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Local HDTV Info and Reception > Las Vegas, NV - HDTV
Word Maestro's Avatar Word Maestro 12:26 AM 12-26-2007
Vegas-Steven,

SD NEVER looks "fine" on any HD station. Nor does TBS-HD, and TNT-HD, which often (but not always) uses "stretchovision" and CW-HD, so far is a waste. The only HD show I found on it was "Smallville". And even that was in HD two weeks ago, but wasn't this last week.

Why do companies have an HD station, if they don't transmit HD on it?

But of course if you watch alot of the Fox News Channel and You-tube, you're not very discriminating anyway.

gvc's Avatar gvc 07:25 AM 12-26-2007
I have both D* and Cox. I completely agree that D*'s SD picture is noticeably worse than Cox's. But, on the other hand, D*'s HD picture quality beats out what the 8300 DVR spits out from Cox on any HD channel comparison between the two.
vegas-steven's Avatar vegas-steven 04:14 PM 12-26-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Word Maestro View Post

Vegas-Steven,

SD NEVER looks "fine" on any HD station. Nor does TBS-HD, and TNT-HD, which often (but not always) uses "stretchovision" and CW-HD, so far is a waste. The only HD show I found on it was "Smallville". And even that was in HD two weeks ago, but wasn't this last week.

Why do companies have an HD station, if they don't transmit HD on it?

But of course if you watch alot of the Fox News Channel and You-tube, you're not very discriminating anyway.

well. I don't know what to say about that last line regarding fox and youtube. Seeing as alot of people wacth non network news and don't want to watch CNNs positions politically I guess I am probably not the only guy who tolerates the non HD of it.

I am actually huge on quality of signal. It kills me that so much hd is actually upcomverted crap. That is an issue I had with d* their hd count includes alot of channelsnlike the cw with 1 or 2 hours of hd per day.

As for youtube. All my original files are on mini dv and the movies themselves are h.264 encoded at between 1500-3000 Kbps. They are indistinguishable from the original. Youtube ruins them with crappy flash 7 encoding.

Anyone know a better quality site with youtube like traffic and features??
bruin95's Avatar bruin95 12:29 AM 12-27-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by vegas-steven View Post

so the OTA HD is ok?

Yes.
Word Maestro's Avatar Word Maestro 01:38 PM 12-27-2007
Cox FINALLY has ABC-HD back on.
Only took 5 days. Ridiculous (Holiday or no holiday).

Now we'll see how long before the next loss of signal or interruption in service occurs.
I'll bet it won't be TOO long.
GeorgeLV's Avatar GeorgeLV 05:30 PM 12-27-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Word Maestro View Post

Cox FINALLY has ABC-HD back on.
Only took 5 days. Ridiculous (Holiday or no holiday).

Now we'll see how long before the next loss of signal or interruption in service occurs.
I'll bet it won't be TOO long.

Haven't you switched to DirecTV yet?
jb1219's Avatar jb1219 09:21 PM 12-27-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Word Maestro View Post

Cox FINALLY has ABC-HD back on.
Only took 5 days. Ridiculous (Holiday or no holiday).

Now we'll see how long before the next loss of signal or interruption in service occurs.
I'll bet it won't be TOO long.

good lord...why dont you cancel their service already.. i'm so tired of reading about your personal pity-party when it comes to cox.
Word Maestro's Avatar Word Maestro 11:45 PM 12-27-2007
I will switch to D* after the month of January.

D* does not carry PBS-HD, and there are several music programs including "Live from Lincoln Center" and "The Metropolitan Opera Presents" on PBS-HD, which I want to see. Since I am not a millionaire, I cannot afford two HD services.

Thank You for your suggestions and interest.
Word Maestro's Avatar Word Maestro 12:17 AM 12-28-2007
jb1219,

Why don't you put me on your "ignore" list? That way my personal "pity-party" won't interfere with a brave, tolerant and staunch soul like yours. The same advice is hereby freely dispensed to others who find my posts annoying to their psyches.
bruin95's Avatar bruin95 12:27 AM 12-28-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Word Maestro View Post

D* does not carry PBS-HD

They will soon.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showthread.php?t=957956
vegas-steven's Avatar vegas-steven 12:33 AM 12-28-2007
I've no complaints against cox. The he looks great and most of their channels are 100% hd. All the time. Sure d* seems great but the sd programming indeed does look washed out cmpared to cox. Since as it is now we watch most things in sd that factors in IMO.

You have 72 hours after actvation to cancel service and avoid the fee. D* tried t charge me still and I had to spend 2 days disputing the charge.

I recommend you get a FREE hd box first and if you don't lime the signal ECT you can always cancel without paying 300 for the DVR.

