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post #91 of 4969 Old 01-01-2003, 09:01 AM
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I third the recommendation for Champagne Audio. The guys there are serious about staying informed on these topics (and I stop by about once a week to make sure they know the latest that's going on!).

WAND seemed more stable last night, but I had to re-orient my antenna to pull in the signal. I wonder why - did they do something with their transmitter?

John C.
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post #92 of 4969 Old 01-01-2003, 09:15 AM - Thread Starter
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As to WAND last night .... they obviously did something.

As to the antenna reorientation .... early in the evening you
may have had to re-orient to avoid interference from the channel
18 NTSC station in Lafayette Indiana ..... early in the evening there
was a period of the strongest tropo propagation from the east I
have ever seen .... for example, there was a Grade A picture
from Ch. 20 (PBS) in Indy! Ch 18 was Grade B before WAND turned on.
For the first time ever I got a good picture on 29. At the peak I
even got a stable picture on digital 46 from Indy .... over the
local LP 46!

But what WAND did should not change the picture quality. Did
nobody else notice? Their 17-2 appeared with a picture ...
just what I had "guessed" would eventually show up there ....
all weather all the time. Actually a wonderful resource.

Doug McDonald
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post #93 of 4969 Old 01-01-2003, 10:00 AM
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Doug,

Yes,there was some hot"refraction action" here last night also.All St.Louis DT's,except 39,were in very strong for a period of time.KDNL 30 completely wiped out local WTIU 30 to the extent I thought they went off the air.Not even a trace of cci.Amazing stuff.

Also had WAND DT-18 in when Layfayette 18 cooled down.Only one new DT log,WBUI DT-22,Decatur.DTV log #70.

**HAPPY NEW YEAR**
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post #94 of 4969 Old 01-01-2003, 04:42 PM
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The tropo must have been it - today everything is back to normal, and I'm getting a very stable picture on 17-1, which I've been watching since the Rose Bowl came on (thank you, WAND). Not HD, but far superior to what I get on their analog signal.

Meanwhile, still not a peep out of Fox. Now that football season is about over, I don't really care anymore . . .

John C.
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post #95 of 4969 Old 01-05-2003, 07:48 PM
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So, what is the verdict on WICS-DT? I got it once or twice in November, but have never been able to get it since. I'm at least 40 miles from the transmitter. I can get WBUI-DT and WAND-DT fine, even when I point my rotor at what I believe to be towards WICS-DT's antenna (according to antennaweb.org).

They were just teasing with high power and now back down into a few light bulbs range (as reported here earlier)?

WAND-DT DD5.1--I guess not. I just e-mailed their engineering to ask about that. I guess nobody else here notices or cares

Matt
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post #96 of 4969 Old 01-06-2003, 05:17 AM
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I get WICS-DT very rarely -- and I'm only about 15 minutes out of Springfield. It's pretty disappointing.

As for WAND-DT, I can't say that I've ever noticed them broadcasting DD 5.1. If they were, I'm pretty sure I would have noticed by now. I usually look twice at what's on when I see the blue light on my receiver...
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post #97 of 4969 Old 01-06-2003, 06:45 AM - Thread Starter
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Neither WICS, WICD, nor WCIA can tease with high power. They
don't have the transmitters, and for WICS and WICD, the antennas would melt anyway.

What WCIA has that WICD and WICS (Sinclair) don't have is
an antenna at full tower height. WICD and WICS are on
antennas barely taller than Ham radio operator can use.

You should not expect them to get any better before May 1, 2006.

Doug McDonald
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post #98 of 4969 Old 01-06-2003, 10:29 AM
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It must have been a real fluke to get WICS-DT around 40 miles away then. I have a good NBC out of St. Louis fortunately.

However, the Sinclair ABC out of St. Louis is still having transmitter problems (the engineer posted again today). Between this and WAND-DT, maybe one will be ok for the Super Bowl--I guess DD5.1 would be a bonus at this point.

Matt
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post #99 of 4969 Old 01-15-2003, 01:33 AM
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Well, I guess DD5.1 isn't high on WAND-DT engineering's list either. My e-mail of 10 days ago was ignored.

I realize it will be nice to have 2 choices to choose from for the Super Bowl, but I just wish somebody could give a technical explanation why it is so hard to get a 5.1 feed retransmitted. Probably in a thread around here somewhere. Maybe I'll start a new one.

