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post #11941 of 11970 Old 02-15-2015, 09:45 AM
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Matt,
I have full signal bars in Oxford for 20.1.


But my CBS 62.1 went totally out Sat. night an still not back. Anybody else?
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post #11942 of 11970 Old 02-15-2015, 10:05 AM
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WWJ-DT added a subchannel, last night. 62.2 is now "Decades." You may need to rescan.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decades_%28TV_network%29

Walking the fine line between jaw-dropping and a plain ol' yawn.

Last edited by DrDon; 02-15-2015 at 10:30 AM.
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post #11943 of 11970 Old 02-18-2015, 10:39 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDon View Post
WWJ-DT added a subchannel, last night. 62.2 is now "Decades." You may need to rescan.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Decades_%28TV_network%29
Cool Concept -- Binge watching of classic shows... I wish Get Smart was upcoming (instead of last month) though...

Thanks for letting us know!

Dave
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post #11944 of 11970 Old 02-18-2015, 02:34 PM
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they are doing the binge thing until their official launch on Memorial Day
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post #11945 of 11970 Old 03-08-2015, 04:46 AM
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FWIW The addition of "Decades" also included a whole a new encoder, I'm told.

Walking the fine line between jaw-dropping and a plain ol' yawn.
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post #11946 of 11970 Old 03-09-2015, 05:50 AM
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how does it encode differently?
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post #11947 of 11970 Old 03-09-2015, 06:28 AM
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From the looks of things, "better."

Walking the fine line between jaw-dropping and a plain ol' yawn.
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post #11948 of 11970 Old 03-09-2015, 08:48 AM
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do you have a spec sheet differentiation between old and new?
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post #11949 of 11970 Old 03-09-2015, 08:53 AM
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Lord no. TV is in a different building, so getting eyes on the new gear ain't happening until the next time I have a reason to go over there. You gotta admit, it looks better now - even with a subchannel - than it was looking a year ago. Maybe if Carol Cain calls in sick, this week, they'll have me sub and I can find out more.
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post #11950 of 11970 Old 03-12-2015, 11:35 AM
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Interesting news for those of us who are BHN customers. Charter is in talks to buy BHN per this article: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...house-networks

I'm guessing that this would only happen if the Comcast deal blows up. In that case, Charter would be after TWC instead.
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post #11951 of 11970 Old 03-12-2015, 08:15 PM
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Originally Posted by yimitz View Post
Interesting news for those of us who are BHN customers. Charter is in talks to buy BHN per this article: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/articl...house-networks

I'm guessing that this would only happen if the Comcast deal blows up. In that case, Charter would be after TWC instead.
Let's all hope the Comcast deal implodes.
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post #11952 of 11970 Old 04-15-2015, 10:16 AM
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I am in Farmington Hills near 9 Mile and Inkster and have problems.

I have a 25-year old Archer VU-110, VHF/UHF/FM pointing at C 9.1. It also does C 2.x well.
And a RCA ANT751 UHF antenna aimed at magnetic 90 as closely as I can. 
They are 25 ft above ground and go into Antenna's Direct EU385CF UHF/VHF Antenna Combiner.



I recently cut off the outdoor portion of my coax, pushed some of the spare inside the attic out and re-terminated it. And replaced the grounding block a.k.a. antenna discharge unit. 



I have an old Sony DHG-HDD500 DVR which can be brought back from the brain dead by rebooting to confirm that it can do a good picture when my TiVo Premier XL displays a mess for the same channel.

1. Per tvfool 56.1 and 20.1 are both at magnetic 104. 56.1 has good PQ. But 20.1 gets a "problem with signal" message on my TiVo.

2. Per tvfool 7.1 is at magnetic 86 and 4.1 is at at magnetic 83. 7.1 occasionally has a good picture for brief intervals but 7.x are usually a mess. This is true with both tuners in the TiVo. But 4.1 is good.

I am mystified. Suggestions, comments, insults, relevant information is greatly appreciated.
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post #11953 of 11970 Old 04-15-2015, 04:45 PM - Thread Starter
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WXYZ swaps Live Well for Laff

As of April 15, WXYZ has dropped the Live Well Network and added the Laff channel. It's still 480i.

Roger in DTW
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post #11954 of 11970 Old 04-15-2015, 05:06 PM
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As of April 15, WXYZ has dropped the Live Well Network and added the Laff channel. It's still 480i.
I am in mourning.
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post #11955 of 11970 Old 04-16-2015, 07:12 AM
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Originally Posted by humbug2 View Post
I am in Farmington Hills near 9 Mile and Inkster and have problems.

