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post #61 of 4352 Old 04-30-2009, 06:52 AM
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Originally Posted by Inundated View Post

Getting an improved WGGN from Strongsville is not that far of a stretch. I think their new tower is between Norwalk and Ashland, which would give you this FCC TV Service Area map:

Maybe with a better/bigger antenna. But my outdoor, amplified, omni-directional antenna can't pull in WGGN here in Strongsville. It appeared that one day and the signal was very weak, no hint of a signal now or prior. Maybe they will give it a boost after June 12th??

Having just read what WGGN is and it's programming offerings, I don't want it!

As Rossanne Rosanadana says ......never mind.
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post #62 of 4352 Old 04-30-2009, 10:26 AM
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Originally Posted by toby10 View Post

Maybe with a better/bigger antenna. But my outdoor, amplified, omni-directional antenna can't pull in WGGN here in Strongsville. It appeared that one day and the signal was very weak, no hint of a signal now or prior. Maybe they will give it a boost after June 12th??

I'm assuming that they're testing the new facility. It's probably whatever they will use after the 12th, so the only improvement would be if there's some analog channel on their digital RF channel going away.

I'm only interested for reception/DX/DTV watching purposes. I'm not exactly making any special effort to pull in WGGN here, either If I wanted similar programming, I get it in my teeth from WDLI-DT 17.1-17.5 just down the road...
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post #63 of 4352 Old 04-30-2009, 11:00 AM
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Originally Posted by Inundated View Post

I'm assuming that they're testing the new facility. It's probably whatever they will use after the 12th, so the only improvement would be if there's some analog channel on their digital RF channel going away.

I'm only interested for reception/DX/DTV watching purposes. I'm not exactly making any special effort to pull in WGGN here, either If I wanted similar programming, I get it in my teeth from WDLI-DT 17.1-17.5 just down the road...

AMEN!
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post #64 of 4352 Old 04-30-2009, 11:05 AM
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Originally Posted by toby10 View Post

AMEN!

Welcome to the Wonderful World of Over-Air Digital TV, where I can watch Spanish-language religion 24 hours a day (WDLI DT 17.4) without spending a single dime. Recession buster!

And soon, I'll have two more subchannels of English-language religion, when the TCT folks take over WOAC...well, that's kind of a tossup vs. infomercials...
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post #65 of 4352 Old 04-30-2009, 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Inundated View Post

Welcome to the Wonderful World of Over-Air Digital TV, where I can watch Spanish-language religion 24 hours a day (WDLI DT 17.4) without spending a single dime. Recession buster!

And soon, I'll have two more subchannels of English-language religion, when the TCT folks take over WOAC...well, that's kind of a tossup vs. infomercials...

Yeah, I hear ya! OTA is getting like cable/sat in the "great, more sub-ch's of crap that I'll never watch", albeit on a much smaller scale.

I *really* think the networks and/or studios should follow MGM's lead with it's THIS.tv idea for sub-ch broadcasting. Even with a small and shrinking audience it still seems a viable way to get their (already paid for) additional programs and advertisers $$$$ out to millions of people who refuse to go the cable/sat route.

I'm hearing more and more the "I'm ditching my overpriced cable/sat and going back to OTA" comments. Sometimes just having OTA alone, but often combined with other free or low cost streaming services like Netflix, Amazon etc.. to broaden out the viewing options.

I'm too addicted to cable offerings and those HTPC's / servers still scare me so I'll be with cable for a long time. But I do see the attraction in combining free OTA HD with a plethora of new and evolving online video sources.
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post #66 of 4352 Old 04-30-2009, 01:41 PM
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I enjoy watching the 43.2 channel but I hate the aspect reduction from 2.35 x 1 to 4 x 3. There is also substantial editing for time and expletives, even the weak ones. But then I can go over to 35 analog and watch Roy Rogers and Bob Steele and lots of horses. Dilinger was very clean of expletives but big on death with many bullets.
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post #67 of 4352 Old 04-30-2009, 02:17 PM
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Originally Posted by JJkizak View Post

I enjoy watching the 43.2 channel but I hate the aspect reduction from 2.35 x 1 to 4 x 3. There is also substantial editing for time and expletives, even the weak ones. But then I can go over to 35 analog and watch Roy Rogers and Bob Steele and lots of horses. Dilinger was very clean of expletives but big on death with many bullets.
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That 4:3 is a PITA. I have to adjust the tuner and the TV to get a proper 16:9 normal aspect. Do the WVIZ subs have 4:3?

