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post #14131 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 10:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TPeterson View Post
Chuck, aiui, they haven't even acknowledged that there IS a problem. They're too incompetent to check the transport stream for missing packets. There'll be no solution found while they're in denial.


Francis said that he has seen the problem and that he upgraded the encoder software. Maybe others at the station are in denial. I don't know.

Chuck
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post #14132 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 12:54 PM
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I exchanged e-mails with Francis and he said, "We had a changeover switch that induced the tiling. Should be good from 10am this morning."

I don't know what that means. Has there been any recent problems?

Chuck
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post #14133 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 01:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calaveras View Post
I exchanged e-mails with Francis and he said, "We had a changeover switch that induced the tiling. Should be good from 10am this morning."

I don't know what that means. Has there been any recent problems?

Chuck
Toast0's graph for RF 12 showed the Utilization dropping from 99 to as low as 98.067 starting at ~ 8:34 AM.

RF 49 is at 99 %. Both are higher than most stations, dropping down to 96-97 range I would suggest.

SHF
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post #14134 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 02:02 PM
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30 Minute test showed only 38 sequence errors, not clean but low enough to be acceptable.

SHF
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post #14135 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 03:57 PM
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Thumbs up 15 minutes of no A/V breakups on KNTV

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Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
30 Minute test showed only 38 sequence errors, not clean but low enough to be acceptable.

SHF


Started watching some NASCAR Sprint race 15 minutes ago and so far, all is good. What is "tiling" ?
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post #14136 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 04:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calaveras View Post
Francis said that he has seen the problem and that he upgraded the encoder software. Maybe others at the station are in denial. I don't know.

Chuck


KNTV has over 120 reviews on Yelp and rated one star: https://www.yelp.com/biz/nbc-kntv-sa...-san-francisco
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post #14137 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 06:01 PM
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Originally Posted by PeninsulaMark View Post
Started watching some NASCAR Sprint race 15 minutes ago and so far, all is good. What is "tiling" ?
Looks clean to me also, over 200 laps.

Google "Video Tiling"

Maybe they got the capability of watching several streams at the same time on one display. Maybe they are starting to watch what they are sending out.

SHF
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post #14138 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 06:28 PM
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Video tiling

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Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
Looks clean to me also, over 200 laps.

Google "Video Tiling"



EXAMPLE: http://support.brighthouse.com/Artic...s-Tiling-3500/
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post #14139 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 06:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calaveras View Post
I exchanged e-mails with Francis and he said, "We had a changeover switch that induced the tiling. Should be good from 10am this morning."

I don't know what that means. Has there been any recent problems?

Chuck


The problems were much more than just tiling.
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post #14140 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 06:47 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PeninsulaMark View Post

I misread that as "tilting." No wonder it made no sense. Still this is the first time I've heard it called tiling.

Chuck
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post #14141 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 06:54 PM
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Originally Posted by PeninsulaMark View Post
KNTV has over 120 reviews on Yelp and rated one star: https://www.yelp.com/biz/nbc-kntv-sa...-san-francisco

I read some of the posts. They seem a bit harsh. KNTV isn't that hard to receive. A lot of those reviewers had indoor antennas, probably UHF only antennas. They need to come over here so we can set them straight.

I still think a lot of people believe OTA is like cell phones, a built-in antenna is good enough. They don't realize the system was never designed for small indoor antennas. An average antenna outdoors at 30' was the assumed standard. Most people would have no problems if they had that for an antenna.

Chuck

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post #14142 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 07:04 PM
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Wink

Quote:
Originally Posted by Calaveras View Post
I misread that as "tilting." No wonder it made no sense. Still this is the first time I've heard it called tiling.

Chuck


When KNTV was problematic, the only thing the picture did not do was tilt!
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post #14143 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 08:45 PM
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KNTV is still not as good as it should be

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Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
Looks clean to me also, over 200 laps.

Google "Video Tiling"

Maybe they got the capability of watching several streams at the same time on one display. Maybe they are starting to watch what they are sending out.

