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post #31 of 94 Old 06-20-2017, 10:42 AM
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Originally Posted by Gorilla Killa View Post
I was more along the lines of why he made Fifth Element first. Same as why Lucas made New Hope first, couldnt make the movie they wanted since technology wasnt there yet. Cameron and Avatar same thing.

He said Avatar made it possible, I do wonder how many other directors have things in the vault they were waiting to do since Luc seems to think anything is possible now.

Have we plateaued in the realm of how good a movie can be visually and audibly?

Im sure this movie is all green screen and cgi, don't care personally, just make it a stunner. It appears to be just that now gimme my nachos dawg
I remember George Lucas said something along those lines as well, about why the prequels took so much time... He said the technology wasn't there, but finally anything was possible.....back...in..1999. Look at TPM now and some of the visuals are terribly outdated and unconvincing. But you can acknowledge the lack of technological advances only after the fact. But yeah, it seems nowadays that CGI can look stupidly realistic, and I guess the upcoming Transformers film will still find a way to visually blow our minds. Our brains will always know it's an illusion though, maybe a perfect illusion, but still an illusion. The ultimate problem with CGI is that no matter how realistic it can be, it's never real. When I see Thor and The Hulk fighting in the Thor 3 trailer, I don't think for one second that Thor is in any danger. I guess the key is how it is combined with the real footage - in that respect, the Transformers films, imo, are among the best I've ever seen.
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post #32 of 94 Old 06-20-2017, 10:50 AM
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There are still major limitations to CGI. A great example is the last shot of Rogue One, where they did the fake Carrie Fisher. It looked horribly fake. In a movie of stupendous amounts of very high quality CGI, I'm assuming they did the best that can be done these days, right?
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post #33 of 94 Old 06-20-2017, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by Dean Roddey View Post
There are still major limitations to CGI. A great example is the last shot of Rogue One, where they did the fake Carrie Fisher. It looked horribly fake. In a movie of stupendous amounts of very high quality CGI, I'm assuming they did the best that can be done these days, right?
They probably did, just like they did with Jeff Bridges in Tron Legacy, or Robert Downey Jr. in Civil War. I don't know if we'll ever come to a point where a CGI human character is as convincing as a real person, but I guess that's the most difficult thing to achieve in CGI.

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post #34 of 94 Old 06-20-2017, 03:01 PM - Thread Starter
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I agree TPM is awful, its funny it didnt seem that bad when it came out. I cant even watch it now that I have a big screen. I hope they did their best, to be honest I replayed the Vader scene at the end so many times I glazed over Carrie.

I always like to think there is room for improvement, when we hit the limit of what the human eye can perceive then I guess that will be the end game. 10 years from now we will be shuddering at this years crop of blockbusters.
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post #35 of 94 Old 06-30-2017, 12:08 PM
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They are screening the opening scene in front of Spider-Man: Homecoming at select theaters.

http://www.prnewswire.com/news-relea...300482639.html

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Moviegoers will get an early look at the complete and unedited opening sequence of Luc Besson's "Valerian and the City of a Thousand Planets" in select theaters showing "Spider-Man: Homecoming" beginning with its first showtimes on Thursday, July 6. STXfilms will distribute the epic adventure in the United States beginning on July 21, 2017.

The never-before-seen opening sequence of "Valerian," which details the creation of the film's Space Station Alpha, will appear during the trailer section and Besson's spectacular vision of the future will be presented exclusively in 3D and Premium Large Format.

Participating exhibitors to feature the exclusive "Valerian" sequence include select screens at AMC (in Dolby Cinema), B&B Theaters (in Grand Screen Large Format), Cinemark (in Cinemark XD and RealD 3D), Emagine Entertainment (EMAX Large Format), Harkins Theaters (Ciné Capri Large Format and Ciné 1 Large Format), along with select regional circuits nationwide.
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post #36 of 94 Old 06-30-2017, 09:20 PM
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Hope the story is as good as the visual. Can't wait.
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post #37 of 94 Old 07-03-2017, 09:37 AM
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Definitely want to see this one. I saw the trailer watching the new transformers with my son. There is a scene in the trailer around the beginning I actually thought it was going to be the sequel too Avatar.



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post #38 of 94 Old 07-07-2017, 10:02 AM
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I'm looking forward to this movie. I've been a fan of The Fifth Element" so I hope this movie delivers what I like : Great Visuals, Great Music and Unexpected twists.