It's OTA and family friendly so it will be edited to Sesame Street standards.

EDIT: Yup, all subs are 4:3
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post #68 of 4352 Old 05-02-2009, 09:24 AM
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The only subchannel not in 4 X 3 is WKBN-DT 27.2 aka WYFX. It's not only 16 X 9, it's HD!

A BTW For Simpsons fans: The last few Sundays WJW has been reducing the 16 X 9 HD feed to 4 X 3 at the beginning of the show to run a stupid crawl about the end of analog TV ON THE DIGITAL CHANNEL???!??!!! I switch to WYFX to get The Simpsons in uninterrupted 16 X 9 HD.

A note to all the local advertisers who bought local avail time on WJW during The Simpsons: I see all the car dealers ads in Bordman thanks to this stupid crawl chasing me off WJW.

I can't believe the FCC would mandate the "end of analog" warning on the digital signal. Save that warning for the analog feed.
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post #69 of 4352 Old 05-02-2009, 09:26 AM
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Originally Posted by Michael P 2341 View Post

The only subchannel not in 4 X 3 is WKBN-DT 27.2 aka WYFX. It's not only 16 X 9, it's HD!

If only they would (could) do that on all subs without affecting the primary ch.
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post #70 of 4352 Old 05-02-2009, 12:47 PM
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That's a real "breath holder". When the money man says, "Why are you doing that when we could have 3 more channels with money filling up the dumptrucks".
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post #71 of 4352 Old 05-02-2009, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by JJkizak View Post

That's a real "breath holder". When the money man says, "Why are you doing that when we could have 3 more channels with money filling up the dumptrucks".
JJK

In their shoes I'd make the same choice.
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post #72 of 4352 Old 05-03-2009, 07:11 AM
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Just wanted to thank everybody for the help. I got my Winegard MS 2002 mounted to the chimney, and I'm all set. Was a little worried when I did the initial scan and only 5 and 8 came in, but then I realized I didn't have the power on to it. Once I did, everything came in very clearly. The only issue is channel 25, which will improve soon I guess, but I can get 49 really well.
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post #73 of 4352 Old 05-03-2009, 08:57 AM
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Originally Posted by Skraut View Post

Just wanted to thank everybody for the help. I got my Winegard MS 2002 mounted to the chimney, and I'm all set. Was a little worried when I did the initial scan and only 5 and 8 came in, but then I realized I didn't have the power on to it. Once I did, everything came in very clearly. The only issue is channel 25, which will improve soon I guess, but I can get 49 really well.

Congrats! Those are about as low profile (with decent performance) as you can get. If the flat white contrasts with your homes color too much you can paint it with any non-metalic paint. I stained mine with my homes brown house stain (need not bother with the top of it, obviously).

What is the difference between your MS2002 and my MS2000? Just a newer model? Just curious.
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post #74 of 4352 Old 05-03-2009, 03:13 PM
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What is the difference between your MS2002 and my MS2000? Just a newer model? Just curious.

Didn't see anything online which talked about the difference, it was just the only thing the place I ordered it from had. I was a little impressed when the package arrived to see an April 14, 2009 date of manufacture stamped on it.
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post #75 of 4352 Old 05-03-2009, 03:36 PM
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You mean it wasn't made in China?
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post #76 of 4352 Old 05-06-2009, 08:06 AM
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Originally Posted by Skraut View Post

The only issue is channel 25, which will improve soon I guess, but I can get 49 really well.

25 will improve as soon as they as they can get an antenna on that new WKYC tower rising above the Parma area, which, according to various reports, is now about halfway done.

WVIZ filed with the FCC that it could have its new facility up by "mid-May", which won't happen unless they work really, really fast.

