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post #10621 of 10640 Old 11-10-2014, 06:20 PM
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This just in "mobile HD" is DEAD .............seriously!

So when are WYFF and WHNS going to stop wasting
their bandwidth on "mobile HD" service?

I would seriously DOUBT that ANYONE is receiving
the mobile DTV signal on their now obsolete phones I don't believe any current smart phones are offering this in the USA as of this time.

If the stations close those services they can BOTH add at least one additional sub channel for regular OTA service, which would be a great improvement of their community service obligations.

Has anyone heard from WYFF Chief Engineer Doug Durkee
lately?

We definitely need a decent 24/7 weather channel OTA !
With the upcoming winter season it would be of great help.
Sure we can use the computer to punch up pages of weather
data, but it is nicer to simply change a channel and see
a carousel of specific weather information that changes automatically and have the local forecasters come on live from time to time to update us. It's been years since
NBC Weather PLUS left the airwaves and I still miss it, and I have heard the same from many other viewers in the area.

Last edited by dubber; 11-12-2014 at 09:23 PM.
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post #10622 of 10640 Old 11-10-2014, 06:51 PM
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I don't know if there is any future use for Mobile DTV. But as of now, I don't think it is utilized by most consumers. I too would rather see that signal reallocated to an additional subchannel, or just put the bandwith back into improving the quality of the main HD signal. As far as weather channels, the current choice would likely be Accu-Weather or Weather Nation. As Weather Plus will probably not be returning.
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post #10623 of 10640 Old 11-11-2014, 02:16 PM
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Why waste valuable bandwidth on a weather channel? There are all sorts of very well done internet sites, and apps for smartphones and tablets that will give you all kinds of current weather info pretty much instantaneously. Rather see it go to improve the quality of the main channel which often looks pretty poor.
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post #10624 of 10640 Old 11-12-2014, 08:58 PM
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It look like WYFF done updated their on the air promo annoucement to wyff 4.2 movies instead of this wyff 4.2

but the haven't change over to the Movies yet as they still showing THISTV
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post #10625 of 10640 Old 11-12-2014, 09:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tylerSC View Post
I don't know if there is any future use for Mobile DTV. But as of now, I don't think it is utilized by most consumers. I too would rather see that signal reallocated to an additional sub channel, or just put the bandwith back into improving the quality of the main HD signal. As far as weather channels, the current choice would likely be Accu-Weather or Weather Nation. As Weather Plus will probably not be returning.

Heck I doubt more than a tiny handful of consumers still use mobile DTV. The local affiliates ceased advertising it on their stations several years ago. There are NO mainstream
phones offered today in the USA that offer it. So it
for all intensive purposes is dead.
I have to chuckle at what Doug Durkee claimed more than several years ago , touting Mobile DTV as the next best thing since sliced bread...Bzzzz! Wrong. I told him that was nonsense and it would never pan out. I wish they would bag it NOW,and free up the bandwidth for other sub channels.


If a station opts for Accu Weather or WN they must pay quite a bit for broadcast rights, while using a standalone service would be very inexpensive and a better choice for a our smaller market, the fact that NBC allowed other stations to continue to use the equipment and software engine for
Weather PLUS (only asking that the affiliates stop using the name ) as a standalone product makes good economic sense. Some markets like Des Moines, IA WHO NBC 13 and Charlottesville, VA WVIR NBC29 still use it today and it works fine. The WYFF version of Weather PLUS was excellent, with a good selection of radar maps, current conditions, and other info, and unlike other local stations SuperDoppler 4 radar is updated about every 30 seconds or so which makes it the best in the market. When Weather PLUS was on
I left my 32" set on that channel 24/7. then switched to WHNS 21.2 when Weather PLUS went off the air.

I'm pretty sure that Mobile DTV uses significantly more bandwidth than did Weather PLUS as a standalone product on a subchannel so you would still gain an improved network channel picture quality. The WHNS 21.2 DT uses very little
bandwidth with its 3DRadar channel only updated every 5 minutes or so.