Btw. D* had way lover support linewaits than cox did foe me. I spent 30 minutes on hold once and then got an Indian call center which couldn't help me.

Something to consider.
Word Maestro's Avatar Word Maestro 12:46 AM 12-28-2007
bruin95,

Thank you for that information regarding PBD-HD on D*.
So far, that has been the only thing that deterred me from making the switch from Cox, many, many months ago. In addition the inclusion of the Fox Regional Sports Networks in HD (I'm an inveterate baseball fan) make me look forward to the installation of D* in the near future.
gvc's Avatar gvc 09:02 AM 12-28-2007
I dont see why you cant get PBS-HD free OTA. doesn't your HDTV have a built in HD tuner that can pull in all the locals? PBS-HD is on channel 10-1 i think.
hdtvxpert's Avatar hdtvxpert 09:18 AM 12-28-2007
You can get PBS-HD on D* as long as you get the H-20 or HR-20 receivers. They have built in OTA. KLVX has a strong enough signal that if an outdoor antenna is not an option, bunny ears will pull it fine most anywhere in town.
GeorgeLV's Avatar GeorgeLV 11:38 AM 12-28-2007
DirecTV adds CSTV and Tennis in HD.

Las Vegas HD Channel Guide December 28, 2007
Code:
Broadcast Networks   OTA    Cox   DirecTV   Dish  CMA (Pahrump)
------------------  -----  ----- --------- ------ -------------
ABC  (KTNV)          13-1   732      13
CBS  (KLAS)           8-1   730       8
Fox  (KVVU)           5-1   735       5
NBC  (KVBC)           3-1   733       3
PBS  (KLVX)          10-1   731
CW   (KVCW)          33-1   734
MyTV (KVMY)          21-1 

Cable Networks
------------------ 
A&E                         707     265     9419
Animal Planet                       282     9489
Biography                           266
Bravo                               273
Cartoon Network                     296
CMT                                 327
CNBC                                355
CNN                                 202
Discovery                   727     278     9487
Food Network HD             724     231-1   9462
Fox Business                        359
FX                                  248
HGTV HD                     723     229-1   9461
History                     703     269     9491
MTV                                 331
National Geographic         702     276     9429   562
Nickelodeon                         299
Science Channel                     284     9490
Sci-Fi                              244      
Spike                               325
TBS                         726     247     9499
TLC                         722     280     9488
TNT                         709     245     9420   565
USA                                 242
VH1                                 335
Weather Channel                     362

HD Only Networks
------------------
HD Theater                  700      76     9421   555
HDNet                                79     9422
HDNet Movies                         78     9423
MGM                                 255
MHD                         725     332     9492
Mojo                        706
Smithsonian                         267
Universal HD                708      74     9427   560
Voom - Animania                             9474
Voom - Equator                              9471
Voom - Family Room                          9486
Voom - Film Fest                            9480
Voom - Gallery                              9472
Voom - GamePlay                             9485
Voom - HDNews                               9482
Voom - Kung Fu                              9479
Voom - Monsters                             9481
Voom - Rave                                 9470
Voom - Rush                                 9476
Voom - Treasure                             9477
Voom - Ultra                                9478
Voom - World Cinema                         9475
Voom - WorldSport                           9473

Premium Networks
------------------
HBO East                            501     9456
HBO West                    710     504            510
Cinemax East                        512     9458
Cinemax West                711     514            530
The Movie Channel                   544
Showtime East                       537     9460
Showtime West               720     540            520
Sho Too                             538
Starz East                          520     9435
Starz West                  721     521    
Starz Comedy                        519
Starz Edge                          522
Starz Kids & Family                 518 

Sports (* games only)
------------------
Big Ten Network                     220     9500
CSTV                                610
ESPN                        704     206     9424   550
ESPN2                       705     209     9425
FSN West                            652      367*
FSN Prime Ticket                    653      361*
FSN Arizona [1,2]                   649-1*   365*
FSN Bay Area [3]                    654-1*
Fuel                                612
Golf/Versus HD                      604     9468
NBA TV                              601     9508
NFL Network                 729*    212     9464
NHL Network                         215      403
Speed                               607
Tennis                              217

1 - MLB D'backs only. Other pro teams blacked out.
2 - NHL Coyotes in Pahrump and some other outlying zip codes, blacked out in Las Vegas valley.
3 - MLB Giants and A's. Other pro teams blacked out.