I have a 25-year old Archer VU-110, VHF/UHF/FM pointing at C 9.1. It also does C 2.x well.
And a RCA ANT751 UHF antenna aimed at magnetic 90 as closely as I can. 
They are 25 ft above ground and go into Antenna's Direct EU385CF UHF/VHF Antenna Combiner.



I recently cut off the outdoor portion of my coax, pushed some of the spare inside the attic out and re-terminated it. And replaced the grounding block a.k.a. antenna discharge unit. 



I have an old Sony DHG-HDD500 DVR which can be brought back from the brain dead by rebooting to confirm that it can do a good picture when my TiVo Premier XL displays a mess for the same channel.

1. Per tvfool 56.1 and 20.1 are both at magnetic 104. 56.1 has good PQ. But 20.1 gets a "problem with signal" message on my TiVo.

2. Per tvfool 7.1 is at magnetic 86 and 4.1 is at at magnetic 83. 7.1 occasionally has a good picture for brief intervals but 7.x are usually a mess. This is true with both tuners in the TiVo. But 4.1 is good.

I am mystified. Suggestions, comments, insults, relevant information is greatly appreciated.
It sounds like you have a lot going on for being so close to the TV towers (2-5 miles for all of them), like why do you have 2 UHF antennas tied together with an antenna combiner? That sounds like a recipe for disaster. Literally I have used a paperclip on the antenna input of a TV in a commercial building at 11 Mile and Evergreen and gotten a usable signal. Maybe you should look at scaling back some of this as you may be overloading the input of your tuner.
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post #11956 of 11970 Old 04-16-2015, 08:05 AM
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Quote:
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It sounds like you have a lot going on for being so close to the TV towers (2-5 miles for all of them), like why do you have 2 UHF antennas tied together with an antenna combiner? ...
you may be overloading the input of your tuner.
The Archer Antenna feeds real VHF through the combiner which filters out UHF. This gets me C 9.1 and C 2.x. The RCA antenna feeds UHF through the combiner which filters out VHF. This gets the rest of my channels.

TiVo tech support said their tuners were not easily overloaded and this should not be my problem.

I have read that TiVo does not show strength but quality of the signal. But they call it strength and so will I.

I have watched signal strength on many occasions and have not seen any indication of near maximum on the TiVo or maximum on the Sony. The channels I have problems with show lower than some with good PQ and higher than others with good PQ. The main characteristic of a problematic channel is major fluctuations in the signal on the TiVo.

Comments, etc. are appreciated.
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post #11957 of 11970 Old 04-20-2015, 07:54 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by humbug2 View Post
TiVo tech support said their tuners were not easily overloaded and this should not be my problem.
Comments, etc. are appreciated.
TiVo tech support vs actual local engineer? I'm going with Gary every time.

Call it whatever you want, but IIRC, most of those "signal meters" simply display the reverse of the amount of error correction being used. Doesn't help much with anything other than coarse adjustments.

Easy way to test things. Stick some $10 rabbit ears on the TiVo. Yeah, you'll lose CBET, but if everything else comes in fine and stable, then overload was your issue.
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post #11958 of 11970 Old 04-20-2015, 08:12 AM
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Quote:
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TiVo tech support vs actual local engineer? I'm going with Gary every time.

Call it whatever you want, but IIRC, most of those "signal meters" simply display the reverse of the amount of error correction being used. Doesn't help much with anything other than coarse adjustments.

Easy way to test things. Stick some $10 rabbit ears on the TiVo. Yeah, you'll lose CBET, but if everything else comes in fine and stable, then overload was your issue.
Yesterday I tried a FM trap which had been suggested. No discernible effect. Removed that and inserted a variable signal attenuator. I varied the attenuator from min to max pausing at several points. It did lower the indication for C 9 which continued to have good PQ. C 4.1 went into erratic pixelation. C 20.1 and C 7.1 continued to have the same problems with no apparent effects.

Suggestions are appreciated. I have a parts closet with a half-century's accumulation of things A-V and I think there is a bow tie there which I will try.
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post #11959 of 11970 Old 04-20-2015, 09:11 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DrDon View Post
TiVo tech support vs actual local engineer? I'm going with Gary every time.