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post #39 of 94 Old 07-08-2017, 02:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean Roddey View Post
There are still major limitations to CGI. A great example is the last shot of Rogue One, where they did the fake Carrie Fisher. It looked horribly fake. In a movie of stupendous amounts of very high quality CGI, I'm assuming they did the best that can be done these days, right?
Funny thing is, the earlier CG (Tarkin) was so good, they almost fooled me. Then to see the weaker rendition of Fischer at the end is disappointing. What the heck happened?

"I knew you'd say that"...*BLAM!*
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post #40 of 94 Old 07-08-2017, 07:17 PM
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Funny thing is, the earlier CG (Tarkin) was so good, they almost fooled me. Then to see the weaker rendition of Fischer at the end is disappointing. What the heck happened?
I thought the same thing.

I believe the difference is because all of the scenes of Grand Moff Tarkin were in scenes that were dimly lit. I think the lower light condition made it easier to make a visually believable CGI character. In brightly lit scenes, the CGI just is not good enough yet to provide enough realism to trick the human eye.

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post #41 of 94 Old 07-08-2017, 07:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rezzy View Post
Funny thing is, the earlier CG (Tarkin) was so good, they almost fooled me. Then to see the weaker rendition of Fischer at the end is disappointing. What the heck happened?
They both look ridiculous and easily recognizable as CGI to me. Took me completely out of the movie at the time. When they do silly things like this, it makes me wish they'd do the entire movie as CGI, which I don't mind at all.
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post #42 of 94 Old 07-09-2017, 01:36 AM
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I wonder if the Fisher thing was an afterthought that wasn't originally part of the script , and I mean to show her explicitly like that.
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post #43 of 94 Old 07-11-2017, 06:05 AM
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Ouch.



"The Razzies don't need to wait until the end of the year to anoint a winner for 2017. The Golden Turkey Awards should be republished with a new cover. Euro-trash is back, while sci-fi will need to lick its wounds for a while. Dane DeHaan, who has starred in two of the most egregiously bloated misfires of the year with A Cure for Wellness and now this, should do a couple of indie films, while Cara Delevingne needs to learn there is more to acting than smirking and eye-rolling. Rihanna should pretend this never happened. And the Hollywood studio chiefs can breathe easy that, this time, at least, they'll escape blame for making a giant summer franchise picture that nobody wants to see, since this one's a French import.
Yes, Valerian and the City of a Thousand Planets really is that bad, bad enough that you don't know for the longest time that Valerian is one of the lead characters and not a planet or a spaceship. Sporting special effects and sets that smack of 50-year-old Barbarella-style tackiness, Luc Besson's $200-million eyesore will barely trigger a momentary blip on the American box-office radar screen, leaving Besson with the lone hope that there are parts of the world where the entertainment tastes remain, ahem, less discriminating."



http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/rev...review-1019847

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post #44 of 94 Old 07-11-2017, 06:25 AM
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It appears my tastes are less discriminating, as I always seem to enjoy movies that reviewers trash.

Can't wait!
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post #45 of 94 Old 07-11-2017, 07:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post
Ouch.



"The Razzies don't need to wait until the end of the year to anoint a winner for 2017. The Golden Turkey Awards should be republished with a new cover. Euro-trash is back, while sci-fi will need to lick its wounds for a while. Dane DeHaan, who has starred in two of the most egregiously bloated misfires of the year with A Cure for Wellness and now this, should do a couple of indie films, while Cara Delevingne needs to learn there is more to acting than smirking and eye-rolling. Rihanna should pretend this never happened. And the Hollywood studio chiefs can breathe easy that, this time, at least, they'll escape blame for making a giant summer franchise picture that nobody wants to see, since this one's a French import.
Yes, Valerian and the City of a Thousand Planets really is that bad, bad enough that you don't know for the longest time that Valerian is one of the lead characters and not a planet or a spaceship. Sporting special effects and sets that smack of 50-year-old Barbarella-style tackiness, Luc Besson's $200-million eyesore will barely trigger a momentary blip on the American box-office radar screen, leaving Besson with the lone hope that there are parts of the world where the entertainment tastes remain, ahem, less discriminating."



http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/rev...review-1019847
First of all, that guy sounds like a real party animal. <

Second, if Cara Delevingne wants to just smirk and eyeroll, I'm probably still on board with that.