Last edited by dubber; 11-12-2014 at 09:34 PM.
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post #10626 of 10640 Old 11-22-2014, 08:23 AM
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I've got a question for those of you who use the PC based recording methods with Charter... is there any way to derive from the channel maps on the cable card a list of channels that are "SDV"? I was going to go pick up a cable card for my TiVo next week but people on the TiVo forums are complaining that now the Tuning Adapters don't work since the latest TiVo software update. They require a firmware update that won't be available until 2015 to completely work with the Roamios. I'm curious which channels are SDV in our market. I read somewhere that if you look at the channel map on a HDHomeRun that all Charter's SDV channels are listed in the channel map with a frequency of 999MHz.

Can anyone confirm this? I hate to go pick up the card, to find out the handful of channels I'm looking for are missing.
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post #10627 of 10640 Old 11-22-2014, 02:19 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpalmer2k View Post
I've got a question for those of you who use the PC based recording methods with Charter... is there any way to derive from the channel maps on the cable card a list of channels that are "SDV"? I was going to go pick up a cable card for my TiVo next week but people on the TiVo forums are complaining that now the Tuning Adapters don't work since the latest TiVo software update. They require a firmware update that won't be available until 2015 to completely work with the Roamios. I'm curious which channels are SDV in our market. I read somewhere that if you look at the channel map on a HDHomeRun that all Charter's SDV channels are listed in the channel map with a frequency of 999MHz.

Can anyone confirm this? I hate to go pick up the card, to find out the handful of channels I'm looking for are missing.
FWIW, here's Greenville's channel map. Can't make heads or tails of it myself. Don't see 999. Haven't tried running the report with my TA unplugged. I suppose it's possible there's nothing on SDV now.
Spoiler!
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post #10628 of 10640 Old 11-22-2014, 06:20 PM
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Originally Posted by mdavej View Post
FWIW, here's Greenville's channel map. Can't make heads or tails of it myself. Don't see 999. Haven't tried running the report with my TA unplugged. I suppose it's possible there's nothing on SDV now.
Thanks! Would you be willing to run one with the TA unhooked for comparison purposes? Or just a "flip through" with the TA unhooked? I'm really only interested in knowing which of the HD channels (705 & up) might be SDV. I won't watch anything below that.

Based on the channel map you posted I'm theorizing that the super long groups are SDV SD channels, and the banks of HD channels that have 4 listed are SDV... which would be bad for me, because unlike most of Charter's viewers I actually do watch C-SPAN, C-SPAN2 and C-SPAN3 occasionally. Based on my theory those would be SDV channels according to your map.

Last edited by cpalmer2k; 11-22-2014 at 07:24 PM.
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post #10629 of 10640 Old 11-22-2014, 11:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpalmer2k View Post
I was going to go pick up a cable card for my TiVo next week but people on the TiVo forums are complaining that now the Tuning Adapters don't work since the latest TiVo software update. They require a firmware update that won't be available until 2015 to completely work with the Roamios.
I believe you may have misunderstood. Tuning adapters work just fine on TiVos on Charter in the GSP area. Next year TiVo is rolling out support for streaming MPEG-4 channels next year. However, Charter isn't using that type of encoding on any channels yet. I'm using tuning adapters on Roamios and a Series4 with no issues.
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post #10630 of 10640 Old 11-23-2014, 03:29 AM
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Tuning adapter

