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post #1 of 26638 Old 09-03-2003, 09:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Well, in that other thread (that discussed the 3100 -> 3510 transition) a bunch of folks were saying we should do this, so here it is!

I haven't called yet to try to swap my box out. Reports from some about marginal PQ improvements are making me stay put for the moment...

Maybe I'll try to get one for my bedroom to replace the SD box in there...

TM

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post #2 of 26638 Old 09-03-2003, 11:41 AM
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Nice move with the thread, TM. I've been considering adding a 3510HD, if I can get one, before returning my 3100HD and check if the image 'fog' really vanishes as a few have said. The faint haze doesn't really bother me since it's so subtle, but from earlier A-B comparisons with CBS OTA I know it's diminishing low-contrast hi-rez detail (faint-blue shirt pinstripes, for example). I'd add a SA8000 recorder/converter, too, if I didn't think TWC would announce the 8000HD version shortly, eliminating the need for both changes, and if there's a simple, practical way of operating two adjacent converters using the same remote codes.

Meanwhile, I see new channel 708 is working normally for USA Network's H/DTV tennis feeds. But it's totally blank for anything else here, other than a spectacular INHD demo loop last Friday. -- John
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post #3 of 26638 Old 09-03-2003, 01:56 PM
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There are enough of us here to keep a thread alive.

John, I have to be honest, the Pioneer HD box is a lateral move at best. It's nice that the box can stretch the SD pictures, but the S-Video and Video feeds of SD pictures is not as good as the SA3100. As a result, I no longer use my TV's stretch mode, which I like better than the Pio HD stretch mode. The box is also a lot more jittery than the SA3100. It takes a little longer to change channels and the programming guide operates with a slight delay that I find annoying. The overall PQ is a bit nicer and the DVI connection is nice too. Overall, considering the effort I expended into getting the Pioneer, I wouldn't do it again. The SA worked with few operating flaws. The Pio is a better box, but it has operating flaws (i.e., jittery menu, stretch mode no good, HD/SD channel switching causes black screens..)

As for the SA8000 PVR. I did get it and it is awesome. Yes the HD version would be great too, but if you have a second TV, run out and get one. Actually they are running a promotion for free install, or first month free if you pick it up and do a self install, which requires no effort other than plugging it in to the wall and TV.

I'm underwhelmed by 708. The PQ was jumpy at times and didn't have the same wow factor as Monday Night Football. I missed the InHD loop. Can't wait.

Drew
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post #4 of 26638 Old 09-04-2003, 07:31 AM
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Love this thread...We in NYC have more issues than just the new box. Here is what I am continually asking TWC-NYC(and of course getting no answer). 1. When will we get WPIX-DT back? We're missing Mets HD as well as regular WB prime time shows. 2. Will we EVER see ESPN-HD...Now that NFL has started you'ld think negotiations would heat up. 3. What ever happened to our getting Discovery-HD? So many other TWC systems nationwide have already added it. Why does the greatest city in the world always last?...4 will MSG-HD and FSNY-HD remain exclusive to Cablevision? and 5. When Bravo-HD and Cinemax-HD and Starz-HD comes alive in the next few months, will TWC-NYC add them immediately or will we once again watch the rest of the country addit first. I gave up on HDNet since we are getting the INHD stations. I hope everyone is putting pressure on TWC-NYC to make it the leader in HD in the nation as I would bet given the economic status of many NY'ers that there are as many or more HD ready TV's here than anywhere else in the US
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post #5 of 26638 Old 09-04-2003, 08:00 AM
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I have just returned from the HD Hardware forum. Someone there said that TWC Albany has the SA3250 installed. From paper, the SA 3250 has very nice features. Like full time signal on all outputs. Will TWC NYC ever use the SA 3250?
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post #6 of 26638 Old 09-04-2003, 09:09 AM - Thread Starter
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Glad we got this going

I played with a friend's 8000 and it is VERY cool. I may get that for the bedroom to replace my SD box... But I agree with BelB64 in general - where/when are the other channels coming? I call the HD hotline every now and then to request new channels and groan at their absence.

BTW so far on 708 the tennis I've seen has looked decent, though 4:3, not HD. Not nearly as nice as the NBA all star stuff they used 708 for!

TM

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post #7 of 26638 Old 09-04-2003, 09:09 AM
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Haven't heard anything on the SA HD Box.

As for the questions on channel line up, the two biggest questions listed above are where is WPIX-DT and Discovery HD. Adding chan 711 and then removing it was a cruel tease! Nobody has been able to ferret out an answer to this mystery. TWC has a national deal with Discovery-HD. Why it is not on the NYC network is mind-boggling.

As for MSG, FSNY, ESPN, Bravo, Cinemax, Starz and HD Net, I can see the political issues in getting them turned up. Even still, TWC NYC will need to remain competitive on the HD front with RCN on the doorstep. I already know 5 people that have switched to RCN for their HD service. I don't know the exact value of a subscriber these days, but it's somewhere between $2200 and $3500. The cost to re-acquire that sub is not cheap either.

