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post #91 of 4033 Old 09-23-2003, 08:13 AM
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gakon,

You aren't alone on the lousy PQ of that show. See this thread:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...hreadid=305054

I only watched the opening sequence, and it looked fine.

I generally get great colors on all of the HD channels and KUSA is no different. I have the same set as you (except, perhaps, for the size -- mine is the 507W), so I'm guessing that ours are set up a little differently. Have you done any of the SM tweaks? When I changed from gamma 4 to 0, it made a big improvement in my PQ. I haven't changed anything else.

I did set the 5100 to output 1080i yesterday. I'm not sure if I'm seeing any improvement or not. Maybe, but its hard to tell since I don't have anybody to change modes while I sit back and look for differences. I kinda think it is better, but I wouldn't put money on it.

Tim
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post #92 of 4033 Old 09-23-2003, 08:46 AM
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I heard comcast downgrades all 720p signals to 1080i before they send it out to customers because 1080i works better on their system. Therefore, switching to 1080i output could be better for comcast subscribers because this is the native res. of the incoming signal. If you leave the STB to 720p, it is doing another translation and artifacts could occur.

Summary:

720p -> Comcast -> 1080i -> customer -> 720p -> TV
vs.
720p -> Comcast -> 1080i -> customer -> 1080i -> TV

One less translation if you leave box at 1080i.
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post #93 of 4033 Old 09-23-2003, 11:05 AM
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Quote:


Anyhow he said the press release about two Broncos games in HD were for games airing on Fox.

That is not possible because Fox does not do HD, they have 480i widescreen which may or may not be de-interlaced at the local station. Fox will be doing some prime time in 720p next fall but has not yet announced if they will be doing any 720p sports next fall.

Don
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post #94 of 4033 Old 09-23-2003, 12:08 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by donyoop
That is not possible because Fox does not do HD, they have 480i widescreen which may or may not be de-interlaced at the local station. Fox will be doing some prime time in 720p next fall but has not yet announced if they will be doing any 720p sports next fall.

Don

Don,
Comcast considers the widescreen Fox an HD channel. I know it isn't, and you know it isn't, but comcast has 2 catagories Regular (SD) or HD... Fox's picture is terrible compared to real HD, and I hope as more people get HDTV it will force them to reconsider thier plans. Also I thought the widescreen Fox was Progressive scan, not that it makes much of a difference.

Benzyl
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post #95 of 4033 Old 09-24-2003, 06:50 AM
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Did anyone else notice the delay between sound and picture Tuesday night on Fraiser on KUSA's hd? It was pretty annoying. I remember people mentioning it on the Denver hd OTA forum but for some reason I thought it couldn't happen on cable hd. It seemed to be better on Leno.
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post #96 of 4033 Old 09-24-2003, 10:39 AM
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I saw this posted over on one of the other forums, and thought I would share it here. I'm not sure how much truth there is to this, but if it is true, it sounds interesting. I know I would jump at the chance to ditch my digital cable package if I could still recieve all my hi-def channels. Take a look....

------

Hmm, from some of the other boards it looked like they can't force you to get digital in order to get HD (so guys back east were getting HD with just the basic local package). Here is the quote:

From the March/April 2003 issue of The Perfect Vision, page 33:

"The FCC requires these local [HDTV] digital channels to be part of 'basic service,' the lowest-price tier of service offered by the cable company (and the only one that's regulated by law), though it doesn't mandate that signals be sent out unencrypted. So if all you want is to see is every local [HDTV] digital broadcast channel offered by your cable company today, you can receive them at the cost of 'basic service' and an HD-box rental..."

"What the cable companies' sales people don't always tell you is that you don't need to order the expensive 'digital packages' to get premium HD channels. A law called the 1992 Cable Act has a provision in it that took effect last October. Called the 'buy through' provision, it basically says that if you have "basic service" you cannot be required to get a higher tier of service...to receive a premium HD channel such as HBO-HD."

