St. Louis, MO - HDTV - Page 441 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Baselworld is only a few weeks away. Getting the latest news is easy, Click Here for info on how to join the Watchuseek.com newsletter list. Follow our team for updates featuring event coverage, new product unveilings, watch industry news & more!


Forum Jump: 
 15Likes
Reply
Thread Tools
post #13201 of 13210 Old 07-19-2015, 03:24 PM
AVS Special Member
 
Robert Simandl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Peters, MO
Posts: 2,861
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 37 Post(s)
Liked: 22
I suspect it's because of the pitifully low bitrate KMOV is using.

I still have recordings of CSI and CSI Miami from several years back. Without commercials, those episodes took up about 5.9GB of space each on my hard drive and had bitrates of well over 15mbps.

New episodes of Zoo only take up about 3.2 to 3.5GB, and the bitrate is often barely over 10mbps. For a "1080i high definition broadcast." Well hey KMOV, guess what? That's the same maximum bitrate that 480p STANDARD DVD'S USE!

Oddly, kSDk's bitrates aren't much better. American Odyssey episodes also take up about 3.5GB each, but they're doing something (relatively) right because American Odyssey and Aquarius episodes consistently look better than Zoo and Under the Dome episodes.

Of course I realize that's setting the bar pretty low.

BTW, KTVI and KPLR, which "only" have 1 extra subchannel each, nowadays look much better than either kSDk or KMOV. Arrow episodes on KPLR have bitrates of 12-13mbps and the file sizes are usually around 4.4GB, not as nice as KMOV used to be but much nicer than KMOV is now. KTVI Wayward Pines episodes are about 4.2GB each.

I haven't watched or recorded anything on ABC lately, so can't comment on KDNL.
turls likes this.

Bob Simandl ... somewhere near St. Louis
Robert Simandl is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #13202 of 13210 Old 07-24-2015, 01:57 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Robert Simandl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Peters, MO
Posts: 2,861
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 37 Post(s)
Liked: 22
I knew these movie subchannels had lots of commercials, but holy crap!

I finally got around to editing the commercials out of 30-3 Grit TV's broadcast of "Armored Attack," a 1943 war movie in a 2-hour time slot. Without commercials, it was only 75 minutes. That's 45 minutes of commercials in a 2 hour slot, or 22 and a half minutes of commercials per hour. Which means only 37 and a half minutes of program per hour.

Silly me for thinking an 82-minute movie in a 2 hour time slot would be relatively uncut.

Bob Simandl ... somewhere near St. Louis
Robert Simandl is offline  
post #13203 of 13210 Old 07-24-2015, 05:31 AM
Advanced Member
 
moman19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 800
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 10
On the positive side, it certainly can't take up much disk space.
moman19 is offline  
post #13204 of 13210 Old 07-24-2015, 11:52 AM
Member
 
kc9hzn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 171
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked: 11
The first subchannel network I had any experience with was TheCoolTV, and I was taken aback by the sheer number of ads. Seems that's how they manage to make their money.
kc9hzn is online now  
post #13205 of 13210 Old 07-24-2015, 07:17 PM
AVS Special Member
 
ProjectSHO89's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2009
Posts: 2,874
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 135 Post(s)
Liked: 92
Except TheCoolTV didn't make any money... or at least didn't pay the stations for carrying the broadcasts.

Yeah, I can't stand watching anything on any of the diginets without DVRing it so the commercials can be skipped.
ProjectSHO89 is offline  
post #13206 of 13210 Old 07-25-2015, 09:56 AM
Advanced Member
 
moman19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 800
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Perhaps the thought process of the broadcasters goes something like this:

"Most OTA viewers are too poor or too cheap to pay for Cable or Satellite. So if they want to view events for free, we're gonna STICK it to them with endless commercials. So, who cares if we have to cut content out of a program or if the primary HD channel quality suffers. They're getting what they pay for....." Hail, hail the almighty dollar!
moman19 is offline  
post #13207 of 13210 Old 07-25-2015, 10:39 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Robert Simandl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Peters, MO
Posts: 2,861
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 37 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Quote:
Originally Posted by moman19 View Post
On the positive side, it certainly can't take up much disk space.
You got THAT right! The movie in question, Armored Attack, ran 75 minutes after removing commercials (should have run 82, which triggered my rant above in the first place) and takes a whopping 1.59GB of disk space.

