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post #631 of 10552 Old 09-29-2004, 03:49 PM
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I'm new to this forum, but I've certainly enjoyed all the good info on here. I'm a Charter subscriber and really wish they would up their content. The picture quality is good, but only 6 channels? Well, seven with the part-time Braves channel. I sure hope to see Fox, ABC and CBS soon.
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post #632 of 10552 Old 09-29-2004, 04:56 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by tommyp007
I sure hope to see Fox, ABC and CBS soon.

If your TV has a QAM tuner, you can get WSPA's digital channel by tuning to C103.2.
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post #633 of 10552 Old 09-29-2004, 07:42 PM
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My Hughes HTL-HD obviously does not have QAM tuner, and I wanted to maybe "play around" with getting some "extra" HD channels from Charter (even though I don't subscribe to their HD service). Anyone know of a cheap set-top QAM tuner? I know this might be considered "dark," but I figured I'd ask.
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post #634 of 10552 Old 09-29-2004, 10:34 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by dashaund
To clarify, WBSC is available digitally on two stations. An SD simulcast on 13-2 from WLOS, and on 40-1 out of Boiling Springs (I believe). The 40-1 (ch. 14) will the in HD soon, since its already at 720p now, no HD content being fed yet. Its better quality than the 13-2 simulcast. If you can pick it up (its a very weak station), then watch 40-1 instead. For antenna adjustment, its nearly 180 deg opposite from WLOS's transmitter.

My post saying it was on 13-3 was wrong and as has been correctly stated it is on 13-2. I'm surprised though that they both (40-1 & 13-2) aren't the same. It shouldn't be that difficult to mirror the station's output at the same high quality, but I know very little when it comes to HD technology.

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post #635 of 10552 Old 10-01-2004, 07:16 AM
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walterc

Its the same content being transmitted on both transmitters. The 40-1 is in 720p and 13-2 is in 480i. The difference is that 40-1 right now is an SD upconvert, and the 720p allows for more bandwidth and a much cleaner picture. They're not showing any HD content just yet, but they're set up for it. The SD upconvert does make a huge difference in picture quality, however.
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post #636 of 10552 Old 10-01-2004, 02:00 PM
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I have recently purchased an HDTV with the built-in HD tuner. I have an outside antenna mounted on the chimney of my two story house. I am able to pick up all the stations that I believe that I should except one, WASV. I have some problems with WSPA freezing and pixelating. But, the others seem to be OK. WYFF is the strongest, even WLOS is coming in OK. I thought about rotating my antenna slightly, to see if this helps with WSPA's reception. Does anyone have any advice for me? I would like to improve WSPA and also be able to pick up WASV. I have used the info from antennaweb to get this for. I live in Fountain Inn, SC. Two things I failed to mention are that I do not have an antenna rotor and I have a Channel Master amplifier on my coax from the antenna.
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post #637 of 10552 Old 10-01-2004, 03:16 PM
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Get a rotor,that way you can maximize your reception for each station. I have a channel master rotor with a remote control that lets you preset each station so you can just enter the station number and go right to that position. The remote is compatible with pioneer cable box codes ,so i can use my universal remote to control it along with my HDTV/w built in HD tuner and Directv and my DVD player and my Sony stereo. Lots better than a table full of remotes.
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post #638 of 10552 Old 10-01-2004, 04:34 PM
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A rotor may be the thing for you, but you might want to experiment on a compromise single position. I have found that in my location, and get all the stations with good PQ. Much simpler, if you can make it work.

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post #639 of 10552 Old 10-01-2004, 04:53 PM
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I thought I'd give you guys an update on my situation. I ordered the
CM 4221 antenna and the CM 7775 Pre-amp and these were scheduled to be installed today. However my installer got stalled on the appointment before me so it looks like Monday early evening.

I tried pushing him to come as late as possible because I get strong signals until about sundown. Today the difference was very pronounced. Even as late as 6pm I was getting upper 80's on WYFF, WLOS, and WHNS, but by 7:15pm I was around 20 for WYFF and WHNS, and barely above 11 on WLOS. He's coming at 5:00pm, but I've got him doing something else until about 6:00pm so hopefully he'll finish up around 7:00pm or a little after so I'll be able to tell if the new setup is making a difference.