But both stations are presumably still aiming for going full power digital on June 12th. They can probably get the thing done by then, with a week or two to spare to test both the new DT 26 signal for WVIZ, and DT 17 for WKYC. 17 analog out of Canton signed off last month.

So, I'd say, "hope" for earlier, "expect" June 12th.
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post #77 of 4352 Old 05-06-2009, 08:27 AM
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Though I have TWC and a Terk HDTVa Antenna, I bought a Free to air Satellite System with my Income tax this year..Buy the proper receiver, dish, LNBF and add a motor..Pull in what's out there..for free..At the moment, I can receive:

2 Retro TV Network feeds-(East/West)
Several This TV affiliates..(Though they may go anytime, since the stations are in the process of being sold)
Montana PBS
Some Montana and 1 Michigan Fox affiliate (same situation as the This affils)
2 Wyoming ABC affiliates (Casper and Cheynne) Watching their news is fascinating..All the reporters/anchors look about 18 years old)
A couple of MyNet Affiliates (also being sold)
All the TBN Diginets
Several other religious English Channels
ABC News Now
White Springs TV-Public Domain Movie heaven
Ohio News Network
Many Foreign Networks and scattered radio stations
NBC-TV "wild feeds"
Varied other educational channes such as the Research Channel and Univ. of Washington TV

This in no way replaces Cable/Satellite for most people, but I can see some..With a good outdoor antenna..That this might be just about enough tv..And This is WITHOUT "pirating" signals..
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post #78 of 4352 Old 05-06-2009, 04:47 PM
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Tim Lones:
What is a "Free To Air Satellite System" in detail?
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post #79 of 4352 Old 05-06-2009, 05:41 PM
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Well, I can tell you what I use..

Fortec 36" Satellite Dish
Fortec Star Dynamic Free-to-Air receiver
Sadoun Universal LNB
Sadoun DG-280 motor to move the dish using the remote for the receiver.

I bought the equipment in a package deal from Sadoun Satellite Sales out of Columbus for around $300.00

The dish has to be bigger than the normal DBS Dish..and installation can be tricky..There are lots of places one can find help..
Also I didnt mention this in my original post, but I have a KuBand system..
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post #80 of 4352 Old 05-07-2009, 02:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JJkizak View Post

Tim Lones:
What is a "Free To Air Satellite System" in detail?
JJK

FTA, as the name implies, is free broadcasts of ch's and networks from around the world. Here is a list of English stations available:
http://www.ftalist.com/english.htm

But, keep in mind, to get all of those listed ch's you would need to access all 15 satellites (rotation and separate LNB for each).
Two of the Galaxy sats cover probably half the ch's listed.
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post #81 of 4352 Old 05-07-2009, 03:27 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by toby10 View Post

FTA, as the name implies, is free broadcasts of ch's and networks from around the world. Here is a list of English stations available:
http://www.ftalist.com/english.htm

But, keep in mind, to get all of those listed ch's you would need to access all 15 satellites (rotation and separate LNB for each).
Two of the Galaxy sats cover probably half the ch's listed.


Which is where what is called a HH-(Horizon to Horizon) motor comes in,,

Here are a few pictures of my setup..




I do apologize if the topic is straying too far from OTA..Just wanted to present another option for folks..
LL
LL
LL
LL
LL
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post #82 of 4352 Old 05-07-2009, 04:07 AM
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Which is where what is called a HH-(Horizon to Horizon) motor comes in,,...............
.............I do apologize if the topic is straying too far from OTA..Just wanted to present another option for folks..

No, it's interesting, alternatives are good to know about which is why I posted the FTA ch list. FTA offers an incredible opportunity to see a multitude of ch's, broadcasts, and alternative programming from around the world. It is especially handy for bi-lingual persons or people who may be transplants from another country.

I looked into FTA years ago but decided against it for two main reasons:
- Any needed southerly exposure for sat is not possible for me (trees)
- Thousands of ch's to choose from, but very few I would watch.

When I narrowed the available ch's down to English versions, then filtered out the many duplicates (multiple PBS', ABC's, etc...) then filtered out the networks I'd never bother with (kids stuff, religious ramblings, etc...) there wasn't much left for my interests.

