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post #1171 of 1189 Old 06-18-2013, 09:37 PM
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Originally Posted by dave73 View Post

You will need separate coax lines for each antenna, but once combined in the combiner, it shares the same coax going into the house. In my setup, I have 3 antennas: Antennacraft CS600 for VHF & Antennas Direct DB8 pointed at Chicago, & combined into an RCA TVPRAMP1R pre-amp (has separate VHF & UHF ports & set to separate), then one line goes into a Winegard CC7870 coupler (if that's what you have as well), then I also have a Winegard HD-1080 2 bay antenna pointed toward Cedar Lake, IN for my local PBS station, since that station drops out if I don't have an antenna pointed south (WHNW-LD otherwise interferes with WYIN), & that line hooks into the Winegard coupler as well. The 2 Chicago antennas are hooked on the side that allows for the pre-amp to pass thru, while the other side does not, which is for the Winegard antenna.

I don't know if you read on the website, that the Antennacraft Y5-7-13 antenna needs a 300 ohm to 75 ohm transformer, since it doesn't have the 75 ohm transformer built in, like it is on the DB8. If you don't have one, then you'll have to make a trip to your local Menards, Lowes, or Home Depot to get one (if one isn't included). I know you'll be happy to get WREX in better once you do get your VHF only antenna. I know in my case, reception is overall better with separate VHF & UHF antennas.

I did order the Winegard CC7870 combiner. I also ordered a Channel Master CM3075 transformer so hopefully I'm good to go!

Dave
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post #1172 of 1189 Old 06-24-2013, 03:30 PM
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I did order the Winegard CC7870 combiner. I also ordered a Channel Master CM3075 transformer so hopefully I'm good to go!

Dave

Update: the antenna guy installed the VHF antenna with balun and combiner this afternoon. 13 comes in just as good as the Rockford UHF channels, and the UHF channels are just as good as they were when I had the UHF antenna all by itself.

Thanks everyone for your helpful advice!

Dave
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post #1173 of 1189 Old 06-25-2013, 11:06 AM
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Update: the antenna guy installed the VHF antenna with balun and combiner this afternoon. 13 comes in just as good as the Rockford UHF channels, and the UHF channels are just as good as they were when I had the UHF antenna all by itself.

Thanks everyone for your helpful advice!

Dave

Later in the day I noticed an issue with 13-3 (MeTV Rockford). During moments of rapid motion, the entire picture appeared to switch to a blockier appearance as though the frame's resolution was no better than half what's normal. Within a second or two, resolution would return to normal. The effect was reminiscent of a fractal generator I used to run (named FractInt) that would plot a fractal in multiple passes, increasing resolution with each pass until all details were plotted. The visual effect is VERY different than what I'd expect from a pixelization episode in that the latter effect typically involves visual corruption of part of the frame whereas 13.3's issue affected the entire frame in a uniform manner. I have never seen this effect with any other HDTV signal. I have never seen it with 27.2 (MeTV Madison). My TV's signal meter shows 80% signal for 13 versus 65% for 27 so 13 is definitely coming in stronger.

Might what I saw be an artifact of digital compression? I'm thinking that perhaps by transmitting two 720p and one 480i subchannels, channel 13 is running a greater risk of visible compression artifacts versus a station that transmits, say, one 1080i and one 480i subchannel. Then again, it's my impression that 13-1 (the main 720p subchannel) often looks visibly inferior to 27-1 when both are broadcasting the same shows, so perhaps there's a broader issue with Rockford 13.

Besides these brief episodes, I have to say that 13.3's image appeared to be rougher/noisier compared with 27.2, so much so that I'm going to be sticking with 27.2 for my MeTV viewing, with 13.3 being a backup in case atmospheric conditions prohibit reception from Madison. When presenting one of the better-looking shows such as "Hogan's Heroes", 27.2 can look much like a well-authored DVD, but 13.3 looks like an inferior DVD that's not undergone digital image cleanup. This is something of a disappointment, but I am glad that my new VHF antenna gives me a backup source for MeTV albeit with an inferior picture.

Dave
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post #1174 of 1189 Old 06-28-2013, 04:06 AM
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Originally Posted by daveu8282 View Post

Later in the day I noticed an issue with 13-3 (MeTV Rockford). During moments of rapid motion, the entire picture appeared to switch to a blockier appearance as though the frame's resolution was no better than half what's normal. Within a second or two, resolution would return to normal. The effect was reminiscent of a fractal generator I used to run (named FractInt) that would plot a fractal in multiple passes, increasing resolution with each pass until all details were plotted. The visual effect is VERY different than what I'd expect from a pixelization episode in that the latter effect typically involves visual corruption of part of the frame whereas 13.3's issue affected the entire frame in a uniform manner. I have never seen this effect with any other HDTV signal. I have never seen it with 27.2 (MeTV Madison). My TV's signal meter shows 80% signal for 13 versus 65% for 27 so 13 is definitely coming in stronger.

