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Old 01-13-2016, 01:50 PM
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12-3 is up and running now. It was already on the Tivo, just had to select the channel box. It will probably be a while before the program guide updates.

Speakers: Klipsch RF-7II(2), RC-64II, RS-62II(2), RP-160M(2), Velodyne HGS-15, HSU VTF-15H, Atlantic Technology IC-6-OBA(4)
AVP: Yamaha CX-A5100
Amps: Emotiva XPA-5(2), XPA-3
Oppo BDP-103, Roku 4
JVC DLA-RS500U, (132" screen)
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Old 01-13-2016, 03:36 PM
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12.3 is live! In 480i 16:9... squished vertically for this SIUE at APSU game. There's a "WKRC-3" watermark in the upper-right hand corner in the black bar. Hopefully they'll fix the aspect ratio soon!
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Old 01-13-2016, 03:38 PM
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can definately tell they arn't giving the channel much bandwidth. fast motion scenes look terrible on the 12" tv in the kitchen. I can't even imagine what it looks like on my 40" sony.
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Old 01-13-2016, 03:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Balloonfanatic View Post
can definately tell they arn't giving the channel much bandwidth. fast motion scenes look terrible on the 12" tv in the kitchen. I can't even imagine what it looks like on my 40" sony.
The Picture is definitely SD quality but it's better than what I thought it was going to be. I think they are running variable bandwidth so depending on what's running on the main channel then the other two sub channels are allocated more or less bandwidth.

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Robert

Last edited by microbob; 01-13-2016 at 04:01 PM.
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Old 01-13-2016, 05:56 PM
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Happy New Year....I'm a fan of ASN nothing like a college sports network for small schools tapping into the Cincinnati market
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Old 01-27-2016, 09:08 AM
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Ch. 2 in Dayton is running commercials announcing the Justice Channel is coming monday to ch. 2-3.
luvmyhdtv likes this.

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Old 01-30-2016, 11:12 PM
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Originally Posted by ThoraX695 View Post
12.3 is live! In 480i 16:9... squished vertically for this SIUE at APSU game. There's a "WKRC-3" watermark in the upper-right hand corner in the black bar. Hopefully they'll fix the aspect ratio soon!
12.3 and 9.3 are both still unwatchable. I wish the stations would fix the stretch-o-vision.
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Old 02-03-2016, 02:44 PM
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12.3 and 9.3 are both still unwatchable. I wish the stations would fix the stretch-o-vision.
I talked the chief engineer at channel 9 yesterday about the issue you are also experiencing with 9.3.

he narrowed it down to my tivo dvr.
Channel 9.3 and 12.3 are fine in 4 x 3 format (not stretched) if I use the tv's tuner.

he suggested I check the video output settings and see if that fixes my problem.

the settings for a hdtv should be for 16 x 9 output with bars on the side. that setting should allow the non hi def.channels like 9.3 to show in 4 x3 in the center of the screen and not be stretched.

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Old 02-05-2016, 07:50 PM - Thread Starter
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LOL, although its way past being funny at this point ...... MPEG2 720(or 704)x480 SD video can be flagged as 16x9 or 4x3. WCPO is sending what is actually 4x3 video improperly flagged as 16x9 on 9.3 ....

Similar to DVD players(and any commerical DVD I've ever seen since what -----... 1999? ---- has had this "flag" set correctly for the included content) which "adjust" the video signal(such as add letterboxing for a 4x3 set for 16x9 so called "anamorphic" video) --- according to a menu setup option you set regarding whether your display device is 4x3 or 16x9 aspect ratio ----- most modern TV's /etc have a "set by program"(or called something similar/etc) feature which displays content in its proper aspect ratio on the TV screen AS LONG AS THE PROVIDER(In this case broadcast station) ENCODES THE PROPER MPEG2 Metadata (i.e. "flag- technically an "MPEG2 Descriptor") as 4x3 or 16x9 depending on the source video .....


WKRC 12.3 is the same story at present(4x3 video flagged as 16x9)--- It seems a little "different" because of the letterbox bars they are adding(which are encoded picture information - that's what makes it "really" 4x3 currently), not something that is added by your tv .....Or to look at it another way If the letterboxing was gone, it would be "proper" 16x9 currently, as it is whenever WKEF runs ASN programming on one of their subs ....

The other area Sinclair operated stations send a 16x9 flag on their SD subchannels, but manage to do it correctly when what is 4x3 content is airing by inserting(i.e. "squeezing in") pillarbars(which is also encoded picture information in this case) on the sides ... this allows them to run actual 16x9 content(properly and without letterboxing) on those channels properly as long as they "remove" the pillarbars during the actual 16x9 content - of course, this is likely done automatically ......

update: Then there is WDYC 36.2 sending 16x9 video flagged as 4x3 ... thus, tv's with a "set by program" feature will "squeeze" in pillarbars on the sides, making for distorted video .....

And amazingly, problems with this very simple issue are not limited to local broadcast TV stations .. for example Dish Network (SD) channels 279 and 280 are "actual" 16x9 SD video(280 has been like that for several years)with no letterboxing added -- Try displaying that properly with say a Dish 311 receiver and a 4x3 TV!!!(on a 16x9 TV all one has to do is "stretch it" to fit the entire screen - same deal with WDYC broadcast station 36.2 mentioned above) ..... I'm not sure how many Dish subs cares about SD RT or CCTV English, but .....

