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post #271 of 1760 Old 06-16-2006, 05:35 AM
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Is CMU's station in Kalkaska doing anything in HD yet, or are they still just showing their regular SD feed on a sub channel?

Hope to setup a digital tuner for some friends at their cottage next month and just wonder what new they will be able to see (they currently can't get any of CMU's analog stations, so even the SD feed with be a new station for them).

Thanks in advance,
Mark
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post #272 of 1760 Old 06-16-2006, 05:43 AM
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Still SD as of now, spoke to someone there and they hope to have a HD signal up this summer, waiting for one more part I guess, Funny cause when I was in Charter about two weeks ago they said CMU will probaly never get HD due to lack of money and that ABC should be going HD at any minute they said, ya right. Cross fingues, would love to watch Austin City Limits in HD if it is in HD
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post #273 of 1760 Old 06-16-2006, 06:09 AM
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tvb6171, thanks. I think some of the newer Austin City Limits shows are in HD. PBS has some great HD programs. I've recorded many on my D-VHS deck this past 4 months so I can watch them again later. Hope CMU can get it running, you folks will really like it!
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post #274 of 1760 Old 06-16-2006, 10:00 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvb6171 View Post

Still SD as of now, spoke to someone there and they hope to have a HD signal up this summer, waiting for one more part I guess, Funny cause when I was in Charter about two weeks ago they said CMU will probaly never get HD due to lack of money and that ABC should be going HD at any minute they said, ya right. Cross fingues, would love to watch Austin City Limits in HD if it is in HD

Charter has been claiming ABCHD will be offered in HD "any day now" for about 6 months..

Sure will be nice when it happens, but Im not very optimistic about it anymore..

Hey how about ESPN2HD Charter? Da
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post #275 of 1760 Old 06-20-2006, 08:22 AM
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The problems Guffy1 says they have with CBS HD must be through Charter. I pick them up off air, and have no problems with pixellation at all. It is an absolute crystal clear signal. Same with WPBN-HD. My only problem with WPBN is that it is sometimes 8:15pm or later before anybody "flips the switch" to HD.
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post #276 of 1760 Old 06-22-2006, 01:32 PM
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Do you know for certain that WPBN broadcasts an HD picture? The sister station (7 & 4) WTOM simply sends out a stretched version of the SD picture and they don't multicast. WTOM's picture may be digital but it is definitely not high definition. I always thought that channel 4 was a satellite of channel 7 and that everything was duplicated but this is apparently not true. Channel four's picture is very hard to watch as 1) the picture is a full stretch with obvious distorted ratios and 2) because a portion of the picture is cut off. Scores at the top of the screen during ball games are out of frame and cut off with their stretch and are typical examples of this bad stretch process. The full stretch is bad enough but when then don't have enough technical competence to scale the picture to fit the frame then I have to wonder if they can walk and chew gum at the same time. I know that Raycom neglected 7&4 as their pockets were empty but hopefully the new ownership will improve the technical aspects of the service. If you are indeed receiving an HD broadcast (I know diminished by multicasting) then I would interested in confirmation of this.
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post #277 of 1760 Old 06-22-2006, 02:00 PM
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Originally Posted by ogre5697 View Post

Do you know for certain that WPBN broadcasts an HD picture? The sister station (7 & 4) WTOM simply sends out a stretched version of the SD picture and they don't multicast. WTOM's picture may be digital but it is definitely not high definition. I always thought that channel 4 was a satellite of channel 7 and that everything was duplicated but this is apparently not true. Channel four's picture is very hard to watch as 1) the picture is a full stretch with obvious distorted ratios and 2) because a portion of the picture is cut off. Scores at the top of the screen during ball games are out of frame and cut off with their stretch and are typical examples of this bad stretch process. The full stretch is bad enough but when then don't have enough technical competence to scale the picture to fit the frame then I have to wonder if they can walk and chew gum at the same time. I know that Raycom neglected 7&4 as their pockets were empty but hopefully the new ownership will improve the technical aspects of the service. If you are indeed receiving an HD broadcast (I know diminished by multicasting) then I would interested in confirmation of this.

WPBN does HD without question...Its really crappy HD with the 2 sub channels, but its HD..
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post #278 of 1760 Old 06-23-2006, 04:36 AM
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Again, I think your problems with WPBN-DT are issues with Charter. I get them off air, with a very clean signal and actually very good HD. Two standard defintion subchannels do not degrade an HD subchannel. There is plenty of bandwith on a broadcast signal. An HD subchannel could cause a problem.
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post #279 of 1760 Old 06-23-2006, 01:28 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SonyLCD View Post

Again, I think your problems with WPBN-DT are issues with Charter. I get them off air, with a very clean signal and actually very good HD. Two standard defintion subchannels do not degrade an HD subchannel. There is plenty of bandwith on a broadcast signal. An HD subchannel could cause a problem.

