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post #31 of 1296 Old 08-11-2004, 10:08 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ucsbgaucho
How is the OTA reception in Santa Barbara? I called up DirecTV to ask them about waivers, and they said you deal straight with them to get waivers from the local affiliates. But Dracula, you said KCOY gave you a waiver directly from them, which I hope to do. I assume when you call DirecTV and you say "i can't get any OTA reception, can I get a waiver" they'll maybe set up a signal test. Does that mean a test on the current OTA antenna you have installed? I'll most likely be renting a place and won't be able to have a big roof antenna, so will they determine based on my small clip-on antenna what my signal is, and then grant me the waiver? Also, does the fact that they provide locals to SB/SLO area now affect my chances of receiving the waiver to get the national feeds and HD? I only want the waiver obviously so I can watch the HD broadcasts, so I don't know if they'll say "we already give you your locals, so you're stuck with the analog signal and you can't get HD" Any help is appreciated!

I have never used OTA in Santa Barbara so I do not know. You do deal with DTV for the waivers but when you get a denial (like from KCOY) you call the station and have them change from denial to approval for the waiver. No signal test involved. I got my waivers before DTV had the local channels but I don't see that it matters.
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post #32 of 1296 Old 08-11-2004, 10:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by ucsbgaucho
Also, what do you think would happen if, when I moved down and couldn't get any of the locals OTA, I called up D* to get the waiver, and if they denied me, if I threatened to cancel and switch to cable, would they maybe agree to give me the waiver in that case? Or is their rule on waivers strictly black and white, no room for bargaining?

The waiver is from the local TV stations not DTV. DTV would love to give you all of the waivers since it means more money for them. But they are restricted by FCC rules and must get the approval from the local TV stations.
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post #33 of 1296 Old 08-23-2004, 07:34 AM
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ucsbgaucho:

I recently purchased an HDTV to go along with my DTV service. I live in Goleta, and I requested that DirecTV pursue the wavers for me. They will do all the work for you, and though they say it takes about 45 days, I am now receiving channels 30 days later. Right off the block I am getting CBS-HD, ABC, and FOX, NY and LA on all. However, NBC is not coming in so I take it KSBY denied the waver. By the way, I don't think there is any over-the-air HD in santa barbara, unless you can get KCOY all the way from Santa Maria. For what it's worth, I had them note on the application that 1) I live adjacent to an airport, and 2) the mountain directly blocks the signal to Santa Maria.

dracula:

I noticed that you reversed the denial of your waver from KSBY (nbc). Is there a particular phone number I should call, or should I just start sending emails to people on this page:

ww w.ksby.com/unclassified/646967.html

Also, what was the timeframe for the turnaround between denied and approved? I'd really like to catch some HD olympics.

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post #34 of 1296 Old 08-23-2004, 06:28 PM
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hypermog:

Which ABC are you getting? NY and LA? or just KEYT?

I got the KSBY waiver by calling the station on the phone and talking to a lady in charge of waivers. I don't remember her name but I think it was a Hispanic name.

You will not be able to see HD Olympics because channel 84 is not broadcast in Santa Barbara regardless of the waiver for getting NY and LA NBC channels. I was really angry when I found out so I now watch HD coverage on Cox cable channel 706. It is a pity I cannot record cable HD like I can with DirecTV HD stuff.
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post #35 of 1296 Old 08-24-2004, 12:02 AM
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Here's my story for the networks.

Originally, before we had an HDTV, we just signed up for the middle package. I forget what it's called, but it doesn't matter. At that point we didn't even have locals, or anything else for that matter. However, I decided to purchase a 50 inch Sony GWIII earlier this year, and I wanted some HD service to accompany it. After I had the Triple-LNB dish installed, and the new HD sub going, for some reason, and only on the HD receiver, I also started receiving locals. The SD receivers wouldn't pull it down, but the receiver that gets the 110 sat also gets KSBY, KEYT, KCOY, and whatever fox is, along with the WB too I think. At that point I also put in the waiver request. Cut to last week, and the receiver starts acting up. It restarts itself and it has lost all of the 'surf menu' options. I re-acquire all the channels and now I have the NY and LA feeds of FOX, CBS, and yes, ABC (Channels 386 and 387), on ALL receivers in the house, in addition to the CBS-HD channels for the HD STB. Therefore, I now have access to