Pentagon TV would certainly be interesting from time to time, but for me such infrequent viewing couldn't justify the cost and tinkering (this coming from an A/V tinkerer).

OTOH, there is always the availability of Al Jazeera.
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post #83 of 4352 Old 05-07-2009, 05:11 AM
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I am also surrounded by huge oak trees with a small opening to the major tv antenna farms in the Parma/Seven hills area.
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post #84 of 4352 Old 05-08-2009, 11:27 AM
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Im just courious if anyone in the massillon/canton area can pick up nbc or cbs? they are the only 2 channels i cant get and i know the wek signal and all but its almost june12 and i still cant pick them up. i have this antenna antennasdirect.com/DB8_HD_Antenna . any help would be great.
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post #85 of 4352 Old 05-08-2009, 12:07 PM
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Originally Posted by samcraig View Post

Im just courious if anyone in the massillon/canton area can pick up nbc or cbs?

any luck with Youngstown? NBC-HD/CW-SD & CBS-HD/Fox-HD Youngstown are strong here in North Canton...
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post #86 of 4352 Old 05-08-2009, 01:41 PM
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Be patient on NBC, their tower is being built right now.

As for CBS, you likely need a VHF antenna of some kind. You might want to consider adding something like the Y10-7-13 or something of that nature to your setup to receive that and Fox after the transition.

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post #87 of 4352 Old 05-08-2009, 02:19 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by samcraig View Post

Im just courious if anyone in the massillon/canton area can pick up nbc or cbs? they are the only 2 channels i cant get and i know the wek signal and all but its almost june12 and i still cant pick them up. i have this antenna antennasdirect.com/DB8_HD_Antenna . any help would be great.

The DB8 antenna is intended primarily for UHF reception. As NBC Cleveland is currently still on VHF ch 2 with low power, you'll probably not be able to receive them. When they move to ch 17 in June, you should have much better prospects. CBS Cleveland is on VHF ch 10 and will remain there after the June switchover date. They will probably remain problematic for some time as their power increase request is running into objections from Canadian station CFPL, London ON who is also on ch 10. (Ch 10 was a very poor channel choice for CBS Cleveland as it has always had interference problems, going in both directions.)

As previously noted, CBS/NBC Youngstown stations are good alternatives as they put strong signals into the Canton/Massillon area and they are both on UHF channels. If you had a VHF/UHF antenna, I would also recommend NBC station WTOV ch 9 in Steubenville OH as they now put a strong signal into this area. Previously, they were on ch 57 which also worked well for the Canton area. CBS station WTRF ch 7, Wheeling WV also provides a usable signal into much of this area when received on a good antenna system.

Personally, I would never recommend a UHF only antenna to anyone. A VHF/UHF antenna is usually more preferable and should be equipped with an antenna mounted preamplifier, at least for this area. You should also be able to rotate your antenna with a rotor or otherwise as signals are arriving here from different directions. Proper directional antenna adjustment also seems to generally be much more critical for digital reception than it is/was for analog reception. Omni-directional antennas will probably be more problematic that directional ones, IMO. Finally, your antenna should be mounted as high as possible away from obstructions and connected with appropriate cabling. Hopefully, some of this will be helpful to you. I'm sure that others will have further suggestions.
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post #88 of 4352 Old 05-18-2009, 04:10 AM
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This morning I am picking up WTOL-11 Toledo (RF17) 11.1 and their 11.2 Weather Now, using the Terk HDTVa in Canton..First time I've gotten something outside the area in a while, and the first for WTOL.
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post #89 of 4352 Old 05-18-2009, 05:34 AM
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Sometimes with ducting Toledo analog channels 11 and 13 will come booming in and if strong enough will get picked up on the digital scan.
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post #90 of 4352 Old 05-19-2009, 02:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tim Lones View Post

This morning I am picking up WTOL-11 Toledo (RF17) 11.1 and their 11.2 Weather Now, using the Terk HDTVa in Canton..First time I've gotten something outside the area in a while, and the first for WTOL.

What's going to happen when WKYC DT switches to RF 17???
I hope WTOL DT plans on going back to rf 11, otherwise those in the fringe area between Cleveland and Toledo are screwed.
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