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Old 07-31-2016, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by mrc54 View Post
i called and spoke to the station manager's office about losing the weather channel. She kept talking about band width. I told her that wndy has been doing 2 1080i channels and a 480i for almost a year and the picture quality is very good. My other home is down there. Back came the band width answer. I suggested they call the engineers at wndy. if wndu can't do 2 108i and a 480i, maybe they should hire an engineer that can!
wsbt
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Old 07-31-2016, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by morphinapg View Post
wsbt
Yes, thought I put WSBT in title. My bad.
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Old 08-01-2016, 05:56 AM
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5.1 Audio vs 2.0

I noticed on the 8 am news on 22.2 that it is in 2.0 audio whereas the simulcast on 28.1 is in 5.1 audio. I wonder if WSBT will upgrade the FOX channel to 5.1 audio.
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Old 08-01-2016, 08:03 AM
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so for an outside the area observer...what is on 28 now?
Just H&I or a copy of Fox still?
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Old 08-01-2016, 08:35 AM
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Originally Posted by unclehonkey View Post
so for an outside the area observer...what is on 28 now?
Just H&I or a copy of Fox still?
28.1 is a simulcast of 22.2 but with 5.1 DD audio. 28.2 is H&I. I understand this simulcast to be temporary but I don't know for how long.
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Old 08-01-2016, 08:47 AM
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Originally Posted by bflora View Post
28.1 is a simulcast of 22.2 but with 5.1 DD audio. 28.2 is H&I. I understand this simulcast to be temporary but I don't know for how long.

I read somewhere that the simulcast will end at the end of September.

Last edited by Timroberts; 08-01-2016 at 08:53 AM.
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Old 08-01-2016, 03:21 PM
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wsbt
Even with the latest encoders, running two HD channels AND a subchannel is very difficult to do right, and even then, compromises are made. So, I more than bet WSBT's engineers were in on this meeting, and went: "we can't do 2 HD channels and a sub without new encoders, or without dropping our weather channel to at least make them look reasonably good". And management said: OK. "No money for new encoders; 22.3 is gone!" Given the proliferation of the Internet and weather websites, these weather subchannels are becoming unnecessary (and I'm a meteorologist!). This is especially true since WSBT's website has all that info there already. They make virtually no money off of it, versus a considerable amount from being a FOX affiliate. That was an easy decision to make.

And what about WSJV? I could see that becoming ABC. And then we'd go full circle with affiliations on that station. If anyone thinks H&I will make enough money for 28.1 to make a profit, they're mistaken. Something major has to happen with 28 for it to make money after Fox is gone...

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Old 08-01-2016, 04:12 PM
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Even with the latest encoders, running two HD channels AND a subchannel is very difficult to do right, and even then, compromises are made. So, I more than bet WSBT's engineers were in on this meeting, and went: "we can't do 2 HD channels and a sub without new encoders, or without dropping our weather channel to at least make them look reasonably good". And management said: OK. "No money for new encoders; 22.3 is gone!" Given the proliferation of the Internet and weather websites, these weather subchannels are becoming unnecessary (and I'm a meteorologist!). This is especially true since WSBT's website has all that info there already. They make virtually no money off of it, versus a considerable amount from being a FOX affiliate. That was an easy decision to make.

And what about WSJV? I could see that becoming ABC. And then we'd go full circle with affiliations on that station. If anyone thinks H&I will make enough money for 28.1 to make a profit, they're mistaken. Something major has to happen with 28 for it to make money after Fox is gone...
I think it is obvious that WSJV will auction its bandwidth. I also have a hunch ABC will end up on WNDU.
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Old 08-01-2016, 04:28 PM
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How is WSJV still a thing at all after this sale? I thought that was the point.
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Old 08-07-2016, 06:41 AM
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WSBT 22.3 WEATHER channel disappears

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Originally Posted by morphinapg View Post
wsbt
WSBT'S weather channel was one of the worst ones out there. Now it evaporated, without warning. The official excuse is that it took too much bandwidth. All of a sudden, WSBT noticed that 22.3 was hogging excessive bandwidth. Yeah, sure, whatever.

Never mind you had to wait 15-20 minutes for the important radar screen to appear during bad weather events. To scroll through gobs of advertising, dewpoint screen, flight delay screen, and other trivial and unmeaningful screens.

22.3 was clutterred, poorly laid out, and annoying to look at. Yet, it was a public service. My 93 old neighbor relied on it as he does not have internet. I'm sure he wasn't the only one that put up with all the garbage advertising to get a peek at the weather forecast.
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Old 08-07-2016, 09:41 AM
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WSBT'S weather channel was one of the worst ones out there. Now it evaporated, without warning. The official excuse is that it took too much bandwidth. All of a sudden, WSBT noticed that 22.3 was hogging excessive bandwidth. Yeah, sure, whatever.

Never mind you had to wait 15-20 minutes for the important radar screen to appear during bad weather events. To scroll through gobs of advertising, dewpoint screen, flight delay screen, and other trivial and unmeaningful screens.

