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post #91 of 6997 Old 02-11-2003, 08:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by KBandy
fgr41, where are you? I am just south of Bridgeport and Morris. You've got the same line up we do. As far as why WRTV doesn't say "6" instead of 25, that is done via channel mapping software at the broadcaster. Probably either personal preference or lack of capability of the equipment is why they don't.

I'm with you on the program guides. As far as I know, the only local station that sends the guide info is WISH.

I'm in Avon, and have to say that the sig strength I get is impressive. I have an attic antenna and am using a amp that was left from Time Warner cable. I was worried because the cable from the antenna is not very thick gage and has a union 1/2 way on a 75 foot run that then gets put into a diplexer to combine the DTV and OTA signals, then split in back of the TV. The weakest signal I get is 85, most channels are in the high 90's.

It's great to see so many stations doing DT here. I think there is only one more station I'm waiting on and every local channel worth watching will be DT. Now if only WRTV would do channel mapping I would have nothing to whine about.

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post #92 of 6997 Old 02-12-2003, 04:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by fgr41
It's great to see so many stations doing DT here. I think there is only one more station I'm waiting on and every local channel worth watching will be DT. Now if only WRTV would do channel mapping I would have nothing to whine about.

Yup, I guess we're fortunate to live in a "DTV Zone" or what ever Indy was designated. I have a Samsung 150 for OTA, so I don't have any signal strength numbers, but my "meter" is normally about mid-deflection. So you don't get 53 (WTTV, Trafalgar) either, I see. I guess we'll have to wait until they up their power. At least we can catch the channel 4 basketball games on 59-2.

Later,
Ken
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post #93 of 6997 Old 02-13-2003, 04:09 PM
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Anyone else have problem where WFYI changes from re-mapped channel 20 to DT 21 and then screen goes black,with sound continuing?
I am in New Castle using a DISH 6000 with 8VSB. I can added DT channel 21 and it will re-map to 20 correctly and show up in the guide also. I can select it from the guide or tune to it directly. After watching it for a while it will go black and show as channel 21-1. This has happened at various different times,from two minutes to more than an hour and a half.
The receiver will lock-up for about 20 seconds. I can then channel up to 21-2 for a couple of seconds,till the banner display changes to 20-2 and go back to 20-1. Then the cycle will repeat. I have a signal strength in the high eighties. Anyone have any clues (TOM)????
Tickled to death that PBS is now on the air!!!!

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post #94 of 6997 Old 02-13-2003, 04:12 PM
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I haven't watched enough of 20.1 or .2 to know. Most of the time I just check out what is on while im dial'n around.

I'll try and toon in more and see if I have any trouble.

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post #95 of 6997 Old 02-14-2003, 05:13 AM
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WFYI-DT runs about 58kw toward New Castle, which is about 44 mi from the xmtr. Could you be getting a marginal signal, at times? I've never seen any remapping, but I'm only 12 mi. from the xmtr and have plenty of signal.
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post #96 of 6997 Old 02-14-2003, 05:21 AM
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Just have to chime in on how ecstatic I am about having basically all my local channels in DTV. I have many other family members around the country with HD-ready sets and no local digital signals to pull down, except maybe CBS. DTV is awesome and we are really fortunate in Indy.
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post #97 of 6997 Old 02-14-2003, 09:18 AM
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I'm wary of trying to diagnose problems with other stations, but you should give a ring to WFYI Engineering and let them know you're having some problems.

Some of the factors to consider: when are your problems happening - daytime (when they may be making some adjustments) or evening (less likely that they're fiddling)? What make and model receiver are you using and what version of software does it have? Do you know of any Channel 21s coming from, say, Dayton? You may be picking up a bit of signal off the back side of the antenna and thus getting some contradictory PSIP (virtual tuning) data.

We're all learning a lot, both on the station side and the viewer side!

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post #98 of 6997 Old 02-14-2003, 10:30 AM
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Hey Tom, did you ever reach a conclusion on the "red saturation" or digital overdrive problem that was discussed earlier? I know on the opening of CSI (the original), when the scene cuts to a bright red, with the detective with a two way up to his mouth, there is always a break up and "stuttering" of the picture. And on just about any source with suddenly bright colors, there will be picture break up, and some times even audio drop outs, I believe.