"If the customer service person says you must get a digital tier of service to get HDTV, insist on speaking to a supervisor."
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post #97 of 4033 Old 09-24-2003, 11:55 AM
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nu2this

Thanks for the info. I have my TV set up where I switch between HD channels on the 5100 and standard channels with the TV. I could not believe how poor standard cable looked through the 5100. Having it hooked through the TV has greatly improved the PQ. I do have one last question for you. Is there a special audio output setting on the 5100. I can not get a digital single sent to my receiver. I have an optical cable connecting the 5100 to my DD receiver and the receiver defaults to Dolby pro logic. I have switched through all the high def channels and I can not get it to output DD. Is it because only certain programs during certain times of the day only play in DD. I though that INHD1 and 2 where always broadcasted in DD.
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post #98 of 4033 Old 09-24-2003, 01:10 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by BBYRNE
nu2this

I have an optical cable connecting the 5100 to my DD receiver and the receiver defaults to Dolby pro logic. I have switched through all the high def channels and I can not get it to output DD. Is it because only certain programs during certain times of the day only play in DD. I though that INHD1 and 2 where always broadcasted in DD.

From what I can tell, most of the audio is sent via the 5100's digital links in DD 2.0. That signal causes my A/V processor to switch on DPL decoding. I have received DD 5.1 from the HBO-HD channel, so it does work. The non-HD channels come through as standard PCM, which can also be decoded by DPL.

MiD
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post #99 of 4033 Old 09-24-2003, 01:47 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by mjmbond
From what I can tell, most of the audio is sent via the 5100's digital links in DD 2.0. That signal causes my A/V processor to switch on DPL decoding. I have received DD 5.1 from the HBO-HD channel, so it does work. The non-HD channels come through as standard PCM, which can also be decoded by DPL.

MiD

That's been my experience as well. There is very little 5.1 audio being transmitted. I've had it ocassionally on HBO-HD and the InHD channels. Mostly, though, its just DD 2.0. Since I do get 5.1 sometimes, I assume that Comcast is just passing through the sound that they receive.

I think even Leno could benefit from 5.1. It would be cool to have the audience laughter coming from the back channels so that it would sound like I've got a front row seat in the audience.

Tim
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post #100 of 4033 Old 09-24-2003, 03:01 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by David_Levin
Called today for service. Well don't bother if you're not yet upgraded for Cable Internet service (County Line & University).

Does Comcast Denver really have 80% of thier customers upgraded?


I live near University and Dry Creek. I talked to an installer today and he said they finished the upgrade and were up and running!!! I was a bit skeptical so I called a CSR and she said that the service had been activated in the area and they were in their final testing period. She said that the hdtv and high speed internet should be available in a few days after they made sure everything was working properly. If you are in the same upgrade grid as I am you may have service very soon!!! Do yourself a favor and call a CSR and ask about HDTV!!
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post #101 of 4033 Old 09-24-2003, 09:50 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by BBYRNE
nu2this

Thanks for the info. I have my TV set up where I switch between HD channels on the 5100 and standard channels with the TV. I could not believe how poor standard cable looked through the 5100. Having it hooked through the TV has greatly improved the PQ.

BBYRNE, I'm glad this hook up helped. I'm going to try to talk my family into giving it another try. Since you are currently using this set up, maybe you could answer some of your original questions for me. First of all, how much of a pain is it to juggle two remotes when you switch back and forth? If you accidentally change channels on the TV while watching hdtv, do you have to cycle through the TV/video input again or will pressing ANT, at that point, get you a sdtv station? Do you see any other drawbacks to this hook-up?

Have you gotten any DD 5.1 yet? I saw parts of Harry Potter on HBO in 5.1 the first day I got comcast and it was great. Since then, I havn't seen (heard) anything. I've been hooked on those nature shows on INHD. I even watched the thing about TEXAS!!!!!!! Oh well, the broadcast was so life-like, I'll never have to go there.
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post #102 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 10:09 AM
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I just went to the Colorado Comast site and I noticed that ABC has been added to list of channels available to Colorado customers. I am at work right now, can someone check to see if we actually have the channel.


comcastcolorado.com/ComcastColorado/channels.html

Just FYI I was at this site yesterday and it didn't have ABC.

