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Johnstown, PA - HDTV

469K views 4K replies 207 participants last post by  RedPenguin2 
#1 ·
Central Pennsylvania Digital TV Status (February 11, 2009)


This covers State College, Altoona, Johnstown, and other communities in DMA #98 with a focus on State College.

Contributors: tinyiota, PA_MainyYak, winkydink, golferadam

Where to find HD:


Comcast in State College and surrounding areas offers 28 (or more) HD channels. As of mid February 2009 all broadcast networks are available.


D&E offers an HD package as well including all locals.


Atlantic Broadband offers around 20 channels including all five networks.


(this section is poor at the moment as the nice write up was lost in AVS' db crash... it will be updated with something better soon)




Courtesy of tinyiota:


DirecTV delivers our market's local channels WPSU, WJAC, WTAJ, WWCP and WATM, along with the Pittsburgh CW affiliate WPCW. These channels are available either from the 72.5 Ku band orbital location, which requires a 2nd "small" dish pointed almost due south, or from their Ka band satellites, which requires both an MP4 capable receiver and a newer Ka band dish. It is expected that at some point, the locals on the 72.5 satellite will be phased out and a Ka band dish and receiver will be required for locals in our market.


There is presently no information on when(if) WPSU or WPCW will be available in HD, nor is there any information available on if or when WHVL might be carried.



Commentary:


As of February 23, 2007, all major networks are passing HD over the air in our market, however, not all parts of the market can receive all networks.


Customers of Atlantic Broadband in Altoona and Johnstown can receive all major networks in HD via cable.


Comcast customers in State College and surrounding areas are missing CBS in HD at this time as Comcast has not yet come to agreement with Nexstar for retransmission of WTAJ's high definition service and therefore only provides PBS, NBC, FOX, and ABC in HD. (WTAJ is rumored to come to Comcast on 1/26/09)


D&E Communications in State College offers WJAC, WATM , WPSU and WTAJ in HD and a full HD package.


Status:


WPSU-DT (Analog 3, Digital 15) PBS - Clearfield, PA (Post-transition: 15)


Subchannels: 3.1 PBS-HD, 3.2 WPSU-TV, 3.3 WPSU "Create"


FCC Service Contours: Analog (3) Digital (15)


WPSU, the PBS affiliate owned and operated by the Pennsylvania State University is arguably doing more with DTV than many other stations in the country. WPSU-DT is testing a Single Frequency Network wherein the main transmitter in Clearfield is supplemented by on-channel boosters, which are nearly synchronized with the main transmitter, in State College, Altoona, and Johnstown. This ensures that WPSU-DT can/will be received with even the simplest antenna configuration in each of the major communities of our market. Current WPSX-DT is operating its main transmitter at 537 kW and its on-channel booster in State College at 50 kW, sufficient to provide a city-grade signal in and around State College. WPSU-DT is currently passing the PBS HD Channel. I suggest using a directional antenna as it is possible in areas outside the intended center of the booster's directional beam to receive both signals and have what appears to be a bad multipath problem. For those looking, the on-channel booster is on Pine Grove Mountain.


Plans for deployment of on-channel boosters to Altoona and Johnstown are on hold at this time.


WJAC-DT (Analog 6, Digital 34) NBC - Johnstown, PA (Post-transition: 34)


Subchannels: 6.1 NBC-HD, 6.2 NBC Weather Plus, 6.3 WJAC-TV


State College Translator: Analog 7, Digital 42


FCC Service Contours: Analog (6) Digital (34) Analog Translator (7) Digital Translator (42)


WJAC-DT was first on the air in the market with their digital signal and they passed HD from network immediately. WJAC-DT is transmitting at 1 MW from Laurel Mountain, approximately 65 miles from downtown State College. WJAC also passes DD5.1 from network.


WJAC-DT can be received in State College, however many people have had trouble depending on their exact location. WJAC's channel 42 digital translator is online now and provides a great signal in the area.


WATM-DT (Former Analog 23, Digital 24) ABC - Altoona, PA


Subchannels: 23.1 ABC-HD, 23.2 WATM-TV, 23.3 WWCP-TV


FCC Service Contours: Analog (23) (Off air as of 2/17/2009) Digital (24)


WATM-DT is ABC in HD and over the air. The major area cablecos all carry WATM in HD as well. This channel also includes a FOX SD subchannel.