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post #640 of 10552 Old 10-02-2004, 05:52 AM - Thread Starter
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Re WHNS HD progress:
Based on usually reliable information WHNS has received its new digital MW for HD upgrade...but other needed equipment on order has yet to arrive.
This seems to be an indication that there is a determination to finish the project soon.

JB - Asheville

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post #641 of 10552 Old 10-02-2004, 08:53 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by jerry birdwell
Re WHNS HD progress:
Based on usually reliable information WHNS has received its new digital MW for HD upgrade...but other needed equipment on order has yet to arrive.
This seems to be an indication that there is a determination to finish the project soon.


It looks like it's going to be close then for them to make the World Series. I'm just hoping they have it up for Thanksgiving so we can watch Football in HD. At the worst I hope they have it ready for the NFL playoffs. NFL Sunday Ticket doesn't cover these so if WHNS isn't in HD then it's back to their crappy signal from DirecTV. Sort of off topic, but I do wonder why the standard signal on DirecTV locals for WSPA and WYFF is pretty good while WLOS and WHNS is really bad? Why would two be more compressed than the other two? Hopefully my OTA situation will be improved after Monday, and I won't have to worry about it.

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post #642 of 10552 Old 10-02-2004, 09:50 PM
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Hello everyone - this will be my first post in this HDTV Greenville forum. I live in Greenville, SC and have been enjoying OTA HDTV for a couple of years. I started out w/ a cheap indoor $25 RCA antenna, and that did fine at getting a couple of HD channels... but after moving into a house in the Woodruff road area, I needed something better, the RCA could only get 1 channel, CBS. So I installed a CM 3020 antenna and a recommended CM pre-amp, and now I can get good reception.

I haven't tweaked the antenna direction a whole lot until tonight -- I wanted to watch the 2-hour re-airing of the 1st 2 episodes of LOST on ABC tonight. I had not been able to get ABC to come in before, but after tweaking for a while, I now get NBC, CBS, ABC, FOX and PBS in HD along w/ a few other regular DTV channels.

Anyways, this is in regard to walterc's post about WLOS. I haven't seen such clear, non-motion-blocky HD except on CBS before tonight... wow. It looked awesome. What doesn't -- and has never -- looked awesome is PBS. Tons of crappy motion-blockiness on every pan & every dissolve. Blah. And almost the same for NBC -- the Olympics got pretty blocky at times.

But back to ABC tonight on the LOST show -- even on very fast pans it looked just like film. I didn't see a single problem with that picture... stunning.


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post #643 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 12:19 AM
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Hello Pixelman, welcome aboard. I'm kind of new myself.

I have no doubt that the picture quality from WLOS-DT is very good. Hopefully I'll be enjoying it myself just in time for Monday Night Football. If you've read my posts then you know I'm changing my OTA setup this coming Monday.

I did want to mention that when I shared that I received PBS very well as opposed to WLOS I meant the strength of signal and not the quality of the broadcast. I never actually sit down and watch a show on PBS, but when I am checking signal strength I will switch to it just for comparison sakes.

So before tweaking your antenna you got everything but WLOS? Did you use the compass orientation from antennaweb.org to set it or just played around with it until it came in? I'm planning to get my installer to aim the CM 4221 right at WLOS since it is my weakest station in hopes that it will come in, and I'll still get everything else.

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post #644 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 05:27 AM - Thread Starter
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Re: "Local to Local" from Satellite

Too often the satellite local service does not stand up to comparisons with off air and certainly not to the quality in the studio. A couple of weak links contribute to this...first (for this area) the satellite providers pickup the signal from off air and it is not always of best quality. DirecTV picks up the WLOS signal in SC. Secondly, both major providers are cutting the band width to the limit in order to squeeze out more channels.
But...it is not just the local stations...too many of the channels look just terrible. And the pay movie channels are the pits, too often.
(And don't bother to try to call to complain!)

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post #645 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 09:52 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by walterc

So before tweaking your antenna you got everything but WLOS? Did you use the compass orientation from antennaweb.org to set it or just played around with it until it came in?[/b]

Before tweaking, I didn't get WLOS or FOX. It used to be that I could only get NBC or CBS, but not both. It seems to be getting better as the days go by.