Thanks,
Enrique
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post #103 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 10:53 AM
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I see ABC added too. I don't have Comcast yet. I have DirecTV. Can anyone tell me if you get INHD with your HD basic subscription?
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post #104 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 11:27 AM
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Tom - InHD and InHD2 are part of the HD subscription.

yamahar6red - I see ABC on that list, but not on the list you can get to from the main page (http://www.comcastcolorado.com/Comca...els.html#local). I did see it mentioned on the first page, but that's a typo (they say KUSA is ABC, but it's NBC). I spoke with a CSR who had no new information about ABC (or CBS, for that matter - I'm still going to bug them about that).
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post #105 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 11:37 AM
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It's on the page you linked. Scroll to the bottom, or refresh your browser if the page is cached.
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post #106 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 11:39 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by gakon
InHD and InHD2 are part of the HD subscription.


But just to be clear, are those channels included if all you sub to is the Basic package for 13.44 and the HD STB rental at 9.95? We know the Local channels in HD are available that way.

I thought maybe to get the InHD channels you might have to sub to a full blown Digital package that starts in the forty something dollar range? Not so?

Dan

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post #107 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 11:47 AM
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One last question, and many thanks in advance....

What are the approximate dimensions of the Motorola 5100 set top box?

Tom
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post #108 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 11:48 AM
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Ditto DP1's question...

(I know what he'z thinkin'....keepin' his dish! And MNF.)
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post #109 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 12:13 PM
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Well I already get MNF in HD and I'll be keeping my satellite HD systems no matter what, but yeah, I'd like to take a gander at those InHD channels because thats about the only HD content out there that I dont otherwise have access to.

The thing is though, Comcast doesnt have my area ready quite yet anywayz so for the moment it doesnt really matter.

Dan

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post #110 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 12:54 PM
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If you're thinking of getting Comcast just to get InHD, I would go to www.inhd.com and look at their programming schedule. If you find something you can't live without, then it might be worth it. If you think so, I might suggest spending more time outdoors.
I got Comcast because I don't have a dish, and I didn't spring for an OTA box because all of the OTA channels that I care about should be on cable in a few years or less (and I can wait that long for WB to be in HD).

The 5100 is 17"W x 14"D x 2 5/8"H.

I already had the expanded cable (not digital) when I got HD from Comcast, so I can't answer your question about the cost. However, based on Comcast's web site, I'd say that you can get ALL of these channels with the basic analog cable. You can always call and find out (although you may get a CSR who thinks you need full digital to get any HD channels). I'm glad someone provided this information because, given the poor quality of the SD channels, I'm not sure digital cable does anything for me, and I'd rather have the 9.95/month.

Tom - thanks - my page was cached.
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post #111 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 01:05 PM
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The kicker is, I could get all the HD locals OTA free except ABC...Grrr!
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post #112 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 02:29 PM
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I haven't looked at your other posts, but how hard have you tried to get ABC? I live well south of downtown (south end of HR, not really on a hill), and I WAS able to pick up ABC OTA (I borrowed a receiver for a few days just to see what I could get). It took a little effort (not too much), but that was with a set of rabbit ears sitting right on top of the TV. I was surprised because when I first set it up, I got nothing on ABC, but when MNF rolled around I got a little more motivated, and spent some time moving the antenna. Signal strength was weak, but enough to get a lock.
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post #113 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 03:22 PM
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In unicorporated Arapahoe County at Himilaya and Chenango (east of Quincy Reservoir), with rabbit ears I was able to get Fox. None of the others. I won't deny I haven't tried as hard as I could. I can see downtown (barely) from a window upstairs. I just might if I get a good attic antenna, which would not be a total loss even if it didn't work now, once the new tower is up on Lookout Mtn.

I may play around with the rabbit ears some more. The HDTV is downstairs, so I have to run some cable upstairs (or use the cable that's already in the walls), where I have the line of sight, to see if that helps get any of the others besides Fox. Thanks for the encouragement. Still pining over not seeing the MNF win in HD.
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post #114 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 06:04 PM
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Well, no ABC, despite the web site info. Neither CSR I spoke with had ABC on their "official" channel lineup cards. Not that there was anything to watch on ABC tonight....
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post #115 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 08:02 PM
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Eeew....
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post #116 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 08:52 PM
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I just ordered Comcast and will provide the lowest price package I have been given by the few CSR's I've spoken with. The lowest package available for Digital HD is called "Comcast Digital Classic" which is $45.99. This is good until the end of the year and then goes up $5.00 to $50.99.