Might what I saw be an artifact of digital compression? I'm thinking that perhaps by transmitting two 720p and one 480i subchannels, channel 13 is running a greater risk of visible compression artifacts versus a station that transmits, say, one 1080i and one 480i subchannel. Then again, it's my impression that 13-1 (the main 720p subchannel) often looks visibly inferior to 27-1 when both are broadcasting the same shows, so perhaps there's a broader issue with Rockford 13.

Besides these brief episodes, I have to say that 13.3's image appeared to be rougher/noisier compared with 27.2, so much so that I'm going to be sticking with 27.2 for my MeTV viewing, with 13.3 being a backup in case atmospheric conditions prohibit reception from Madison. When presenting one of the better-looking shows such as "Hogan's Heroes", 27.2 can look much like a well-authored DVD, but 13.3 looks like an inferior DVD that's not undergone digital image cleanup. This is something of a disappointment, but I am glad that my new VHF antenna gives me a backup source for MeTV albeit with an inferior picture.

Dave

Dual HD looks like crap. WLS-TV runs the main channel & Livewell Network in 720p HD. 7.1 looks ok, but 7.2 looks bit starved. With WREX running NBC in 1080i & CW+ in 720p, along with MeTV in 480i, you can expect it to look like crap. WKOW is running only 27.1 in 720p, with 2 subchannels in 480i, ¬ having problems with HD.
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post #1175 of 1189 Old 07-31-2013, 09:20 PM
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Hi folks.

Anybody know if WREX reduced transmission power recently? I live 10 miles south of Madison. Over the last few years I've occasionally had problems receiving WREX, but the last couple weeks the signal has rarely been good enough to provide a picture.

Thanks.
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post #1176 of 1189 Old 09-01-2013, 02:00 PM
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We live in Rochelle IL (61068) and recently installed a Wineguard HD7694P in our attic and pointed it toward Rockford. We were hoping to get four stations but can only receive good reception on 2. 13-1(nbc) comes in with 80% signal strength and 39-1(fox) comes in with 50-60%, 17-1(abc) get 30% but is pixelated quite a bit and we get nothing for 23-1(cbs). We have the signal amplified and we also put in an FM trap. Looking at TV Fool and Antenna Web.org we should be receiving all these stations but what I really don't understand why we aren't getting the two in the middle of the signal band. We've tested the signals on both our Panasonic plasma tvs. We would really appreciate and suggestions anyone might have to improve the signal on 17-1(abc) and 23-1(cbs)
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post #1177 of 1189 Old 09-05-2013, 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by feh View Post

Hi folks.

Anybody know if WREX reduced transmission power recently? I live 10 miles south of Madison. Over the last few years I've occasionally had problems receiving WREX, but the last couple weeks the signal has rarely been good enough to provide a picture.

Thanks.

I've been wondering about WREX, too. I'm in Belvidere so I'd estimate I'm 20 miles east of the WREX transmitter on Rockford's west edge. It doesn't seem to come in nearly as strong as the other Rockford channels: 17, 23, and 39. I have combined VHF and UHF antennas on a second-story roof. Yesterday I added a rotor and a mast preamp. Last night, when I rotated the antennas 310 degrees to pick up Madison, WREX disappeared as far as my TV was concerned. When I rotated the antennas to 270 degrees to favor Rockford, WREX came in but with a fluctuating signal that varied between 60-100% signal quality. This morning, I checked again at 310 degrees: WREX was comparable to what it was last night at 270 degrees. I got unvarying 100% signal quality for WKOW out of Madison both last night and this morning, and I got WKOW last night even at 270 degrees albeit with somewhat degraded signal strength. This means that WKOW is coming in better for me than WREX even with a rooftop VHF antenna! Either the guys who installed the rotor and preamp somehow managed to disconnect my VHF antenna from the combiner or WREX is really weak right now!
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post #1178 of 1189 Old 09-05-2013, 03:11 PM
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Hello Gumbyspw,

Try turning off or removing the amplifier. From Rochelle, you may be amplifying the signal too much!