Matt
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post #100 of 4969 Old 01-15-2003, 06:51 AM
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Matt,

The Dolby 5.1 feed comes from ABC at a non-standard bitrate (640 kb/s) from the ATSC standard (384 kb/s). Thus, the affiliate is responsible for purchasing a decoder to split to three AES audio pairs, L/R/C/LFE/RS/LS, and then re-encode the AES pairs at the compressed bitrate. In addition, the need to switch these AES pairs requires additional audio switching apparatus, be it a router, or HD switcher. ABC does not feed all HD programs in 5.1, therefore the affiliate also needs to control the encoder to switch it from DD5.1 to DD2.0 whenever the network is only providing stereo. Again, the affiliate needs to justify each purchase in difficult economic times, just as I had to do to get my DTC-100 past the wife!
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post #101 of 4969 Old 01-15-2003, 09:39 AM
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Best explanation I've found without a search Thanks . . . I assume somehow CBS plans on an easier route or else they wouldn't be speaking for their stations saying they will have x number of them up in 5.1 this year!

However, I did get a response to a follow up e-mail to WAND-DT engineering. To paraphrase, I guess they have the required equipment for DD but are still working on configuring it.

There is still hope for Super Bowl Sunday I guess . . .

Matt
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post #102 of 4969 Old 01-15-2003, 10:00 AM
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Turls,
You are not the only one hoping for the superbowl in HD 5.1. Please keep the board informed of any updates you get them. I get WAND here in Normal only if I reaim my antenna, so until you say it is up and running correctly I won't be making the effort to reaim.
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post #103 of 4969 Old 01-15-2003, 11:28 AM
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Well, I wouldn't be surprised if there is a way to manually switch they wait until the big day to do it. I have a rotor so it will be no big deal for me to go with either KDNL-DT or WAND-DT, depending on which one is better that day or else who is passing through 5.1.

As far as just HD goes, both seem to be doing pretty well, but I usually leave mine towards St. Louis for obvoius reasons.

Matt
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post #104 of 4969 Old 01-17-2003, 09:27 AM - Thread Starter
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WAND-DT is sick. They are working to fix the problem. The macroblock
problems are not your antenna.

Doug McDonald
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post #105 of 4969 Old 01-22-2003, 05:09 AM
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I was trying to watch all the HD programming on Channel 18 last night. Great Video but no audio for the entire evening! Channel 42 was fine as was 23-1. Did you notice the lack of audio? I am beginning to worry about this for the Superbowl.


Pacragoe

Winegard 9095P with Channel master rotor.

pcragoe
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post #106 of 4969 Old 01-22-2003, 07:55 AM - Thread Starter
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Yep. No audio on WAND.

Doug McDonald
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post #107 of 4969 Old 01-22-2003, 09:14 AM - Thread Starter
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I talked to WAND's chief engineer. There's no way we are going
to be able to contact their on-duty engineer in the evening, because
their phone system simply is incapable of doit it .... I don't understand why.

That's the bad news.

The GOOD news is that they were trying to get surround sound working
in time for the Super Bowl. They may succeed. Also, they will be sure to check to see and hear that everything is working more reliably in the future.

Doug McDonald
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post #108 of 4969 Old 01-22-2003, 10:44 AM
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Thanks for the follow up.

I will turn in this evening to see if the sound is on from 8:00 -8:30.

pcragoe
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post #109 of 4969 Old 01-22-2003, 11:43 AM
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I thought they had it working, it just took a manual switch. Maybe I misunderstood the response and your info is newer than mine.

I would think they would be able to do the manual switch for the SB if nothing else.

In any case, I'll start the day pointing at Decatur. KDNL-DT's engineer confirmed they don't even have the equipement for DD5.1 and won't get it anytime soon.

Quote:


Originally posted by jdmcdonald
The GOOD news is that they were trying to get surround sound working
in time for the Super Bowl. They may succeed. Also, they will be sure to check to see and hear that everything is working more reliably in the future.


Matt
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post #110 of 4969 Old 01-27-2003, 06:50 AM
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No posts on the SB? Did somebody start a different thread? Well, no DD5.1 on WAND-DT. I was lead to believe by the engineer that they had the equipment, it just took a manual switch? Is it that complicated?

Maybe the DD5.1 viewers were spared the lip sync issues I had the ENTIRE game. Come on ABC! It definitely dulled the impact of the SB HD for my guests . . . a little

Matt
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post #111 of 4969 Old 01-27-2003, 07:55 AM
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Yep, the lip-sync issues were disconcerting, but the picture was just stunning.

By the way, I switched between WAND and Detroit's ABC station (which I get via Canada's StarChoice small dish system), and they were having lip sync issues, too. Not as bad as WAND, but it made me wonder whether the problems were network-feed related. Also, no 5.1 from Detroit, either, even though that station does ABC's prime time programming in 5.1. So I wonder if the 5.1 problems were network related (although this also could have been a StarChoice issue).