WWCP-DT (Former Analog 8, Digital 8) FOX - Johnstown, PA


State College Translator: Analog 59, Proposed Digital 17


Subchannels: 8.1 FOX-HD, 8.2 WATM-TV


Translators and FCC Service Contours: Analog (8) (Off air as of 2/17/2009) Digital (8) State College Analog (59) State College Digital (17)


WWCP-DT began passing FOX in HD on or around 2/23/07. As this is fed from the FOX splicer it is expected that the audio stream is DD 5.1 during network programming.


WTAJ-DT (Analog 10, Digital 32) CBS - Altoona, PA (Post-transition: 32)


Subchannels: 10.1 CBS-HD


FCC Service Contours: Analog (10) Digital (32)


WTAJ began passing HD and DD5.1 OTA on January 26, 2007. They currently have no plans for subchannels so it looks like we'll see full 19+ Mbps 1080i. While it took a long time to come it appears to be worth it! The picture is spectacular, however, there have been some problems with the DD audio mix.


WHVL (Analog 29, Digital 27) MyNetworkTV - State College, PA (Post-transition: 27)


FCC Service Contours: Analog (29) Digital (27)


WHVL was a long neglected LP broadcasting from Rattlesnake Mountain to the north of State College. In August of 2007 this station was relaunched as the market's MyNetworkTV affiliate. A poster in this thread, 75ohms, has kept us up to date with information regarding WHVL... Rumor is that as of mid February 2009 that WHVL is broadcasting a test signal including its intended final configuration of 29-1 720p MyNTV, 29-2 480i America One.


WKBS-DT (Analog 47, Digital 46) Cornerstone - Altoona, PA (Post-transition: 46)


Subchannels: 47.1 WKBS-DT


FCC Service Contours: Analog (47) Digital (46) STA


As I am generally uninterested in television religion I don't know anything more than the FCC knows about this station. They are currently transmitting with 6.1 kW and can be received in State College using an 8-bay or high gain yagi. Their CP is for 50 kW.


WNEP (Translators in State College on 36, 39) ABC - Wilkes-Barre, PA


FCC Service Contours: Analog (36) Analog (39) Digital Contours Not Yet Available


WNEP has had translators in State College for as long as I can remember. Before WATM become our ABC affiliate in the 80's, WNEP provided ABC service to the State College area (together with WHTM of Harrisburg).


WNEP has translators all over eastern Pennsylvania from Allentown northward and westward to State College.


On March 31, 2006, the FCC received flash-cut applications for both the channel 36 and 39 translators. This would provide State College with two (three) sources of ABC in HD.


Miscellaneous


W13BY, what appears to be a translator for WKBS or the same network WKBS is affiliated with, also has applied for a low-power DTV license for channel 12.


FCC Service Contours: W13BY Proposed LD 12




Reception of anything from Harrisburg is unlikely as stations are either assigned the same freqeuncy as a station in DMA 98 or a translator in the State College area or are more than 80 miles away. The only station on a channel not used in the State College area is WHP-DT on channel 4, at about 59 miles, but WPSU's analog on channel 3 seems to throw off quite a bit of adjacent channel interference and makes it impossible to receive.



Just how local are our "local" stations


I've added this section based on a post by pa_maniyyak that details the ownership of our local broadcast stations.

WJAC is owned by Cox Enterprises, Inc, one of the major players in media, and based in Atlanta. The NBC affiliate is one of 15 Cox TV stations in medium and large markets. The company also owns radio stations, newspapers, a huge cable company, and other media interests.

WTAJ has just recently been purchased by Nexstar Broadcasting, based in the Dallas area, making our local CBS affiliate part of a chain of 32 small and medium market owned stations (along with another 17 stations under operating agreements.)

WWCP FOX8 is owned by Peak Media of Pennsylvania, which in turn, is owned by a holding company based in Tampa that owns ten other small market TV stations and has minority interest in several others.

WATM ABC23 is operated by FOX8, but is owned by Palm Television, L.P., which is controlled by CBIZ Business Solutions of St. Louis, Inc.

WKBS is the religious station in Altoona, operated by Cornerstone Television, Inc, based in a rather well equipped facility near Monroeville, PA, distributing programming to religious stations around the world. While that may be construed as “local”, it is also a rather large enterprise. The company also operates WPCB-TV in Greensburg as well as several low power translator stations scatted across western Pennsylvania, West Virginia, and Harrisburg, PA. No HD for them.