The channels currently available in this package include:
1. NBC
2. Fox
3. PBS
4. In-Demand (1)
5. In-Demand (2)
6. ESPN

Showtime and HBO are also available in Digital/HD as a la carte or in higher end, more expensive packages. Comcast does not include any Digital/HD in the very lower end packages (ie. Comcast Basic ($13.44) or Comcast Standard ($36.04).

This is the info I ordered off of and believe it to be accurate. Let me know differently if I'm missing something. I hope this helps as the information posted in these forums have been extremely helpful to me.
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post #117 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 09:11 PM
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Your information may be correct, maybe not. Obviously, the website is wrong about ABC being in the lineup. Ironic though that as Gakon pointed out, it was just added today. But the fine print on the subscription level required I copied below from the website.

http://comcastcolorado.com/ComcastCo.../channels.html

*HDTV may not be available in all areas. To receive HD features and benefits, a HD television (not provided), converter, remote control and other equipment is required. After the free promotional period ends, monthly equipment charges, in addition to applicable service charges, may apply. Advertised channels/stations generally provide a mix of HD and non-HD programming. HD programming is limited to the programming provided to Comcast in HDTV format by the programming provider. HDTV programming and programming charges subject to change. Basic service subscription is required to receive HDTV. Installation, equipment and other charges may apply. Taxes, franchise fees and FCC fees apply. Please call your local Comcast Cable office for restrictions and complete details about service, prices and equipment. Pricing and programming may change. Service is subject to terms and conditions of Comcast Cable Subscriber Agreement. ©2003 Comcast Cable Communications, Inc. All rights reserved. All other trademarks are the property of their respective owners.
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post #118 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 09:37 PM
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Correction:

HD and Digital can be added to the Comcast Basic Package of $13.44 as indicated in Tom Roper's earlier Post. If you want to go this route, you need to ask the CSR for this package or they will start you out at the Comcast Digital Basic Rate that I subscribed to. The $13.44 Package does include all local progamming and In-Demand 1 and 2. In-Demand is integrated into the Digital Box they provide.

The CSR I spoke with said Channel 7 is now available with very limited programming in HD. He checked with his Supervisor and that seems to be the consensus. The Discovery Channel is also coming soon.

I wanted ESPN for additional sports so I'm sticking with package I bought knowing that more HD is coming and most likely coming soon.
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post #119 of 4033 Old 09-25-2003, 11:10 PM
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[quote]Originally posted by QBeck
[b]I just ordered Comcast and will provide the lowest price package I have been given by the few CSR's I've spoken with. The lowest package available for Digital HD is called "Comcast Digital Classic" which is $45.99. This is good until the end of the year and then goes up $5.00 to $50.99.


my local mits rep just emailed me and said he hooked up his integrated mits to basic cable and gets fox, nbc, abc, pbs digital/hd free.
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post #120 of 4033 Old 09-26-2003, 01:15 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by vikesbroncs
my local mits rep just emailed me and said he hooked up his integrated mits to basic cable and gets fox, nbc, abc, pbs digital/hd free.

That has me wondering...

If I hook up a terrestrial antenna, the same antenna receives both analog (NTSC) and digital (ATSC) signals. When the coax from the terrestrial antenna is thus connected to my Sony HD200 set top box, I can play analog and digital programming on the TV.

The Mits should work the same way, the difference being the ATSC decoder is internal to the TV, instead of inside a separate set top box like mine.

Basic cable might work the same way. ATSC + NTSC on the same cable just as if coming from a terrestrial antenna? If so, the Motorola 5100 set top box might not be necessary if you already owned an ATSC tuner? Just run the cable into the set top box? Could it be, the Motorola 5100 serves (2) functions, an ATSC tuner for people who don't already have a set top box? And for decoding encrypted broadcasts, PPV, premium channels?

I wonder.
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