Nashville, TN - OTA - Page 137 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Baselworld is only a few weeks away. Getting the latest news is easy, Click Here for info on how to join the Watchuseek.com newsletter list. Follow our team for updates featuring event coverage, new product unveilings, watch industry news & more!


Forum Jump: 
 159Likes
Reply
Thread Tools
post #4081 of 4093 Unread 07-10-2015, 08:57 PM
Senior Member
 
NashGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 208
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trip in VA View Post
It doesn't.

- Trip
No additional power costs for the transmitter?
NashGuy is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #4082 of 4093 Unread 07-11-2015, 08:19 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Trip in VA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Alexandria, VA, US | Age: 26
Posts: 14,749
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 245 Post(s)
Liked: 91
Send a message via AIM to Trip in VA Send a message via Yahoo to Trip in VA
Nope. If the bits aren't used, it's stuffed with "null packets" which essentially transmits zeroes in the empty spaces. Stations always transmits 19.393 Mbps whether it's all used or not.

- Trip

N4MJC

Comments are my own and not that of the FCC (my employer) or anyone else.

RabbitEars

"Ignorance and prejudice and fear walk hand in hand..." - Rush "Witch Hunt"

Trip in VA is online now  
post #4083 of 4093 Unread 07-11-2015, 10:05 AM
Senior Member
 
NashGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 208
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trip in VA View Post
Nope. If the bits aren't used, it's stuffed with "null packets" which essentially transmits zeroes in the empty spaces. Stations always transmits 19.393 Mbps whether it's all used or not.

- Trip
Hmm, good to know! Since I have your ear, Trip, can you tell me the typical bitrate (how many Mbps) used for a 1080i or 720p OTA broadcast? I'm sure it ranges a bit (which is why a station with lots of sub channels will have a lower bitrate/worse PQ on the main HD channel), but I'm just wondering, rough estimate.

I've noticed that when watching the same show (Wayward Pines) via Hulu, with a 3.2 Mbps MPEG4 (H.264) 720p stream, it looks just as good as the MPEG2 720p broadcast from my local Fox 17 station -- both show crisp detail and no problems with blockiness in dimly lit areas or fast-moving scenes. (Maybe if I could take screenshots I'd notice a slight difference here and there but sitting a few feet from my 52" 1080p Samsung, I cannot, and I think I have a pretty good eye for HD PQ.) From what I've read, it sounds like H.264 is 2 to 3 times as efficient as MPEG2. But I would guess that Fox 17's main HD channel is broadcasting at at least 12 Mbps seeing as how they only have a single SD sub channel.
NashGuy is offline  
post #4084 of 4093 Unread 07-11-2015, 10:21 AM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Trip in VA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Alexandria, VA, US | Age: 26
Posts: 14,749
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 245 Post(s)
Liked: 91
Send a message via AIM to Trip in VA Send a message via Yahoo to Trip in VA
It's hard to say. These days, many stations use variable bitrate encoders that vary the number of bits based on how much is needed by the video. A high motion sporting or nature scene might need a large amount of bandwidth, while a talking head needs very little. All of that being said, my website's data (which isn't perfect, particularly because of the large number of stations on variable bitrate encoders) suggests the average 1080i video stream is 13.6 Mbps while the average 720p video stream is 12.1 Mbps, nationwide.

http://www.rabbitears.info/oddsanden...?request=avgbr

MPEG-4 is generally taken to need about 50% of the bandwidth of MPEG-2 for equivalent quality. So a 12 Mbps 720p feed would need about 6 Mbps, give or take, to be equal in quality.

- Trip
NashGuy likes this.

N4MJC

Comments are my own and not that of the FCC (my employer) or anyone else.