SHF


Dr. Fischer:

KNTV is not 100%. There is mild rare intermittent tiling and video fractures mid-screen, but no audio disruptions. So it's only 92.6% better.
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post #14144 of 14233 Old 09-04-2016, 10:52 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
P.S. Is there anyone who has good reception for RF 2 KQRO-LD VC 45 that can check it ever so often, Toast0's chart shows it was off the air for about a week.
I see the transmitter on the air today (09-04-16) but no signal lock here
Your prayers have been answered...
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post #14145 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 12:18 AM
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Originally Posted by SFischer1> Is there anyone who has good reception for RF 2 KQRO-LD VC 45 that can check it ever so often, Toast0's chart shows it was off the air for about a week.
Keith told me that he was having problems with KQRO RF2 interfering with KFTY RF2 when the conditions were better than normal a few weeks ago. KKPM 28 at Sutter Buttes gets its signal from KFTY and then feeds stations in Chino and Redding. He had to turn KQRO off to stop the interference until he put an antenna with a narrower beam up at KKPM. Once he got the new antenna installed, KQRO was turned back on.

A little side note here that you all might find interesting. Keith's stations originate from his control center in Santa Rosa that feeds KFTY on Mt. St. Helena. As mentioned above, KKPM gets it's feed from KFTY and that feeds the stations in Chico and Redding. KTVJ 12 (RF 4) on Mt. Tamalpais also gets its feed from KFTY and KQRO 45 (RF 2) on Mt. Chual gets its feed from KTVJ. K03HY has not been on the air for the past few months, but when it comes back on it will also get its feed from KTVJ.

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post #14146 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 07:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Larry Kenney View Post
... K03HY has not been on the air for the past few months, but when it comes back on it will also get its feed from KTVJ.

Larry
It's consuming a little power now:

http://ruka.org/~toast/atscdata/chart.php?c=2
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post #14147 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 08:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Kenney View Post
KA little side note here that you all might find interesting. Keith's stations originate from his control center in Santa Rosa that feeds KFTY on Mt. St. Helena. As mentioned above, KKPM gets it's feed from KFTY and that feeds the stations in Chico and Redding. KTVJ 12 (RF 4) on Mt. Tamalpais also gets its feed from KFTY and KQRO 45 (RF 2) on Mt. Chual gets its feed from KTVJ. K03HY has not been on the air for the past few months, but when it comes back on it will also get its feed from KTVJ.

TiVo made a major change to my channel line-up deleting all the Salinas channels and adding a bunch of stations from Sacramento north, most of which I can't receive. It added 5 of Keith's stations; K03HY, KFTY, KTVJ, K02QX and K16IW (Redding). How Redding got in there I don't know. They have complete program guide info for .1 - .8 so 40 listings got added to my program guide! I deleted them all except KTVJ which is the strongest of the two I can receive.

Chuck
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post #14148 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 09:05 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
It's consuming a little power now:

http://ruka.org/~toast/atscdata/chart.php?c=2
Not sure what you mean by this. K03HY sure isn't consuming any power as the transmitter is off the air.

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post #14149 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 09:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Calaveras View Post
TiVo made a major change to my channel line-up deleting all the Salinas channels and adding a bunch of stations from Sacramento north, most of which I can't receive. It added 5 of Keith's stations; K03HY, KFTY, KTVJ, K02QX and K16IW (Redding). How Redding got in there I don't know. They have complete program guide info for .1 - .8 so 40 listings got added to my program guide! I deleted them all except KTVJ which is the strongest of the two I can receive.

Chuck
Wow! Looks like I'll never own a TiVo! Any receiver that removes channels from my scanned list on its own is not for me. I always "Add Digital Channels" and never do a full scan so that the list in my TV is a list of every station I've ever received. Stations can come and go, but unless they're in your list already you'll never see them.

It's interesting that the TiVo is adding stations that you can't receive. K03HY hasn't been on the air in months.

Larry
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post #14150 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 09:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Kenney View Post
Not sure what you mean by this. K03HY sure isn't consuming any power as the transmitter is off the air.
Not according to Toast0's antenna, HDHR and the software he wrote.

Here are the empty streams listed:

Time Streams
2016-09-05 00:31:11 PDT


1: 45.1 KQRO-LD (no data)
2: 45.2 BHTV (no data)
3: 45.3 DCTV (no data)
4: 45.4 VMTV (no data)
5: 45.5 GodTV (no data)
6: 45.6 Daystar (no data)
7: 45.7 AUN (no data)
8: 45.8 NBTV (no data)
9: 45.9 TheWalk (no data)
10: 45.10 AlmaVis (no data)
tsid=0x247B



It was on for ~ 12 hours with data but then at midnight the above (no data) appeared.

