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post #1 of 7466 Old 05-26-2003, 03:31 PM - Thread Starter
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I say we share some info, and I'll start.

Reciever: Zenith HD-SAT520
Antenna: Channel Master Stealth (Model 3010)
Amp: None
Area: South Arlington
Channels Recieved:
4-1 Fox
5-1 NBC
8-1 ABC
8-2 Weather Map
11-1 CBS
13-1 KERA
21-1 UPN/HDNET
21-2 Weather Map
27-1 KDFI
33-1 WB
39-1 Don't Watch
48-1 Don't Watch
51-2 Don't Watch
68-1 PAX

All channels come in with good signal strength and no dropouts since I went to using the Stealth Antenna.

E4B
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post #2 of 7466 Old 05-26-2003, 07:45 PM
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I'm up in Plano with a roof-mounted Winegard antenna and a Zenith HDR-230. Before that, I was using a Toshiba DST-3000 -- but the change hasn't affected what I can receive.

I'm getting everything that you list, plus 24-1 and 58-1. I did manage to receive 2-1 on one occasion, but it was generally too weak, and now seems to be off the air.
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post #3 of 7466 Old 05-28-2003, 10:23 AM
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I receive 14 DTV stations here in Plano. This includes KXII in Sherman, TX at a distance of just under 70 miles!

Here is some information I obtained with my HiDTV PC tuner card...

KDTN-DT (2) 43 Cannot receive weak signal most of the time.

KDFW-DT (4) 35-1 FOX
704x480P, 16:9, 17.700 Mbps video, 59.94 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio

KXAS-DT (5) 41-1 NBC
1920x1088I, 16:9, 18.170 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 256 Kbps audio

WFAA-DT (8) 9-1 ABC
1920x1080I, 16:9, 16.190 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio
WFAA-DT (8) 9-2 Weather
704x480I, 4:3, 2.398 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio

KTVT-DT (11) 19-1 CBS
1920x1080I, 16:9, 19.100 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio

KXII-DT (12) 20-1 CBS
1920x1080I, 16:9, 19.190 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio

KERA-DT (13) 14-1 PBS
1920x1080I, 16:9, 14.000 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio

KTXA-DT (21) 18-1 UPN & HDNet
1920x1080I, 16:9, 16.690 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio
KTXA-DT (21) 18-2 Weather
704x480I, 4:3, 2.500 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio

KUVN-DT (23) 24-1
704x480I, 4:3, 9.200 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio

KDFI-DT (27) 36-1 I do not cosistently receive this weak signal.
704x480P, 4:3, 45.000 Mbps video, 59.94 frames/sec, 192 Kbps audio

KDAF-DT (33) 32-1 WB
720x480P, 16:9, 7.920 Mbps video, 59.94 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio
1920x1080I, 16:9, 13.990 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 384 Kbps audio

KXTX-DT (39) 40-1
704x480I, 4:3, 15.000 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 192 Kbps audio

KSTR-DT (49) 48-1
704x480I, 4:3, 15.000 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 192 Kbps audio

KFWD-DT (52) 51-1
704x480I, 4:3, 15.000 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 192 Kbps audio


KPXD-DT (68) 42-1 PAX
704x480I, 4:3, 15.000 Mbps video, 29.97 frames/sec, 192 Kbps audio

A few comments and questions...

Note for KERA-DT 14-1 and KXAS-DT 41-1-- 1088I is not a typo. Is 1088I really possible?

KDAF-DT 32-1 actually uses 480P most of the time but switches to 1080I for the WB HTDV programs.

Note for KDFI-DT 36-1 -- they were showing a video bit rate of 45 Mbps. That is impossible but that is what is my tuner displayed.

Can anyone explain how a tuner obtains all this information? Is this part of the PSIP data or is it actually extracted from the video and audio data? If the info is obtained from the PSIP data, than station operator error could explain the bogus numbers.

Thanks.
DonP
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post #4 of 7466 Old 06-01-2003, 11:39 AM
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Okay - here goes - received the Samsung 165 STB yesterday and couldn't wait - so I ran out to BestBuy on 635 and picked up a Silver Sensor. Plugged it in, scanned , and here's what I get......

