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post #901 of 6671 Old 01-28-2005, 06:55 AM
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Originally posted by TByronT
Yes, I seem to get frequent freeze-ups on WAVY (10), and occasionally on WHRO (15) tonight. But WVBT (43) is OK here. However, I often have troubles with all three when it really gets COLD, like it is now. Probably, my VOOM batwing OTA antenna... I can pivot it to get good signals, but often its not worth the effort -- unless I can find a sweet spot to gets all channels.

Its nice to have the new low power WAVY/WVBT clones (17 and 45), as backups for their more powerful parents -- since I never seem to have any trouble with them. Of couse they don't help when I want to watch an HD program.

WAVY 10 and Fox 43 have been perfect here. This morning temp was 15 deg and no problems. Rock solid 70 signal on 10 and 70 - 75 on 43.

Harold Jackson
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post #902 of 6671 Old 01-28-2005, 07:03 PM
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I noticed that the HD video quality looked superb tonight on 13-1. Then I just discovered that the radar is back on 13-2.
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post #903 of 6671 Old 01-28-2005, 07:04 PM
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FYI for George....the picture tonight on Enterprise tonight on 27-1 is excellent, but the sound is very choppy.
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post #904 of 6671 Old 01-28-2005, 08:45 PM
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Here's the latest on cable must-carry and multicasting from the FCC. (via HDTV Magazine)

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/20...t_x.htm?csp=34

John Chester

"No matter where you go... there you are."
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post #905 of 6671 Old 01-28-2005, 11:04 PM
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Quote:
Originally posted by johncchester
Here's the latest on cable must-carry and multicasting from the FCC. (via HDTV Magazine)

http://www.usatoday.com/tech/news/20...t_x.htm?csp=34

I think there was a thread on this started about a month ago in the programming forum. I wonder when the ruling will come? Not to slam the affiliates but this war needs to end. HD locals need to be on cable. People will be much more prone to buy HD sets when they know their cable provider can deliver the locals to them. theres just a huge amount of viewers that will never unplug from the cable pacifier and who find the idea of an antenna and seperate tuner ridiculous. Many of us would probably not have ventured into the satellite provider world if this thing wasnt an issue.
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post #906 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 06:40 AM
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The other thred is the place for cable fans to promote and advertise Cox cable and to mostly bash the stations. This one is for OTA broadcast related issues. Please keep on topic.

Harold Jackson
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post #907 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 10:10 AM
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Now children!

CHAS ZOSS OPPO EAP 2nd ROUND late entry!
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post #908 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 10:16 AM
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Must carry and multicasting are not relevant to this thread?

Rules:

"Topics should focus on over-the-air digital television or carriage of those signals by third party vendors such as cable or direct broadcast satellite services."

HJ you are out of line. "Understanding & tolerance are the first orders of the day (as we are a diverse group of people meeting in a common area)."
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post #909 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 12:53 PM
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Greetings!

After a long, generous conversation with Peter Dennant on local DTV and what digital channels would end up on Cox (and when), he invited me to this forum, which I've monitored for a week or two.

Just today installed a CM 4228 in my attic, after having 90' of RG6 run from my TV (Dell 42" plasma HDTV) to the attic. (Thanks to Bruce Lowekamp for confirming that this config would work.) Took my best guess aiming the antenna. Getting some very good initial results without a pre-amp (although I bought one - CM 7775 - with the antenna and will install it if needed).

I'm in central James City County, 5 miles NW of Williamsburg proper, about 37 miles from the broadcast towers in Driver. These readings could be improved once I play with the antenna direction.

CH SS SNR
3.1 65 20
3.2 66 20
10.1 63 25
10.2 63 25
10.3 63 25
13.1 67 25
13.2 67 25
15.1 57 25
15.2 57 25
15.3 57 25
15.4 57 25
43.1 70 21
43.2 71 21
49.1 76 19
49.2 75 19
49.3 75 19
49.4 75 18

Looking at this, I get the feeling listing all of the subchannels is redundant (sorry...newbie).

Today is pretty clear, so we'll see how things go in adverse weather. If anyone has suggestions for improving my setup, I'd be glad to hear from you. Think the amp is necessary, or will it over-amplify the signals?

Thanks!

Jay N.
Williamsburg, VA
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post #910 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 01:17 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by vurbano
Must carry and multicasting are not relevant to this thread?

Rules:

"Topics should focus on over-the-air digital television or carriage of those signals by third party vendors such as cable or direct broadcast satellite services."

HJ you are out of line. "Understanding & tolerance are the first orders of the day (as we are a diverse group of people meeting in a common area)."

What's the matter Vurbano? Not enough "Bandwith" on the other thread to hold all your whines and complaints? So now you've had to bleed over into this one.

