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post #181 of 3402 Old 03-05-2006, 07:00 AM
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alpha,

Yes, you could get ABC and CBS in HD as long as your TV has a HD tuner.
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post #182 of 3402 Old 03-05-2006, 07:03 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alphastrike View Post

So if I wanted to toss the DVR (not planning to but if), then all I would have to do is plug the coax into the back of the TV and I would get the locals in HD?

IF your TV has a built in digital tuner, that's all you need to get the HD locals, either OTA w/ antenna (free), or via your cableco (if your cableco carries them).

Just connect the coax and do a channel scan via the TV's setup menu.
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post #183 of 3402 Old 03-09-2006, 08:35 AM
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Not sure if any of you have noticed, but 5 is not currently showing their newscast looped on 5-2 and doppler on 5-3, instead the doppler is 5-2, and 5-3 is mirroring 5-1. I emailed the station yesterday to see if they planned on keeping it that way, or if it was a issue at the station, and haven't heard back yet, but if they do keep it that way, I am concerned that 5-3 is sucking bandwidth to show the exact same as 5-1. I know D* can map the same signal to multiple channels without taking up bandwith, so I hope that is the case with 5, otherwise, they need to fix the issue!
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post #184 of 3402 Old 03-09-2006, 09:41 AM
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They're probably remapping, since both channels are 1080i.

Maybe they're mucking with the sub channels in preparation to do upcoming March Madness basketball game multicasts. Just guessing, but the LR CBS affiliate does multicasts of those games.
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post #185 of 3402 Old 03-09-2006, 10:23 AM
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I hope that is the case, I inquired about that as well in my email. If I ever hear anything, I will let you all know! On a different note, did anyone have any issues with their OTA channels from the storms? I had some pixelation on AETN, but that was it this AM.
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post #186 of 3402 Old 03-09-2006, 04:38 PM
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Up here in Carroll County, we lost KFSM-DT for a bit during the hail and very heavy rain storm today. Also lost DirecTV right before the hail hit the ground (but was still falling through the atmosphere). D* was out for about 30 seconds or so. KFSM was out for a few minutes, which is normal here considering we're on the edge of their low power xmitter range, per the FCC.

What's weird is we get LR locals via D* (long story) and are supposedly outside the reach of the D* LR spotbeam. But the LR locals never went out!
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post #187 of 3402 Old 03-09-2006, 11:03 PM
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Regarding KFSM's change in programming on 5-2 and 5-3, here is the response I got when I inquired about the absense of the news repeats on 5-2 a couple of days ago:

"We had to end our broadcast of our news repeat on DT 5.2 and replace it
with our radar. It was a business decision based on costs to operate a
channel. We plan to offer the channel when there is a larger digital
audience available and we can offset our expenses with advertising
revenue.
Thank you far watching and please watch our newscasts at their original
broadcast times on KFSM-DT 5.1.

Van Comer
President and General Manager
KFSM"

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post #188 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 04:29 AM
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I wonder if it's gone from cockscable.
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post #189 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 09:24 AM
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During the Razorback game last night, the pixellation, white static, and all-around poor picture on the digital channel caused me to switch over the analog, which wasn't much better, but was at least watchable.

Was this a local station issue or was it a Jefferson Pilot issue? I didn't notice this as much during the early games.
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post #190 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 11:26 AM
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I have been trying to get OTH DTV reception for about four weeks in Fianna Hills area.

I currently receive:
KOET 3.1 (PBS)
KFSM 5.1 (CBS)
KAFT 13.1 (PBS)
KHBS 40.1 (ABC)

I originally had problems with ABC but it appeared the other day. I do not know why.

I have talked with both the ABC and NBC enginneers. They have been very helpful. I have noticed the ABC enginneer on this board. Thanks Larry, it is great to see your interest in the customers trying to receive OTA HD. Also, thanks for answering your phone!

I am wondering if anyone on the hill in Fianna gets NBC. The enginneer at NBC told me I should be receiving their signal. I am willing to put any antenna up I need to prove a point. If the government tells me I can receive the signal than they must be right. It is frustrating that on top of a hill in the middle of town I can not get all local stations with quality outside antenna (Channel Master 3010 w/amp). If anyone can advise another antenna or someone that knows OTA antennas in the Fort Smith area, please post the info.