Thanks,
Ken
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post #99 of 6997 Old 02-14-2003, 02:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Ken,

I'm still noticing the same thing on CSI. That's about the only show I watch where I notice that situation.


Open question to all: Is anyone else getting strange signal readings from WFYI-DT? Does anyone know if the station is actually operating at its full licensed power? Since I first saw the station a week ago today, I've been getting very low signal readings on my DTC100. Several times I've experienced some very wild and fluctuating signal readings. I live about 6 miles NE of the "antenna farm" and in the past I have experienced some multipath problems with various stations until I changed my outside antenna last year and added a variable attenuator to the line. All the other local stations are reading fine. At 5 p.m. this evening the signal meter was reading only 52 for channel 21, with some signal fluctuations and occasional dropouts. Meanwhile, channels 9, 16, 32 and 46 were reading 94; channels 25,45 and 53 were reading 88; and even 11 (WLFI-DT, Lafayette, without my preamp on the line right now) was reading a rock-solid 46. I'm confused as to why my signal for 21 is so low and erratic.

Steve
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post #100 of 6997 Old 02-14-2003, 04:05 PM
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Steve,

I live in Spencer and all the channels I get from Indy are 88 to 92 signal but WFYI-DT doesn't come in at all. The analog channel come in fine. I would like to know my self.

Brad
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post #101 of 6997 Old 02-14-2003, 04:46 PM
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Steve,

I'm still getting good readings on the DTC-47-57 even after lowering the tower from 45ft down to 30ft last night,in anticipation of the ice storm.Is both your installs still operational?Any difference? Maybe you're in a deep radiational null from their tx.

Sure wish it would warm up.I'm sick of winter!

GB
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post #102 of 6997 Old 02-14-2003, 10:37 PM
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I'm not getting WFYI, UPN, or WHMB up in Kokomo tonight (antenna: UHF and a UHF/VHF in my attic, no amp, aiming almost south, no rotor; tuner:Philips DSHD800).

All my numbers seem low tonight though (because of the snow/rain?):
9-65
11-15
16-0
21-0
25-86
32-0-30-72 (all over the place)
45-72
46-93
53-0

Is WFYI-DT up 100% of the time now? Is there a schedule of what is on 20-1 and 20-2, what is in HD, etc...? I didn't find much on their website.

The 20kW power of CBS 9 explains why it has always been weak for me. Why would they choose (or be forced) to use 9 if there is another 9 so close? I always thought it might have something to do with the fact it was VHF where everything else I get (UHF) has been around 20% stronger.


BTW, I have a webpage setup for some friends/coworkers to help answer the questions they are asking me about HDTV from Indy...


IndyHD

I'll try to get it updated this weekend with the latest info.
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post #103 of 6997 Old 02-15-2003, 02:42 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by KBandy
Hey Tom, did you ever reach a conclusion on the "red saturation" or digital overdrive problem that was discussed earlier? I know on the opening of CSI (the original), when the scene cuts to a bright red, with the detective with a two way up to his mouth, there is always a break up and "stuttering" of the picture. And on just about any source with suddenly bright colors, there will be picture break up, and some times even audio drop outs, I believe.
Thanks,
Ken

Bit off-topic to this thread but is the issue I posted about in the HDTV Hardware section something like what you guys are talking about?

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...hreadid=226588

AKH
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post #104 of 6997 Old 02-15-2003, 05:49 AM
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AKH, it sounds similar. But some of what you mention sounds like the nature of the digital beast.
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post #105 of 6997 Old 02-15-2003, 08:58 AM
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I watched WFYI last night on and off for a while from 6:30 to 8:00. It changed to DT 21-1 twice. After it reset to 20-1,I turned my antenna East to Dayton/Columbus OH to see how strong WBNS on DT 21 was. I would occasionally get a whiff of WBNS. One time I got enough signal to see that they are not sending PSIP info to re-map their channel to channel 10. I don't think their signal is strong enough to effect WFYI when my antenna is pointed to the West. BTW I am using a Channel Master 3677 antenna,33' off the ground and a Channel Master 0064dsb pre-amp. My signal strength is still in the high 80s. Will keep watching a bit longer before I contact WFYI.
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post #106 of 6997 Old 02-15-2003, 10:18 AM
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Bright red still causes WISH-DT to break up. A friend in Atlanta never sees it on CBS there. Those who see the CBS HD feed don't see the break up, either.
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post #107 of 6997 Old 02-15-2003, 10:21 AM
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I updated the database this morning and it includes the new WTTK-DT application. Download the TVFMSTNS database into its own directory and unzip. Then run TVFMSTNS.