Jeff

Last edited by Nitewatchman; 02-05-2016 at 09:20 PM. Reason: update as noted/improved spelling and formatting
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Old Today, 07:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nitewatchman View Post
LOL, although its way past being funny at this point ...... MPEG2 720(or 704)x480 SD video can be flagged as 16x9 or 4x3. WCPO is sending what is actually 4x3 video improperly flagged as 16x9 on 9.3 ....

Similar to DVD players(and any commerical DVD I've ever seen since what -----... 1999? ---- has had this "flag" set correctly for the included content) which "adjust" the video signal(such as add letterboxing for a 4x3 set for 16x9 so called "anamorphic" video) --- according to a menu setup option you set regarding whether your display device is 4x3 or 16x9 aspect ratio ----- most modern TV's /etc have a "set by program"(or called something similar/etc) feature which displays content in its proper aspect ratio on the TV screen AS LONG AS THE PROVIDER(In this case broadcast station) ENCODES THE PROPER MPEG2 Metadata (i.e. "flag- technically an "MPEG2 Descriptor") as 4x3 or 16x9 depending on the source video .....


WKRC 12.3 is the same story at present(4x3 video flagged as 16x9)--- It seems a little "different" because of the letterbox bars they are adding(which are encoded picture information - that's what makes it "really" 4x3 currently), not something that is added by your tv .....Or to look at it another way If the letterboxing was gone, it would be "proper" 16x9 currently, as it is whenever WKEF runs ASN programming on one of their subs ....

The other area Sinclair operated stations send a 16x9 flag on their SD subchannels, but manage to do it correctly when what is 4x3 content is airing by inserting(i.e. "squeezing in") pillarbars(which is also encoded picture information in this case) on the sides ... this allows them to run actual 16x9 content(properly and without letterboxing) on those channels properly as long as they "remove" the pillarbars during the actual 16x9 content - of course, this is likely done automatically ......

update: Then there is WDYC 36.2 sending 16x9 video flagged as 4x3 ... thus, tv's with a "set by program" feature will "squeeze" in pillarbars on the sides, making for distorted video .....

And amazingly, problems with this very simple issue are not limited to local broadcast TV stations .. for example Dish Network (SD) channels 279 and 280 are "actual" 16x9 SD video(280 has been like that for several years)with no letterboxing added -- Try displaying that properly with say a Dish 311 receiver and a 4x3 TV!!!(on a 16x9 TV all one has to do is "stretch it" to fit the entire screen - same deal with WDYC broadcast station 36.2 mentioned above) ..... I'm not sure how many Dish subs cares about SD RT or CCTV English, but .....
I just had a issue with SOL on 25.6 got complaint about the graphics, after checking into it the up-link is 544X480 we were doing 704X480 and the encoder was have a issue with the very bad graphics they do about 80% white with no edge, our encoder was trying to "make-up" data, thus you could see artifacts around the graphics.
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Old Today, 06:37 PM - Thread Starter
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I just had a issue with SOL on 25.6 got complaint about the graphics, after checking into it the up-link is 544X480 ....
Since you brought it up --- That's actually another one Dish (ch 257 - they call it SBN) has 16x9 video(without encoded letterboxed bars) which privides distorted video on at least some SD dish receivers (such as 311 - which have no available menu option to set user display's aspect ratio) ..... Weather nation(WN)(ch 215) and Al Jazzera America (216 however long it lasts) are two more ....

anyway -- Those odd horizontal resolutions can be several different resolutions that aren't necessarily commonly used/known (with MPEG2 have to be MOD 16/dividable by 16 though If I recall correctly, involving macroblock size/etc), but, they're not "ATSC Compliant" (Only 720x480,704x480, 640x480 for SD), the PAR (Pixel aspect ratio) is just different, I'm not sure how "any given" MPEG2 decoder would handle some of those, though ... I do know that the DBS sat providers use some of them .....

I was thinking that maybe the situation on 12.3/wkrc could possibly involve receiver(possibly with AR conversion settings on it/etc) they might use to pick up that ASN feed ... But, I'm not sure where that's done/etc, given I know Sinclair does a lot of stuff(or did, last time I'd heard) with their area stations from columbus .....

If they were to get rid of the letterbox bars though, It would require more bits --- those encoded "black bars" really don't use anything(if the borders "fit" within each macroblock .....



-------------------------

25.5 Heartland audio ----

Anyway, on another note --- Elliot --- On all of my decoders, WBQC-LD 25.5 Is left channel only audio (one doesn't notice it as much if using a dolby "surround mode" on receiver/etc).... unless it is something going on on my end --- Any chance you can encode either "real"(or "fake" for that matter) 2.0 stereo, or, what would be better than the way it is, just 1 channel monaural ?

I haven't looked at the transport stream with an analyzer in quite a while, as all the equipment I need is packed away/difficult to get to currently(and will be for a long time!) as I'm renovating the rooms where I use that stuff, but I assume it's probably encoded 2.0 at 192Kb/s or similar ....

Thanks,

Jeff
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