Third, here are some initial reviews from similar wet blanket types on "Fifth Element".

"Todd McCarthy of Variety wrote, "A largely misfired European attempt to make an American-style sci-fi spectacular, The Fifth Element consists of a hodgepodge of elements that don't comfortably coalesce."[71] David Edelstein of Slate was even more critical, saying, "It may or may not be the worst movie ever made, but it is one of the most unhinged."[5] Chris Tucker's performance as Ruby Rhod also polarised critics.[82] He was praised in the Los Angeles Times[83] and in Time; the latter called him "the summer's most outrageous special effect."[84] Josh Winning of GamesRadar, however, singled out Tucker's performance as the low point of the film, ranking it as No. 20 on his 2011 list, "50 Performances That Ruined Movies".[85]"



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Fifth_Element


EDIT - Fourth "Sporting special effects and sets that smack of 50-year-old Barbarella-style tackiness" This is a bad thing now?
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post #46 of 94 Old 07-11-2017, 08:28 AM
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I don't know if I would enjoy Valerian, but the fact that such disparaging remarks were made about The Fifth Element, which I do enjoy, is interesting.
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post #47 of 94 Old 07-11-2017, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Morpheo View Post
"leaving Besson with the lone hope that there are parts of the world where the entertainment tastes remain, ahem, less discriminating."


http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/rev...review-1019847
I find it amusingly naive that he believes American moviegoers have "discriminating" taste.

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post #48 of 94 Old 07-11-2017, 09:34 AM
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Second, if Cara Delevingne wants to just smirk and eyeroll, I'm probably still on board with that.
And preferably with a very limited set of clothes


...I can't wait for the movie, regardless of the reviews. Besson has never been a critic favorite, even in France. Valerian looks like a lot of fun.
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post #49 of 94 Old 07-11-2017, 09:39 AM
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I find it amusingly naive that he believes American moviegoers have "discriminating" taste.
Also..."Luc Besson's $200-million eyesore will barely trigger a momentary blip on the American box-office radar screen" - I don't know, but it seems US audiences usually enjoy Besson's films, Lucy did quite well after all, and the marketing for Valerian has been rather active. Of course nobody knows if audiences will like it right now, but I think there's good chances the movie will appeal to a lot of people.

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post #50 of 94 Old 07-12-2017, 10:18 AM
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Also..."Luc Besson's $200-million eyesore will barely trigger a momentary blip on the American box-office radar screen" - I don't know, but it seems US audiences usually enjoy Besson's films, Lucy did quite well after all, and the marketing for Valerian has been rather active. Of course nobody knows if audiences will like it right now, but I think there's good chances the movie will appeal to a lot of people.
I expect that the lack of a star will really hurt the movie's box office chances. A goofy European sci-fi flick like this is inherently a risky proposition in the North American market, and this one doesn't have a leading man like Bruce Willis to anchor it. Nobody gives a crap about Dane DeHaan.

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post #51 of 94 Old 07-12-2017, 04:04 PM
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I expect that the lack of a star will really hurt the movie's box office chances. A goofy European sci-fi flick like this is inherently a risky proposition in the North American market, and this one doesn't have a leading man like Bruce Willis to anchor it. Nobody gives a crap about Dane DeHaan.
I don't think the presence of a "star" is as important as it used to be. Do people really go to a (fill in a name) movie anymore? For example, people will see go see Chris Hemsworth as Thor, but does that mean they'll see any movie just to see him? I don't think so.
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Clearly big names are still important, as was just being discussed in the Leona Headly thread. It's unfortunate, but definitely true. Lots of folks think big stars get paid big bucks to act, but it's actually part of the marketing budget. They could get people who can act for a lot less. Just having them on the cover is a big advantage, and when those big stars go out on the required publicity tour who is going to be too busy to have them on? Or if the big star tweets about his or her new movie, how many people are going to read that vs. some unknown person?

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post #53 of 94 Old 07-12-2017, 05:43 PM
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I don't think the presence of a "star" is as important as it used to be. Do people really go to a (fill in a name) movie anymore? For example, people will see go see Chris Hemsworth as Thor, but does that mean they'll see any movie just to see him? I don't think so.
Stars may have less pull on their own than they did in the past. However, the lack of any stars in a movie is still seen as a negative. Audiences find the presence of a star they like to be reassuring. When they debate whether to see a movie or not, the cast can push them one direction or the other.