Harold Jackson
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post #911 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 03:22 PM
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Now, boys (HJ & Vurbano), play nice!

Besides HJ, this IS about our local affilliates' programming! ... and I get as tired of reading Vurbano's "whining" as anyone here, (Although I think he may have a point, I'm not ready to make a religion of it, as he has.)

BEGIN RANT:

I just want an agreement in place, so that the snowball will roll. I understand both sides of the argument and I don't care WHO caves or compromises. I just want "Joe-Six-Pack" to see the WOW and sign on, so that HD ratings, stats & OUR INVESTMENTS will be real & relevant. That JUST WON'T HAPPEN until ALL of the local affiliates are available via the "pacifier" (love that term) of cable TV! I hear it every day!

From a personal (i.e. selfish) point of view, I am sick & f-----g tired of having to explain the entire politics of this rediculous stalemate, multiple times a day, every time I install another Cox HD Box, on another HDTV.

Please believe me, I am no fan of Cox. I worked for one of their subcontractors for a while (MANY Moons ago) and got a good, inside look at their weirdness. I kicked them out of my home 9 years ago (LONG before HD was an issue). I hate that company with all my heart & soul.

BUT... they ARE the delivery system of choice for the VAST majority of TV viewers in our area. (I still like the term "pacifier". )

Let's get real, kids... until it happens... WE WON'T COUNT!!!

The relevant question is.... "Are ANY of the parties involved even talking?" "Are ANY negotiations even happening?"

If not... WHY?

If not... WHEN?

...and I KNOW that there are Cox people lurking in here. (Please grow a pair and speak up.) I don't think that they can even admit that anyone can get ANY TV, outside "The System". (Psychotic behavior, granted, but is expecting the whole world to erect antennae any more sane?)

BOTH sides have invested FAR too much time, money, blood, sweat and tears to let this go on any longer!

THIS B.S. HAS GOT TO END!!! ... or the HD "pooch" will really get screwed... from both ends!

...and guess who loses to the feuding corporations (Cox vs. Linn, Belo, Sinclair, etc.)... AGAIN!!!

John Chester

"No matter where you go... there you are."
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post #912 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 04:39 PM
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Well said, John! (standing and politely applauding)
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post #913 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 04:41 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Todd
I noticed that the HD video quality looked superb tonight on 13-1. Then I just discovered that the radar is back on 13-2.

WVEC is squeezing the hell out of 13-2. I think WTKR has the best looking radar sweep BUT I never watch...

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post #914 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 04:51 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by raycer
Well said, John! (standing and politely applauding)

"Uhhh, Thank ya, thank ya vurry much."

May the voice of reason prevail!

Who? Me? Go figure.

John Chester

"No matter where you go... there you are."
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post #915 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 05:07 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by johncchester
Now, boys (HJ & Vurbano), play nice!

Besides HJ, this IS about our local affilliates' programming! ... and I get as tired of reading Vurbano's "whining" as anyone here, (Although I think he may have a point, I'm not ready to make a religion of it, as he has.)

BEGIN RANT:

I just want an agreement in place, so that the snowball will roll. I understand both sides of the argument and I don't care WHO caves or compromises. I just want "Joe-Six-Pack" to see the WOW and sign on, so that HD ratings, stats & OUR INVESTMENTS will be real & relevant. That JUST WON'T HAPPEN until ALL of the local affiliates are available via the "pacifier" (love that term) of cable TV! I hear it every day!

From a personal (i.e. selfish) point of view, I am sick & f-----g tired of having to explain the entire politics of this rediculous stalemate, multiple times a day, every time I install another Cox Box, on another HDTV.

Please believe me, I am no fan of Cox. I worked for one of their subcontractors for a while (MANY Moons ago) and got a good, inside look at their weirdness. I kicked them out of my home 9 years ago (LONG before HD was an issue). I hate that company with all my heart & soul.

BUT... they ARE the delivery system of choice for the VAST majority of TV viewers in our area. (I still like the term "pacifier". )

Let's get real, kids... until it happens... WE WON'T COUNT!!!

The relevant question is.... "Are ANY of the parties involved even talking?" "Are ANY negotiations even happening?"

If not... WHY?

If not... WHEN?

...and I KNOW that there are Cox people lurking in here. (Please grow a pair and speak up.) I don't think that they can even admit that anyone can get ANY TV, outside "The System". (Psychotic behavior, granted, but is expecting the whole world to erect antennae any more sane?)

BOTH sides have invested FAR too much time, money, blood, sweat and tears to let this go on any longer!

THIS B.S. HAS GOT TO END!!! ... or the HD "pooch" will really get screwed... from both ends!