4-1 Fox
5-1 NBC
8-1 ABC
8-2 Weather Map
11-1 CBS
13-1 KERA
21-1 UPN/HDNET
21-2 Weather Map
24-1 Univision
27-1 KDFI
33-1 WB
39-1 Telemundo
48-1 No idea (spanish)
51-1 No idea
68-1 PAX

Basically - the UPN / HDNET is absolutely incredible. The rest of the major networks are great, but for some reason I get black bars on the sides - is this normal? TV is 16:9 and I thought all HD content was 16:9 no?

Silver Sensor pulls in the channel 8 ABC NO PROBS but I do have to get up and move it in a different direction to the rest of the reception. But I do get black bars on the left and right as well which may not be fun during Monday Night Football.

I wish I had time to read the Samsung instruction book - no patience!


VSapra
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post #5 of 7466 Old 06-02-2003, 03:19 PM
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Using a Terk 55 with no power booster mounter to my second story chimney I get all of the same channels and PBS out of Denton. I noticed someone listed UPN/ HDnet what is the story with that? I hadn't heard about them sharing a channel. Is is showing all the same programing as HDnet via Direct TV?
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post #6 of 7466 Old 06-02-2003, 07:12 PM
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I spoke too soon - flipped on today to watch the Stanley Cup and blammo - no WFAA-DT (8-1)...

damn silver sensor - any idea's how I can get the VHF channel that has all the good stuff (i.e sports)?

VSapra
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post #7 of 7466 Old 06-03-2003, 09:09 AM
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Vsapra

what part of the metroplex in? i have found ABC to be the strongest signal so far. in fact it is to strong for one of my antennas. if you have satelite you can use the terk that attaches directly to it and di-plexes with the RG-6. I had good luck with that antenna on every channel except NBC which was a little to weak to come in steady.
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post #8 of 7466 Old 06-03-2003, 07:49 PM
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LB - I live at Trinity Mills/Tollway in an apt. so I am limited to indoor options - now here's the weird part - on Sunday I got ABC no problemo but last night - not a sausage.

Hope tomorrow is a better day with the hoops and all that.

VSapra
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post #9 of 7466 Old 06-04-2003, 09:27 AM
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VSapra - I will flip it on during the next game and post during the game if it is coming in. I have on rare occassion seen where the station is down for a short period. Got love that bleeding edge techonology.

I know people have knocked them but I have had VERY good luck with the Terk TV55 and i live about 10 miles north of you. It can be set in a window or mounted just outside the window. It even comes with a short flat piece of RG-6 so you can run it thru the window without drilling any holes in your apartment. Just a thought, you could always return it if it didn't work.

Lunchbox
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post #10 of 7466 Old 06-04-2003, 06:28 PM
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Vsapra - The NBA finals are coming in strong and clear up in The Colony. if you still can't tune it in your definately need to go another route with your antenna.

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post #11 of 7466 Old 06-04-2003, 07:10 PM
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well I tried to plug in a rat-shack in-line amplifier and this has definitely improved it a bit, but I am still getting lots of drop-outs.

Here's another question - I am now getting a stronger, but fluctuating signal. The signal meter shows 45-50% for 2 seconds, then 0% and then 45-50% again.

I played around with the Silver Sensor and strangely enough pointing it 180 degrees AWAY from the usual 4-1, 5-1, 11-1, 21-1 signals also gives it a little improvement.

Anyone? Idea's? Help?!? I Need ABC sports..........

VSapra
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post #12 of 7466 Old 06-05-2003, 06:09 AM
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VSapra - Sounds like your getting a signal reflection problem. It is bouncing off of something and hitting your antenna causing it to go out of phase and drop. That's why turning it improved the problem. Unfortunately the only way to correct it is to re-point the antenna as you did or move it to another location.

Have you tried putting the Silver Sensor away from the window for ABC, like on top of the TV? This may help as there won't be as much bounced signal from the side of the building near the window.

good luck

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post #13 of 7466 Old 06-05-2003, 06:29 AM
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Going back to the question of 21-1, you have listed this as UPN/HDNET. Titan-TV only lists it as UPN. Where did you get the HDNET listing? Have you seen any HDNET programing on this channel?