Bob Simandl ... somewhere near St. Louis
Robert Simandl is offline  
post #13208 of 13210 Old 07-28-2015, 07:06 AM
AVS Special Member
 
Robert Simandl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: St. Peters, MO
Posts: 2,861
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 37 Post(s)
Liked: 22
Well I figured that HAD to be a fluke, so I tried this again with THREE VIOLENT PEOPLE, recorded April 5.

It's a 100 minute movie, in a 2 and a half hour time slot on Grit TV, channel 30-3 in St. Louis. Here's the result in VideoRedo Plus:



Out of a two hour, thirty-one minute recording, the actual movie lasted 99 minutes. That's 52 minutes of commercials in a two and a half hour broadcast.

Check out the green and red bar below the main picture. The green segments are program segments. The red segments are commercial breaks. Several of the commercial breaks are nearly as long as the movie segments.

And am I the only one who gets really annoyed at them broadcasting a 16:9 picture, but letterboxing widescreen content in the 4:3 safe area resulting in black bars on all four sides of the picture? Again, see the pic. The ENTIRE MOVIE was broadcast like this. In fact, those black side bars have been there since February (which was the last time I remember Grit showing a widescreen movie in actual widescreen).

Why are they still bothering to broadcast a 16:9 picture when there's only been 4:3 content for the last six solid months?

Bob Simandl ... somewhere near St. Louis
Robert Simandl is offline  
post #13209 of 13210 Old 07-28-2015, 07:58 AM
Advanced Member
 
moman19's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2003
Location: St. Louis, MO
Posts: 800
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 12 Post(s)
Liked: 10
Quote:
Originally Posted by Robert Simandl View Post
.......Why are they still bothering to broadcast a 16:9 picture when there's only been 4:3 content for the last six solid months?
Choose your poison:

A - No one is minding the store as the system is on auto-pilot
B - No one knows how to tweak the settings at the transmitter
C- No one at the station (somewhere in Ohio, I believe) really cares
D - Where is Jim when we need him?
E - All the above

Simply stating the obvious

BTW, that red/green bar you displayed tells the whole story. Great graphic!
moman19 is offline  
post #13210 of 13210 Unread Today, 06:39 PM
Member
 
kc9hzn's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 171
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 6 Post(s)
Liked: 11
Of course, the long ad breaks (and the repetitive, LCD ads associated with them) are one of the problems with, and a fact of life of, diginets. The goal is to be profitable from day one, both at the network level and the affiliate level. (And, of course, the diginets don't have Big Four money backing them, so the margin for profitability is pretty slim.) In a way, they have an easier road than Fox did when they intended to make MyNetworkTV profitable from day one. MyNetworkTV had to produce new content and had to justify that content with eyeballs. Diginets just have to get enough eyeballs to justify keeping the subchannel on (it helps when the network pays what it's supposed to, otherwise the affiliates rebel, like with TheCoolTV). The network provides enough ad slots to be profitable (major expenditures are content deals, satellite bandwidth, promotion, affiliate contracts), and as long as the affiliate gets enough money, they don't care (subchannel specific expenditures for local stations are E/I programming/compliance, EAS compliance, promotion). Oddly enough, the expenses for a diginet subchannel seem to be fixed, ie it doesn't really matter what they put up as a subchannel, the expenses are likely to be very similar (I have a hunch that the viewership numbers are pretty similar, too).
kc9hzn is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Local HDTV Info and Reception

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off