipathy this film generated

I remember when it was first released talking to people and seeing reviews about how awful it was. went to see it with much trepidation and found I really liked it. its not as good as episodes IV and V, but certainly, to myself, on par with Vi. It was made as a kids movie to introduce a new generation to Star Wars (and it's merchandise). Quite sucessful on those fronts

there was plenty of uneven directing, mixed up story lines and miscasting in the OT, but nostalgia tinges our memories with forgiveness

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post #19 of 69 Old 07-19-2014, 11:44 PM
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Most of you have probably seen this, but for those who have not, here is a pretty thorough dissection on how bad The Phantom Menace is, and it is pretty entertaining in its own right. Phantom Menace is the only Star Wars movie I have not seen, although I have seen the Pod race and thought that was pretty cool.
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post #20 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 12:16 AM
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Two of the actors he didn't hire, including Hayley Joel Osment, went on to bigger and better things.
I'm guessing the other is Justin Berfield, who went on to play Reese in Malcolm in the Middle. Part of his audition was in the DVD extras. He would have been a pretty cool Anakin.
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post #21 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 12:27 AM
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I'm guessing the other is Justin Berfield, who went on to play Reese in Malcolm in the Middle. Part of his audition was in the DVD extras. He would have been a pretty cool Anakin.
The kid I remembered was Michael Angarano, who I later worked with on the Disney film Sky High, as well as the TV series Will & Grace. He was 10 times the actor Jake Lloyd was, but I have to confess, Jake did look more like Luke Skywalker at the age of (say) 8 or 9.

But I think there's more to casting somebody than just getting the right look. I think Lucas just flat-out made the wrong choice, and unfortunately by this point there was nobody around to tell him no.
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post #22 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 07:52 AM
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It was made as a kids movie
Yeah, I'm sure the kids were extremely interested in the plotline about "trade disputes".

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Originally Posted by Marc Wielage View Post
But I think there's more to casting somebody than just getting the right look. I think Lucas just flat-out made the wrong choice, and unfortunately by this point there was nobody around to tell him no.
It's interesting to contrast the reaction of fans to TPM, over which Lucas had total control, to that of ESB, over which he had the least control. Not coincidentally, Lucas thinks ESB is the worst of the Star Wars films.
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post #23 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 01:07 PM
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Are all 6 movies available in 3D yet?
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post #24 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 02:30 PM
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Are all 6 movies available in 3D yet?
AFAIK, only TPM has been converted, and only in theaters...
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post #25 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 03:10 PM
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Most of you have probably seen this, but for those who have not, here is a pretty thorough dissection on how bad The Phantom Menace is, and it is pretty entertaining in its own right. Phantom Menace is the only Star Wars movie I have not seen, although I have seen the Pod race and thought that was pretty cool.
Most of you probably haven't seen this, so for those of you who haven't, here's a summary and link to a pretty thorough discussion of how poor the Red Letter Media criticism is:

http://www.slashfilm.com/star-wars-f...menace-review/

Unfortunately, the author of the rebuttal doesn't include any rape jokes, load it with heaps of misogynistic imagery or commentary, or offer readers any tator tots, so the RLM key audience is unlikely to make it through even a fraction of it. A few of the author's points are mentioned in the Slashfilm article, though.

Scott

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post #26 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 03:25 PM
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Are all 6 movies available in 3D yet?
NO. From Entertainment Weekly:

Lucasfilm postpones 3-D release of 'Star Wars' prequels to focus on new film


“Lucasfilm has decided to postpone this fall’s scheduled release of Episodes II and III in 3D,” said the studio in a statement Monday to EW. “Given the recent development that we are moving forward with a new Star Wars trilogy we will now focus 100 percent of our efforts on Star Wars: Episode VII in order to ensure the best possible experience for our fans. We will post further information about our 3D release plans at a later date.”


http://insidemovies.ew.com/2013/01/2...wars-prequels/

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post #27 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 03:30 PM
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Good on you, man! Speak your mind and let it out. Don't allow yourself to be swayed by the nerd hipster crowd.
Quite right. The hatred for this movie isn't as universal as you might suspect. There are plenty of us who enjoyed the heck out of it.


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post #28 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 04:39 PM
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thx everyone!
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post #29 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 05:27 PM
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Originally Posted by srw1000 View Post
Lucasfilm postpones 3-D release of 'Star Wars' prequels to focus on new film... “Given the recent development that we are moving forward with a new Star Wars trilogy we will now focus 100 percent of our efforts on Star Wars: Episode VII in order to ensure the best possible experience for our fans.
I think what that means is: "the 3D re-releases didn't make very much money, plus they took a lot of time and money to do, so they're on the back burner now."

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It's interesting to contrast the reaction of fans to TPM, over which Lucas had total control, to that of ESB, over which he had the least control. Not coincidentally, Lucas thinks ESB is the worst of the Star Wars films.
I'd like to know the source for that quote. Lucas seemed to be very high on Empire in the "Making of" book released just a couple of years ago. In fact, he asked Irwin Kirshner to direct the third movie, but Kirshner demurred because he was exhausted and also wanted to direct other films.
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post #30 of 69 Old 07-20-2014, 06:16 PM
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A lot of people talk about how bad episode 1 was. I watched it 3 times on opening day and really enjoyed it. The problem is most people forget that these movies are meant to be for young children. Too many adults take these films seriously as great works in fantasy. I thought Return of the Jedi was the worst in the series but I still enjoyed it because I know the basis of the story was meant to appeal to the young child in me. Talk about cheesy and poor dialogue, Jedi had the worst script of all the films. Little tiny teddy bear Ewoks helping to overthrowing the Galactic Empire ??? Wooden arrows piercing Storm trooper armor ??? Really ??? But I do love the premise of basic sticks and stones being used against modern technology. Overall I really liked all the films and they are my favorite fantasy movies of all time.
BTW, the fight scenes with Darth Maul makes it all worth it...
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