CBS-HD East (Channel 80)
CBS-HD West (Channel 81)
CBS East (Channel 380)
CBS West (Channel 381)
ABC East (Channel 386)
ABC West (Channel 387)
FOX East (Channel 388)
FOX West (Channel 389)

In addition to KEYT, KSBY, KCOY, and the other locals. (HD set only still)

Now, just to get that NBC waiver through ... >:-]

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post #36 of 1296 Old 08-26-2004, 01:15 PM
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I emailed KEYT about their HD availability status yesterday, and here is what I got:
-----------------------------------
Most of the construction on the current KEYT DTV broadcast facility at our
transmitter site is completed. We are now waiting for PG&E to complete their installation of equipment needed supply the necessary power. Broadcasting of a KEYT digital signal should begin sometime in September.

The signal will be carried over-the-air on Channel 27. It has not yet been
confirmed which of our primary cable carriers (Cox, Comcast, Charter &
Adelphia) will carry our digital signal and on what channel. The signal
will still be in the 3 x 4 aspect ratio vs. the high definition ratio of 9 x
16. The signal will be similar to our analog signal except it will be more
crisp and be on a 3-second delay. Actual broadcast of programming in the 9 x 16 aspect ratio will be subject to the installation of additional
converters, installation of an ABC digital downlink and the local cable &
satellite carrier's clearance of our HDTV signal. We have recently been
notified by ABC that they expect to install the necessary equipment at KEYT
sometime in first quarter of next year.

Regards,
Bob Grissom, VP/General Manager
KEYT
-------------------------------------------

So, it looks like another NFL season without ABC MNF in HD for us locals with COX cable. I don't think there is much of a chance, but I'm asking COX what it would take to carry KABC Los Angeles HD until the local broadcaster is up and running HD....
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post #37 of 1296 Old 08-31-2004, 12:00 AM
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I emailed the controller at KSBY and I was able to receive the NBC waiver. So it is possible to get waivers for all four networks in Goleta. I have them for NBC, CBS, ABC, and FOX.

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post #38 of 1296 Old 08-31-2004, 08:51 AM
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Yes, I also have all the waivers. Received the ABC waiver this week and watched MNF last night from New York ABC. The reason for the waiver is the bad KEYT signal which the chief engineer of KEYT said was being picked up OTA in a Santa Maria industrial park with lots of static.

But the main reason for getting the waiver is to be able to watch ABC HD on DTV when it becomes available. That way I don't need any KEYT HD OTA.
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post #39 of 1296 Old 09-01-2004, 04:25 PM
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Can you guys post the contact info for each person you talked to? I got a nice response from the GM of KCOY/KKFX since they are the same, although he never specifically said they'd grant me a waiver. I'm waiting till Tuesday to have an installer come out and set me up with D* again through the mover's package, but I think my location is going to take a very tall pole to see over the 2-story apt building immediately adjacent. I'm on Ellwood Beach Drive. How much do you think that's going to cost? And would it be more worth it do just do it myself?

So did you guys receive the waivers by going just through DirecTV, or did you contact each individual station? Sounds like you did both. For those that you contacted through the station itself, can you post email addresses or phone #s and names for me? Thanks!

By the way, you get both KSBY and KCOY through Cox for HD, and I emailed them about adding Fox Sports West to their HD lineup since they already offer it as the regular channel. I just received a "we'll forward that to our marketing dept" response. I REALLY hope I dont have to go with cable, I want to keep Directv so bad especially if I can get the network HD feeds through waivers, and with DirecTV in negotiation for inHD, and with BravoHD getting some more content ready.

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post #40 of 1296 Old 09-01-2004, 04:29 PM
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Also, what does the waiver say? Does each station have their own that you just request they fax to you? Or do you type something up, send it to them and have someone there sign it and fax back? I'd like to contact all of them asap and get this out of the way so I can get the networks right off the bat and not miss any HD football!