WPSU is owned and operated by the Pennsylvania State University.


(added by slykens 11/24/2007)

WHVL is owned by Channel Communications out of Lewistown
 
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#2,754 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroOneTwoThree /forum/post/16847417


I have not seen any other station do this so I'm kinda confused.


What is the point of having WJAC-HD and WJAC-SD?


As far as I can see, all ATSC TVs and Converter Boxes that I have seen

can simply play the HD version even if it's an SD TV.


So why not just get rid of SD and give RTV more bandwidth so it's not

always blurring?

It was done originally to accommodate cable TV operators whose equipment did not do center cut properly. WPGH and WPMY in Pittsburgh do the same thing, as does WATM, running ABC-HD on 23.1, ABC-SD on 23.2, and FOX-SD on 23.3. I would think that as cable operators gradually modernize their plants, the need to provide the SD feed will go away.

Switching between the RTN feeds of WJAC and WPXI really demonstrates how bit-starved the WJAC RTN channel is.
 
#2,755 ·
Any ABB folks having this problem?

Ch 715 (WPCW-HD) is replaced with the "Not Authorized" splash screen on both of my STBs. I did a full reboot and had tech support do their remote mojo. They claim it's only my boxes that are affected.

All other HD channels are running normally.
 
#2,756 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by PA_MainyYak /forum/post/16852040


Any ABB folks having this problem?

Ch 715 (WPCW-HD) is replaced with the "Not Authorized" splash screen on both of my STBs. I did a full reboot and had tech support do their remote mojo. They claim it's only my boxes that are affected.

All other HD channels are running normally.

Odd...comes in fine for me.


DGK
 
#2,758 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JK77 /forum/post/16852755


WPGH's 53-2 has been gone for about a week now.

Actually not. the SD channel is still there, but showing up as 43.2 due to PSIP issues, according to this entry on the Pittsburgh thread.
 
#2,760 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by JK77 /forum/post/16859508


No 43-2 nor 43-4 on my set nor converter boxes, and when I try to manually type them in, they all revert to 53-1.

What does TSReader say about it?


- Trip
 
#2,763 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroOneTwoThree /forum/post/16865286


Why does WJAC's RTN/RTV seem to at times no matter if it's ATSC or QAM have constantly A/V or lip-syncs problems.


Is the RTN/RTN feed just bad to begin with?


It is bit starved. I believe the bitstream rates are posted earlier in this thread, but RTN is getting less than 2 MB, AFAIK.

That's mostly due to WJAC's use of the 6-3 SD version of its primary program. You can see the difference when switching between 6-2 and 11-2 (WPXI) when they are running the same RTN content.

It would seem the cable providers are getting their 6-2 signal from the same bit stream, whether it is OTA or by fiber.
 
#2,764 ·
We just recieved a notice from Comcast today saying they are moving some channels around and it appears as though the Pittsburgh stations in my area are moving from their current anolog channel to a digital channel. The only exceptions are WPCW and WQED. WQED will stay on Ch. 13 and WPCW will move to Ch. 15.


Here are some of the changes...


KDKA is moving from Ch. 2 to Ch. 191

WTAE is moving from Ch. 4 to Ch. 189

WPXI is moving from Ch. 11 to Ch. 190

WPMY is moving from Ch. 7 to Ch. 193

WJAC-HD is going from Ch. 748 to Ch. 706

WTAJ-HD is going from Ch. 725 to Ch. 711

WJAC-RTN is going from Ch. 106 to Ch. 187


It also mentions that some networks in HD like TBS-HD and CNN-HD will move. This new line-up will take effect on or after August 3rd. The notice mentions that they are moving some of the analog stations to digital so they can make more room for HD channels.


I'm not sure, but it appears as though only people that have cable boxes will be able to view the Pittsburgh channels. Also, I'm not sure, but will I still be able to get some of the Pittsburgh channels on my TV with a digital tuner. I think I might because WPGH-HD has been off Comcast for about two years, but I get it on my TV with a digital tuner on channel 53-1.


I don't think it's a very good move at all.
 
#2,765 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by PA_MainyYak /forum/post/16866986


It is bit starved. I believe the bitstream rates are posted earlier in this thread, but RTN is getting less than 2 MB, AFAIK.

That's mostly due to WJAC's use of the 6-3 SD version of its primary program. You can see the difference when switching between 6-2 and 11-2 (WPXI) when they are running the same RTN content.

