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post #901 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 11:44 AM
 
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Well, up here on the "hill" [ N. Wright Rd ] in Janesville was getting 13 HD BEFORE yesterday with at least 60% signal. Now no signal whatsoever. Also seem to have lost 17 digital , but 17 analog still comes in, albiet snowy.

I have a garage attic antenna ( 14 element uhf/vhf outdoor type ) with a dual port amp on it supplying 11 db boost per port. All the Madison stations still come in great. as well as 39-1, 23-1, but no 13 or 17 DTV.

Did some of these stations switch frequency and transmitter location when they went full digital? I was under the impression that most stations would be going "full power" when they switched to only digital. Yes/No?

This is on a Phillips 26PF5321 LCD in our bedroom and a Mitsubishi LT-46231 in the living room. Neither gets the above mentioned channels anymore even after a rescan. I have an RCA ATSC21 , maybe I'll try hooking that up and see if it gets anything my two sets won't.
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post #902 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 11:57 AM
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13 moved to RF channel 13 I believe, you probably need to re-scan to pick it up.
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post #903 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 12:36 PM
 
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Quote:


This is on a Phillips 26PF5321 LCD in our bedroom and a Mitsubishi LT-46231 in the living room. Neither gets the above mentioned channels anymore even after a rescan.

Did rescan.... actually twice. Last night and just an hour ago. Samo-samo here...
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post #904 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 12:41 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phase700B View Post

Did rescan.... actually twice. Last night and just an hour ago. Samo-samo here...

If you haven't already, first delete the channel(s) you are having trouble receiving before re-scanning.
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post #905 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 01:02 PM
 
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I think the stations are still having problems. 30 minutes ago, I checked my Philips HDTV and 17-2 was on, but black screen on 17-1, which is impossible. Now a few minutes ago both 17-1 and 17-2 are on. Still no 13. I did manually delete 13-1 on my second rescan and still no 13.
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post #906 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 01:05 PM
 
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I also just connected up an unused RCA ATSC21 HD tuner cleared it a did a fresh scan. Doesn't pick up 13 DTV either. Are they on another planet or is there some broadcast format or sub code info that they are using that won;t work with all DTV tuners?
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post #907 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 02:22 PM
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I have the DirecTV H20 receivers, rescanned on both of them last night and both found 13 without problems, so at least it *can* work. Today I did a scan using my eyeTV hybrid USB tuner using just a small desktop antenna, and although I had 13 before it is not coming in now. Channel 3 and 27 from Madison are, though, as well as 17/23/39 from Rockford, so maybe something isn't quite right exactly... I dunno.

Just FYI, the USB stick is using the Xceive XC5000 tuner and LG DT3305 ATSC Decoder.
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post #908 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 02:43 PM
 
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Ok, went back to the RCA ATSC21, did a rescan, still no 13. I then checked signal strength for the other Rockford stations, 17-1, 23-1, 39-1. I noticed 17-2 breaking up a bit and sure enough, signal was only about 30 - 35%. However 23-1 is hovering around 55-60% and 39-1 is at least 75%. So, given the weather and maybe something different with 13's transmission location or actual power output, I may not get 13 DTV here on the north side of Janesville.... unless I go outside with my antenna on a mast. Don't wanna do that. Don't need 13 that much.

There must be something amiss though. We should be within the reception area and I see others are having some problems too.

We watch 27-2 mostly [ almost like TV Land and no cost ] and 3-1 for NCIS, Mentalist, news weather.
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post #909 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 04:41 PM
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The RCA ATSC21 is a very old and not-very-sensitive tuner, isn't it? If so, you might do better with a Samsung DTB-H260F or something newer.
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post #910 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 05:13 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

The RCA ATSC21 is a very old and not-very-sensitive tuner, isn't it? If so, you might do better with a Samsung DTB-H260F or something newer.

You need to read the rest of my posts. The RCA was just another try since my two other HDTVs also stopped picking up the WREX signal.
Quote:


This is on a Phillips 26PF5321 LCD in our bedroom and a Mitsubishi LT-46231 in the living room. Neither gets the above mentioned channels anymore even after a rescan. I have an RCA ATSC21 , maybe I'll try hooking that up and see if it gets anything my two sets won't.

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post #911 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 05:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phase700B View Post

All the Madison stations still come in great. as well as 39-1, 23-1, but no 13 or 17 DTV.