I used the compass from antennaweb as a guide, and also experimented a lot, with my wife giving me feedback over the radio as i turned it. I'm using the same antenna to feed my regular TV in another room, and everything is coming in well there also, except for CBS, which has some major ghosting, and ABC is slightly grainy.

I don't have a way of checking signal strength -- I'm just using the internal tuner on my Mits. So my signal meter is: the channel stays on perfect, or it may glitch every once in a while, or it's not there at all.


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post #646 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 11:22 AM
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Quote:


Anyways, this is in regard to walterc's post about WLOS. I haven't seen such clear, non-motion-blocky HD except on CBS before tonight... wow. It looked awesome. What doesn't -- and has never -- looked awesome is PBS. Tons of crappy motion-blockiness on every pan & every dissolve. Blah. And almost the same for NBC -- the Olympics got pretty blocky at times.

Doesn't ABC broadcast in 720P? Some people say that 720P generally handles motion better. Also about PBS, I believe they usually split their bandwidth up by broadcasting several subchannels at the same time. This is probably why their HD quality suffers so much.
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post #647 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 12:51 PM
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Yes, ABC is in 720p, along with ESPN and now FOX. It is said that it handles motion better, and I find that to be true. I have heard some find flaws in FOX's HDTV so far, but I think they've been fixed. I can't speak for myself since WHNS doesn't have HD installed yet. We'll have to wait and see. And, I agree that PBS's broadcast does lack performance. A lot of artifacts in their broadcasts. It must be due to the lack of bandwidth with their subchannels...good observation. Off topic, I was cleaning out one of my old storage cabinets and found an old UHF bowtie antenna I had put away, you know, the cheapos you get with new TVs and such that you usually toss. I hooked it up to my digital OTA receiver and was stunned at its performance, performing better than a $40 amplified VHF/UHF set top antenna I had bought. Its very touchy...you have to have it at a perfect angle to get reception, but once you do it locks in at a VERY strong signal. I can get every DTV channel except WLOS, and I'm considered in a rural area! I might make a makeshift base to test it out. Just thought I'd share my observation on how vintage technology is sometimes better than some of the expensive stuff on the market today. Kind of depressing isn't it?
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post #648 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 03:39 PM - Thread Starter
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I assume your comments on PBS are regarding SCETV's Channel 9. Over a year ago SCETV promised to involve its viewers in tests of 720P but that never happened and their picture quality with motion artifacts is below that of UNCTV's Channel 25. (And I find the co-channel problems on VHF very objectionable.) It is nice to have SCETV's 24 hour HD schedule but I would vote for the 720p if it improved the picture. On the otherhand, UNCTV cuts back to only two channels when it commences HD at 8 p.m.

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post #649 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 05:28 PM
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Hi. im new to this thread. I live in spartanburg and would like to get WHNS-DT for the world series. I have no clue what equipemnt to buy. I dont want to get a huge antenna. Can you guys reccomend what i should get to get this channel. And i would like to buy it from circuit city because i have a 400$ gift card. Thx.
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post #650 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 05:59 PM
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First off, welcome to the forum thespy007! The more input from local viewers, the better. Okay, so I assume you have an HDTV already. After that, are you looking to receive DirecTV/DISH at all? If DirecTV, I have a Hughes HTL-HD receiver that I would recommend highly. If just OTA, then look at the Motorola or LG receiver. Samsung makes a lot of these. Personally, I don't like Samsung equipment. I know many on here use them and love them, but I have found many faults, especially with OTA reception when the signal is borderline. The LG box has the same chipset that my Hughes uses, and it works G-R-E-A-T! I'm not sure if the Motorola does or not. As far as antennas, that's something you might be working on with trial and error, I'm sorry to say. It depends on your location. Do you live in an apartment or your own home? What elevation? Any trees/buildings/etc in the way? The Silver Sensor is pretty good. Terk has been known to make some pretty crappy products, not even bringing into account that they are ridiculously overpriced. On paper the TV55 is supposed to whip every other antenna up onside and down the other, but I can do better with my $2 UHF bowtie (see previous post). I'm trying to stay within your CC Gift Card here. If all you want is WHNS, then just try a few antennas and see what you get. After that, you'll have to move on to some more sophistcated stuff. My personal favorite for this area is the 4-Bay UHF bowtie design. The Antenna's Direct (antennasdirect.com) DB4 is what I use. That is about $70 w/shipping plus mounting equipment and cable. Channel Master makes the 3021/4221. You can order those from a number of places. It may seem overwhelming at first for such a short question. It's a trial and error process...that's why we're all here! And, hey, my $2 bowtie might be all you need, but I don't think you'd be happy with that for a long term solution. Others PLEASE post your opinions! I don't know everything, never have, and don't claim to. If you own a Samsung receiver and a Terk TV55 and are seeing great results, let me know!
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post #651 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 06:17 PM
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Thx for the reply dashaund. My hdtv has the ota hdtv tuner built in. I live in a 2 story house, there are some tall tress behind my house but shouldent be that much of a problem. Also would i have to buy a pre-amp for the antenna or is that just an option? I remember seeing the Terk antennas at CC so ill go check that out. Thx.
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post #652 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 07:04 PM
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I live in Inman, roughly in the same line of sight as you for all the staions. I have had great success with the CM 4228 mounted upside down in my attic. No preamp, no rotor., Very simple. All in, mast and all, about $60 at Harvey Electronics on Asheville Highway. Good luck!