Drew
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post #8 of 26638 Old 09-04-2003, 09:13 AM
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Got my HD cable box couple days ago (I'm in bergen county, NJ). The box was 3100HD. So far, PBS looks incredible. So is InHD. I'm not a tennis fan, but I find myself watching US open. Jay Lenno also looked very good. Still, I could'nt bring my self to watch the show. The cable has over 300 channels and I'm reduced to flipping between 7 channels. I hope TWC will add more HD channels soon. By the way, does anyone know if CBS will broadcast their regular football games in HD?
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post #9 of 26638 Old 09-04-2003, 01:34 PM - Thread Starter
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Hey Drew, what's the RCN HD lineup? SOrry to be lazy, I guess I could go look at their site!
TM

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post #10 of 26638 Old 09-04-2003, 02:34 PM
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I'm scheduled to get my HD STB swapped in on wednesday. From earlier posts in this thread, it sounds like there's a bunch of models floating around that TWCNYC uses for their HD boxes. Is there one in particular that I should request if that's even at all possible? I've been pretty happy with my SD box, and I'd be pretty aggravated if the HD box I receive on Wednesday doesn't work as smoothly with the channel guide/switching channels/OnDemand, etc. Any insight would be greatly appreciated...

Jason
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post #11 of 26638 Old 09-04-2003, 03:55 PM
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Thx for creating the thread - Ive got an appointment tomorrow for a 3510 & later in the day my 34xbr910 is arriving... can hardly contain myself!
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post #12 of 26638 Old 09-05-2003, 07:04 AM
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RCN's line up includes ESPN-HD and HD-Net, HD-Net MOvies, Discovery HD, plus the other standard channels. For some reason they don't carry one of the major Networks, I think CBS? They also charge a premium, but whatever, my cable bill is 130+ with RoadRunner, two boxes, PVR, etc.. A small premium for the channels I want isn't a big deal so long as its reasonable.

http://www.rcn.com/hdtv/hd-channels.php

I'm sure TWC will get their act together soon, but they better hurry because HD customers, I'm sure of this, are among the most valuable customers they have. This should be a no brainer for them!


Jason, as for cable box requests, you can see from my earlier post that the two boxes used in Manhattan are the SA3100 and the Pio 3510. A lot of people, myself included, went through hoops to get their box upgraded to the Pio. Upon further analysis, I wouldn't complain so long as the box gets a clean HD picture. I did have to go through 2 SA3100 boxes before I got one that worked. I then had the switch to the Pio box. In my opinion, the channel guide worked much better on the SA model, but you did have to switch video inputs, composite to component if you wanted to watch HD or SD. Wasn't a big deal in retrospect. Just make sure that your PQ on HD channels is clean. Watch each channel for a solid minute while the guy is there to make sure there is no pixelation or signal drops.

Drew

PS: I'm watching the INHD Demo on Ch 708 right now and it's pretty sweet! Some cool under water shots of fish, coral.
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post #13 of 26638 Old 09-05-2003, 07:23 AM
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Having used the 3510 for a week or so, I find that, to me, the main benefit of this box vs. the 3000 is the way it recovers from glitches. The 3000 would freeze, then black out for a couple of seconds before recovering.
The 3510 just mutes the sound for a second, then continues without blacking the picture out.
Pix quality seems about equal.
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post #14 of 26638 Old 09-05-2003, 08:07 AM
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FYI: Here is an excerpt from a recent article on TWC's HD situation.

Time Warner Cable has carriage agreements with ABC, CBS, NBC, PBS, HBO, Showtime, Discovery Networks, In Demand, several of Fox Sports Net's regional sports networks and over 70 local broadcast stations for carriage of high definition signals. It provides HDTV set-top boxes to more than 120,000 customers.
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post #15 of 26638 Old 09-05-2003, 08:43 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by bigd86
Having used the 3510 for a week or so, I find that, to me, the main benefit of this box vs. the 3000 is the way it recovers from glitches. The 3000 would freeze, then black out for a couple of seconds before recovering.
The 3510 just mutes the sound for a second, then continues without blacking the picture out.
Pix quality seems about equal.

Yeah, the SA3100HD was totally bothersome last night for MNF in this respect. Right when a play would be going off, blam! - blackout and no sound for a few seconds. Annoying.

Like Time Warner.
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post #16 of 26638 Old 09-05-2003, 09:32 AM - Thread Starter
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I gotta keep scanning to check for the InHD demo... which reminds me, when are we going to be able to watch HD flicks on demand?

TM

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post #17 of 26638 Old 09-05-2003, 11:12 AM
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I don't think that INHD is related to In Demand insofaras PPV. I've posted this question on the programing board earlier today. From what I can gather, it's competition to HDNET??

Drew
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post #18 of 26638 Old 09-06-2003, 05:40 AM
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I'm one of those who is ready to move to RCN once they are done working in my area. TWC is just not cutting it for me. I think what will really push me over is if they ask for more $$$ for INHD.