13 moved back to ch 13 VHF.
You may need to get a different antenna.
Just a thought...
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post #912 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 05:37 PM
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Does anyone know what WREX ERP is now. I don't think their at the 15KW on RF 13. Moving from RF 54 to 13 they would have to substantially lower their power.
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post #913 of 1188 Old 02-18-2009, 10:37 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sebenste View Post

Hey all,

WREX is not doing well with 12 kw down here in DeKalb. At my place on the northwest side, I used to get it easily with my ChannelMaster 4228 UHF antenna. But now, I only have VHF antennas pointed east and south. Picking it up off the side isn't working from either antenna. I have one for standby use and that one may need to be added to my antenna arsenal to get it. As a side note, I have a ChannelMaster 4228 (discontinued) UHF-only antenna at work, and it's near the top of a 80' building, or about 60' up. It gets WREX-DT in going from good to bad. But to be fair, 13 analog off that thing was multipath Hades and I fully expect my third generation tuner isn't liking it.

But on a nastier note, they couldn't even lock it from the NIU Holmes Student Center antennas, some 180' up! They get blips of it, but a lock isn't there (it's even too weak to resolve any PSIP data). To be fair, those antennas are probably just UHF antennas, albeit professional (cable TV) quality ones. In any case, until that issue is resolved, it's been taken off the NIU campus cable system and replaced with WTVO-DT instead, which proverbially pegs the signal meter.

Edit: I unhooked one of my two ChannelMaster 4228 mesh screen UHF antennas, which I used primarily just to get WLS and WTTW in Chicago. When my 6th gen tuner came along, one of the two antennas wasn't needed anymore. So, I put it into a VHF slot on my VHF-UHF splitter, put it on the north side of my attic, pointed it towards Rockford, and it took a lot of tweaking to get the reception of WREX to a solid 60% lock, just leaning against a wall until the weather warms up and I can spend more time up there. I can't get WWTO-DT 10 anymore on my VHF antenna pointing south since that slot is now filled, but due to a hill in the way, I rarely got it anyway. If they go 80 kilowatts, then it'll happen, but until the weather warms up, this is what I have for now, which is fine.

Also, a friend of mine in Waterman, using a Winegard HD7084P pointed at Rockford, is now able to lock WREX-DT solidly for the first time. And, a guy on the Chicago OTA board who lives in Plano, 25 miles southeast of DeKalb, got WREX for a few minutes this afternoon, but then lost the signal. He can lock WTVO fine, but not WIFR or WQRF.


I have the new 4228HD and I have in a attic single story ranch house and I have it pointed about 300` to Madison and I was able to lock on WREX 13 since they switch from 54 to 13, while the Rockford is at 240` and currently I don't have any pre-amp hook up to it yet but I was able to get Madison FOX 47 which is on 11 with good lock on it too. When I move it to Milwaukee I was able to get PBS 10 which is on 8 for DT and no problem getting them.

Willie
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post #914 of 1188 Old 02-19-2009, 05:08 AM
 
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That is probably the problem with me. If 13 moved to the lower power RF position, then I may have to get that rotor that I've had sitting it a box mounted up in the garage attic.

That being said, I still get Milwaukee analog channel 6 off the side of my antenna, and before "transition day" was getting Milwaukee analog channels 4,10, 12 and UHF 18 and sometimes 24, with my antenna parked at about 300 degrees towards Madison. That does mean I'm picking up all the Rockfords off the back/side of my antenna. I just think it's weird that I get Milwaukee analogs off the side when they are farther away, but Rockford is iffy. But, there are always terrain issues, power levels, etc.
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post #915 of 1188 Old 02-21-2009, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Phase700B View Post

That is probably the problem with me. If 13 moved to the lower power RF position, then I may have to get that rotor that I've had sitting it a box mounted up in the garage attic.

That being said, I still get Milwaukee analog channel 6 off the side of my antenna, and before "transition day" was getting Milwaukee analog channels 4,10, 12 and UHF 18 and sometimes 24, with my antenna parked at about 300 degrees towards Madison. That does mean I'm picking up all the Rockfords off the back/side of my antenna. I just think it's weird that I get Milwaukee analogs off the side when they are farther away, but Rockford is iffy. But, there are always terrain issues, power levels, etc.