Mike

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post #14 of 7466 Old 06-05-2003, 09:04 AM
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Mike191 - I am an HDTV newbie here - when I turned on my receiver on Sunday (pretty much all day) I got 21-1 - basketball from San Fran with an HDNet Logo at times - I think it was the CableCar Classic.

I did some more research to try and figure out what feeds HDNET is providing and someone else stuck a .pdf with the UPN schedule for the next week on the Dallas Home Theatre Group website.

To answer your question - I am not sure if it is really the real HDNET, maybe just parts of the feed at certain non-primetime hours.

VSapraUPN Schedule
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post #15 of 7466 Old 06-05-2003, 09:10 AM
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Lunchbox -

Have you tried putting the Silver Sensor away from the window for ABC, like on top of the TV? This may help as there won't be as much bounced signal from the side of the building near the window.

Right now , the silver sensor is not close to the window at all - it is about 9 feet high, up on top of my entertainment center, in the middle of my living / dining room (the entertainment shelves seperate the two rooms).

Other questions/thoughts:
Could the ceiling fan be bouncing signals around?
Does 2.4 Ghz Wireless networking impact the signal?
Does a commercial panny plasma put out enough RF interference near the VHF band?

At a loss for idea's on ABC Sports........WFAA-DT , especially since people up in the Colony (20 miles north of me) are having no probs!
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post #16 of 7466 Old 06-05-2003, 09:16 AM
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I also run a 2.4 Ghz home network and don't have any interface.

I strongly believe the problem you are having with WFAA is that they are soooo strong it is bouncing and they only way around it is to find a spot where the antenna doesn't pick up the bounce or try a less sensitive antenna.

I actually have two antenna's and have to switch to my less sensitive one to keep WFAA from droping due to bouncing signals.


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post #17 of 7466 Old 06-05-2003, 12:03 PM
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Skimming through the schedule I see maybe four shows which are in HD. The Basketball and Hockey Finals, Jag and CSI. Is that all there is to HD right now in Dallas and beyond? Doesn't seem worth the trouble to get OTA tuner and antenna. Have I missed anything?

Mike

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post #18 of 7466 Old 06-05-2003, 05:15 PM
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Mike191 - Also Law and Order, CSI and all sorts of stuff on KERA, UPN etc.

Too bad I missed 24...that would have been nice.

OK Lunchbox - the saga continues.......

my silver sensor fell over on its side due to the added weight of the in-line radio shack amplifier and guess what - rock solid WFAA-DT.

So now I have the Stanley Cup on, but it doesn't look like HD, but an upconverted signal, still in 4:3.

VSapra
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post #19 of 7466 Old 06-05-2003, 05:16 PM
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nix that - its just switched to HD.....

boooooooo yaaaaaaah

Vsapra
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post #20 of 7466 Old 06-05-2003, 07:52 PM
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Vsapra - good deal i see you have figured out the antenna mojo. Just screw with till you figure it out or get lucky.

The last NHL game there were a couple of times they forgot to flip the switch to widescreen. As well when they switch to a SD cam we suffer with 4:3.
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post #21 of 7466 Old 06-06-2003, 07:23 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Mike191
Going back to the question of 21-1, you have listed this as UPN/HDNET. Titan-TV only lists it as UPN. Where did you get the HDNET listing? Have you seen any HDNET programing on this channel?

Mike

KTXA-DT has been broadcasting HD Net for a year now. In the beginning we were bradcasting the same HDNet that airs on ch. 199 of DirecTV. Currently we are airing HDNet OTA.

We do switch away for UPN Primetime (Upconvert) on a daily basis.

KTVT/KTXA Engineering

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post #22 of 7466 Old 06-06-2003, 07:25 AM
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Quote:


Originally posted by Mike191
Skimming through the schedule I see maybe four shows which are in HD. The Basketball and Hockey Finals, Jag and CSI. Is that all there is to HD right now in Dallas and beyond? Doesn't seem worth the trouble to get OTA tuner and antenna. Have I missed anything?