22.3 was clutterred, poorly laid out, and annoying to look at. Yet, it was a public service. My 93 old neighbor relied on it as he does not have internet. I'm sure he wasn't the only one that put up with all the garbage advertising to get a peek at the weather forecast.
22.3 used excessive bandwidth because 22.2 became a fox channel, and so they had to upgrade 22.2 to HD. They didn't have the bandwidth to broadcast two HD channels as well as the weather channel, so they had to shut it down.

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Old 08-07-2016, 10:06 AM
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Originally Posted by morphinapg View Post
22.3 used excessive bandwidth because 22.2 became a fox channel, and so they had to upgrade 22.2 to HD. They didn't have the bandwidth to broadcast two HD channels as well as the weather channel, so they had to shut it down.

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Gray broadcasting has no problem doing two HD channels and an SD Channel. They run CBS main NBC HD sub and me/my sub in Nebraska just fine. In North Dakota they do NBC main FOX HD sub and MeTV sub in Western North Dakota just fine. In the East swap Fox for CBS.

A basic Weather Channel like that does not take up a lot of bandwidth. So it sounds like they just decided to end it and is using this as an excuse
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Old 08-07-2016, 10:22 AM
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Gray broadcasting has no problem doing two HD channels and an SD Channel. They run CBS main NBC HD sub and me/my sub in Nebraska just fine. In North Dakota they do NBC main FOX HD sub and MeTV sub in Western North Dakota just fine. In the East swap Fox for CBS.

A basic Weather Channel like that does not take up a lot of bandwidth. So it sounds like they just decided to end it and is using this as an excuse
Either those stations have more bandwidth available to them, or they are overly compressing their HD stations. Either way, not an option for WSBT.

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Old 08-07-2016, 02:15 PM
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Either those stations have more bandwidth available to them,
Every RF station is allocaed the same amount of bandwidth.

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or they are overly compressing their HD stations.
nope. I've seen the dual HD in Fargo and its better picture than what my ABC is in Minneapolis. KSTP (ABC Mpls) uses 1/2 their bandwitdh for mobile TV so their OTA picture looks like crap (they have one SD sub).

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Either way, not an option for WSBT.
it is an option. but they decided not to pursue that avenue. Hey I applaud them for looking out for the HD picture but they could easily allocate minimal bandwidth for a static weather station.
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Old 08-07-2016, 02:18 PM
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I'm saying it may not be an option for their quality standards.

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Old 08-07-2016, 02:36 PM
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I'm saying it may not be an option for their quality standards.
I figured since Sinclair is the owner and they do it in other markets...2 HD + SD and in most markets that they do it the SD is an actual diginet and not a static weather station they would do it there too.
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Old 08-07-2016, 03:41 PM
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since Sinclair is the owner

Unclehonkey,

I think Sinclair wanted to jettison the weather service as the channel was not sufficiently profitable. Comcast was helping to fund 22.3 but they stopped that awhile ago. BW is only the excuse to give out when asked.

Seems like the Ferenghi have taken over the planet. Cheers.
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Old 08-07-2016, 06:33 PM
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Well, what are the bitrates we're dealing with here? Perhaps 22.1 and 22.2 are max bitrate HD broadcast channels, while the other ones listed before have been downgraded to allow room for a third channel. Again, they may not be willing to compromise their main channels to support some third channel that almost nobody watches.
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Old 08-07-2016, 06:51 PM
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Unclehonkey,

I think Sinclair wanted to jettison the weather service as the channel was not sufficiently profitable. Comcast was helping to fund 22.3 but they stopped that awhile ago.
that makes sense
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Old 08-07-2016, 06:54 PM
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Well, what are the bitrates we're dealing with here? Perhaps 22.1 and 22.2 are max bitrate HD broadcast channels,
The only way you can use "max bitrate" or bandwidth is if it was a single HD station, no subs, no mobile...like the CBS O&O's before they added Decades last year (Minneapolis was one of them...)

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while the other ones listed before have been downgraded to allow room for a third channel.
The diginets usually have a contract whereas this wx may not.

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Again, they may not be willing to compromise their main channels
But its Sinclair that makes the decision (since they are the owner) and they do it in other markets

The response that Comcast was help footing the bill for the WX and they stopped doing that makes more sense
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Old 08-07-2016, 07:12 PM
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The only way you can use "max bitrate" or bandwidth is if it was a single HD station, no subs, no mobile...like the CBS O&O's before they added Decades last year (Minneapolis was one of them...)
I meant max bitrate in the ATSC sense, not in the sense of theoretical bandwidth.

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But its Sinclair that makes the decision (since they are the owner) and they do it in other markets

The response that Comcast was help footing the bill for the WX and they stopped doing that makes more sense
They may be the owner but that doesn't mean they make that decision.
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Old 08-09-2016, 05:10 AM
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WSBT 22.3 Disappears

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Originally Posted by morphinapg View Post

They may be the owner but that doesn't mean they make that decision.
Morph,

If the owner, (Sinclair), doesn't make the decision then, Who does? The viewers?
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Old 08-09-2016, 11:22 AM
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Morph,

If the owner, (Sinclair), doesn't make the decision then, Who does? The viewers?
WSBT makes decisions on their own too, you know...

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Old 08-12-2016, 12:15 PM
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WSBT makes decisions on their own too, you know...

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True, you do have point. 22.3 in the end just was not worth the aggravation to WSBT.
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