Sorry for the bad quoting, My original question was about KQRO-LD. I cannot receive it but Toast0 can. Switching the call letters to a list of ones that few are interested in if they cannot receive them is bad pool.

It seems to come and go. Is it remote controlled? It's a long drive from Santa Rosa and the final part is on a bad dirt road AFAIK.

SHF

Last edited by SFischer1; 09-05-2016 at 09:38 AM.
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post #14151 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 11:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Kenney View Post
Wow! Looks like I'll never own a TiVo! Any receiver that removes channels from my scanned list on its own is not for me. I always "Add Digital Channels" and never do a full scan so that the list in my TV is a list of every station I've ever received. Stations can come and go, but unless they're in your list already you'll never see them.

I need to clarify. TiVo gets stations in 2 ways. The main way is that it is based on the zip code you enter. The stations in that list are supposed to be based on what can be received in that zip code no matter where they come from..... sort of like a generic TV fool list. Those stations have complete guide information. In order to get stations from the Scaramento, SF and Monterey markets I tricked it by using the zip code for the Mt. Hamilton post office. That worked pretty well but it didn't get everything. The 2nd way TiVo gets stations is for you to scan. Any stations it finds not already in the zip code based list are added to the overall list. There is no guide information for these stations. You can point your antenna in different directions to add more scanned stations.

What happened is that TiVo modified the zip code based list, deleting Salinas, adding a few SF market stations and a bunch of LP Sacramento market stations. Stations that I scanned in were not deleted. I pointed the antenna to Salinas and recovered some of the deleted stations.

The only issue I ran into was that the zip code list has KUNO VC 8 / RC 8 which doesn't exist according to the FCC. This prevented KSBW 8.1 from being added to the scanned list. KSBW 8.2 and 8.3 are in the scanned list.

Interestingly they added KAHC but with VC 45. They haven't got the word yet that they've changed to VC 43.

This is the first time I've seen Keith's stations to be listed with complete guide information for the sub channels.

Chuck
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post #14152 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 12:24 PM
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Originally Posted by Calaveras View Post
I need to clarify. TiVo gets stations in 2 ways. The main way is that it is based on the zip code you enter. The stations in that list are supposed to be based on what can be received in that zip code no matter where they come from..... sort of like a generic TV fool list. Those stations have complete guide information. In order to get stations from the Scaramento, SF and Monterey markets I tricked it by using the zip code for the Mt. Hamilton post office. That worked pretty well but it didn't get everything. The 2nd way TiVo gets stations is for you to scan. Any stations it finds not already in the zip code based list are added to the overall list. There is no guide information for these stations. You can point your antenna in different directions to add more scanned stations.

What happened is that TiVo modified the zip code based list, deleting Salinas, adding a few SF market stations and a bunch of LP Sacramento market stations. Stations that I scanned in were not deleted. I pointed the antenna to Salinas and recovered some of the deleted stations.

The only issue I ran into was that the zip code list has KUNO VC 8 / RC 8 which doesn't exist according to the FCC. This prevented KSBW 8.1 from being added to the scanned list. KSBW 8.2 and 8.3 are in the scanned list.

Interestingly they added KAHC but with VC 45. They haven't got the word yet that they've changed to VC 43.

This is the first time I've seen Keith's stations to be listed with complete guide information for the sub channels.

Chuck
It sounds like you may be a victim of the Gracenote to Rovi guide data transition, it's been causing problems for a number of people. TiVo's contract expired recently and was not renewed, meanwhile, TiVo was purchased/merged with Rovi and just recently there's been a transition to using Rovi guide data instead of Gracenote. It hasn't gone smoothly for all subscribers.

You can read more and find a link to ask for guide data corrections in the below link,
http://www.tivocommunity.com/tivo-vb...d.php?t=542760

Guide data corrections,
https://www.tivo.com/lineup.html

A TiVo employee has been active in the thread helping individuals get their guide data corrected.
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post #14153 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 06:10 PM
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Guide data corrections,
https://www.tivo.com/lineup.html

A TiVo employee has been active in the thread helping individuals get their guide data corrected.