SD subchannels dont hurt the PQ of an HD channel?...Now thats amusing...

The fact is, one SD subchannel can and will significantly degrade an HD channel...2 SD subchannels will unquestionably degrade an HD channel.. That is just blatantly bad information you are passing out..

I get WPBN OTA and via Charter. OTA may have a tiny edge, but both feature pixelation, macroblocking, and motion artifacting on a daily basis...

This is caused by the sub channels, without question.. And it was not happening, ever, before those subchannels were added..
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post #280 of 1760 Old 06-28-2006, 05:17 AM
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Whoa, Guffy, I understand that you have a problem with multi-casting from your previous posts, but save your sarcasm. We are on the same team here. Your ire would better be directed at the two stations in the market (ABC and FOX) that make no attempt whatsoever at broadcasting HD, than for picking on NBC who does it with subchannels. You have some sort of problem with your receiver or your television or Charter. I watch over the air HD TV nearly every single night, and do not have any problems with pixellation or motion artifacts on either CBS or NBC. I will grant you, a SECOND SD subchannel could indeed cause a problem on certain types of broadcasts, i.e. sports with quick camera movements and picture changes. Perhaps they may want to shut down one of the their subchannels when they begin Sunday Night Football. However, for the majority of the prime time programming that 7 & 4 broadcasts, there are no issues with my television, and I am picking the signal up a long ways from the transmit site. I give them credit, as they invested A LOT of money in putting a digital signal on the air, and I don't blame them for trying to recoup some of that money with additional channels. Again, if you are going to get upset, get upset with Fox 33, who will again be broadcasting the lions in SD this fall, with no real plans to upgrade. Or 29 & 8, who can't ante up the money to put a few microwave hops between TC and Kalkaska.
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post #281 of 1760 Old 06-28-2006, 07:20 AM
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so are the artifacts coming from charter then? I see them real bad on both cbs and nbc through moxi
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post #282 of 1760 Old 06-28-2006, 11:20 AM
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Wow. Today is the first time I have accessed this site in a few months, and from what I see, is most discouraging. I was hoping to start getting HD from Charter in September, but after reading the last several posts, I am beginning to have second thoughts. My location pretty much prevents me from purchasing/using my own antenna for any kind of HD reception, so Charter or satellite are my only choices. I am getting tired of waiting, but I refuse to spend money on an inferior service.

Dang!

Mike

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post #283 of 1760 Old 06-28-2006, 12:32 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SonyLCD View Post

Whoa, Guffy, I understand that you have a problem with multi-casting from your previous posts, but save your sarcasm. We are on the same team here. Your ire would better be directed at the two stations in the market (ABC and FOX) that make no attempt whatsoever at broadcasting HD, than for picking on NBC who does it with subchannels. You have some sort of problem with your receiver or your television or Charter. I watch over the air HD TV nearly every single night, and do not have any problems with pixellation or motion artifacts on either CBS or NBC. I will grant you, a SECOND SD subchannel could indeed cause a problem on certain types of broadcasts, i.e. sports with quick camera movements and picture changes. Perhaps they may want to shut down one of the their subchannels when they begin Sunday Night Football. However, for the majority of the prime time programming that 7 & 4 broadcasts, there are no issues with my television, and I am picking the signal up a long ways from the transmit site. I give them credit, as they invested A LOT of money in putting a digital signal on the air, and I don't blame them for trying to recoup some of that money with additional channels. Again, if you are going to get upset, get upset with Fox 33, who will again be broadcasting the lions in SD this fall, with no real plans to upgrade. Or 29 & 8, who can't ante up the money to put a few microwave hops between TC and Kalkaska.

No one is mad..Just stating the facts,thats all..

Ive never seen an HD setup via OTA or Charter that didnt pixelate and artifact via WPBNHD..Seen at least a half dozen WPBN HD OTA setups in this area, they all pixelate exactly the same, even on simple shows like The Office you can see pixelation during a fast scene transition..

Bottom line, you simply dont know what youre looking for..

Anyone with any knowledge of the industry knows that 2 SD subchannels sharing the bandwith of an HD channel will cause pixelation and artifacting without fail..

Anyone with knowledge of the industry also understands that Joe Six Pack will not see or recognize the problems for what they are. Joe Six Pack will swear on his mothers grave that he dosent see the problem, and that the problem dosent exist..

Welcome to the forums Joe
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post #284 of 1760 Old 06-29-2006, 06:22 AM
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Anyone have any opinions on picture quality of Dishnetwork HD? how does it compare to Charter? was thinking of jumping ship to Dishnetworks PVR. Im hooked on HD, and Moxis 80 gig is not doing it anymore.
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post #285 of 1760 Old 07-01-2006, 05:55 AM
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Originally Posted by tvb6171 View Post

Anyone have any opinions on picture quality of Dishnetwork HD? how does it compare to Charter? was thinking of jumping ship to Dishnetworks PVR. Im hooked on HD, and Moxis 80 gig is not doing it anymore.