It would seem the cable providers are getting their 6-2 signal from the same bit stream, whether it is OTA or by fiber.

I knew that it was bit straved.


I just didn't think that would screw up the voice though.


I figured it just made the quality low not screw with A/V sync.
 
#2,766 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroOneTwoThree /forum/post/16870788


I knew that it was bit straved.


I just didn't think that would screw up the voice though.


I figured it just made the quality low not screw with A/V sync.

Yeah, the audio needs fewer bits, but if those particular bits are the ones lost at a given moment ... and the lower bit rate would imply less error correction. A shame ATSC does not support MPEG-4.
 
#2,767 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroOneTwoThree /forum/post/16865286


Why does WJAC's RTN/RTV seem to at times no matter if it's ATSC or QAM have constantly A/V or lip-syncs problems.


Is the RTN/RTN feed just bad to begin with?

I've seen other RTV affiliates on satellite, and they too have audio sync issues. Usually I have to turn off my DVB receiver then back on for the audio to sync.
 
#2,768 ·
My friend and I both live in or around the city of Johnstown.


West End/Oakhurst and Oakland.


My question is, we are both unable to have rooftop antennas where we live.


We only ever seem to get WJAC period.


When analog was around it was pretty much the same, except I received audio of some with no picture.


Does it look like we will ever receive anything else or just WJAC?


EDIT: I'm not complaining about WJAC, my friend and I are both glad, since we both like RTN, but we are surprised we can't receive any other channel at all.
 
#2,769 ·
Is there a reason you can't install roof-top antennas?
 
#2,771 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroOneTwoThree /forum/post/16875505


...When analog was around it was pretty much the same, except I received audio of some with no picture.

That was because in analog broadcasting the audio was transmitted as a separate modulation at the upper end of the station's broadcast channel. With DTV broadcasting the audio is digitized and is encoded and compressed along with the video elements for broadcasting. (This is the reason older multi-band radios which had a band to listen in on the television audio, no longer work.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroOneTwoThree /forum/post/16875505


...My question is, we are both unable to have rooftop antennas where we live ...

And my question to you is, what kind of antenna are you and your friend currently using to receive WJAC OTA?


Assuming no one it saying to you that you can't install an outdoor antenna, like a landlord (and against FCC regulations by the way), could you install one in say an attic, which might provide better reception?


----

Oh, so it is your landlord. You then should take a look at this:
http://www.fcc.gov/mb/facts/otard.html
 
#2,772 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by SamVin /forum/post/16876052


That was because in analog broadcasting the audio was transmitted as a separate modulation at the upper end of the station's broadcast channel. With DTV broadcasting the audio is digitized and is encoded and compressed along with the video elements for broadcasting. (This is the reason older multi-band radios which had a band to listen in on the television audio, no longer work.)


And my question to you is, what kind of antenna are you and your friend currently using to receive WJAC OTA?


Assuming no one it saying to you that you can't install an outdoor antenna, like a landlord (and against FCC regulations by the way), could you install one in say an attic, which might provide better reception?

Well basically we only have antennas that came with our Hauppauge TV Tuner Cards hooked up to our ATSC-to-Analog converter boxes.


He has a DigitalStream from Radio Shack and I have an RCA from Walmart.


Anyway, I live in a part of the city that has issues receiving, so I may be out of luck. I mean police radios sometimes malfunction here, radio stations don't get picked up as well, and definitely cell phones act bad.


Anyway, he's in a slightly better area than me, he gets a 91 out of 100 signal on WJAC, yet still can't seem to receive anything else.


Yet if I go up the road a tad bit in to Richland Twp, PA, my TV Tuner Card on my laptop can pick up WWCP but it breaks up.
 
#2,773 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroOneTwoThree /forum/post/16876096


Well basically we only have antennas that came with our Hauppauge TV Tuner Cards hooked up to our ATSC-to-Analog converter boxes.


He has a DigitalStream from Radio Shack and I have an RCA from Walmart.


Anyway, I live in a part of the city that has issues receiving, so I may be out of luck. I mean police radios sometimes malfunction here, radio stations don't get picked up as well, and definitely cell phones act bad.


Anyway, he's in a slightly better area than me, he gets a 91 out of 100 signal on WJAC, yet still can't seem to receive anything else.