Exactly. Sorry I'm late in replying here, but WREX's power doesn't seem to be transmitting effectively with its 12 kw. It should be a blowtorch here in DeKalb, but it is not. Maybe the antenna or transmitter needs to be tweaked, I don't know. But it should do better than what it is right now. With 12 kilowatts, the rejection of the antenna of a relatively weak signal is not surprising. You'll need that rotor to get it.

Gilbert
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post #916 of 1188 Old 02-21-2009, 04:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sebenste View Post

Exactly. Sorry I'm late in replying here, but WREX's power doesn't seem to be transmitting effectively with its 12 kw. It should be a blowtorch here in DeKalb, but it is not. Maybe the antenna or transmitter needs to be tweaked, I don't know. But it should do better than what it is right now. With 12 kilowatts, the rejection of the antenna of a relatively weak signal is not surprising. You'll need that rotor to get it.

It would be interresting to see what the MER and the EVM readings are. MER shoud be 27+ and EVM should be below 4.

"Celebrating 15 years of searching for new and inovative ways to completely screw up television"

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post #917 of 1188 Old 02-23-2009, 07:38 PM
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Originally Posted by hvs10trk View Post

It would be interresting to see what the MER and the EVM readings are. MER shoud be 27+ and EVM should be below 4.

I live at the East edge of Rockford, near Alpine and Charles, which is near the highest point in Rockford. I am using amplified indoor antennas (2), one is a Terk which includes rabbit ears and the other is a Radio Shack which also includes rabbit ears. I find it nearly impossible to lock onto WREX, channel 13. Is the correct Transmit Number for this station 54? I did find that the Rabbit Ears need to be about 21 inches long to lock onto WREX. The other 3 Rockford stations lock in very well. Right now, I have the TV connected to the Terk locked onto 13.001 and 13.002 without breakup. Since I just looked up the transmit number, 54, I am going to try to set my other TV to that number and see if I can get a lock on WREX on that TV.

----------

OK, I just went to the other HDTV tuner which shows Transmit number, Channel number and Signal Strength.
I set the transmit number to 54 and was not able to get any signal no matter how I adjusted the antenna. Then I set the Transmit number to 13. After extending the rabbit ears to full length, the meter jumped to 57%.

Apparently the reason that I was getting a good signal prior to the switchover, is because the transmit number was 54. I assume that 54 was UHF and 13 is VHF. Maybe now, thanks to the help found here, I can get WREX good enough to view it on that primary over-the-air tuner. :-)

After more tweaking, I got the signal strength up to 65. This is good enough to watch both WREX programs. The rabbit ear length is 19 inches for both. The tips are 6.5 inches apart. This Radio Shack antenna has a mesh reflector with a wire bow tie in front of the reflector and rabbit ears behind the reflector. The bow tie had to be rotated a little clockwise from full counter-clockwise. The upper left and lower right wire segments extinding from the center hub now form a vertical straight line. The amplifier dial is set to three o'clock, not quite maximum. Rabbit Ear length and Bow Tie rotation are very critical! Signal strength is about 90 for the other 3 Rockford stations.

The antenna is sitting just below and just in front of the wall mounted TV, which is not ideal.

Before the switch-over, I used the Terk with this tuner and had it on a high shelf in a nearby closet, where the Terk was getting all four Rockford TV Stations most of the time.
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post #918 of 1188 Old 02-24-2009, 09:22 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by iwampfler View Post

I live at the East edge of Rockford, near Alpine and Charles, which is near the highest point in Rockford. I am using amplified indoor antennas (2), one is a Terk which includes rabbit ears and the other is a Radio Shack which also includes rabbit ears. I find it nearly impossible to lock onto WREX, channel 13. Is the correct Transmit Number for this station 54? I did find that the Rabbit Ears need to be about 21 inches long to lock onto WREX. The other 3 Rockford stations lock in very well. Right now, I have the TV connected to the Terk locked onto 13.001 and 13.002 without breakup. Since I just looked up the transmit number, 54, I am going to try to set my other TV to that number and see if I can get a lock on WREX on that TV.

----------

OK, I just went to the other HDTV tuner which shows Transmit number, Channel number and Signal Strength.
I set the transmit number to 54 and was not able to get any signal no matter how I adjusted the antenna. Then I set the Transmit number to 13. After extending the rabbit ears to full length, the meter jumped to 57%.

