Minneapolis, MN - OTA - Page 79 - AVS Forum
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post #2341 of 2350 Old 10-23-2014, 03:33 PM
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I'm curious if Comcast may actually have a better HD version of KSTP, maybe they get their signal from fiber
yes they get their feeds via fibre
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post #2342 of 2350 Old 10-23-2014, 04:58 PM
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Originally Posted by unclehonkey View Post
yes they get their feeds via fibre
But I thought I read somewhere(not sure if it was our market) that some stations feed the fiber the same signal as would go to the transmitter. If this was the case cable would suffer the same as OTA.
I don't have cable but if someone did and also had OTA it would be interesting to compare the filesize(or bitrate if you could read it realtime) for say a 1hr ABC HD program. I know OTA a 1hr KSTP HD program is less than a standard DVD, under 4gb, which is way too small for decent HD. Compare this to WCCO where a 1hr HD program is over 6gbs.
Whoa, just checked WFTC(Fox9.1) and they are even worse than KSTP, coming in at a paltry 3.6 gb for a 1hr program! I don't watch much on FOX and what I do isn't probably too demanding but I've never seen the issues on FOX9.1 as I do on KSTP. Wonder if FOX has a better or newer encoder....
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post #2343 of 2350 Old 10-23-2014, 05:24 PM
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Originally Posted by jjeff View Post
But I thought I read somewhere(not sure if it was our market) that some stations feed the fiber the same signal as would go to the transmitter. If this was the case cable would suffer the same as OTA.
I don't have cable but if someone did and also had OTA it would be interesting to compare the filesize(or bitrate if you could read it realtime) for say a 1hr ABC HD program. I know OTA a 1hr KSTP HD program is less than a standard DVD, under 4gb, which is way too small for decent HD. Compare this to WCCO where a 1hr HD program is over 6gbs.
Whoa, just checked WFTC(Fox9.1) and they are even worse than KSTP, coming in at a paltry 3.6 gb for a 1hr program! I don't watch much on FOX and what I do isn't probably too demanding but I've never seen the issues on FOX9.1 as I do on KSTP. Wonder if FOX has a better or newer encoder....
I'm with you, I think no matter how they receive it (fiber vs OTA) I think the odds of having a different feed are slim. Would be nice for someone to compare.

As for FOX, yep, the pretty much suck too for PQ. Locally here I would put NBC at the top, say 9/10. CBS gets an 8 FOX a 5.5 and ABC a 3. KSTP is the worst excuse for an HD channel I have seen anywhere. And our FOX NFL broadcasts are terrible too. Other than NFL on FOX it's a good thing I don't watch either channel.
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post #2344 of 2350 Old 10-23-2014, 06:20 PM
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Are there even mobile DTV capable receivers on the market? I've never seen any. Seems like one of those pre-smart-phone-and-4G-LTE-everywhere ideas that sounded good at the time (like HD Radio on AM).
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post #2345 of 2350 Old 10-23-2014, 06:51 PM
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Originally Posted by mattdp View Post
Are there even mobile DTV capable receivers on the market? I've never seen any. Seems like one of those pre-smart-phone-and-4G-LTE-everywhere ideas that sounded good at the time (like HD Radio on AM).
Very few, but they are out there. You really have to go looking to find them.

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I'm with you, I think no matter how they receive it (fiber vs OTA) I think the odds of having a different feed are slim. Would be nice for someone to compare.
I remember someone here doing a comparison some months ago and it was clear that the fiber feed was much better since they weren't feeding the Mobile piece of the transport stream to the cable company.

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post #2346 of 2350 Old Yesterday, 06:22 AM
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Originally Posted by Trip in VA View Post
I remember someone here doing a comparison some months ago and it was clear that the fiber feed was much better since they weren't feeding the Mobile piece of the transport stream to the cable company.

- Trip
That might explain why more people aren't complaining about KSTP's picture quality as most people probably watch it on cable or satellite(which may be the same feed as cable).
Kind of a switch from the early days of HDTV when OTA was generally considered better PQ than compressed satellite or cable.
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post #2347 of 2350 Old Yesterday, 07:45 AM
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It's still generally true that OTA is better than the fiber feed, or at least equivalent. I think KSTP just does a totally separate signal path for the fiber feed because of the huge amount of compression they're having to do to accommodate the Mobile DTV.

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post #2348 of 2350 Old Yesterday, 09:24 AM
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Whoa, just checked WFTC(Fox9.1) and they are even worse than KSTP, coming in at a paltry 3.6 gb for a 1hr program!
Rabitears says 3.3 so its close

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I don't watch much on FOX and what I do isn't probably too demanding but I've never seen the issues on FOX9.1 as I do on KSTP. Wonder if FOX has a better or newer encoder....
I mainly watch it via 9.9 which doesn't seem to have the issues as 9.1 does
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post #2349 of 2350 Old Yesterday, 02:53 PM
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I have Comcast and KSTP is definitely a better picture on cable than on the OTA signal.
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post #2350 of 2350 Old Yesterday, 07:48 PM
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Originally Posted by John21 View Post
I have Comcast and KSTP is definitely a better picture on cable than on the OTA signal.
Thanks for your observations, that might make sense then why more people aren't complaining.
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Originally Posted by unclehonkey View Post
...
I mainly watch it via 9.9 which doesn't seem to have the issues as 9.1 does
When they first added 9.9 I made a couple test recordings and both channels were identical in size for a 1hr program, so I figured it was a wash. I think people speculated that even though 9.9 could have more bandwidth, FOX may have been sending the same bitrate program to both channels. I'll have to do more testing, problem is I watch such little FOX and what I do isn't really demanding material. Now if they aired things like live event shows, especially ones with lots of strobes, it would be easy to spot a bitstarved picture.
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