A side note: It is also frustrating that after owning a $6000 HDTV for six years, I still cannot watch network programming in HD (directed at NBC). You should provide a waiver to customers or get your towers going. I know there is a lot to it for the station, but HD is no surprise. It has been around for almost twenty years. The customers are doing their part. We are buying the equipment and watching the shows. All we want is a signal that matches the technology in 2006.
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post #191 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 01:47 PM
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On KHOG last night, the pixelation at one point locked up my receiver and I had to reset it to watch it. The last time there was an issue, it was weather related, but at the point in time last night it was bad out, I don't recall any weather issues. Pretty frustrating.
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post #192 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 01:52 PM
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DasGeek, I live about 10 miles southeast of you on a hill on the north side of Greenwood, and get our NBC station's digital signal on channel 27 (KFTA-DT) with a Channel Master 4221 antenna and 7777 amplifier hooked to a new H-20 receiver. Neither the H-20 nor my older Hughes HTL-HD can read the channel's PSIP information though, so it shows up as 27-1 with no program or station information. If you haven't done so already, you might want to try a manual scan for channel 27.

My understanding is that they're still broadcasting at low power. I'd be interested in knowing what the NBC engineers might have said about their power output and PSIP implementation.
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post #193 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 04:54 PM
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40/29 thank you for joining these forums and posting. I admire that, and although we realize any answers will be unofficials ones, it's really great for representatives of a broadcaster to be here. Here in Fayetteville 40/29 PQ on Cox HD is amazing. No complaints by me. Are there any plans to have the local news in HD?

I am wondering if KNWA, KFSM and FOX can come online too? That would be great.
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post #194 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 05:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by arkeng View Post

...Neither the H-20 nor my older Hughes HTL-HD can read the channel's PSIP information though, so it shows up as 27-1 with no program or station information....

arkeng,
I don't think the H20 uses PSIP at all for the channel info banner or guide. I was told that it gets all of the info from the D* advanced program guide. So KFTA must not be doing PSIP correctly and they must not be providing program guide info to D* either.
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post #195 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 08:24 PM
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I'll try to answer a few things, or just ramble.

First, sorry for the sorry (no pun intended) basketball video yesterday. JP is using AMC 2 which seems to be very weak and using an analog signal to boot. Hardly anybody is still using analog on KU band satellites. Anyway, what you saw yesterday is the best we could pick up on any of five dishes. Apparently a lot of the problem is the weather because we didn't do anything and it looks fine today.

Don't know why anybody should be getting blocking on 29-1. The power level has been rock steady at 100% for months and looks good on our Samsung HDTV and Sencore analyzer. That transmitter is better than 40's. It is totally solid state and uses 24 power modules. If one were to fail, we would still be able to make 100% power. After that, it would go down in 1/24 th increments. We did have a problem the other night with a tripped primary power circuit breaker which took it down hard until the engineer could drive to the transmitter. But that happened at 1 AM and was back on by 2 AM. No cause for the tripped breaker could be found. Wednesday morning 29-1 went into a loop playing the same few seconds of video over and over. It was OK on 40-1. The engineer on call reported he was on his way to the transmitter and I happened to be arriving at the studio at 6:00 AM for a trip to OK City. I found that the loop was at the box called Streambridge. It takes the CH 40 PID and changes it to 29 's PID so 40's signal does not go through it. I rebooted the box and that fixed the problem. I called the Fay engineer and told him he could go back home for awhile.

News in HD. I wish! Hearst-Argyle is buying HD equipment for the top three markets of their 27 stations this year. Guess who is the smallest market? Besides, I can imagine how much the anchors will be complaining when everybody can see every ugly zit. Right now, all we are capable of doing in HD is patching ABC directly into the transmitters or else the single HD deck we have been using to tape delay Lost. Anything else and we have to bust back to SD.

We are going to ask for money for 5.1 equipment for ABC next year. It takes 1 1/2 years to get something in the budget. That's life in a big corporation. Wish us luck if you have 5.1

Would you guys like to see some equipment pictures?

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post #196 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 08:35 PM
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4029engineering,
Thanks for all the info. I'm sure it's appreciated by all on this forum.

I too, am also still getting occasional macroblocking glitches (usually a few mostly white macroblocks in a row), but signal is strong and steady at the time they happen.

Pictures would be nice :-)
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post #197 of 3402 Old 03-10-2006, 08:50 PM
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4029engineering,
Indeed yes, pictures would be appreciated.
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post #198 of 3402 Old 03-11-2006, 09:51 AM
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I spent the entire day yesterday researching an antenna solution. I am more confused now that ever. Most of the people I talk to that sell antennas over the internet suggest that it will be very hard for me to get all the channels I want without a rotator. I refuse to use a rotator. One guy recomended a Winegard HD7084P. It is almost ten feet long. I also think it is directional so the rotator is going to be needed.

The one thing I do know about our area is that getting all the basic networks off air is almost impossible. The towers are in every direction. The terrain is terrible. I think I am going to give up. The only channel I am not getting now is NBC. Of course that is the channel I want most (The Office and My Name Is Earl). NBC's signal is unwatchable on Dish Network. I would like to get better signal on other channels but at least I am receiving them.