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post #41 of 1296 Old 09-01-2004, 06:01 PM
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Just call up D* and ask them to get the waivers for you. They will send them out to the applicable stations. Let them do the work. For me, the only one that denied was KSBY, and at that point I emailed them personally. I'm not going to give out his name, but it can be derived easily from information I've posted on the previous page. I mean, I wouldn't want my email address floating around on some random forums...

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post #42 of 1296 Old 09-02-2004, 08:59 AM
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Thanks for the info, that is who I emailed yesterday, waiting to hear back. I emailed the chief engineer from KCOY/KKFX and got a response back saying that you can only get the HD feeds if you are in an O&O market, so obviously he's not involved in the process between his station(s) and DirecTV for the waivers. Since you went through DirecTV for them, I didn't bother emailing him back to explain it to him.

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post #43 of 1296 Old 09-02-2004, 03:24 PM
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Well got another response from the engineer at KCOY/KKFX... interesting...

<<Chris,

DirecTv does not have agreement with KCOY or KKFX for waiver, we do not
do waiver for HD and the network will not do waiver if do not live in a
city that they own a station. But if DirecTv is doing this then I will
forward this to our legal dept. Thanks >>

Almost sounds like he was going to get the agreement with DirecTV taken away or something. So when you guys went through D* for the waiver, that means they have pre-arranged agreements with affiliates that will or will not grant the waiver? Or do they still request the waiver on an individual subscriber basis? I hope I didn't screw my chances of getting the waiver from D* for them, but if you guys were able to, why wouldn't I?

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post #44 of 1296 Old 09-02-2004, 07:50 PM
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UCSBGaucho you are diminishing your chances of getting a waiver because you are not understanding the situation. Before you start asking (demanding?) waivers you should understand what a waiver is first.

There is no pre-existing arrangement between D* and any non O&O (read: Santa Barbara) affiliate for waivers. As far as the local affiliates go, they could care less about what national services (Distant Network Service, in this case) D* offers because it has nothing to do with them and their local network broadcast. You must understand that the waiver is an arangement between YOU and the LOCAL AFFILIATE that has arguably nothing to do with D*. If you have an agreement with your neighbor Bob that he will provide you all of the bicycles you want to buy, and one day you decide you want a bicycle from across town, Bob doesn't care where you plan to get the bike from. All he cares is that it's not him, understand? In this case the bike dealer across town would be Voom, echostar, D*, whatever. All that matters is that Bob has to agree to let you get your bike from somewhere else.

KCOY pays a fee to CBS in order to have the right to broadcast their content in this area. Therefore, it is KCOY's right to gain revenue if you wish to receive CBS content in this area. By asking for the D* feed, you are in affect telling them that it is your intention to bypass this right that they *pay for* and effectively circumvent their sole revenue stream. Keep in mind that you have absolutely no right *whatsoever* to get the D* west coast feed because the local KCOY is offered over D*, even if you can't get it over the air. Thus, you are asking KCOY to voluntarily wave their right to gain money off of you, purely out of the goodness of their heart -- hence the term "waiver."

Here is an excerpt from the letter I sent to KSBY, just to give you the gist. Do not copy and paste it because they will recognize it for sure.

Quote:
I realize that KSBY-TV is entitled to my advertising dollar, and I also realize that KSBY-TV pays for its right to broadcast the NBC signal in my area. I would like to establish that I do receive the KSBY feed via sattelite through DirecTV's local affiliates program -- in standard definition of course. I have read the page detailing KSBY's plans for over-the-air HD broadcasting, and if and when it is available I would love to receive it.

For some time now I have enjoyed Tony, Wendy, Dave, Ryan, and the rest of the KSBY news and sports staff, and in receiving a separate channel for high-definition content, I would not cease to watch your local programming with which I am accustomed. I simply would like to have an option to switch to a high-definition feed of this fall's NBC's high-definition programming for the times when it is available.

My advice to you now is to do what I said originally, let D* do their waiver work, wait for that little results postcard to arrive, stop meddling with the affiliates, stop making quasi-demands, and go from there.