^^I have a Tivo Premiere with Charter Cable using a cable card and a tuning adapter. The first issue is getting the cable card properly paired to operate the system. You have to get a knowledgeable tech on the phone to properly input the cable card info into the system. This took several attempts. Then the tuning adapter should also function correctly. But I have also had problems since the recent firmware update. The cable channels would not tune, and only the local antenna channels would work. But I went into DVR diagnostics under test tuning adapter, and the cable channels would tune in with adequate signal. A temporary fix, but still problems returned. I then did a system reset and all now functions again. Hopefully the issue is finally fixed. I also use a Gaffney zip code to receive complete channel listings for both GSP and Charlotte antenna channels. Because using the Greenville zip only gave me listings for WBTV, and I receive all of the Dallas signals and sometimes WSOC and WCCB. However, the WSOC translator info is still not listed.
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post #10631 of 10640 Old 11-23-2014, 06:33 AM
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Originally Posted by rrainwater View Post
I believe you may have misunderstood. Tuning adapters work just fine on TiVos on Charter in the GSP area. Next year TiVo is rolling out support for streaming MPEG-4 channels next year. However, Charter isn't using that type of encoding on any channels yet. I'm using tuning adapters on Roamios and a Series4 with no issues.
You're lucky then, you must have an older TA or haven't gotten the latest TiVo software update then. By TiVo and Charter's own admission the recent update has "broken" support for Motorola TA's on TiVo Roamios.

Quote:
Update 9/3/2014:
Every HDHomeRun (and every TiVo, cable STB, etc) contains a unique security certificate used for authentication, similar to how SSL works. These certificates are generated by a third party signing authority.

From what we have been able to determine, if the security certificate is from Jan 2014 or earlier everything works fine...
Cablecard authenticates the device certificate OK.
Cisco TR authenticates the device certificate OK.
Motorola TR authenticates the device certificate OK.

If the security certificate is from May 2014 or later the Motorola TR is unhappy...
Cablecard authenticates the device certificate OK.
Cisco TR authenticates the device certificate OK.
MTR700 TR does not authenticate the device certificate.
and from TiVo

Quote:
Here's the story:

Motorola/ARRIS Tuning Adapters need to be updated to version 1.40 of the firmware, in order to be compatible with current CableLabs device certificates.

We are reaching out to all cable operators to notify them of this issue, and to urge them to update to the latest Arris firmware.

If you are experiencing this issue, you may want to contact your cable operator and request the firmware update. (I don't know which ones are in a position to update right away, but I expect it would be helpful to have a ticket open so they are aware you are in urgent need of the firmware update.) Feel free to share my email (margret@tivo.com) with anyone you contact trying to resolve this. I am happy to provide additional details to your cable operator.

In addition, you may want to send me an email with the subject "<your cable company name> TA firmware 1.4". Include in that email:
- name on your cable company account
- phone number on your cable company account
- email address on your cable company account
- an incident/ticket number if you've opened one with your cable company
- your TiVo TSN

We may be able to forward your info to your cable company as well, with hopes they can target your Tuning Adapter for an early firmware update.

I'm so sorry for all of this trouble!

--Margret
__________________
Margret Schmidt
Vice President, Design & Engineering
Chief Design Officer
TiVo Inc. *
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post #10632 of 10640 Old 11-23-2014, 07:36 AM
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My original tuning adapter stopped working last summer, and they replaced it with a new one in August. All was good until the firmware update in October. If I continue to have problems, I may go see if Charter can replace the tuning adapter with the correct version.
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post #10633 of 10640 Old 11-23-2014, 08:30 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cpalmer2k View Post
Thanks! Would you be willing to run one with the TA unhooked for comparison purposes? Or just a "flip through" with the TA unhooked? I'm really only interested in knowing which of the HD channels (705 & up) might be SDV. I won't watch anything below that.

Based on the channel map you posted I'm theorizing that the super long groups are SDV SD channels, and the banks of HD channels that have 4 listed are SDV... which would be bad for me, because unlike most of Charter's viewers I actually do watch C-SPAN, C-SPAN2 and C-SPAN3 occasionally. Based on my theory those would be SDV channels according to your map.
Couldn't get my report to run with the TA unplugged. But I did flip through all the HD channels, and none were missing except a few Spanish channels. Caveat is I've deleted all shopping and religious channels from my system and only have Digital Tier 1 (not 2). Last time I flipped through all channels with no TA, I was only missing about 20 SD channels and a few premiums.