ArkEng, Did you buy your antenna locally? I would like to buy locally so I can return if it does not work well.

One thing I am considering is getting an antenna that will pick up the Tulsa towers. They are all in the same place. I assume that their NBC is broadcasting HD. Does anyone know?
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post #199 of 3402 Old 03-11-2006, 04:00 PM
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DasGeek,
I bought the 4221 and the 7777 preamp a couple of years ago from Wise Electronics on Dodson. I got the 4221 instead of a more directive antenna because of the diverse locations of our digital locals and because they're all UHF except for KAFT-DT (RF channel 9), and chose the 7777 because it covers both UHF and VHF.

The Tulsa NBC station, KJRH-DT, channel 2-1 (RF channel 56) is transmitting network shows in HD. I get it with a good signal here in Greenwood, usually around 80 percent. If you haven't already, you should try pointing your present antenna toward Tulsa and doing a scan for Tulsa stations to see what you might get.

I don't know the particulars for your exact location, and I'm not familiar with the 3010 you're using, and I'm no antenna expert either, so I couldn't say whether or not you could improve your reception or get Tulsa stations with a 4221 or similar antenna. But I can offer a few observations based on my location and setup. It appears that the KFSM and KHBS and KAFT transmitters may be close to 90 degrees off-axis at your location if your antenna was pointed toward Tulsa, and the 4221 has a deep null around 90 degrees off-axis, so reception of your CBS and ABC and PBS locals could be an issue if you went with a 4221 or more directive antenna. But since you're receiving those stations now with your present setup, you may or may not have a problem with something like the 4221. KAFT-DT could be more of a problem, since it's both off-axis and VHF (out-of-band for the 4221). I get around a 65 percent signal strength for KAFT-DT with the 4221 pointed at Tulsa, but only with the preamp, without it, no signal. And finally, if you're now getting a good signal from KOET-DT in Eufaula with your present setup, then that may be an indication that your location would allow reception of the Tulsa stations with something like a 4221 or 4228 and a preamp. I get KOET-DT with about 80 percent signal strength. But nothing is certain in life and television reception...

I myself have been rethinking my decision to go with the 4221 instead of a more directive antenna like the 4228, because I've found that I can get both KFSM-DT and KHBS-DT on my old Hughes HTL-HD receiver with a six-inch piece of copper wire stuck in the antenna connector in back if I bend it right, so a bit more directivity in an antenna might not be an issue. I'd really like to get the Tulsa Fox station.

Good luck with your reception efforts, let us know what you decide.
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post #200 of 3402 Old 03-11-2006, 08:19 PM
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I didn't like the rotor solution either. I'm not as big a TV watcher as you guys so I don't want to pull in Tulsa. I am in Van Buren so I installed two Radio Shack UHF antennas. Pointed one at Cavanal for KHBS (shooting through a pecan tree), one towards Mountainburg for NBC, KFSM and KAFT. Even though KAFT is VHF, I am getting enough signal to watch it most of the time. I'll probably add a cheap VHF/UHF one of these days to make it better. I used a two way splitter in reverse on the mast to combine the two antannas to one coax to my receivers.

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post #201 of 3402 Old 03-12-2006, 06:19 AM
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I am surprised that you got that to work. I have read alot about combining two antennas together. I know there are many issues with the two antennas phasing together and not canceling each others signal. Glad you got it to work. Everyone I have talked to about it say it is a real gamble.
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post #202 of 3402 Old 03-12-2006, 07:56 AM
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DasGeek,
It is a crap shoot. Either it works, or works until the atmospheric conditions or seasons change, or fails miserably. Fortunately, it works well for me up here on a hill in Carroll County. I'm getting KFSM, KAFT, KHOG and Springfield channels KYTV and KOZK.

4029engineering,
Have y'all gotten any reports of the infamous reboot loop problem from viewers with the new H20 DirecTV/OTA HDTV receivers? When tuning to a particular OTA channel with the H20, it goes into a continuous reboot loop. In my case, it happens to be 29-1, which I've had to remove from my channel list.

Problem started a couple of weeks ago and stopped. Without warning, the problem resurfaced again yesterday morning (saturday). D* says they're aware of the problem and the only fix they offer is to remove the offending channel from the locals list, which I had already done. But I would like to watch 29-1 again!
Any expert insight into the cause of this problem would be appreciated.
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post #203 of 3402 Old 03-12-2006, 01:05 PM
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Two Antennas: A little bit of misconception or missing some physics there. Combining two antennas ON THE SAME CHANNEL is tricky. You have to trim the length of one cable until you get the signal from the two antennas to combine in phase. This isn't as hard as it seems. The length needed is determined by wavelength which is the speed of light divided by the frequency. So at UHF frequencies the magic length is usually within one foot. You can also build a phase shifter which is easier than trimming cable. But all this is more than I care to deal with here. One thing for sure, if I lived in an area where I needed the gain I wouldn't hesitate to combine one or more antennas dedicated to a channel I really wanted to watch and combine them with a reversed splitter trimming the lead from each antenna for max signal strength. Once the lengths are trimmed properly, it won't have to be done again.