www.qsl.net/w9aj
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post #108 of 6997 Old 02-15-2003, 02:42 PM - Thread Starter
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Thanks guys for the feedback on WFYI-DT reception. Greg, your stacked Triax antenna array is still outside and I have tried it on WFYI-DT. Sometimes the signal is slightly better from it, but usually I have a little stronger signal from the 4228. I'm sure the current height situation is part of the factor.

Here at 5 p.m. it appears that WFYI-DT is completely off the air. I'm getting zero signal. Per the comments from WRTV engineer Paul Roehm, in an earlier post, maybe the engineers at WFYI are finalizing the installation. It will be interesting to see how the signal is when the station signs on again. Meanwhile, the snowy, windy weather today doesn't seem to be affecting DTV reception. Currently I'm getting a very strong reading of 92 from WTTV-DT, 53 at 37 miles and a stable reading of 52 from WLFI-DT at 40 miles.

Larryv, that's an interesting application for WTTK-DT, if I followed it correctly. Moving the transmitter site for WTTK-DT, 54 from Windfall to Indy and using the WXIN tower is rather surprising. About two months ago Rick Poling commented to me in an e-mail that when ch. 54 signed on I wouldn't have any trouble receiving it. Now I understand.

Steve
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post #109 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 08:57 AM
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Same problems here with WFYI in Fishers. I was picking it up just fine a couple nights ago and now nothing. Must be the station...
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post #110 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 10:33 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by fgr41
Question I have is, why doesn't ABC 25.1-2 show up as 6.1-2 since all the other of the major networks convert their channels to their Analogue #?

I e-mailed WRTV about this many months ago and the engineer told me that they are going to abandon channel 6 and stay on 25 once the analog channel shuts down. I think (?) it was that the FCC wants all channel 6 stations to give their bandwidth back to the FM band.
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post #111 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 10:49 AM
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Anyone know what's up with UPN WNDYDT and why the signal strength would be so erratic? I've seen it cycle between o (unlocked) and 72.
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post #112 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 10:55 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by kwerner
Anyone know what's up with UPN WNDYDT and why the signal strength would be so erratic? I've seen it cycle between o (unlocked) and 72.

I just flipped over and didn't get any signal in Kokomo either. Maybe snow/weather related?
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post #113 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 11:00 AM
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WNDYDT is pretty much always like this regardless of weather from what I remember.
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post #114 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jim_Hunt
I e-mailed WRTV about this many months ago and the engineer told me that they are going to abandon channel 6 and stay on 25 once the analog channel shuts down. I think (?) it was that the FCC wants all channel 6 stations to give their bandwidth back to the FM band.


Hmmmm that's disappointing for me... I was hoping that when WRTV moved their digital signal to ch 6 I'd have a better chance of receiving it at my location. Even tho I am on a hill with a 40' tower, I am not at the top of the hill. So there is more hill behind me (north of me) and trees. I can get signal from 25-1 but rarely enough for a lock or viewable.

That is using a combo VHF/UHF antenna with preamp and rotor. I do have an 8 bay CM UHF antenna and preamp but it is on a 25' mast and doesn't do as well as the tower antenna. Perhaps I need to get it on top of the tower.... Won't be me climbing it tho!

AKH
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post #115 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 03:46 PM - Thread Starter
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WNDY-DT is strong and stable at my location this evening. I'm 17 miles from the tower at 214 degrees. Just a reminder that the station does use a directional antenna so your reception problems could be partially related to your location. To the north/northwest, field values range from .849 @ 350 degrees all the way down to .193 @ 310 degrees. Just for fun, I plugged in the latitude and longitude readings for the WNDY tower in Strawtown and for the WIOU-Radio towers on St. Rd. 26, Kokomo to check the distance and azimuth.... www.indo.com/distance/index.html This website calculated the distance to be 21 miles @ 333 degrees. At 330 degrees, WNDY-DT's field value is .532, which should indicate around 282kw(corrected) heading that direction. Conversely, your TV antenna should be pointing SSE at about 153 degrees.