Call it whatever you want, but IIRC, most of those "signal meters" simply display the reverse of the amount of error correction being used. Doesn't help much with anything other than coarse adjustments.

Easy way to test things. Stick some $10 rabbit ears on the TiVo. Yeah, you'll lose CBET, but if everything else comes in fine and stable, then overload was your issue.
That sounds like a good course of action. I live about the same distance from the towers at 11 1/2 mile and Stevenson. I can get all the locals including WJBK on RF7 at full strength with just a bowtie in the attic and nearly 50 ft. of coax with no amp. I have to go outdoors for CBET. My results at near the set on the first floor are pretty spotty. My antenna has to look through the wire mesh behind the plaster in the walls that make the downstairs multipath city for me.
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post #11960 of 11970 Old 04-21-2015, 08:41 AM
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I tried a bow tie on the 6 foot cable to the TiVo. There are very large windows on the West and Northwest sides of the room. I aimed it due West then tried rotating it Northward until aimed at the Antenna for 7.1. Problems with 7.1 continued with no noticeable difference. C 62.1, less than 2 miles away, went from good, which it normally is, to periodic pixelation and freezing.

One thing that I find curious is watching the TiVo "Signal Strength" meter. It shows good readings well into the green while the picture displayed for 7.1 is badly broken up and 20.1 gives an error message not a picture. Other times the strength will fluctuate wildly and rapidly from 70s to 20s or even turn off the strength display for a second.
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post #11961 of 11970 Old 04-21-2015, 10:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by humbug2 View Post

One thing that I find curious is watching the TiVo "Signal Strength" meter. It shows good readings well into the green while the picture displayed for 7.1 is badly broken up and 20.1 gives an error message not a picture. Other times the strength will fluctuate wildly and rapidly from 70s to 20s or even turn off the strength display for a second.
That's the problem with a meter that's calculated on error correction and not actual signal quality. If it's so bad it CAN'T use error correction, then the amount of error correction goes to zero and the meter goes fullscale green. I can swing my array to point at my neighbor's house and the mutipath gives me two signals of nearly equal strength on WJBK. Full scale signal on the tuner, no picture. At least that's how I figure it.
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post #11962 of 11970 Old 04-21-2015, 11:56 AM
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That's the problem with a meter that's calculated on error correction and not actual signal quality. If it's so bad it CAN'T use error correction, then the amount of error correction goes to zero and the meter goes fullscale green. I can swing my array to point at my neighbor's house and the mutipath gives me two signals of nearly equal strength on WJBK. Full scale signal on the tuner, no picture. At least that's how I figure it.
Remember that digital is a much different animal than the old analog transmission days. High signal strength can overload a tuner, and multipath is something to be avoided at all costs. It can be caused by nearby hills, buildings, trees (I have seen trees blowing in the wind make a signal completely unwatchable, yet it is fine on calm days) and as Bozzmonster mentions, wire mesh lathe for plaster walls. Just putting the antenna near a window is not enough. Remember that even you can cause multipath if you are near the antenna or walking around in the room. A small antenna in the attic or on a small pole outside is probably the best option, so long as there are not a lot of trees nearby.
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post #11963 of 11970 Old 04-21-2015, 12:08 PM
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Not to mention planes. I didn't NEED a yagi to pick up Cincinnati stations when I lived in Florence. I needed the narrow beam so the planes that landed over my house didn't mess up my reception

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post #11964 of 11970 Old 04-22-2015, 08:49 AM
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Not to mention planes. I didn't NEED a yagi to pick up Cincinnati stations when I lived in Florence. I needed the narrow beam so the planes that landed over my house didn't mess up my reception
And right now one from Metro is quite audible. I didn't know this could be a factor. It might explain the times when a show is faultless except for a few brief instances of problems.

Additionally my antenna sees nothing but trees for almost half the year. They are particularly thick in all directions to broadcast towers.
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post #11965 of 11970 Old Yesterday, 09:15 AM
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Hi Everyone,

First time posting here. My current TV setup is an indoor antenna using a Terk UHF/VHF HDTVa antenna in which I am getting all the signals that I want that I normally watch. Most of the time I'm getting CBET-TV9 clearly but usually around 9:45-9:50pm this spring, I have lost signal for a few hours for it to only come back around 11:00-11:30pm. This is usually near the end of hockey games that I'm recording and I lose the last little bit. It is quite annoying.