Thanks! I filed a report.

Most of my issues are not covered in their standard error list.

Here's a few weird ones:

K16IW is in the Redding DMA but is placed in the Sacramento DMA.
KSTV is an old analog station no longer on the air.
MCAET Channel 59 - No normal call sign so no idea what this was but MCAET is being carried on K38JP 38.1 in Salinas.

Chuck

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post #14154 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 07:36 PM
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...
MCAET Channel 59 - No normal call sign so no idea what this was but MCAET is being carried on K38JP 38.1 in Salinas.

Chuck
Monterey County Office of Education
http://www.monterey.k12.ca.us/progra...es/mcaet/index

Other non-normal call signs

PROGRAM 1: 1.1 WhatsOn
PROGRAM 3: 65.1 ION
PROGRAM 1: 38.1 SBN

And the list goes on and on.

Could 59 be a very very old Analog channel?

SHF

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post #14155 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 07:48 PM
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45.1 kqro-ld

I get it now, KQRO-LD is just like KGO VC 7 RF 35, if the input is lost the utilization goes to zero.

SHF
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post #14156 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 09:27 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
Monterey County Office of Education
http://www.monterey.k12.ca.us/progra...es/mcaet/index

Other non-normal call signs

PROGRAM 1: 1.1 WhatsOn
PROGRAM 3: 65.1 ION
PROGRAM 1: 38.1 SBN

And the list goes on and on.

Could 59 be a very very old Analog channel?

SHF

Well, actually those are network names, not call signs. When I say call sign I mean the one issued by the FCC and used to identify the station.

I'm not aware of any station ever using channel 59 in northern California but I suppose it could be. There was no call sign associated with it and no RF channel number.

Chuck
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I get it now, KQRO-LD is just like KGO VC 7 RF 35, if the input is lost the utilization goes to zero.

SHF
That's correct. If one station in the chain has a problem it messes up all of the stations down the line after that.

If KFTY on Mt. St. Helena goes out, the entire chain of stations go blank.

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post #14158 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 09:40 PM
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Originally Posted by SFischer1 View Post
PROGRAM 1: 38.1 SBN

SHF
When did that change over from MMAX? Guess I better update my lists!

Larry

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post #14159 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 09:55 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Calaveras View Post
Well, actually those are network names, not call signs. When I say call sign I mean the one issued by the FCC and used to identify the station.

I'm not aware of any station ever using channel 59 in northern California but I suppose it could be. There was no call sign associated with it and no RF channel number.

Chuck
The requirement to identify the station may now be the tsid which is unique for each station.

http://www.rabbitears.info/oddsandends.php?request=tsid

But "K38JP" is not in the list. I remember that the RabbitEars list is needed as the FCC does not list the "tsid" for stations.

There are gaps in both the SALINAS CA and MONTEREY CA numbering. The "tsid" could be determined by a HDHR scan if anyone down there has one.

Could the Analog Channel be 56 not 59? "K56AA" came up in the FCC "Call Sign History".

SHF
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post #14160 of 14233 Old 09-05-2016, 10:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry Kenney View Post
When did that change over from MMAX? Guess I better update my lists!

Larry
I found a HDHR scan dated 6/28/2016 with:

SCANNING: 623000000 (us-bcast:39)
LOCK: 8vsb (ss=96 snq=62 seq=100)
TSID: 0x0189
PROGRAM 1: 38.1 MMAX
PROGRAM 2: 38.2 Sino TV
PROGRAM 3: 38.3 KTNC
PROGRAM 4: 38.4 Comet
PROGRAM 5: 38.5 NTD
PROGRAM 6: 38.6 Works
PROGRAM 7: 0 (control)

The scan I did this morning:

SCANNING: 623000000 (us-bcast:39)
LOCK: 8vsb (ss=100 snq=86 seq=100)
TSID: 0x0189
PROGRAM 1: 38.1 SBN
PROGRAM 2: 38.2 Sino TV
PROGRAM 3: 38.3 KTNC
PROGRAM 4: 38.4 Comet
PROGRAM 5: 38.5 NTD
PROGRAM 6: 38.6 Works
PROGRAM 7: 0 (control)

Just blind luck that I can provide the update.

SHF
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