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post #653 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 07:22 PM
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Everyone trashes Terk, but I have a TV38, live in Candler in a one story house, and I get everything now except for WSPA and WASV (and the WBSC 40-1 channel). I have a hard time understanding how one company can be that better than another when antennas simply seem to be different metal elements attached to each other. Can someone help explain this?
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post #654 of 10552 Old 10-03-2004, 07:56 PM
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That is a mystery that its understanding evades me. I can't tell you why some antennas work better that others when the concept remains the same. An antenna's sole purpose is receiving radio waves out of the air. I trash Terk because a lot of their products stink and they charge way too much. Many of their antennas have the same design as others and they charge twice as much or more, and their performance is sometimes half as good. I'm sorry, I've had bad experiences with their products, as many other people have had (just walk in to BB or CC and see how many open box returns they have on sale), and won't buy from them again. Anyway, this thread isn't for product reviews but for local reception. Antennas vary in design and size, bigger is usually better. Certain designs work better in certain situations. The actual dimensions of the pieces used are calculated to match the wavelength of the signal it is intended to receive (the reason why we have antennas made for VHF or UHF...some are made to receive both). I'm glad your antenna works for you, that's all that really matters. I was just making a buying suggestions out of experience, but I also told him to try different antennas to see what might work best. For me, I haven't found a Terk to work at all. I hooked a pair of VHF rabbit ears up to my receiver and it worked better than the TV55 I tried out. What does that tell you?
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post #655 of 10552 Old 10-04-2004, 08:16 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by walterc
I've been looking forward to seeing Enterprise in HD, but although WASV comes in great there's no telling when they'll actually start broadcasting in HD.

...which is odd, since their website has an "HDTV" link under 'Inside Super 62', and appropriately enough, none of the listings under its digital channels have the usual DecisionMark HD indicator. Has anyone pestered them to see what plans they have for broadcasting in HD, if any?

On a lark, I borrowed a Channel Master 3010 StealthTenna from a friend of mine. I was just curious what I could pick up from my house in Simpsonville, and even though I haven't gone to the trouble of doing a proper installation, at least not yet, I just left it on my first-story living room floor, plugged the antenna into my TV (which has an ATSC tuner built in), and was surprised by how much I was able to pick up. WYFF and WSPA both come in the 70s, WLOS (which I wasn't expecting to get at all) in the mid-to-high 50s, ETV, WHNS, WASV, and WBSC, along with a couple other random channels. I tried out a Channel Master 3042 amp, which gave the percentages a healthy boost (particularly for WLOS, which leapt up from 56% to 83%), but I couldn't pick up any additional channels, at least not from the quick, scattered testing I did at different orientations. In my neck of the woods, I don't think there's really anything else to pick up.

