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post #1441 of 1468 Old 07-11-2015, 06:09 AM
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Also, with Gray buying an LD in Sioux Falls, do you think they'll go after KTTW's non-license assets and put them on the LD with a simulcast on KSFY/KABY/KPRY-DT2 in HD? Where would The CW go? Would it stay on KSFY with "3" HD subchannels? Or will KELO pick it up?[/QUOTE]

I assume Gray owns KSFY, what what is a LD? It'd be good if The CW exits 13.2 as they continually broadcast an incorrect EPG.
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post #1442 of 1468 Old 07-11-2015, 09:14 AM
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I assume Gray owns KSFY, what what is a LD?
LD stands for Low-Power Digital.

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post #1443 of 1468 Old 07-11-2015, 04:03 PM
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LD stands for Low-Power Digital.
Thank you. I first thought it meant "low definition" but that made no sense without a noun. I thought all digital stations were of the same ilk, allowing one high definition channel. But does a low power license not provide for a high definition channel? Is a low power channel required to broadcast an EPG?
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post #1444 of 1468 Old 07-11-2015, 08:52 PM
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the only difference between a low powered station and a regular station is how much output power they can use. a low powered station can only broadcast up to 15000 watts.
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post #1445 of 1468 Old 07-11-2015, 08:53 PM
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you can broadcast a high definition channel standard definition channel or a combination of both. As example in Minneapolis we have a lp station. Has telemundo HD and drtv in SD.
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post #1446 of 1468 Old 07-13-2015, 06:08 AM
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MeTV on KSFY 13.3 beginning 09/01/15

The Argus reported this morning KSFY will begin broadcasting MeTV 09/01/15 on 13.3.

The article implies KCPO is broadcasting a digital signal and tower improvements are coming "so pretty soon we'll be able to broadcast it within a 20-mile radius of Sioux Falls."

That would be an improvement as in my experience they're currently broadcasting within a 0-mile radius of Sioux Falls. I receive all Sioux Falls and most Sioux City stations and received KCPO's analog signal. But I've not scanned in KCPO since they converted to digital.
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post #1447 of 1468 Old 08-12-2015, 09:14 AM
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Sioux City gets Decades
From northpine.com

KMEG/14.2 (Sioux City) is now carrying Decades, replacing Grit TV, which moved to KPTH/44.3 (Sioux City). Both channels had earlier carried Azteca America. KMEG and KPTH are operated by Sinclair Broadcast Group and carry CBS and FOX on their primary channels, along with a mix of This TV and MyNetworkTV on 44.2.
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post #1448 of 1468 Old 08-13-2015, 01:30 AM
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Sioux City gets Decades
From northpine.com

KMEG/14.2 (Sioux City) is now carrying Decades, replacing Grit TV, which moved to KPTH/44.3 (Sioux City). Both channels had earlier carried Azteca America. KMEG and KPTH are operated by Sinclair Broadcast Group and carry CBS and FOX on their primary channels, along with a mix of This TV and MyNetworkTV on 44.2.
This has been like that for a few weeks. There is one issue with both channels. They have not fixed aspect ratio. I have emailed them about it two times. I know what is going on because I can change my aspect ratio on my TV to fix it. They are taking a 16x9 video feed and rebroadcasting it in 4x3 not 16x9. The local TV commercials that they added look OK without changing the setting on my TV.
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post #1449 of 1468 Old 08-14-2015, 04:34 AM
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This has been like that for a few weeks. There is one issue with both channels. They have not fixed aspect ratio. I have emailed them about it two times. I know what is going on because I can change my aspect ratio on my TV to fix it. They are taking a 16x9 video feed and rebroadcasting it in 4x3 not 16x9. The local TV commercials that they added look OK without changing the setting on my TV.
Perhaps they want the 4:3 look to duplicate how the programs originally aired? It gives it more of a nostalgic feel. I don't know that, it's Just a theory.