I've had DISH HD for about 5 days now..I consider the HD PQ to be slightly better than Charter.. Less pixelation and a slightly better over PQ is how i see it..

Keep in mind that all the Voom channels are downrezzed HDLite, but they look excellent to me..WAY better than any HDLite I've seen from Directv..

Also keep in mind that the 129 satellite(this satellite carries all their new HD channels and the Voom channels) has issues and you will get low signals on that satellite across the board..Currently Im getting signals in the low 60's to low 70's on that bird, and when theres clouds or rain I lose another 10 points across the board..So far it hasn't been a problem at all, haven't lost signal once..

If it proves to be a problem I will be installing a 2nd dish to point exclusively at 129, and Im sure this will take care of it..

If you have any other DISH questions let me know and Im sure I can help

If you would want to come to my house (off Zimmerman Road) and see the quality of the HD for yourself let me know in a private message..
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post #286 of 1760 Old 07-04-2006, 01:53 PM
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Hey, has everyone here heard the news that Fox Sports Detroit is going HD starting July 14th?

Great news, but who wants to start a pool to guess how many years it takes Charter of West Michigan to pick up FSD-HD?

1 year? 2 years? Half a decade? Never?

I say it will be at least 2 years for these knuckleheads to add it to the lineup
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post #287 of 1760 Old 07-05-2006, 07:27 AM
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Thanks guffy1 for the invitation but I have decided to dump the Moxi, not going to get Dish either, I ordered a HD DVD player on Saturday, should be here Thursday. Think I'm just going to do the local channels in HD here and watch movies on HD DVD player, just hope they get more movies out soon. Im getting the movies from Netflix. Also for those of you waiting, I just talked to a engineer at WCMU(the best station for help on HD) and they said we should defintally see PBS in HD this fall. Awesome.
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post #288 of 1760 Old 07-05-2006, 07:36 AM
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Originally Posted by tvb6171 View Post

Thanks guffy1 for the invitation but I have decided to dump the Moxi, not going to get Dish either, I ordered a HD DVD player on Saturday, should be here Thursday. Think I'm just going to do the local channels in HD here and watch movies on HD DVD player, just hope they get more movies out soon. Im getting the movies from Netflix. Also for those of you waiting, I just talked to a engineer at WCMU(the best station for help on HD) and they said we should defintally see PBS in HD this fall. Awesome.

Youll be more than happy with that HDDVD player as long as you have an HDMI connection..I had one for a few weeks and it was absolutely the best HD ever..The upconversion of SD movies via the HD DVD players is outstanding also..

I did return the unit because I was extremely unhappy with the amount of time Netflix was taking to deliver HD movies (4 to 6 business days in most cases)..

I was also dissapointed in the lack of 1080p support..Im hoping they come out with a 1080p player real soon..

This fall Im going to buy another HD DVD player and see if Netflix has gotten any better on delivery of HD DVD titles..
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post #289 of 1760 Old 07-11-2006, 06:42 AM
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Report from the Higgins Lake area:

Last weekend I was up to Higgins Lake, and installed a old Samsung SIR-TS160 receiver in some friends cottage. They are located about a quarter of a mile off the southwest side of the lake, with a lot of trees and hills around them. The antennas I have installed there in the past are a 10 element yagi for channel 9 pointed at WWTV, and a Channel Master 4221 four "bowtie" UHF antenna pointed at WGTU. The channel 9 yagi does also pick up WPBN's analog signal on channel 7, but there is a little bit of snow on it.

They had added a VCR/DVD player since the last time I worked on their system and with me adding a DTV receiver, I decided to add a distribution amp so channel 7 analog would not get any worse. With the distribution amp in line the SIR-TS160 picked up WCMV-DT at 100%, but WGTU-DT was only jumping from 0 to 30% and was unwatchable, with the picture locking up all the time from signal dropouts. From that I have to guess that WGTU-DT is not running at full power, being they are on the same tower as WCMV-DT. With the UHF antenna pointed at WGTU/WCMV-DT I was unable to pickup either WWTV-DT or WPBN-DT.