Around 11 a.m. today I noticed that WFYI-DT was on the air and then about an hour later I noticed it was off. Last I checked it was still off the air.

AKH, regarding WRTV-DT, your profile doesn't mention your location. How far are you located from the tower at 79th & Township Line Road? I'd be curious to know. Thanks.

Steve
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post #116 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 04:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by goldrich
AKH, regarding WRTV-DT, your profile doesn't mention your location. How far are you located from the tower at 79th & Township Line Road? I'd be curious to know. Thanks.

Steve

I am 3 miles west of Bedford. Just off IN 450- (3 miles on HWY 450 from HWY 37 and IN 450 intersection to be more exact).

AlanH
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post #117 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 04:26 PM
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Re: WNDY-DT
Antenna field is voltage based, not power. So a field ratio of 0.532 with 1,000kw in the main lobe, translates to 282kw at 330 deg. This is 5.5db down from the main lobe.
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post #118 of 6997 Old 02-16-2003, 04:55 PM - Thread Starter
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larryv,

Thanks for correcting my miscalculation and for the explanation. I thought it was power based....oops!! I'll edit the post.

AlanH,

That's quite a distance to Bedford. The extra height might help you. MAX HD in Greensburg has a lot of experience in that department.

Steve
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post #119 of 6997 Old 02-18-2003, 01:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally posted by goldrich
-snip-
AlanH,
That's quite a distance to Bedford. The extra height might help you. MAX HD in Greensburg has a lot of experience in that department.
Steve

Who is/What is MAX HD?

Antennaweb and TitanTV both think I should recieve WRTV's (25-1) digital signal.... and TTV4 (53-1, 53-2) as well . While analog 4 is fine I was under the impression that the ch 53 signal was too weak to get here. That said, it does register higher than RTV 25-1 on the meter and is SOMETIMES viewable late at night (and on those times 53-1, 53-2 have been viewable, oddly video has been rock solid with only a 37 on the meter which I don't understand)

Altho I do take both sites with a grain of salt. Antennaweb lists Terre Haute analog reception which is marginal for me yet doesn't list some Louisville stations (analog) that are fine.

Louisville ABC is not broadcasting digital @ full power. When they did ramp it up for a test and then a few days later for the Superbowl it was receivable to me BUT not perfect.... My DST3000 had a firmware upgrade since then so maybe it would be better locking in now. Dunno...

OTOH, The Lousiville CBS and NBC tests have pegged my meter and been perfect. Their tower is in Indiana so are closer to me than the city of Louisville actually is.

So it looks like in this part of Indiana... at my location.... there will be some digital holes in reception. I am crossing my fingers that with all the full power testing WAVE and WLKY are doing that they will broadcast at full power here shortly when they finally go 'live'.


I don't hold much hope for FOX reception. Unlike the other analog's from Indy (6,8,13) FOX 59 has not been viewable at all. FOX out of Louisville are doing the absolute minimum possible both in power and terms of broadcast I gather from this forum. I can't get them..sometimes the meter will blip for them but that is it.

...Still curious what the CM4228 would accomplish at the top of the tower.... or another 10' of height on the tower...

AKH
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post #120 of 6997 Old 02-18-2003, 05:19 AM
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MAXHD is in Greensburg, I think.
Surprised you get anything from ch 53. It only runs 4kw and is about 40 mi. from you. 21/25/45 are about 70 mi. from Bedford. That is pushing it for the usual outside antenna. Ch 46 is about 72 mi. and ch 32 is 90 mi. Only 25, 46 and 32 are at or near max power. Ch 21 and 32 are using directional antennas which favor your direction. Only ch 25 is using a top-mounted antenna; all others have side-mounted. You should try the best UHF antennas. The higher the better, but you have a hill near you and that sometimes means stronger signals are at less that maximum height. You should consider a preamp at the antenna. You do not have strong UHF locals, so overloading is not a consideration.
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