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post #45 of 1296 Old 09-03-2004, 03:25 PM
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I haven't made any "demands" of any kind, and I definitely understand that by granting a waiver to anyone, the affiliate is in effect giving up one viewer and hypothetically losing out in potential ratings and advertising dollars. The reason I asked if D* had an agreement with the local affiliates is, if you guys that DO have the waivers from KCOY and KKFX, and you only went to DirecTV to get the waiver, it would SEEM to be logical that DirecTV could have an agreement in place that says "KCOY grants a waiver to those requesting it in the SB/SLO area" or something like that. Obviously in this case that is not correct, and DirecTV negotiates these waivers on an individual basis. So basically if there were two people next door to each other in Santa Barbara and both were requesting waivers from DirecTV for KCOY, one could be approved and the other denied?

So my question is, when you DID have to contact KSBY directly to request a waiver, when you received a response from them, did you have to provide them with any information about your location, or do they just fax you a form saying "KSBY grants this waiver to John Smith for the national NBC feed"? After you contacted KSBY, what was the process that ensued?

As soon as I get my service installed on Tuesday, I'm calling DirecTV to change my address and request the waivers. It took you about a month to receive the results? Does DirecTV automatically activate the HD feeds when they receive the "waiver" acceptance? Would they activate CBS, say, if they received the ok before receiving a response from NBC or ABC? Or do they wait till they have all 4?

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post #46 of 1296 Old 09-04-2004, 04:54 AM
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I am guessing that there are no affiliates who have any actual agreements with D* about waivers. I'm talking about non-owned-and-operated markets here. There are probably some out in the boonies that just grant all waivers as a matter of course (in North Dakota or some such), possibly even ones closer to home. But that is the local affiliate's choice, and not a matter of stated agreement between them and D*. So yes, each case is handled on an individual basis.

Now it is true that D* goes out of their way to do the work in getting a waiver for you. This is probably because the average joe has no idea what a waiver is and would go about getting one in the wrong manner. D* of course has a vested interest in your acquiring of the waiver (they charge you $2+ for each distant network). But the fact remains that it is an agreement between you and the affiliate, even though D* does the legwork.

When you originally talked to D* about sending out the waivers, they ask you a standard set of questions about your property, how dense the area is, if you live in a multistory building, etc. They also ask you if you have anything else to put on the application. I told them I live adjacent to an airport and the Santa Ynez mountains also directly block the path to Santa Maria. After that, D* does everything and you just wait for D*'s response postcard to come back with the results. I actually figured out that some of the waivers had gone through just by surfing, but I also got the postcard shortly after that. In my case, KSBY-NBC is the only network that denied, but as you mentioned, it is possible for different results on an individual basis. Dracula was not able to get the ABC waiver initially but he did get one from NBC right away. I have no insight as to what their decision making process is. It doesn't really matter, since you can always call the station after your waiver is denied. When contacting the local affiliate, it will help to give them information about your area, especially with KCOY who actually does broadcast in HD. The other networks don't, so if HD is your angle you might want to work the aspect I showed in my previous post (I just want an HD option per se).

By the way, if all goes well, you will never actually see a waiver. D* has them faxed directly to them, and they activate the channels automatically, including the HD one(s). The only time you will see one is if you have to call it manually yourself. They do not wait until they have all 4, as far as I know. I'm sure they would not activate any network unless they received the response from that network.

*** Sorry to the other watchers of this thread for so much off-topic information ***

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post #47 of 1296 Old 09-04-2004, 06:53 PM
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Final word on the subject from me. DTV does its best to get the waivers. In fact, they activated my ABC network channels even though I still don't have the postcard with the results. The guy at KEYT (I think David Teves) told me he would send it in and less than 48 hours later DTV activated the ABC network for me.
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post #48 of 1296 Old 09-07-2004, 08:48 AM
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Sounds good to me, thanks for clearing all that up. I actually went on DirecTV's website and checked the Distant Network eligibility page, and it says my address is already automatically eligible for the distant network feeds of CBS and Fox, which means I dont have to do any waiting for a waiver on those, which is GREAT news (especially the LA feed for NFL, two games every day most likely). And I guess I dont mind waiting for the other ones because a) we do get the SB locals and b) they dont have NBC and ABC HD available yet, so no reason to have the waiver right this second.