When you have a conversation with someone and start to tell them about a new movie coming up, what's the first question they ask: "Who's in it?"

Dane DeHaan is not leading man material. The terrible failure of A Cure for Wellness earlier this year proved that. If that movie had been released with a bigger, more appealing star in the lead, it would have done better business.

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post #54 of 94 Old 07-12-2017, 06:57 PM
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Stars may have less pull on their own than they did in the past. However, the lack of any stars in a movie is still seen as a negative. Audiences find the presence of a star they like to be reassuring. When they debate whether to see a movie or not, the cast can push them one direction or the other.

When you have a conversation with someone and start to tell them about a new movie coming up, what's the first question they ask: "Who's in it?"

Dane DeHaan is not leading man material. The terrible failure of A Cure for Wellness earlier this year proved that. If that movie had been released with a bigger, more appealing star in the lead, it would have done better business.
Stars may get some people into theaters, but it's nowhere near a guarantee of boxoffice success. For example, Tom Cruise has had some big flops outside of the MI franchise. The same goes for Johnny Depp. The most you can say is that stars have appeal as a certain character, but that's not the same as saying "insert star A into any movie playing any character and you will make money".
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post #55 of 94 Old 07-12-2017, 07:19 PM
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Originally Posted by RobertR View Post
Stars may get some people into theaters, but it's nowhere near a guarantee of boxoffice success. For example, Tom Cruise has had some big flops outside of the MI franchise. The same goes for Johnny Depp. The most you can say is that stars have appeal as a certain character, but that's not the same as saying "insert star A into any movie playing any character and you will make money".
I'm not saying that putting a star in it would be a guarantee of success. However, having NO stars may very likely push people away. These are not the same thing.

Consider:

Scenario 1: "I don't know if I want to see this movie. But I like Bruce Willis so I'll give it a shot."

Scenario 2: "I don't know if I want to see this movie. Who's the lead kid? Dane DeHaan? Never heard of him. He looks kind of dorky. No thanks."

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post #56 of 94 Old 07-12-2017, 07:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post
I'm not saying that putting a star in it would be a guarantee of success. However, having NO stars may very likely push people away. These are not the same thing.

Consider:

Scenario 1: "I don't know if I want to see this movie. But I like Bruce Willis so I'll give it a shot."

Scenario 2: "I don't know if I want to see this movie. Who's the lead kid? Dane DeHaan? Never heard of him. He looks kind of dorky. No thanks."
I'm not as sure as you seem to be that it works that way. Did people really turn out in droves to see Jurassic World because they were thinking "I want to see Chris Pratt", or did they just want to check out the latest dinosaur movie attached to a known "brand"? Same with Guardians of the Galaxy--Marvel, known brand. Check.
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Originally Posted by RobertR View Post
I'm not as sure as you seem to be that it works that way. Did people really turn out in droves to see Jurassic World because they were thinking "I want to see Chris Pratt", or did they just want to check out the latest dinosaur movie attached to a known "brand"? Same with Guardians of the Galaxy--Marvel, known brand. Check.
Yes, fine, in cases like those the franchise brand overrides the need for stars. That still won't help Valerian any. It has no franchise branding anyone has heard of either.

All it has is: "From the director who made a movie you liked 20 years ago, but has mostly made a lot of crap nobody went to see in the meantime."

It's a hard sell, is all I'm saying.

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post #58 of 94 Old 07-12-2017, 08:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Josh Z View Post
I'm not saying that putting a star in it would be a guarantee of success. However, having NO stars may very likely push people away. These are not the same thing.

Consider:

Scenario 1: "I don't know if I want to see this movie. But I like Bruce Willis so I'll give it a shot."

Scenario 2: "I don't know if I want to see this movie. Who's the lead kid? Dane DeHaan? Never heard of him. He looks kind of dorky. No thanks."
Did you not see the kid in the movie Chronicles.
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post #59 of 94 Old 07-12-2017, 09:05 PM
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Yeah I try to forget it, he pretty much ruined it at the last act with his bad Hayden Christensen imitation of a "Darth Vader" wannabe character he wanted to create.

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post #60 of 94 Old 07-13-2017, 04:38 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by shivaji View Post
Did you not see the kid in the movie Chronicles.


Good film Chronicles

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