Yet if I go up the road a tad bit in to Richland Twp, PA, my TV Tuner Card on my laptop can pick up WWCP but it breaks up.

Well your problem with WWCP doesn't surprise me given the station's polarization pattern to beam most of it's 9 kwatts towards Indiana, Pittsburgh, and Uniontown while short-changing Johnstown, Somerset, and Bedford.


And while I'm not familiar with your tuner card and the antenna that comes with it, I would think even a small to medium metro type (yellow, green, or light green zone) antenna located as high as possible even inside your home would give you more signal to work with and might let you pick up WWCP, and even perhaps really strong PGH stations like KDKA, WPXI, etc.
 
#2,774 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by PA_MainyYak /forum/post/16871799


Yeah, the audio needs fewer bits, but if those particular bits are the ones lost at a given moment ... and the lower bit rate would imply less error correction. A shame ATSC does not support MPEG-4.

If we start the process of deploying ATSC-2 now, we might still be alive to see an OTA transmission..
 
#2,775 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by SamVin /forum/post/16877058

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZeroOneTwoThree /forum/post/16876096


Well basically we only have antennas that came with our Hauppauge TV Tuner Cards hooked up to our ATSC-to-Analog converter boxes.


He has a DigitalStream from Radio Shack and I have an RCA from Walmart.


Anyway, I live in a part of the city that has issues receiving, so I may be out of luck. I mean police radios sometimes malfunction here, radio stations don't get picked up as well, and definitely cell phones act bad.


Anyway, he's in a slightly better area than me, he gets a 91 out of 100 signal on WJAC, yet still can't seem to receive anything else.


Yet if I go up the road a tad bit in to Richland Twp, PA, my TV Tuner Card on my laptop can pick up WWCP but it breaks up.

Well your problem with WWCP doesn't surprise me given the station's polarization pattern to beam most of it's 9 kwatts towards Indiana, Pittsburgh, and Uniontown while short-changing Johnstown, Somerset, and Bedford.


And while I'm not familiar with your tuner card and the antenna that comes with it, I would think even a small to medium metro type (yellow, green, or light green zone) antenna located as high as possible even inside your home would give you more signal to work with and might let you pick up WWCP, and even perhaps really strong PGH stations like KDKA, WPXI, etc.

That all depends on where in Oakland ZeroOneTwoThree is located. I ran a quick TV Fool estimate based on the 1800 block of Bedford Street, and it does indicate WWCP and WJAC should be in range. All other stations fall into the dark gray range "These channels are very weak and will most likely require extreme measures to try and pick them up".

ZeroOneTwoThree can try the TV Fool tool using his exact address to get a clearer idea of what may be possible.
 
#2,776 ·

Quote:
Originally Posted by PA_MainyYak /forum/post/16879517


That all depends on where in Oakland ZeroOneTwoThree is located. I ran a quick TV Fool estimate based on the 1800 block of Bedford Street, and it does indicate WWCP and WJAC should be in range. All other stations fall into the dark gray range "These channels are very weak and will most likely require extreme measures to try and pick them up".

ZeroOneTwoThree can try the TV Fool tool using his exact address to get a clearer idea of what may be possible.

My friend is the one who lives in Oakland.


I live in West End/Oakhurst.
 
#2,777 ·
While TV Fool gives a good estimate of OTA reception, and is much better than Antennaweb.org, it is just that, an estimate and is far from perfect.


For example, at my home I get consistent fringe reception of two stations out of Younstown (WFMJ & WKBN) which doesn't show up at all on my results from TV FOOL. Also WTOV always is listed as one of those "gray" stations, but I actual get it very clearly, all the time. Other stations that it says I should get, I can't receive, or only get occasionally when the atmospheric conditions are just right.


In any case, I think an actual antenna would work better than what I assume is a "stick" antenna that was provided to work on a tuner card for a laptop computer.


So my point is you never know what can or can't be received OTA unless you are willing to do a little experimentation.


And while Z123, might not pick up the major UHF PGH stations directly, at some later point both KDKA and WPCW have plans to build translators at WPCW's old antenna site, which may give him access to a CBS and CW affiliate.
 
#2,778 ·
Is there any place that can just flat out tell you where stations are in your area and what subchannels they provide?


I have tried TVGuide.com, TitanTV.com, and some random others, but nothing seems to just flat out give me every channel in my area including subchannels.


Some guides actually omit subchannels like 6.3/WJAC-SD of WJAC.
 
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