Sports Subscriptions
------------------
MLB Extra Innings HD       soon     yes       no
NBA League Pass HD         soon     yes      yes
NHL Center Ice HD          soon     yes      yes
NFL Sunday Ticket HD         no     yes       no

Word Maestro's Avatar Word Maestro 12:12 PM 12-28-2007
gvc and hdtvexpert,

I live in an apartment complex, but fortunately have a southern facing patio on which I was able to have the D* antenna mounted. I have D* SD on my secondary TV, on which I watch the MLB EI package. But now that those games will be available in HD and now that D* apparently has plans to add PBS-HD to its lineup, I am planning to change that SD antenna and receiver to the 5 LNB dish and the HR20 DVR, and of course connect them to my HDTV, and jettison Cox as quickly as I can.
If the url provided by bruin95 is accurate, PBS-HD will soon be available on D*. Since classical music programming will be very sparse on PBS-HD after January (and until next autumn) and since the baseball season doesn't start until April, I am in no hurry. I doubt if a "rabbit ears" antenna would work very well in my apt, as I am on the ground floor of a three story complex. What makes me believe this, is that I had a Sirrius Satellite Radio installed in my apt and the antenna which was provided brought in ZERO signal, thus necessitating the return of the unit. For me, D* is the way to go as far as PBS-HD and baseball coverage are concerned.
hask's Avatar hask 12:37 PM 12-28-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by GeorgeLV View Post

Haven't you switched to DirecTV yet?

This wasn't addressed to me, but I will answer anyway. I would love to switch to DirectTV, if for no other reason than hockey in HD, but I don't want to give up the convenience of On Demand that I have with Cox, both for premium services such as Showtime and HBO, as well as channels such as Howard TV.

Hask
LVKeith's Avatar LVKeith 02:05 PM 12-28-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by hdtvxpert View Post

You can get PBS-HD on D* as long as you get the H-20 or HR-20 receivers.

Not yet. PBS-HD will be added sometime in 2008 as they just reached an agreement on this recently. Channel 3, 5, 8 & 13 are the only local HD stations on D* at this time and this is only on the H-2x or HR-2x receivers and requires the 5LNB dish.

Keith
GeorgeLV's Avatar GeorgeLV 02:41 PM 12-28-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by hask View Post

This wasn't addressed to me, but I will answer anyway. I would love to switch to DirectTV, if for no other reason than hockey in HD, but I don't want to give up the convenience of On Demand that I have with Cox, both for premium services such as Showtime and HBO, as well as channels such as Howard TV.

Hask

Do you have a high speed internet connection?

If yes, DirecTV has On Demand. For the most part the selection is better than what's on Cox, but no Howard TV yet.
GeorgeLV's Avatar GeorgeLV 02:45 PM 12-28-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by LVKeith View Post

Not yet. PBS-HD will be added sometime in 2008 as they just reached an agreement on this recently. Channel 3, 5, 8 & 13 are the only local HD stations on D* at this time and this is only on the H-2x or HR-2x receivers and requires the 5LNB dish.

Keith

What he was saying is that those models have built-in OTA tuners. All you need to do is plug in an antenna and all of the OTA HDTV channels and sub-channels will be integrated into your guide and DVR.
gvc's Avatar gvc 06:32 PM 12-28-2007
The newer h21 and hr21 do not have a built in OTA tuner.
Word Maestro's Avatar Word Maestro 12:01 AM 12-29-2007
Does anybody have experience using the HR21DVR?

Additional question: Right now I have a 3LNB dish mounted on my patio wall. Will the larger size and weight of the 5LNB "Slimline" cause me any installation or operational problems?
HiHoStevo's Avatar HiHoStevo 12:49 PM 12-29-2007
Has there been local signal outage on 8.1 and 13.1 via OTA here in Vegas??

I am up in Anthem and was receiving 8.1 & 13.1 via a powered antenna and then a week or so ago the signal is no longer receivable. 3.1 for NBC has always been the lowest of the three and it appears to be less reliable also although it does still work.

I am wondering if it is a problem with the power for my antenna or if the local stations (ABC & CBS) had for some reason had signal problems on their HD OTA broadcasts.
gvc's Avatar gvc 01:28 PM 12-29-2007
got a new laptop for xmas with Vista home premium loaded. This is my first experience with Vista. The one thing I'm pulling my hair over is the slowness of the internet and downloads with the Vista laptop as compared to the XP laptop. Same cable modem and router used between the two. When I use the lvcm.com speed test I normally get over 20 Mbps downloads with the XP machine but less than 8 Mbps with Vista. Does anyone here familiar with Vista know of a setting or tweak I can use to get "up to speed" ?
bruin95's Avatar bruin95 04:50 PM 12-29-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by gvc View Post

got a new laptop for xmas with Vista home premium loaded. This is my first experience with Vista. The one thing I'm pulling my hair over is the slowness of the internet and downloads with the Vista laptop as compared to the XP laptop. Same cable modem and router used between the two. When I use the lvcm.com speed test I normally get over 20 Mbps downloads with the XP machine but less than 8 Mbps with Vista. Does anyone here familiar with Vista know of a setting or tweak I can use to get "up to speed" ?