If the two antennas are back to back, as in my case, you are not mixing the same channel. A splitter combines the totally separate frequencies into one cable quite nicely with about 3dB of loss to each signal.

The reboot problem is a new one on me. One thing for sure, Direct does it alot. I'll be in the middle of a good program and suddenly my receiver will be rebooting. I've never had it happen OTA, only on their own sat feeds.

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post #204 of 3402 Old 03-12-2006, 02:09 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4029engineering View Post

...If the two antennas are back to back, as in my case, you are not mixing the same channel....

There is one exception where there may be unintended mixing of the same channel from 2 back to back or off axis antennas:

If the signal is fairly strong and you get the same channel arriving from different directions bouncing off hills or buildings. This is a fairly common problem in hilly parts of Little Rock with their transmitters in different locations. In some areas of town, the two antenna setup may be 180° back to back, but you get multipath problems, and reception is problematic. Newer tuners handle this better, though.

Quote:


The reboot problem is a new one on me. One thing for sure, Direct does it alot. I'll be in the middle of a good program and suddenly my receiver will be rebooting. I've never had it happen OTA, only on their own sat feeds.

Hmm. My H20 receivers have never rebooted in the middle of a non-OTA program, only when tuning to 29-1 and the H20 OTA reboot bug strikes.

What D* receiver do you have? If it's a Samsung TS160 or TS360 with recurrent rebooting, the box is defective.
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post #205 of 3402 Old 03-12-2006, 03:29 PM
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It's a TS360. I figured if that's what Direct is giving customers, I should have one so I see what they see.

Antennas: Yes it can get complicated depending on your location. Multipath is the biggest killer of OTA DTV, esp on the first generation receivers. That is what kills a lot of indoor rabbit ear attempts to receive DTV.

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post #206 of 3402 Old 03-12-2006, 06:47 PM
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Hey 40/29,

I was watching the Miami Heat/Cavs game in HD and when I checked back the game was only in SD. I noticed that the Tornado Watch screen was in effect. Do you have to switch the signal to SD just to show the Tornado Watch map on the screen? Or was this unrelated? Just wondering.
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post #207 of 3402 Old 03-13-2006, 06:44 AM
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Desperate Housewives was not in HD last night. If I'm going to have to watch Desperate Housewives I must at lease have it in HD. What happened?
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post #208 of 3402 Old 03-13-2006, 08:33 AM
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arxaw-I haven't had any issues with my H20 rebooting on 29-1, that's very interesting though. Is that a low-strength station for you?
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post #209 of 3402 Old 03-13-2006, 09:11 AM
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nope. strongest station I get. It's an H20 bug, as it's happening all over the country on different stations. D* is aware of the problem, but whether they fix it is anybody's guess. Current workaround per D*: Don't watch that channel.

Someone else posted in the H20 thread that you can tune to the next higher channel you get, then go down to the offending channel (29-1 in my case), and the box won't lock up. But you can't leave the box on 29-1. If you turn the box off & back on, you risk the blue screen of death on startup.

This problem has happened randomly on both of my H20s.
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post #210 of 3402 Old 03-13-2006, 11:23 AM
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DasGeek,
We had to break down HD so we could put in the weather bugs and crawls.

I know this doesn't make you HD fanatics happy. You can be mad, or you can get glad, but when the weather is bad HD WILL come down and the weather bugs will go in. That's just the way it is, you might as well get used to it.

HD is but one mode of DTV. DTV is the REPLACEMENT for ATV. Anything we run on ATV WILL be run on DTV. For every one of you guys with 50+ inch HDTV screens and 5.1 surround sound there are 100 viewers with plain old vanilla DTV that they ran down to walmart and bought last Christmas. That number will grow between now and the analog shutoff date until DTV is all there is. This is their TV from now on. 40/29 has been, and always will be THE local weather channel, the place to go to for weather, and live, local, late breaking news. If we are able save just ONE life, it will be worth loosing a million HD viewers. Even if we were running multiple subchannels, we would still break em down for weather. We absolutely will not take a chance on missing that one person.

For mcrendog, the only way we can do HD at the moment is to patch ABC directly into the transmitter or playback from one single HD tape deck. Anything else and HD has to come down so we can do it in SD.

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