I've watched Decades and it seems to have less repitition than other "classic" networks. That's good.
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post #1450 of 1468 Old 08-14-2015, 09:23 PM
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Perhaps they want the 4:3 look to duplicate how the programs originally aired? It gives it more of a nostalgic feel. I don't know that, it's Just a theory.

I've watched Decades and it seems to have less repitition than other "classic" networks. That's good.
All of the other channels that is 4x3 broadcast like MeTV, ThisTV and other GritTV from Omaha looks OK. It is only on these two channels that have people that look like pencils unless I change the aspect ratio.

On my 40 inch LED TV on 4x3 programing like on MeTV, ThisTV, and other GritTV from Omaha, there is like a about 4.5 inch gap on both sides and the programing looks OK. So the aspect ratio looks OK. While on the 14.2 and 44.3, there is about 7.25 inch gap on both sides on the 4x3 TV shows. So it is not 4x3.

I am trying to figure out what aspect ratio it is. It is like about 28 inches diagonal, height is OK at about 19.5 inches, and width is about 21 inches. While the other 4x3 channels that look OK is at 32.5 inches diagonal, height is about 19.5 inches, and width is about 26.5 inches. I used a tape measure to get these numbers from my TV.
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post #1451 of 1468 Old 08-15-2015, 04:55 AM
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All of the other channels that is 4x3 broadcast like MeTV, ThisTV and other GritTV from Omaha looks OK. It is only on these two channels that have people that look like pencils unless I change the aspect ratio.
I seldom receive Omaha television as I live in Sioux Falls. 14.2 is the only channel broadcasting 4:3 I receive. It's a 4:3 aspect ratio so I have vertical black bars on each side, but things look fine.
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post #1452 of 1468 Old 08-15-2015, 11:41 AM
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I seldom receive Omaha television as I live in Sioux Falls. 14.2 is the only channel broadcasting 4:3 I receive. It's a 4:3 aspect ratio so I have vertical black bars on each side, but things look fine.
Weird because I have to change my aspect ratio all the time for 14.2 and 44.3. They are the only two channels that is messed up. I have tried rescanning, but it is still messed up.

By the way, I live half way between Omaha and Sioux City. So I get both.
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post #1453 of 1468 Old 08-17-2015, 12:45 PM
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All of the other channels that is 4x3 broadcast like MeTV, ThisTV and other GritTV from Omaha looks OK. It is only on these two channels that have people that look like pencils unless I change the aspect ratio.

On my 40 inch LED TV on 4x3 programing like on MeTV, ThisTV, and other GritTV from Omaha, there is like a about 4.5 inch gap on both sides and the programing looks OK. So the aspect ratio looks OK. While on the 14.2 and 44.3, there is about 7.25 inch gap on both sides on the 4x3 TV shows. So it is not 4x3.

I am trying to figure out what aspect ratio it is. It is like about 28 inches diagonal, height is OK at about 19.5 inches, and width is about 21 inches. While the other 4x3 channels that look OK is at 32.5 inches diagonal, height is about 19.5 inches, and width is about 26.5 inches. I used a tape measure to get these numbers from my TV.

What's happening here is the original programming is 4:3 and is encoded into a 16:9 frame, black pillar bars on either side. Then the local station is re-encoding the program AGAIN into the 4:3 section of another 16:9 frame which adds a second set of pillar-bars to each side. Effectively giving you double pillar bars and the wrong aspect ratio by squeezing it and REALLY hurting the resolution when expanded to an HD screen....Ouch. Likely that AFD is turned on and set incorrectly for the type of programming they are receiving off the dish. Their ads look fine because they're stretched to fill a 16:9 frame and then squeezed to fill a 4:3 section of the second 16:9 frame.

This a local station issue and their encoder's are incorrectly set. Good luck finding an engineer that knows what you're talking about when you mention this to them.