Mike

Mike,

Nearly all of the CBS Primetime schedule on KTVT-DT is true 1080i. CBS does not produce any News, News Magazine or reality programming in HD.

KTVT/KTXA Engineering

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post #23 of 7466 Old 06-06-2003, 08:23 AM
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Technobil:

When I overlay the Titan Direct TV 199 schedule with the UPN schedule I do not see the same programs. Where can I view the schedule you say is HDNet? I want to be able to get HDNet but don't really want the hassle of Direct or Dish.

Thanks
Mike

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post #24 of 7466 Old 06-06-2003, 10:30 AM
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Technobill - hats off to the quality of the broadcast - I got a nice strong signal and fabulous picture .....now if only I liked college hoops that much!!!

Vsapra
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post #25 of 7466 Old 06-06-2003, 10:33 AM
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Lunchbox - still some drop-outs during the stanley cup - especially when i walk around the room or am I imagining things? Also seems to only drop when HDTV content is on....not the SD upconverted commercial breaks.....

the antenna is about 3 feet above my head level though.....

the search for ABC DT continues.......

VSapra
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post #26 of 7466 Old 06-06-2003, 12:17 PM
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Technobill,
I noticed lots of A/V dropouts last night (picture goes black and no sound for about a second) watching the Mardi Gras documentary on 21-1. This recurred every few minutes. I had a decent signal -- around 77, which is pretty much what I get across the board for ATSC channels.

I didn't see any dropouts during the hockey game on ABC or while watching ER on NBC. And this is the first time I've noticed any dropouts on 21-1 in the last couple of weeks... was this a temporary glitch in the source or broadcast?

BTW- kudos to KTXA for providing a different HDNet feed from the one on DirecTV 199... two channels for the price of one :-).

-Corey


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post #27 of 7466 Old 06-06-2003, 08:20 PM
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Lunchbox - just when I thought I was out [radio shack] brings me back in..........no dice with the silver sensor sitting on its side - I was still getting drop outs etc.

so I unplugged the inline amp and frankly - all the other channels are still fine without the "minor" amplification.

after more research, and a wild idea of plugging in the STB to the apartment antenna feed , I am now getting WFAA-DT no problem, and I managed to catch the end of the SA/NJ game.

Tomorrow - I return the inline amp, and pick something to combine the Silver Sensor (UHF) and Apartment Complex (VHF) antenna signals.

Any idea's, other than an A/ B Switch?

VSapra
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post #28 of 7466 Old 06-07-2003, 07:04 AM
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VSapra - Are you sure you need the Silver Sensor? Double check the Apartment antenna for all the DT signals. Most complex antennas now are dual VHF and UHF. Your problems are probably due to the large buildings and the wiring and other electronic interference in the complex.

Remember that the $3.00 signal splitter is also a signal combiner. If you really do need to combine the two sources, ask about the best splitter/combiner. Remember Radio Shack uses a thinner cable and I would recommend you use the larger better shielded grade of cable.

Remember to ask about the digital signal frequency and any equipments ability to pass these signals. Some frequencies are not passed by all amplifiers and all splitter/combiners. You may need to get a higher grade. You might consider going to Fry's. Some of the people there do understand these things. You are probably closer to the Garland location. The newest location at LBJ and MacArthur is really a nice store. If you go be careful to leave enough time because you will want to roam for a while.

Good Luck,
Mike

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post #29 of 7466 Old 06-07-2003, 12:17 PM
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Vsapra - The signal spliter/ combiner is my next trick to try. I have read that when you combine two antenna signals it will cause a timing issue and cause dropouts. I don't want to use an A/B switch. I will let you know what i find.

I agree about the building antenna as you should be able to get everything with it and not need the Silver Sensor.

Lunchbox
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post #30 of 7466 Old 06-07-2003, 05:52 PM
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I tried getting other HD signals with the building master antenna , but no dice......no worries - I now get everything with a silver sensor and the WFAA on the building antenna.

Let me know how the signal combiner works out - until then, I will be putting the building antenna input into the "cable" input of my sammy and the ss into the "ant" input and switching via the remote when I need to get my Stanley Cup / Hoops fix.

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