...and guess who loses to the feuding corporations (Cox vs. Linn, Belo, Sinclair, etc.)... AGAIN!!!

GOOD RANT JOHN



You make some very valid points but I think the bottom line still is the broadcaster must protect their product which is the signals originating from their transmitters. Long before digital and HD I went through the same fight in Richmond between what is Comcast now and the locals. Several weeks went by with no local content on cable before the cable company was swamped with angry customers and caved in.

In my opinion the argument here is not with the broadcasters but lies with Cox, a company that does not have a history of being customer friendly but a corporate bully.

I somewhat agree with you on what it will take for HD to take off after people experience the Wow factor but....a lot of people could care less about HD. They just want a reasonably priced set with a good picture. There are some ED receivers out that would provide them a good clean digital picture. These are the ones that have to make the switch to digital in order for HD to grow. The prices of HD sets are going to have to come down a lot to entice many to change as they are perfectly happy as it is. I think this is about to happen as I was in Walmart and they have HD tv's now and on their website they have brands I never heard of. Chinese most likely but they will serve to drive the prices of the major brands down making the sets more affordable for the joe six-packs and mom & pops to watch soaps and game shows.

Why would Cox need to have 2 duplicate channels, one analog and one digital to broadcast the content of each station? Seems to me it would be possible to put the local digital on their digital tier and drop the analog and add maybe one sub-cannel for each station without any additional effort on their part since it goes through their STB anyway.

I know it must be very frustrating for those in subdivisions and apartments or have a wife factor to deal with on installing outside antennas. As an OTA viewer I am very happy with that arrangement even though the wife really doesn't like it. (She likes to watch it though)

What really is needed is for the FCC to put a firm cutoff date for analog. Otherwise everyone involved will continue to foot-drag as long as they can get by with it.

Harold Jackson
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post #916 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 05:22 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by VARTV
WVEC is squeezing the hell out of 13-2. I think WTKR has the best looking radar sweep BUT I never watch...

It may look good but I don't think it's as accurate as WVEC's. I did a little test right before the news came on tonight. I knew it was raining in Richmond so I checked WTKR which had nothing, WAVY had nothing, WVEC plainly showed the rain and their sweep matched the NOAA radar from Wakefield. Over the months that the radar has been available I have found that WVEC's is consistently accurate for my location where the others don't. WVEC's is the one I use both on-line and OTA.

Harold Jackson
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post #917 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 05:38 PM
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Originally posted by hjriver
What's the matter Vurbano? Not enough "Bandwith" on the other thread to hold all your whines and complaints? So now you've had to bleed over into this one.

Personal attacks now? taunting?
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post #918 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 05:49 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by hjriver



Seems to me it would be possible to put the local digital on their digital tier and drop the analog and add maybe one sub-cannel for each station without any additional effort on their part since it goes through their STB anyway.


Actually there are some cable customers (probably quite a few) out there that just get the analog channels, using no STB but just a cable-ready set. (my mother-in-law is one of those)
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post #919 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 05:50 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by hjriver
GOOD RANT JOHN



You make some very valid points but I think the bottom line still is the broadcaster must protect their product which is the signals originating from their transmitters. Long before digital and HD I went through the same fight in Richmond between what is Comcast now and the locals. Several weeks went by with no local content on cable before the cable company was swamped with angry customers and caved in.



The same thing happened here with Linn (Only channel 10, at the time)

Quote:


In my opinion the argument here is not with the broadcasters but lies with Cox, a company that does not have a history of being customer friendly but a corporate bully.

AGREED!!!

Quote:


I somewhat agree with you on what it will take for HD to take off after people experience the Wow factor but....a lot of people could care less about HD. They just want a reasonably priced set with a good picture. There are some ED receivers out that would provide them a good clean digital picture. These are the ones that have to make the switch to digital in order for HD to grow. The prices of HD sets are going to have to come down a lot to entice many to change as they are perfectly happy as it is. I think this is about to happen as I was in Walmart and they have HD tv's now and on their website they have brands I never heard of. Chinese most likely but they will serve to drive the prices of the major brands down making the sets more affordable for the joe six-packs and mom & pops to watch soaps and game shows.

Sanyo (JAPANESE) 30" widescreen w/ATSC tuner @ Walmart = $650.00 (we're getting there!)!

Quote:


Why would Cox need to have 2 duplicate channels, one analog and one digital to broadcast the content of each station? Seems to me it would be possible to put the local digital on their digital tier and drop the analog and add maybe one sub-cannel for each station without any additional effort on their part since it goes through their STB anyway.

Why not just downconvert the DTV signal? We all KNOW they can do it. Cox is also minimizing their available bandwidth.

Quote:


What really is needed is for the FCC to put a firm cutoff date for analog. Otherwise everyone involved will continue to foot-drag as long as they can get by with it.