I live in Novi, MI. My antenna is pointed NorthEast closer to direct North as I don't have a compass and my VHF rabbit ears are pointed direct West. My antenna is on the second floor of my home. This position usually nets me the best signal for CBC all day long but I get that drop out at that time.


Any help would be much appreciated. I'm limited to using an indoor antenna only as I do not want to add an antenna to the roof and because I'm getting the reception I need except for a few hours a night.

Since I do not have 5 posts, I am unable to post my tvfool report but once I get to 5 posts I will.

Thank you.
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post #11966 of 11970 Old Yesterday, 09:20 AM
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Hi Everyone,

First time posting here. My current TV setup is an indoor antenna using a Terk UHF/VHF HDTVa antenna in which I am getting all the signals that I want that I normally watch. Most of the time I'm getting CBET-TV9 clearly but usually around 9:45-9:50pm this spring, I have lost signal for a few hours for it to only come back around 11:00-11:30pm. This is usually near the end of hockey games that I'm recording and I lose the last little bit. It is quite annoying.

I live in Novi, MI. My antenna is pointed NorthEast closer to direct North as I don't have a compass and my VHF rabbit ears are pointed direct West. My antenna is on the second floor of my home. This position usually nets me the best signal for CBC all day long but I get that drop out at that time.


Any help would be much appreciated. I'm limited to using an indoor antenna only as I do not want to add an antenna to the roof and because I'm getting the reception I need except for a few hours a night.

Since I do not have 5 posts, I am unable to post my tvfool report but once I get to 5 posts I will.

Thank you.
My antenna location is actually quite a bit different then what I posted.

The UHF portion is actually SouthEast close to direct East. And the VHF portion is actually almost direct North on one ear and the other ear is South west.

Sorry about the confusion.
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post #11967 of 11970 Old Yesterday, 10:52 AM
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Need to know what model Terk antenna are you using and give us a more precise location of your house. Novi's a big place. 8 & Haggerty's a lot different from Pontiac Trail and Beck. A link to your TVFool.com results wouldn't hurt. You only have 2 posts, so you'd have to PM me that (I can edit it in). Also tell us where in the house this antenna is, i.e. "in the second-floor bedroom, which is in the northwest corner."

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post #11968 of 11970 Old Yesterday, 11:11 AM
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Need to know what model Terk antenna are you using and give us a more precise location of your house. Novi's a big place. 8 & Haggerty's a lot different from Pontiac Trail and Beck. A link to your TVFool.com results wouldn't hurt. You only have 2 posts, so you'd have to PM me that (I can edit it in). Also tell us where in the house this antenna is, i.e. "in the second-floor bedroom, which is in the northwest corner."
Thank you DrDon.

I'm using a Terk Antenna Model HDTVa Indoor antenna

I'm on the second floor of my house in the master bedroom which is the Northwest corner of the house. I am at Napier and 12 mile road basically on the border of Novi and Wixom. The biggest crossroads near my house is Wixom and Grand River. http://www.tvfool.com/?option=com_wr...f1f029014fcfce Thanks a lot for your help.

Last edited by DrDon; Yesterday at 11:22 AM.
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post #11969 of 11970 Old Yesterday, 11:38 AM
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So you have the whole house between you and the television stations. That's a lot of multipath and attenuation opportunities. The plus is that you have a little elevation. The antenna you're using, while stylish, doesn't have enough VHF oomph to make CBET reliable. You can TRY moving it around the room with the pointed end of the antenna aimed at Detroit and the VHF elements perpendicular to that line extended horizontally to around 30 inches tip-to-tip. Thing is, anyone meandering around the 2nd floor of the house could cause dropouts on CBC or FOX. Were it me, and the goal is a stable signal from CBET, I'd go with an roof or attic mounted combo such as this. The TV's on the second floor. If the next level is attic, it should be a piece of cake to snake the coax back down into the room. Naturally, the roof is the better choice. CBET is your toughest "get."

And someone might have a better idea. Keep checking back.

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post #11970 of 11970 Unread Today, 06:04 AM
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Yesterday, I had moved the VHF antenna to horizontal and to the 30 inches and I was able to maintain signal at 10:00pm so it looks like it worked. Although it was minimal signal but it still had signal where as I had nothing the night before. Thanks for your help. Hopefully this will do the trick. The funny thing is at 11:30pm I had almost full signal so it looks like the signal wanes at that time and then goes full power afterwards and I'm not sure why.

Thanks!
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