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post #1454 of 1468 Old 08-17-2015, 01:02 PM
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What's happening here is the original programming is 4:3 and is encoded into a 16:9 frame, black pillar bars on either side. Then the local station is re-encoding the program AGAIN into the 4:3 section of another 16:9 frame which adds a second set of pillar-bars to each side. Effectively giving you double pillar bars and the wrong aspect ratio by squeezing it and REALLY hurting the resolution when expanded to an HD screen....Ouch. Likely that AFD is turned on and set incorrectly for the type of programming they are receiving off the dish. Their ads look fine because they're stretched to fill a 16:9 frame and then squeezed to fill a 4:3 section of the second 16:9 frame.

This a local station issue and their encoder's are incorrectly set. Good luck finding an engineer that knows what you're talking about when you mention this to them.
Yea, that is what I thought it was. It is just really hard to word it right when you are emailing people about. Plus I have never got a full email from the station back on the issue. The only email that I got was asking from them is what was the issue.
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post #1455 of 1468 Old 08-17-2015, 01:05 PM
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Here's what I was talking about graphically speaking. The blue bars are kept blue just to identify them, but they'd be encoded as black as well. Note the local ads use the blue bars .
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post #1456 of 1468 Old 08-17-2015, 05:41 PM
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Yep, that is exactly what I am seeing here. Just wish they would fix it, but it seems like they don't know what I am talking about.
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post #1457 of 1468 Old 08-18-2015, 05:52 AM
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It's too bad some are having problems with 14.2's picture. I just tuned it in to find they're broadcasting "The Way We Were" in wide-screen mode. Not full wide screen as horizontal black bars appear at the top and bottom of the screen. But the images look fine proportionally.

Last weekend I scanned in 44.3, which is rare. Their 4:3 format looks identical to that on 14.2 on my set. It must be frustrating to all involved when there's a difference by television.
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post #1458 of 1468 Old 08-31-2015, 06:23 PM
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Quote:
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Here's what I was talking about graphically speaking. The blue bars are kept blue just to identify them, but they'd be encoded as black as well. Note the local ads use the blue bars .
You are right about the engineer don't understanding it. My dad got sick and tried of the aspect ratio issue. He went to the station's studio to talk to them in person. An engineer said they have no control over aspect ratio. It is how they receive it. Even the engineer person says you have to change your TV's aspect ratio. My dad even told him that Grit from Omaha which is a sister station to them does not have this issue. So not sure how to tell them how to fix this.
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post #1459 of 1468 Old 09-01-2015, 05:21 AM
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It's an encoder setting locally, as far as I know, but some older encoders may not support the setting.

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post #1460 of 1468 Old 09-01-2015, 05:38 AM
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So not sure how to tell them how to fix this.
If he's receiving it OTA (over the air), not a lot can be done, other than continuing to annoy them, or call the FCC with a complaint. But if he's getting it, or you are, from a cable provider call them repeatedly and complain to them. If Midco gets these types of complaints they've been known to call the station engineers directly and walk them through the needed changes until it is right on their system. If the complaints come into the Midco Facebook page or any social media stuff, things tend to go even faster. I suspect other Cable companies *might* work that way too, but that is up for debate.

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post #1461 of 1468 Old 09-01-2015, 05:44 AM
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Lightbulb Here's an Idea

Take the image I made above into them and show them that and use it to explain what you are seeing. Maybe that will make it click what is actually happening. They likely don't care. Point out that the black bars in my illustration are being added locally at the station and is NOT what is being provided to them. They are getting at best the middle image with blue bars from the provider off the satellite.

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post #1462 of 1468 Old 09-02-2015, 04:42 AM
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KSFY 13.3 postage stamp display.

KSFY began broadcasting MeTV 09/01/15 but broadcasts a postage stamp image. Black bars exist on the top and bottom of the screen.

I'll give them a week to see if they figure it out. I'm hesitate to contact them as past results with their continually incorrect 13.2 EPG have gone for naught. I think they just don't care.
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post #1463 of 1468 Old 09-02-2015, 08:15 AM
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Originally Posted by rhubarbpie View Post
KSFY began broadcasting MeTV 09/01/15 but broadcasts a postage stamp image. Black bars exist on the top and bottom of the screen.