AMEN, HALLELUIAH and WELCOME to the World of COMMON SENSE!!!

John Chester

"No matter where you go... there you are."
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post #920 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 06:00 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by johncchester




BUT... they ARE the delivery system of choice for the VAST majority of TV viewers in our area. (I still like the term "pacifier". )

Let's get real, kids... until it happens... WE WON'T COUNT!!!

I think that is the reality here. Cable is the "pacifier" of the masses. The masses wont buy the HDTV's until cable has local HD. Like it or not. Thats the way it is. And that is the one thing that will get analog shut off the soonest, The masses buying HD sets and subscribing to cable HD. But that wont happen in large numbers until the issue of local HD on cable is resloved.

On the issue of foot dragging though. What one entity continually urges and argues with the FCC to keep pushing back the cutoff date? The NAB. Dont blame the FCC. IF you were the FCC which could suffer the reprocussions of angry consumers would you set a firm cut off date when the cable companies and broadcasters were still fighting over locals?
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post #921 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 06:01 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by jkhome
Actually there are some cable customers (probably quite a few) out there that just get the analog channels, using no STB but just a cable-ready set. (my mother-in-law is one of those)

Oops, forgot about those on Cox, I'm more familiar with Comcast in Richmond who has just about forced everyone to their digital tier by moving most desired channels there. I guess Cox is headed the same way.

Harold Jackson
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post #922 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 06:17 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by VARTV
WVEC is squeezing the hell out of 13-2.

Looks just fine to me!!
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post #923 of 6671 Old 01-29-2005, 07:20 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Todd
Looks just fine to me!!

Anyone having trouble with 13-2? I can't seem to get my Dish 6000 to lock up on it. I've noticed that with too little BW, those receivers don't like it!

Bill Bibeau, CBT
Retired Broadcasting Engineer
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post #924 of 6671 Old 01-30-2005, 06:57 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by johncchester
Sanyo (JAPANESE) 30" widescreen w/ATSC tuner @ Walmart = $650.00 (we're getting there!)! I'm considering one for the kitchen (where we really watch the MOST).

HA! The high zoot dealer buys a Sanyo from Walmart! I love it. I was certain you would already own one of those double wide refrigerators with a plasma display built into the door. Whatcha got planned for the bath?
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post #925 of 6671 Old 01-30-2005, 07:59 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by BillBibeau
Anyone having trouble with 13-2? I can't seem to get my Dish 6000 to lock up on it. I've noticed that with too little BW, those receivers don't like it!

Looks perfect to me. Absolutely flawless. Pristine. Infact maybe a little bit too much bandwidth. Probably just need a newer reciever. Ive heard those USDTV ones are great.
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post #926 of 6671 Old 01-30-2005, 08:25 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by BillBibeau
Anyone having trouble with 13-2? I can't seem to get my Dish 6000 to lock up on it. I've noticed that with too little BW, those receivers don't like it!

I'm not having any problem receiving it and to me it looks as good as WAVY's 10-3 sweep. Apparently not much BW is dovoted to either one.

Harold Jackson
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post #927 of 6671 Old 01-30-2005, 09:01 AM
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Originally posted by Digitude
HA! The high zoot dealer buys a Sanyo from Walmart! I love it. I was certain you would already own one of those double wide refrigerators with a plasma display built into the door. Whatcha got planned for the bath?

I'm not a "dealer". I'm just a worker bee with as tight a budget as anyone here.

John Chester

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post #928 of 6671 Old 01-30-2005, 11:05 AM
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I am glad to see that other people are starting to get frustrated and vocal about this absurd situation.
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post #929 of 6671 Old 01-30-2005, 11:11 AM
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Originally posted by BillBibeau
Anyone having trouble with 13-2? I can't seem to get my Dish 6000 to lock up on it. I've noticed that with too little BW, those receivers don't like it!

I've got a clear picture with 65 SS this afternoon on 13-2.

It was brought to my attention that I'm not getting 27-1, so some antenna adjustments are in order, I think. Anyone else up this way pulling in UPN OTA?

Jay N.
Williamsburg, VA
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post #930 of 6671 Old 01-30-2005, 12:42 PM
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It was brought to my attention that I'm not getting 27-1, so some antenna adjustments are in order, I think. Anyone else up this way pulling in UPN OTA?

I'm in Williamsburg and get great signal strength from 27-1 on both my DTC-100 and HD-TIVO. The only channel I don't get at all is WB (33-1).

BTW, you can also receive some of the Richmond digitals (ABC, CBS, and sometimes PBS) OTA in Williamsburg as well.

I have two horizontally stacked 4228's (one pointed to Richmond and one pointed to Driver).

Brian
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