For RCN users: what stb do they provide?
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post #19 of 26638 Old 09-06-2003, 07:36 AM
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I just had TWC replace the SA box and they brought out the Pioneer box. One question: because my TV has a DVI input should I use the DVI output? The tech from TWC said the component output is better but I don't think that's true.
Anyone with experience using DVI vs. component?
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post #20 of 26638 Old 09-06-2003, 09:37 AM - Thread Starter
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Drew, thanks for all that info btw.

To all, re ch 708, twice now I've checked it when the guide bar specifically called out programming...one was Star 80 (yikes), the other the INHD Demo (I think that's what it was called). Both times though, nothing. No picture, no sound, no nothing. All my other HD channels work fine (using the 3100 box).

Any thoughts? Lingering blackout issues? Incorrect guide info? SHould I reset the box?

Thanks,
TM

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post #21 of 26638 Old 09-06-2003, 12:59 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by anthonymoody
Drew, thanks for all that info btw.

To all, re ch 708, twice now I've checked it when the guide bar specifically called out programming...one was Star 80 (yikes), the other the INHD Demo (I think that's what it was called). Both times though, nothing. No picture, no sound, no nothing. All my other HD channels work fine (using the 3100 box).

Any thoughts? Lingering blackout issues? Incorrect guide info? SHould I reset the box?

Thanks,
TM

I believe, for us, anyway, that our regular INHD programming doesn't start until 9/15.
Anything we get now is basically just testing it out.
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post #22 of 26638 Old 09-06-2003, 01:11 PM
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More info on INHD is available at http://www.inhd.com/
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post #23 of 26638 Old 09-06-2003, 04:23 PM
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If INHD and TWC are still testing the 708 link I hope they perform more tweaking. Friday night's breakup/pixelation of the U.S. Open was bad from the S.Manhattan headend, with a complete signal loss just after midnight. Earlier games on 708 had numerous glitches, too. Someone in N.J. (programming thread for 9/5 tennis) said Comcast's INHD delivery was okay Friday night. Today's games from WCBS-DT via 702 were mostly fine, just a few video/audio dropouts here. -- John
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post #24 of 26638 Old 09-07-2003, 07:05 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks bigd86.

Funny though John, I haven't found any tennis at all on 708. Only 702 as you say.

TM

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post #25 of 26638 Old 09-07-2003, 08:14 AM
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My PQ of Tennis on 708 was OK, some pixelation. CBS coverage was awesome. Truly awesome. Too bad for Andre', nice play by Roddick. Other than the INHD Demo loop, I haven't seen any of the movies that the preview was supposed to demonstrate. I suspect that the US Open coverage on 708 caused TWC to re-prioritize what they showed.

I haven't heard that TWC is planning on charging for INHD (yet). But it is only a matter of time before TWC add's an HD Tier to the programming. My guess is that ESPN, as well as some other HD channels will be coming soon, but not without a premium. RCN charges extra, and others do too I think, so it's only a matter of time.

Klick, I recently bought a DVI-D cabe from http://www.pacificcable.com for about 28.00. I really like the difference in PQ. I have noticed that it takes a half second longer for the HD channels to tune in, I suspect some sort of delay while decoding the signal??? Just a guess. Ironically, I've found the HD channels to be about the same as the component, but the SD channels are much improved by the DVI connection. Go figure.

Drew
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post #26 of 26638 Old 09-07-2003, 09:33 AM
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Thanks Drew...I unhooked my DVI cable from my Bravo DVD player and hooked it into the set-top box but I received a message that said "please hook the set-top box to and HDTV set"...very strange as it was hooked up.

Anyone know why my Samsung DLP would be able to accept DVD through DVI but not the Pioneer set-top?
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post #27 of 26638 Old 09-07-2003, 09:42 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by klick
Anyone know why my Samsung DLP would be able to accept DVD through DVI but not the Pioneer set-top?
kk [/b]

The first question to ask is-does your DVI connection support HDCP (the HD encryption technology)

I took a quick look on the Samsung website, but they didn't make it very clear.
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post #28 of 26638 Old 09-07-2003, 12:01 PM
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Is the cable system using HDCP? I didn't think that was deployed yet...
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post #29 of 26638 Old 09-07-2003, 12:40 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by klick
Is the cable system using HDCP? I didn't think that was deployed yet...

While I use only the component output, according to our previous thread-"TWC NYC - 3100HD set top boxes"- on the Pioneer 3510HD "HDCP is active all the time, flag is always on, and the component outputs are disabled when using DVI. This is not the intention of HDCP"
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post #30 of 26638 Old 09-07-2003, 02:47 PM
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I think it was on the Official Kansas City board where people with the Samsung DLP were having problems with the DVI port getting the same message as you Klick. Try a search on Samsung and Pioneer 3510 and see what you find, but I know I saw a discussion some were on this in this forum.

Also, are you sure that you are using a DVI-D cable? Don't know that the difference, but I read somewhere that the DVD-I cable wouldn't work?

Drew

Here is a Pioneer HD Box and Samsumg DLP Issue Link
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