Gilbert
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post #1179 of 1189 Old 09-08-2013, 12:04 PM
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Update: We unplugged the FM trap and the signal improved but it's not stable. We also unplugged the amp but that made the signal for 17-1 and 23-1 worse. Signal strength on 13-1 and 39-1 is very good with or without the amp. We've discovered reception on 17-1 and 23-1 improves at night to a stable signal strength of +40% Not sure what our next step should be to improve our day time reception of 17-1 and 23-1.
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post #1180 of 1189 Old 09-08-2013, 12:40 PM
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So I tried a few different combinations with and without the trap and amp to no improvement. I also added a splitter without either trap or amp and lost all channels but 13-1. I don't believe I'm over amplifying the signal give the last setup I tried.
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post #1181 of 1189 Old 09-09-2013, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by Gumbyspw View Post

So I tried a few different combinations with and without the trap and amp to no improvement. I also added a splitter without either trap or amp and lost all channels but 13-1. I don't believe I'm over amplifying the signal give the last setup I tried.

OK. Then what you do have is a serious multipath problem, as well as a weak signal. Do you have aluminum siding? That would surely explain it. I would move the antenna as close to the outer wall as possible which point to the stations. See if that helps.

Gilbert
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post #1182 of 1189 Old 09-09-2013, 01:04 PM
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OK. Then what you do have is a serious multipath problem, as well as a weak signal. Do you have aluminum siding? That would surely explain it. I would move the antenna as close to the outer wall as possible which point to the stations. See if that helps.

We don't have aluminum siding. The antenna is mounted in the attic. We have a 2" diameter wood pole suspended from the middle of the rafters. Our house faces north, the roof line runs east west, so the antenna is pointing to Rockford between two rafters. We used a compass to point it when we installed it and mounted as high on the pole as we could. The roof has one layer of asphalt shingles. The signals on 17-1 and 23-1 fluctuate day to day. When I checked just now 17-1 is coming in at 36% that seems steady but yesterday we had no signal until 8pm and then it wasn't stable. 23-1 had no signal all day and night yesterday but today it briefly came in at 23%. 13-1 and 39-1 are very stable at 92%(13-1) and 77%(39-1) we're starting to get a little frustrated =)
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post #1183 of 1189 Old 09-09-2013, 07:29 PM
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I just have one of the amplified indoor antennas. 17-1 and 39-1 almost always come in at 100% for me. 23-1 is usually 87%.
13-1 was recently coming in at only 50-57% and I couldn't watch it. today it's about 67%.

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post #1184 of 1189 Old 09-10-2013, 10:32 AM
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We don't have aluminum siding. The antenna is mounted in the attic. We have a 2" diameter wood pole suspended from the middle of the rafters. Our house faces north, the roof line runs east west, so the antenna is pointing to Rockford between two rafters. We used a compass to point it when we installed it and mounted as high on the pole as we could. The roof has one layer of asphalt shingles. The signals on 17-1 and 23-1 fluctuate day to day. When I checked just now 17-1 is coming in at 36% that seems steady but yesterday we had no signal until 8pm and then it wasn't stable. 23-1 had no signal all day and night yesterday but today it briefly came in at 23%. 13-1 and 39-1 are very stable at 92%(13-1) and 77%(39-1) we're starting to get a little frustrated =)

I hear ya. Yes, with the antenna in the middle of the rafters (away from the sides of the attic), you get all sorts of signals bouncing around up there. And without a super-directional (read: big) antenna to keep those unwanted reflected signals out, it's always going to be a problem. The solution is to move it closer to the edge of the side (even if it means sacrificing a little height).

In my attic, I have a ChannelMaster 4228 classic antenna on a rotor. It's definitely lower then what it would be in the center of the house. But, it's on a small tripod, and I can rotate it with 1/16" clearing of one of the beams. By doing this, I can easily get all of Chicago and Rockford, and frequently Madison at night when the atmospheric noise floor drops, and other cities as well on calmer nights. That from DeKalb in a one-story.

Gilbert
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post #1185 of 1189 Old 09-10-2013, 11:35 AM
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I hear ya. Yes, with the antenna in the middle of the rafters (away from the sides of the attic), you get all sorts of signals bouncing around up there. And without a super-directional (read: big) antenna to keep those unwanted reflected signals out, it's always going to be a problem. The solution is to move it closer to the edge of the side (even if it means sacrificing a little height).

In my attic, I have a ChannelMaster 4228 classic antenna on a rotor. It's definitely lower then what it would be in the center of the house. But, it's on a small tripod, and I can rotate it with 1/16" clearing of one of the beams. By doing this, I can easily get all of Chicago and Rockford, and frequently Madison at night when the atmospheric noise floor drops, and other cities as well on calmer nights. That from DeKalb in a one-story.