Apparently the reason that I was getting a good signal prior to the switchover, is because the transmit number was 54. I assume that 54 was UHF and 13 is VHF. Maybe now, thanks to the help found here, I can get WREX good enough to view it on that primary over-the-air tuner. :-)

After more tweaking, I got the signal strength up to 65. This is good enough to watch both WREX programs. The rabbit ear length is 19 inches for both. The tips are 6.5 inches apart. This Radio Shack antenna has a mesh reflector with a wire bow tie in front of the reflector and rabbit ears behind the reflector. The bow tie had to be rotated a little clockwise from full counter-clockwise. The upper left and lower right wire segments extinding from the center hub now form a vertical straight line. The amplifier dial is set to three o'clock, not quite maximum. Rabbit Ear length and Bow Tie rotation are very critical! Signal strength is about 90 for the other 3 Rockford stations.

The antenna is sitting just below and just in front of the wall mounted TV, which is not ideal.

Before the switch-over, I used the Terk with this tuner and had it on a high shelf in a nearby closet, where the Terk was getting all four Rockford TV Stations most of the time.

WREX 13 has stopped doing analog on 2-17-09 and switch digtial from 54 UHF to 13 VHF-Hi the old analog channel.

Willie
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post #919 of 1188 Old 02-25-2009, 09:14 PM
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Did WTVO and WQRF end analog programming as planned? WTVO was supposed to be a 60 day nightlight.

Thanks,
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post #920 of 1188 Old 02-26-2009, 05:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Falcon_77 View Post

Did WTVO and WQRF end analog programming as planned? WTVO was supposed to be a 60 day nightlight.

Thanks,

All are off the air except WTVO, nightlighting for 60 days.

Gilbert
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post #921 of 1188 Old 03-02-2009, 08:32 AM
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Comcast is currently providing Rockford digital TV from PBS stations WHA (Madison) and WTTW (Chicago). However, they are only providing the HD channel from WHA. I have asked Comcast to consider switching to WTTW for PBS HD since, in my option, WTTW has better HD content. I have not yet received a satisfactory reply from Comcast. Does anyone have any thoughts as to why Comcast would not want to make this switch?
Thanks for responding.
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post #922 of 1188 Old 03-16-2009, 10:56 PM
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Is anyone having audio dropouts? I have had Fox39 audio dropouts on both Over-the-Air and on DirectTV Tivo (waiting for the new Tivo this fall). The Tivo dropouts are repeatable...so I don't think it's my TV having issues. The dropouts start with a buzz and last about 5 seconds.

Thanks in advance (would just like to know it's them and not me!)
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post #923 of 1188 Old 03-18-2009, 06:30 AM
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Originally Posted by lark930 View Post

Is anyone having audio dropouts? I have had Fox39 audio dropouts on both Over-the-Air and on DirectTV Tivo (waiting for the new Tivo this fall). The Tivo dropouts are repeatable...so I don't think it's my TV having issues. The dropouts start with a buzz and last about 5 seconds.

Thanks in advance (would just like to know it's them and not me!)

lark930, I was having something similar last night while watching American Idol with OTA and a Dish 722 PVR. I haven't watched this weeks episode of 24 yet, but that was recorded with Vista Media Center OTA so I'll see if it has the same problem. On the Dish you get a static popping sound, no audio, and then the audio comes back.
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post #924 of 1188 Old 03-25-2009, 01:55 PM
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Channel 13's move from 54 down to 13 caught me off guard. The DB-4 on a rooftop pole was doing great until then. I live near Elm Ave and Renrose in Loves Park but am now having a lot of trouble getting 13 in the evening, about the time of the Jay Leno show. I guess it is a problem with multi path distortion caused by temperature changes between the ground and overlaying atmosphere. I have a lot of city buildings, houses and trees between me and the antenna on the west side of Rockford.

So, I built a 3 element ch. 13 Yagi and put that on the rooftop pole (26 feet above ground level). This works some of the time, but an indoor rabbit ears also works some of the time for Ch. 13. Bok Antenna service told me all I need is rabbit ears. Not so, too much trouble with temp related multi path.

Today I ordered the Antenna Craft Y5-7-13 Yagi for channels 7-13. What do you think, will this a have enough gain to prevent dropouts on 13? I hope so.