RabbitEars

"Ignorance and prejudice and fear walk hand in hand..." - Rush "Witch Hunt"

Trip in VA is online now  
post #4085 of 4093 Unread 07-11-2015, 12:52 PM
Member
 
kbuke's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: McEwen, TN
Posts: 149
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 24 Post(s)
Liked: 40
Quote:
Originally Posted by Trip in VA View Post
It's hard to say. These days, many stations use variable bitrate encoders that vary the number of bits based on how much is needed by the video. A high motion sporting or nature scene might need a large amount of bandwidth, while a talking head needs very little. All of that being said, my website's data (which isn't perfect, particularly because of the large number of stations on variable bitrate encoders) suggests the average 1080i video stream is 13.6 Mbps while the average 720p video stream is 12.1 Mbps, nationwide.

http://www.rabbitears.info/oddsanden...?request=avgbr

MPEG-4 is generally taken to need about 50% of the bandwidth of MPEG-2 for equivalent quality. So a 12 Mbps 720p feed would need about 6 Mbps, give or take, to be equal in quality.

- Trip
Are "null" packets sometimes used for translators? I ask because I was looking at an LP station the other day and under transmitter power it had this.
kbuke is offline  
post #4086 of 4093 Unread 07-11-2015, 01:06 PM
AVS Addicted Member
 
Trip in VA's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: Alexandria, VA, US | Age: 26
Posts: 14,749
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 245 Post(s)
Liked: 91
Send a message via AIM to Trip in VA Send a message via Yahoo to Trip in VA
All stations transmit at least some null packets. I'm not sure I understand your question.

- Trip

N4MJC

Comments are my own and not that of the FCC (my employer) or anyone else.

RabbitEars

"Ignorance and prejudice and fear walk hand in hand..." - Rush "Witch Hunt"

Trip in VA is online now  
post #4087 of 4093 Unread 07-12-2015, 09:28 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 648
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 82 Post(s)
Liked: 1168
It appears work continues on the audio problem at WRTN?

REV'N (6-2) has been off for a few days, and the audio for RETRO (6-3) was off this morning for a short time.
tomintn is offline  
post #4088 of 4093 Unread 07-12-2015, 01:07 PM
Senior Member
 
NashGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 208
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Hopefully REV'N is off for good and was pulled to make room for the imminent addition of Antenna TV.
NashGuy is offline  
post #4089 of 4093 Unread 07-16-2015, 08:48 AM
Member
 
retrotv's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2011
Location: Middle Tn
Posts: 113
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 28 Post(s)
Liked: 30
Tuff TV is on 6.2 as well as 6.5 right now.
retrotv is online now  
post #4090 of 4093 Unread 07-20-2015, 11:10 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 648
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 82 Post(s)
Liked: 1168
Updating retrotv's information above; Tuff TV remains on 6-2 & 6-5. The sound bleed from Tuff TV to retro TV, currently on 6-3, continues.
tomintn is offline  
post #4091 of 4093 Unread 07-20-2015, 11:46 AM
Senior Member
 
NashGuy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2006
Posts: 208
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 31 Post(s)
Liked: 24
Anyone heard anything further about the addition of Antenna TV on 6-1? The end of July is creeping up. Maybe Rick is now waiting until Aug. to add it, along with sister channel This TV and The Works.
NashGuy is offline  
post #4092 of 4093 Unread 07-20-2015, 02:59 PM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 648
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 82 Post(s)
Liked: 1168
tomintn is offline  
post #4093 of 4093 Unread Today, 09:51 AM
Advanced Member
 
Join Date: May 2011
Posts: 648
Mentioned: 2 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 82 Post(s)
Liked: 1168
For several days, both 6-2 (Tuff TV) & 6-5 (Tuff TV) have been off. I could not hear any audio bleed on retro TV (6-3).

Today the picture for Tuff TV on 6-5 is back, no audio. The audio bleed on retro TV (6-3) is still off.

No issues with 6-1 (Daystar); 6-3, (Public Service TV shows?); 6-4 (Classic TV shows); 6-6 (Classic Movies), or 6-7 (Infomercials).

August 1 is coming!!

Have a great rest of the week!
tomintn is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Local HDTV Info and Reception



Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off