By the way, I followed up with Charter about the availability of the Moxi DVRs in the Greenville area, and they gave me a mid-October estimate. That's something to look forward to, although their limited HD offerings don't leave much to timeshift. Although the quantity isn't quite up to what I'd like, I've been mostly happy with the quality. I guess the signal coming into my house could use a little beefing up, though -- it's not a pervasive problem, but it seems like almost every night, there's a 5-15 minute chunk that's riddled with dropouts. This is an extreme example, but one Sunday evening, I got bored enough to count audio dropouts/macroblocking, and in the space of 60 seconds, there were 13 dropouts. Other than that, I'll just get some minor periodic pixelation or a barely-noticeable audio dropout. Strange how it's mostly reliable, but when I have problems, it seems heavily concentrated. I guess when I schedule the Moxi delivery, I'll kill two birds and have someone check out the signal.
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post #656 of 10552 Old 10-04-2004, 08:29 PM
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I'm amazed! I live in Simpsonville, and I getting Monday Night Football in HD over the air. I'm using a Radio Shack18-880 set top antenna. The signal has gone from 57-77% all night. This is from my basement! That is the best it has ever been. I get break=up every now and then. I think when cars pass by. Anyway, I thought I would share that with all of you.

John B.

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post #657 of 10552 Old 10-04-2004, 10:43 PM
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I thought I'd give you guys an update to my story. I had my newly bought CM 7775 Pre-Amp, and CM 4221 antenna laid out and ready for the installer. When he arrived he told me that he had just been in a home in Thornblade yesterday, and had installed a Pre-amp for a customer who had the exact same SquareShooter I did. He said it made a lot of difference and he was able to get all of the off-air stations in this area. He suggested that we first try hooking up the Pre-amp to my antenna to see what would happen. I was skeptical, but I figured I had nothing to lose.

So he hooks it up, and I begin doing signal strength tests. I knew I couldn't tell too much at that moment since I get everything including WLOS up until around 7:20pm. What I did notice though was that before the Pre-Amp I was getting low 70's for WASV and WBSC and after the install I was getting 90 for WASV and 88 for WBSC. Since I was already getting upper 80's for WHNS, WLOS, and WYFF along with my usual 91 for WSPA I knew the true test would come later. So I then had him put in an extra line with the understanding that if I saw drop-off at the usual time then we'd go with the Channel Master. Well 7:40pm comes along and WLOS is humming right along at 85 with WYFF and WHNS staying at a steady 89 to 90. Usually by this time of night WLOS is around 11 and WYFF and WHNS is around 30. Needless to say I was surprised and pleased. I monitored the signals throughout the night, and they stayed steady.

What I took away from this and would convey to others is that a quality Pre-Amp can make a lot of difference. To be fair it's very possible that I could be doing even better had I had the 4221 installed and maybe even been able to pull in some Charlotte stations. But since I can get everything I need I'm satisfied. I was able to watch MNF in HD for the first time and that was great.

So I feel like my setup is complete. Thanks to everyone for their input and suggestions.

P.S. Since the CM 4221 was just $28 shipped, I'll probably hang onto it in case someone I know goes HD. But I'll also suggest to them to get a CM Pre-Amp to go with it.

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post #658 of 10552 Old 10-05-2004, 01:20 PM
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Sounds great, I'm glad you got it working. I didn't have any hands-on experience to go by when evaluating your experience. And, hey, the pre-amp was cheaper to get installed than the other antenna, right? And, you're right, the quality of the preamp does make a huge difference. I'm considering adding one myself, now, to see if I can pull in some out of area stations. I've got a 4-way distribution amp I just bought from CM and can't recommend it enough. I have zero signal loss with it, which is quite astounding. Keep us posted!
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post #659 of 10552 Old 10-05-2004, 03:05 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by Adam Tyner
Has anyone pestered them to see what plans they have for broadcasting in HD, if any?

Answering my own question, I e-mailed WASV this morning and received the following response:
Quote:
We're looking into the cost of the equipment right now. There's no set date on when you'll be able to see the programming in HD.

So, that doesn't sound very promising. Maybe if I finagle with things enough, I'll be able to pick up WJZY in Charlotte, although I'm not holding my breath...
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post #660 of 10552 Old 10-05-2004, 04:44 PM
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That is odd that WASV will be the last station in this area, not counting WGGS, to go HD and their sister station, WSPA, was the first. Ironic isn't it?

Question for you walterc, where did you buy your CM 7775 preamp?
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