I bought a new machine in March that came with Vista. Had a similar problem with a seemingly slower connection. I had a router that was about 6 years old. Once I connected the computer directly to the modem, bypassing the router, the speeds jumped to "normal" levels. I went out and bought a new router, making sure that it said "Vista compatible" on the box. I haven't had any speed issues since. So my advice would be to connect the laptop directly to the modem and see if your speed jumps. If so, first see if there is updated firmware for your router to make it work better with Vista. If that doesn't work, it's time to go shopping. If the speed didn't increase when hooked directly to the modem, you may need to buy a new one also. That's the one major issue with Vista, hardware compatibility. It just doesn't like older hardware and manufacturers have been slow in updating their drivers and firmware for Vista. They'd rather you go out and buy new hardware.
foghorn2's Avatar foghorn2 06:28 PM 12-29-2007
How is it the same football game is on both 8 and 3 tonight?

It does look better on 8 though.
vegggas's Avatar vegggas 07:41 PM 12-29-2007
Back in town for the holiday weekend...
Watching and comparing the NFL game tonight between NFLNHD, CBSHD, and NBCHD. This clearly shows how the same feed can look different on the varying networks here in Las Vegas.

Best quality = NFLNetwork HD - No breakup at all and a sharp clear picture throughout the game and decent sound (some minor breakup with full screen wipes) . PCM Stereo sounds good using Neo6 mode and Dial Norm autoatically adjusts up by +4db.

Second best quality = CBSHD - Looks like slighty better than normal CBS quality with some picture breakup during fast plays and whole screen graphics wipes. Grass just starting to look "digital" in some shots where you can see the individual blades and light reflections. Stereo audio as usual here for us, but lower and flatter (less dynamic) than NFLN feed.

Worst picture quality = NBCHD - Looks like average NBC feed quality or possibly worse with a flatter less dynamic image. Noticing more picture breakup during plays and many screen graphics wipes. Grass looks very "digital" in comparison to the other feeds. NBC locally takes the Stereo feed sent nationally and "converts" it to a fake Dolby Digital 2.0 feed.

vegggas
vegggas's Avatar vegggas 07:57 PM 12-29-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by foghorn2 View Post

How is it the same football game is on both 8 and 3 tonight?

It does look better on 8 though.

Fog,
Even if you dont watch the game, you should also compare it to the NFLNetworkHD feed on your Dish, compared to your OTA feeds.
The networks are all getting the same feed from NFLNetworkHD and this is what the individual stations do to the pristine signal...
NBC has dropped their video quality a lot over the last few years, and both stations multicast and degrade the image a bit (moreso on NBC).

vegggas
Word Maestro's Avatar Word Maestro 10:44 PM 12-29-2007
I watched the first quarter on the NFL Network, the second quarter on CBS, and the entire final half on NBC.
I AGREE that the NFL Network had the best picture and sound.
But I DISAGREE that the CBS feed was better than the NBC feed. I thought the NBC feed was superior to that of CBS.
On CBS when an end zone camera was being used (for extra points and punts), the picture was momentarily out of focus and there was an apparent "snap" in the picture (not the audio) to bring it back into focus. This did NOT occur on the NFL or the NBC feeds. In addition during rapid action sequences, the CBS feed turned blurred and the NBC feed remained rock solid. For a very brief time in the fourth quarter, I toggled between the NBC and CBS feeds, and DID FIND that the NBC feed was at least 5 seconds BEHIND the CBS feed. But I couldn't see that it affected the picture or audio quality in any way..
I can't wait to FINALLY be rid of Cox after the New Years holiday.
vegggas's Avatar vegggas 11:11 PM 12-29-2007
Word,
I'm glad you got a chance to compare signals, but you do understand that the differences that you saw were related to the networks and had noting to do with Cox, right?
I stopped doing a lot of comparasons between networks at halftime, but there was a brief outage on NBCHD and their weather channel. After that happened, it appears, that NBC may have reduced the bitrate of their subchannel and the audio was warbling there, and the PQ of NBC went up a bit. I still watched NFLNet for their audio because NBC's fake 5.1 sounded bad. The blurring you describe on CBS is related to their old (by todays standards) transmitter encoder that takes the network feed from 40Mbps down to a broadcastable 15 to 18Mbps per signal. They were the first local broadcaster to get their encoder, and it is also the oldest and least efficient. The latest ones can take that same network feed and reduce it down to less than 13Mbs and still look better than their current one at 16Mbps.

vegggas
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