For now they are happy to be getting the PBS feeds from WCMV-DT and the old analogs from 7,9, & 29. From their cottage they have never been able to pick up CMU's analog station near Cadillac, and sometimes they could see CMU's channel 6 in Alpena good enough to watch, but with a lot of snow. They have never been able to pick up the FOX station out of Cadillac either, so if the FOX digital station ever gets going and moves to WGTU's tower they should be able to get that one also.
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post #290 of 1760 Old 07-11-2006, 07:58 AM
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Dont hold your breath on FOX, here in Interlochen can only pick up PBS and NBC, not a blip from ABC or CBS
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post #291 of 1760 Old 07-25-2006, 04:03 PM
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Being on the east side of the tip of the mitt, I get some of my stations from the UP. I get channel 10 (TV 9 & 10) out of the Soo as well as channel 8 (ABC 29 & 8). Recently ABC channel 8 has had a deplorable record. The audio most of the time can't be heard over the hum and this is when the station stays on the air. Further, PBS channel 6 out of Alpena has gone south. Recently the picture quality of channel 6 has not been the best but more important to me is that 57.2 (6.2) and 57.3 (6.3) have been less than stellar when they are available and on the air. The mapping for me has never been right for 57.1 (6.1) even though Central Michigan PBS does not broadcast the HDTV feeds. The mapping really confuses my STB. I am wondering if anyone else can confirm my observations or if anyone can confirm similar situations on the parent Traverse City or Mt. Pleasant stations.
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post #292 of 1760 Old 07-28-2006, 06:15 AM
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well went to FOX33 web site, scroll to the bottom and it looks like we here in Traverse area will be getting FOX in digital this fall, from the same site as ABC and PBS, this cant be happening.Just hope they do HD and the Lions in HD, crossing fingures.looks like they will be doing 500 watts too, which should be good and stong
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post #293 of 1760 Old 07-31-2006, 12:15 PM
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was pulling in WBAY from Green Bay here in Interlochen for a while
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post #294 of 1760 Old 08-01-2006, 12:09 PM
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I would have to think that our FOX network is nowhere near getting HD up and running as of now--and that's assuming they ever do. Anybody hear anything new on ABC hitting HD?
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post #295 of 1760 Old 08-05-2006, 11:13 AM
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Sorry if this is off topic. I am considering purchasing an LCD TV with NTSC/ATSC/QAM receivers. Will I be able to pick up any HD programming from my Charter expanded basic package? I do not have digital service.

Thanks.
Mike

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post #296 of 1760 Old 08-05-2006, 04:44 PM
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On my LG 3100 that has QAM I recieve 7&4 with both sub channels and 9&10 and they have no sub channels, I also get all of the music channels, and boomerang but no sound from boomerang(wierd) along with I think its CNN World or something like that but again no sound. I just got my new Channel Master 4228 and I'm now able to pick up ABC WGTU, and WBAY out of Green Bay but not on a regular basis. Still no CBS tho, can almost lock on to Green Bays CBS and NBC and PBS.
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post #297 of 1760 Old 08-08-2006, 07:38 AM
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well things might get better for all of us having problems with receiving some stations around here, I talked to ABC, FOX, and CBS, sounds like ABC may be going HD this fall, and FOX may, she wasn't sure tho, and CBS will be raising the heighth and power of there antenna Oct first, so maybe i will finally will be able to get CBS. Kinda sound's like October is the magic month for things to get better, also ask ABC about power and she wasn't sure either, hopefully they bump there power up a little.
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post #298 of 1760 Old 08-08-2006, 07:58 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tvb6171 View Post

well things might get better for all of us having problems with receiving some stations around here, I talked to ABC, FOX, and CBS, sounds like ABC may be going HD this fall, and FOX may, she wasn't sure tho, and CBS will be raising the heighth and power of there antenna Oct first, so maybe i will finally will be able to get CBS. Kinda sound's like October is the magic month for things to get better, also ask ABC about power and she wasn't sure either, hopefully they bump there power up a little.

Awesome news about CBS, as Ive never been able to lock in here off Zimmerman RD in TC..

As far as ABC and FOX going HD, Im not going to get too excited about that just yet..

ABC has promising HD for close to a year now..

FOX Im sure will drag their feet for at least a year now that they are finally hinting towards maybe doing it..
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post #299 of 1760 Old 08-08-2006, 08:12 AM
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ya I'm here in the deep woods of Interlochen and my receiver can see CBS but not lock on, so hopefully that will help, the lady at FOX was asking someone else the questions I had, when I asked about FOX doing any HD she said hopefully, so dont know what that means, and thats basically what ABC said too, altho she sounded a little more promising. PBS said that we would be seeing them in HD this fall.
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post #300 of 1760 Old 08-08-2006, 03:25 PM
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WWTV increasing power? Someone in the Grand Rapids thread just said that WWTV was increasing power and raising the height of their tower? That might be great news for me because I am 67 miles out and sometimes I can pick up WWTV if I turn my rotor in that direction. WWMT is only 40+ miles but they are dreadful and currently have their HD signal off. If anyone know when this change with WWTV is going down please let me know.

P.S. when I turned my rotor to the north tonight I picked up Digital 56 and it appears to be PBS. What channel is that and what city?

EDIT: I guess I should read up a little further...
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