Thanks for your help guys, getting my install done sometime this morning, hope they have no problems, my dish will have to go on a pole to reach from my balcony up over the roofline, maybe 5 feet, but once up there I have a perfectly clear view, which is lucky because of all the other big trees around my complex.

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post #49 of 1296 Old 09-07-2004, 08:53 AM
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one other question, can you drop the locals package and keep the distant network feeds if I get granted a waiver for all four? or do you have to keep the locals to receive the Distant Networks?

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post #50 of 1296 Old 09-09-2004, 05:04 AM
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Of course not.

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post #51 of 1296 Old 09-30-2004, 11:43 AM
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Is anyone using the Charter HD DVR? What is the brand/model? How do you like it?
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post #52 of 1296 Old 10-05-2004, 01:35 PM
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WOOHOO! Got my NBC waiver, well I haven't received anything yet, but I just called up DirecTV to check the status, and the CSR told me NBC had been approved so he activated it for me on the spot! Now I've got all 4, and with Fox HD going online supposedly in a week, I'll have that in time for the MLB playoffs. Now I wish ABC HD would get signed as well so I can see the rest of Lost!

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post #53 of 1296 Old 10-05-2004, 10:46 PM
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Is that true about Fox going HD next week? I just watched the MLB championships and wondered about that.

I am also waiting for ABC HD to complete the HD network quartet.
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post #54 of 1296 Old 10-06-2004, 11:46 AM
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Someone posted that on the HD PRogramming board, so I'm HOPING its true, woud be great to have 3 out of 4! Supposedly it'll be on the 12th, just in time for the ALCS and NLCS

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post #55 of 1296 Old 10-12-2004, 01:21 AM
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Indeed, it does look like Fox HD will be activated soon. This is great news, considering my brother is visiting this week from Minnesota and we can possibly watch the Vikings in HD on Fox.

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...79#post4485679

Update: Looks like the Vikes play on ESPN-HD Sunday Night Football this weekend. Awesome.

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post #56 of 1296 Old 10-12-2004, 02:27 PM
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I'm a satellite virgin in SB and am planning on getting a DTV-HD satellite. I am wondering if it is worthwhile to get an OTA. Thanks.
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post #57 of 1296 Old 10-12-2004, 02:46 PM
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No, there is no Over The Air HD in Santa Barbara proper, on any network. The nearest HD broadcast comes from KCOY-HD in Santa Maria, which you may or may not be able to receive depending where you live in Santa Barbara county.

http://kcoy.com/hdtv/hdtv.aspx

It matters not though, as it is quite possible to get the waivers for the four networks, three of which are broadcast in HD on DirecTV.

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post #58 of 1296 Old 12-19-2004, 01:29 PM
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OK, I will answer my own question.

Just got my HD DRV from Charter. Its a SA 8000HD.

Picture quality seems similar to my Dish 811 except for CBS. The KCOY picture looks a little softer (less detail) than WCBS (NY) equivalent.
The SA8000HD is slow to respond to remote button pushes.

Looks good so far. I think I will be disconnecting my Dish soon.
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post #59 of 1296 Old 12-26-2004, 09:16 AM
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LesMoss,

What network stations are available in HD from Charter in your area?

When I call them via the customer service line they say ALL networks are available but the website only shows CBS.

What other PVR's have you used? How does the SA PVR compare? I also was told that it has two tuners, is that true?

Thank you in advance for the information!

-Frank
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post #60 of 1296 Old 12-28-2004, 10:42 AM
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I get only CBS (KCOY-DT, Santa Maria). I believe that is true for the whole Santa Barbara DMA.

When you call Charter you are talking to LA based customer service people. What they tell you applies to Charter's LA customers, not up here.

I have not used any other PVR, so I can't compare it to others. I think the SA8000HD has 4 tuners, 2 Analog plus 2 digital. Check out the "HDTV Recorders" forum here for better info. Charter uses the "SARA" software so the threads relating to the 8000HD on Cox or Comcast should be relevant to Charter.
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