I'll give them a week to see if they figure it out. I'm hesitate to contact them as past results with their continually incorrect 13.2 EPG have gone for naught. I think they just don't care.
Looks to me like they get a 16x9 in a 4x3 frame(letter box) feed off the bird, and then are adding more letterbox bars to it, squishing it further into another 4x3 frame. We'll see if that gets corrected.

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post #1464 of 1468 Old Yesterday, 01:26 AM
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Originally Posted by FoeHammer865 View Post
If he's receiving it OTA (over the air), not a lot can be done, other than continuing to annoy them, or call the FCC with a complaint. But if he's getting it, or you are, from a cable provider call them repeatedly and complain to them. If Midco gets these types of complaints they've been known to call the station engineers directly and walk them through the needed changes until it is right on their system. If the complaints come into the Midco Facebook page or any social media stuff, things tend to go even faster. I suspect other Cable companies *might* work that way too, but that is up for debate.
I have bug the station via Facebook, but they wanted to take it to emails. Then once you email them, I get no replied from them.
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post #1465 of 1468 Old Yesterday, 05:12 AM
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KSFY 13.3 is now in 4:3.

I'm surprised, but KSFY fixed their postage stamp display and is now broadcasting 13.3 in 4:3. I sent a message yesterday noon and noticed the change last night. I'm uncertain my message prompted the change as I received no reply, but bottom line - it's fixed.

It seems the trend is to not broadcast vintage programming in wide-screen mode. KTIV 4.3 broadcasts MeTV in 16:9, but 14.2 and 13.3 broadcast Decades and MeTV in 4:3. Perhaps that's to enhance the old-time feel of the programming. Perhaps it's feedback from viewers who dislike wide distortion. That's never bothered me, but I know some dislike it.
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post #1466 of 1468 Old Yesterday, 05:21 AM
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I wouldn't call it a trend. Retro TV, Me-TV, This TV, GetTV, and Antenna TV are in 4:3, but the other classic networks are in 16:9 (COZI TV, Movies!, H&I, Decades). Four of the five in 4:3 launched in or before 2011, with GetTV being more recent, while the rest are after that date.

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post #1467 of 1468 Old Yesterday, 12:03 PM
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I wouldn't call it a trend. Retro TV, Me-TV, This TV, GetTV, and Antenna TV are in 4:3, but the other classic networks are in 16:9 (COZI TV, Movies!, H&I, Decades). Four of the five in 4:3 launched in or before 2011, with GetTV being more recent, while the rest are after that date.

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I noticed yesterday after my previous comment that my Tivo was incorrectly outputting 4:3 video. After that was corrected, I saw that KSFY is actually sending a 16x9 encoded 480i picture. Inside that 480i_16x9 image is a 4:3 active video with black bars on each side filling out the 16:9 image. On your HD TV it will look right without zoom then. It's easy to see the difference if you look at KDLT-DT2 as that is broadcast in 480i-4x3, and will look stretched if TV (or TiVo) is set to "full/fill/stretch".

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post #1468 of 1468 Old Today, 05:01 AM
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Originally Posted by Trip in VA View Post
I wouldn't call it a trend. Retro TV, Me-TV, This TV, GetTV, and Antenna TV are in 4:3, but the other classic networks are in 16:9 (COZI TV, Movies!, H&I, Decades). Four of the five in 4:3 launched in or before 2011, with GetTV being more recent, while the rest are after that date.

- Trip
It seems a trend here. Perhaps it's how the local affiliate chooses to broadcast. MeTV and This may be 4:3, but KTIV3 (4.3) and KTTW2 (7.2) broadcast MeTV and This respectively in 16:9. If I remember correctly, even KWSD (36.[1-2]) broadcast 16:9. Thank GOD KWSD no longer "tries" to broadcast.

Until 14.2 a month or so ago we had no DTV stations broadcasting anything other than 16:9.
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