By the way, I think we should e-mail WAND and tell them thanks. Even with the sound problems, they are the ONLY central-illinois station doing HD right now, so we should pat them on the back. If the SuperBowl had been on CBS, none of us would have gotten an HD picture (well, I would have via StarChoice, but not from WCIA!).

John C.
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post #112 of 4969 Old 01-27-2003, 08:40 AM
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Do you know the email address for WAND so that we can send them our thanks, for having the superbowl on in HD? I can not comment on the 5.1 lip sync issue as we watched the superbowl at a friends house using my HD reciever, and an HD projector, while listening to the sound of the SD feed which was playing on the other TV's
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post #113 of 4969 Old 01-27-2003, 09:08 AM
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Easiest way to e-mail them is from their website:

http://www.wandtv.com/

Click on "Contacts" in the "Inside WAND" box on the LH side of the site, and you'll get a list of WAND's various departments with their e-mails imbedded.

John C.
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post #114 of 4969 Old 01-27-2003, 10:46 AM - Thread Starter
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The Super Vowl worked just fine Chez McDonald.

The 720p on my 720p LCD RPTV was simply awesome. I did not
notice any artifacts. Perhaps they only occurred with people with
1080i TVs. Oh yes ... there were artifacts galore on upconverted material,
like a one pixel wide yellow line at the right edge of the pillarbox.

This show convinced me that 720 really is the way to go for sports ...
1080@30p would be good for some things, but the FCC should
totally ban 1080i.

Doug McDonald
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post #115 of 4969 Old 01-27-2003, 11:13 AM
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I tried watching the superbowl from wand dt 17-1 with my panasonic 47" windescreen and a new zenith hd420. Not much luck. Terrible problems with the screen breaking up and alot of audio difficulty with dropouts and the sound running behind the lip movements. The picture repeatedly would break up and then go black with no signal and then restore shortly thereafter. These problems were particularly evident during the halftime show. Anyone else have these problems with wand?
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post #116 of 4969 Old 01-27-2003, 01:54 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:


Originally posted by uihoops
I tried watching the superbowl from wand dt 17-1 with my panasonic 47" windescreen and a new zenith hd420. Not much luck. Terrible problems with the screen breaking up and alot of audio difficulty ... Anyone else have these problems with wand?

Not here in Champaign ... it was perfect.

Doug McDonald
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post #117 of 4969 Old 01-27-2003, 05:21 PM
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It looked good on my Samsung ts 160 and Hitachi 57swx.... which converts it to 1080i.... therefore, it does not look quite as good as native 1080i on my set.

The main problem I had was lip sync. The video preceeded the audio by and obvious margin... Not sure why, but I will have to check other ABC material to see if it is there.....

HD Net, and HBO are fine....

Pretty good show overall, but the ABC SD upconvert stuff was awefull... much worse than when the sammy converter does it.

D
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post #118 of 4969 Old 01-28-2003, 08:47 AM
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Migman, did you get to contact Samsung about your OTA issues yet? I'm going to hold you personally responsible if I get those stations eventually if they up the power and Samsung hasn't fixed the problem

Matt
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post #119 of 4969 Old 01-28-2003, 09:45 AM
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After I thanked them for the broadcast, which I received just fine in Springfield, I asked WAND-17-1 how much it costs to upgrade to HD broadcast. Here is their reply. He also apologized for the lip synch problem during the SB.

Is it true that it cost millions to broadcast in HD like WAND is now
doing?

It depends. It can cost a couple of million if the tower has to be
strengthened to take a full power antenna and feed. Digital 480I can now be upconverted for 30-75 grand for the encoding only. The FCC permitted
stations to put on a low power signal to serve the main city only for an
interim solution which saves the cost of a full power transmitter. I didn't
have to strengthen the tower and still spent over a million. The government
is saying the regular transmitter will have to be turned off sometime in the
future so its going to be a pay it now or pay it later unless they change
their mind.

I saw the out of time audio but was afraid I would kill it
By adjusting it.

wandeng@wandtv.com

pcragoe
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post #120 of 4969 Old 02-09-2003, 09:06 AM
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Well, I've contacted everyone.
Samsung and Direct TV alterately ignore, or make lame excuses and fail to address the problem. I did get some good communications with the engineer at the station... and he pretty much said that they have a PSIP problem that causes problems with some boxes... Has to do with two 'primary' (-1) stations. (49-1 and 3-1).
He said it was a top shelf thing to address, buy that was probably 3 weeks ago. I will have to check back.

D
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