I think we've got a "plan of attack" worked out but we are going to wait until temps drop before we climb in the attic. We're going to lower the antenna and move it over a few rafters to a more open area, there are two trees right outside where it's pointing now. We are also going to run new lines to it. We have no idea the condition of the current lines as they were already in the house. This way we can shorten the runs and maybe eliminate the amp. I'll update again after the changes have been made. Thanks everyone for the input!
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post #1186 of 1189 Old 09-10-2013, 10:24 PM
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Wow! I didn't realize it was pointing into trees---that hurts. And if the cable is RG-59 (you can probably identify it by looking at any decent section of it, should be typed on the cable)...double yikes. Definitely let us know how it turns out!

Gilbert
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post #1187 of 1189 Old 09-28-2013, 08:40 PM
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Hello all. My name is Mike and I live on the west side of Rochelle. On a whim, I built one of those homemade 2x4 and wire clothes hangar antennas (bowtie) just to see what I could pick up. I spent $2.60 and i was able to receive WTVO 17 and WREX 13 @ 60-70% and WIFR 23 @ 45-60% just sitting on the floor and leaning up against the wall INSIDE my bedroom! I also used an old -12dB TV/FM amplifier. I moved the antenna outside and mounted it on the fence BELOW the top of the fence (3.5 -4 ft) off the ground WIFR is spotty. I am unable to get WQRF 39 (fox). I need to weatherproof it a little better starting with a outdoor balun I am thinking about mounting the antenna on some PVC and getting it about 8-10 ft off the ground. Again, I did this for under $3.00! So, if were to spend $100, what would I receive? I looked into my attic, but I think it may be a hassle to run coax down (no flooring, just blow in insulation).
I think I wanna go with a good outdoor antenna on my roof or mounted to the side of the house. I have lots of BIG trees around my house and large older homes (I have a 9 year old ranch) around me. I dont want to go to big, and I dont want to much elevation - no tower for me. What do you guys recommend? Currently, the antenna is only hooked up to my bedroom tv (Panasonic 32 LCD) I would like to provide signal to my livingroom tv (Sharp 42 Aquos) I would suspect that I would need to run 45-50 feet of coax max for the antenna and both tvs would that degrade my signal?
Thanx for the help.
Mike
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post #1188 of 1189 Old 02-27-2014, 06:01 PM
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Hello all. My name is Mike and I live on the west side of Rochelle. On a whim, I built one of those homemade 2x4 and wire clothes hangar antennas (bowtie) just to see what I could pick up. I spent $2.60 and i was able to receive WTVO 17 and WREX 13 @ 60-70% and WIFR 23 @ 45-60% just sitting on the floor and leaning up against the wall INSIDE my bedroom! I also used an old -12dB TV/FM amplifier. I moved the antenna outside and mounted it on the fence BELOW the top of the fence (3.5 -4 ft) off the ground WIFR is spotty. I am unable to get WQRF 39 (fox). I need to weatherproof it a little better starting with a outdoor balun I am thinking about mounting the antenna on some PVC and getting it about 8-10 ft off the ground. Again, I did this for under $3.00! So, if were to spend $100, what would I receive? I looked into my attic, but I think it may be a hassle to run coax down (no flooring, just blow in insulation).
I think I wanna go with a good outdoor antenna on my roof or mounted to the side of the house. I have lots of BIG trees around my house and large older homes (I have a 9 year old ranch) around me. I dont want to go to big, and I dont want to much elevation - no tower for me. What do you guys recommend? Currently, the antenna is only hooked up to my bedroom tv (Panasonic 32 LCD) I would like to provide signal to my livingroom tv (Sharp 42 Aquos) I would suspect that I would need to run 45-50 feet of coax max for the antenna and both tvs would that degrade my signal?
Thanx for the help.
Mike

I know this is aa few months old/late, but here goes:

Any splitter would degrade the signal, as well as a long coax run like that. An outdoor antenna on the roof would be ideal in your situation, especially for the living room tv. My house in Sycamore had tons of trees around, but didn't affect the signals that much. Maybe a side mounted antenna for the bedroom would work too if a splitter from the antenna going to both tv's doesn't work as well. Make sure the antenna is UHF/VHF or else you will lose WREX if it's UHF only. Either way, make sure you use TvFool to get your antenna set up properly. Good luck!

Now in NE Tucson, AZ with a cheap rabbit ears antenna. Got everything except KTTU (MyNetwork).
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post #1189 of 1189 Old 09-16-2014, 11:28 AM
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WQRF/WTVO moving fully HD today. WQRF has already switched over - WTVO will do so in an hour or so.

Looks like MyNetwork (17.2) is also HD. Steve Harvey is coming in all 720p like. That will make The Walking Dead watchable.

Last edited by rdoac; 09-16-2014 at 12:38 PM.
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