BTW, did you guys lose signal last night (Tues) eve during the intense rain storm? All the local digital channels went into distortion and then 23 went off the air. Ain't DTV grand?

Dick
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post #925 of 1188 Old 03-25-2009, 03:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Dick West View Post

This works some of the time, but an indoor rabbit ears also works some of the time for Ch. 13. Bok Antenna service told me all I need is rabbit ears. Not so, too much trouble with temp related multi path.

Dick

Bock Antenna told you that you may be able to get them with just rabbit ears. Some people do but there are no absolutes with antennas.
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post #926 of 1188 Old 03-25-2009, 05:50 PM
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It seems like I am stuck...prior to the DTV switch I was able to pick up all local channels without issue but now WREX 13 is just being a thorn in my side.

Location: walking distance to RVC

Set 1: Dish Vip 211 using a RCA ANT1500

Set 2: Vista Media Center w/ Hauppauge HVR-1800 using an old ATI HD-TV Wonder antenna

I'm curious if anyone has any possible suggestions.
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post #927 of 1188 Old 03-25-2009, 05:52 PM
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Have you rescanned your channels since the switch? I have also found that many cutomers with Dish Boxs need to go into the menu then install then local channels rescan then press select all.
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post #928 of 1188 Old 03-25-2009, 06:05 PM
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Originally Posted by Jeff Whitford View Post

Have you rescanned your channels since the switch? I have also found that many cutomers with Dish Boxs need to go into the menu then install then local channels rescan then press select all.

Rescanned multiple times, deleted all channels, rescanned again, fully power cycled boxes, rescanned...

It seems like nothing I do will get the channel to pick up
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post #929 of 1188 Old 03-25-2009, 06:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by brujoh2 View Post

Comcast is currently providing Rockford digital TV from PBS stations WHA (Madison) and WTTW (Chicago). However, they are only providing the HD channel from WHA. I have asked Comcast to consider switching to WTTW for PBS HD since, in my option, WTTW has better HD content. I have not yet received a satisfactory reply from Comcast. Does anyone have any thoughts as to why Comcast would not want to make this switch?
Thanks for responding.

The head end is 90 miles away from Chicago, vs. 60 from Madison, so via an antenna, WHA-DT wins hands down as most reliable. They'd have to fiber in WTTW, and that isn't cheap. Sure, you can get it on a 200' tower in Rockford, but definitely not consistently.

Gilbert
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post #930 of 1188 Old 03-25-2009, 06:51 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dick West View Post

Channel 13's move from 54 down to 13 caught me off guard. The DB-4 on a rooftop pole was doing great until then. I live near Elm Ave and Renrose in Loves Park but am now having a lot of trouble getting 13 in the evening, about the time of the Jay Leno show. I guess it is a problem with multi path distortion caused by temperature changes between the ground and overlaying atmosphere. I have a lot of city buildings, houses and trees between me and the antenna on the west side of Rockford.

So, I built a 3 element ch. 13 Yagi and put that on the rooftop pole (26 feet above ground level). This works some of the time, but an indoor rabbit ears also works some of the time for Ch. 13. Bok Antenna service told me all I need is rabbit ears. Not so, too much trouble with temp related multi path.

Today I ordered the Antenna Craft Y5-7-13 Yagi for channels 7-13. What do you think, will this a have enough gain to prevent dropouts on 13? I hope so.

BTW, did you guys lose signal last night (Tues) eve during the intense rain storm? All the local digital channels went into distortion and then 23 went off the air. Ain't DTV grand?

Dick

Hi Dick,

Welcome to the forum! Been busy but I wanted to reply and say...you bet. If you still get dropouts, then you are suffering from multipath. On analog, you would have seen "ghosts". On digital, you see dropouts/pixellation. By using a high gain antenna, you minimize multipath while getting a stronger primary signal.

I use a ChannelMaster classic 4228 UHF 8-bay antenna with a mesh screen, and I get it, no dropouts, on the northwest side of DeKalb. That antenna blows mine out of the water. If you still get dropouts, your tuner can't handle it. Newer tuners less than 2 years old do a great job, for the most part, at rejecting multipath, especially Samsung, Mitsubishi and LG TV's (and LG/Zenith converter boxes). They have new "6th generation" tuners that are very sensitive and reject multipath very well.

Gilbert
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