My test isn't a guarantee since someone else in my neighborhood could be watching a few SDV channels, allowing me to still get them without a TA resolve. But it should be close.

The groups of 4 are simply premiums on multiple channels, like HBO on 501 and 895. The really big group is Music Choice. The other large groups are SD, only some of which are SDV.

Plugging my TA back in now. Gotta record a few things.
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post #10634 of 10640 Old Yesterday, 10:56 AM
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Originally Posted by dubber View Post
So when are WYFF and WHNS going to stop wasting
their bandwidth on "mobile HD" service?

I would seriously DOUBT that ANYONE is receiving
the mobile DTV signal on their now obsolete phones I don't believe any current smart phones are offering this in the USA as of this time.
Yes, the number of viewers of mobile DTV are few. But we have removed encryption so the older mobile receivers that were obsoleted due to encryption work once again.
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post #10635 of 10640 Old Yesterday, 11:01 AM
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Originally Posted by harrys11 View Post
Why waste valuable bandwidth on a weather channel? There are all sorts of very well done internet sites, and apps for smartphones and tablets that will give you all kinds of current weather info pretty much instantaneously. Rather see it go to improve the quality of the main channel which often looks pretty poor.
Do you really think the quality of our (WYFF) OTA video is poor? Compared to what? Yes, bandwidth is important but so is the quality of the encoder. Newer encoding techniques provide the same or better quality with less bandwidth than older encoders.
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post #10636 of 10640 Old Yesterday, 11:02 AM
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Originally Posted by LMckin View Post
It look like WYFF done updated their on the air promo annoucement to wyff 4.2 movies instead of this wyff 4.2

but the haven't change over to the Movies yet as they still showing THISTV
Movies! coming 12/31
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post #10637 of 10640 Old Yesterday, 11:06 AM
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I have to chuckle at what Doug Durkee claimed more than several years ago , touting Mobile DTV as the next best thing since sliced bread.
Did I really? Don't recall being that enthusiastic about mobile. Mobile was too little, too late. They are working on ATSC 3.0 which will change everything. 4K, mobile, data, etc. Don't hold your breath though.
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post #10638 of 10640 Old Yesterday, 03:39 PM
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Originally Posted by douglasd5 View Post
Did I really? Don't recall being that enthusiastic about mobile. Mobile was too little, too late. They are working on ATSC 3.0 which will change everything. 4K, mobile, data, etc. Don't hold your breath though.
Since the broadcasters have not yet upgraded to 4K, I am not sure it is necessary to upgrade to an expensive UHD TV that they are currently pushing in all the stores. And the so called "upconversion" may actually look worse instead of better. IMO, the best bargains are the remaining Samsung plasmas. The 51F4500 is now $379 and is a very nice basic TV for local antenna or cable HD viewing, despite being 720p. And the 60F5300 1080p model is now $699. Very good picture quality and the best bang for the buck. Too many of the LEDs are overpriced and have quality issues.
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post #10639 of 10640 Old Yesterday, 03:48 PM
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Originally Posted by douglasd5 View Post
Do you really think the quality of our (WYFF) OTA video is poor? Compared to what? Yes, bandwidth is important but so is the quality of the encoder. Newer encoding techniques provide the same or better quality with less bandwidth than older encoders.
WYFF video quality is very good, and I think the 1080i stations look a bit sharper. And the newer advanced encoders seem to make the multicasting of subchannels look better.
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post #10640 of 10640 Old Yesterday, 09:08 PM
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Originally Posted by cpalmer2k View Post
You're lucky then, you must have an older TA or haven't gotten the latest TiVo software update then. By TiVo and Charter's own admission the recent update has "broken" support for Motorola TA's on TiVo Roamios.
I'm running 20.4.5.c with no issues with my tuning adapters.
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