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post #91 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 11:09 AM
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Okay, now I've really screwed up everything. I got to the menu and changed it to 720p but the screen shifted over to the right so I can only see about 3/4 of the picture. Then I tried going back to 1080i and somehow I really screwed up everything and now I can't even see the menu properly on the screen. I've got all kinds of stuff on the screen but I can't see to read the menu and the stations is kind of coming in too so what do I do now?

[b]Bernie
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post #92 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 11:14 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Gardner View Post

I have the same Fuji plasma as you do, and its performance on SD with a 6412 phase II was, although nothing to write home about, quite reasonable. When my 6412 gave up the ghost and Comcast replaced it with a 3416, SD performance on HDMI went to hell. It's so bad that I had to switch to component on SD. The difference between the 6412 and 3416 on SD via HDMI is quite remarkable--and not for the better.

Interesting. Do you think that you were still receiving analog transmissions for SD on the 6412 and that the switch to the all-digital 3416 is the reason for the difference? The 6412 is capable of receiving the SD channels digitally, but apparently it takes awhile for Comcast to find your and switch. I had analog transmission for several months after the rollout of ADS until I noticed one day that it had switched to digital on the SD channels. Didn't notice that much of a difference, but then my setup is already connected as component because of the HDMI repeater problem with the Denon receiver that sits between the 6412 and the Fuji. I can't imagine why switching from HDMI to component would improve matters . . . unless your component input on the Fuji is calibrated differently than the HDMI.
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post #93 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 11:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Saratoga Lefty View Post

Okay, now I've really screwed up everything. I got to the menu and changed it to 720p but the screen shifted over to the right so I can only see about 3/4 of the picture. Then I tried going back to 1080i and somehow I really screwed up everything and now I can't even see the menu properly on the screen. I've got all kinds of stuff on the screen but I can't see to read the menu and the stations is kind of coming in too so what do I do now?

You can walk through the same thing by powering the box off again and then entering the code to bring up the menu. Even if the Sharp doesn't like the output you have set and is displaying gibberish, you ought to be able to scroll through the menu screens by watching the screen on the 6412 itself. The 6412 menu screen will tell you what options you have as you use the arrow keys to move up and down or left and right to find options with the OK/select button to choose the options. That WikiBook explains all the menus and may be helpful to you in doing this if you can't read it on the Sharp.

Worst comes to worse, I bet that the box will reset itself to 1080i if you pull the plug out of the outlet. That's an annoying fix, though, even if it works, because the 6412 will spend the better part of the next day downloading guide information to replace what it has lost. And I'm not entirely sure that will reset it to 1080i.

BTW, the "1080i" sign the Sharp is showing is telling you what the 6412 is outputting not what the Sharp's best setting would be. I'm pretty sure that 720p would be a better match for any LCD that is not capable of 1080 lines of resolution. Your 37D6U has a native resolution of 768 x 1366 which ought to make 720p a better fit. I don't think the Fuji is capable of 1080 lines either, but I haven't kept up with the Fuji line since I bought mine 1.5 years ago.
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post #94 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 11:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Koegel View Post

Interesting. Do you think that you were still receiving analog transmissions for SD on the 6412 and that the switch to the all-digital 3416 is the reason for the difference? The 6412 is capable of receiving the SD channels digitally, but apparently it takes awhile for Comcast to find your and switch. I had analog transmission for several months after the rollout of ADS until I noticed one day that it had switched to digital on the SD channels. Didn't notice that much of a difference, but then my setup is already connected as component because of the HDMI repeater problem with the Denon receiver that sits between the 6412 and the Fuji. I can't imagine why switching from HDMI to component would improve matters . . . unless your component input on the Fuji is calibrated differently than the HDMI.

That's not the issue. Even the upper SD channels above 99 (e.g. digital) have the same problem on the 3416 via HDMI. I tried everything I could, including recalibrating the Fuji and trying all combinations of settings on the 3416, but nothing helps. There are serious video artifacts visible on the Fuji when viewing SD channels via HDMI. Component is about the same as it was on the 6412.

I also have an older Fuji 50" (30 series) with DVI input instead of HDMI, but when I connect the 3416 to it via an HDMI to DVI converter, I get the same crappy results on SD stations.

It's so bad that I'm seriously considering getting a Tivo S3 and returning the 3416 to Comcast.

$300 HDMI cables? P.T. Barnum would have been proud.
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post #95 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 11:51 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Koegel View Post

You can walk through the same thing by powering the box off again and then entering the code to bring up the menu. Even if the Sharp doesn't like the output you have set and is displaying gibberish, you ought to be able to scroll through the menu screens by watching the screen on the 6412 itself. The 6412 menu screen will tell you what options you have as you use the arrow keys to move up and down or left and right to find options with the OK/select button to choose the options. That WikiBook explains all the menus and may be helpful to you in doing this if you can't read it on the Sharp.

Worst comes to worse, I bet that the box will reset itself to 1080i if you pull the plug out of the outlet. That's an annoying fix, though, even if it works, because the 6412 will spend the better part of the next day downloading guide information to replace what it has lost. And I'm not entirely sure that will reset it to 1080i.

BTW, the "1080i" sign the Sharp is showing is telling you what the 6412 is outputting not what the Sharp's best setting would be. I'm pretty sure that 720p would be a better match for any LCD that is not capable of 1080 lines of resolution. Your 37D6U has a native resolution of 768 x 1366 which ought to make 720p a better fit. I don't think the Fuji is capable of 1080 lines either, but I haven't kept up with the Fuji line since I bought mine 1.5 years ago.

Well I tried unplugging and that didn't help. I tried using the "restore all defaults" and that didn't help. I guess I should have left well enough alone. I'm going to call Comcast and see if they can help me figure it out.

[b]Bernie
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post #96 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 12:14 PM
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I'm in Sunnyvale, and I used to get ESPN-HD and Discovery-HD free (i.e. with the expanded basic plan and no subscription to any digital plan). I have a CableCard in my TV. I have not checked those stations for a while, but now they are no longer available. Has something changed in Comcast's encryption policy just recently? What do I need to do to get those two channels back (and perhaps FSN_HD also)?

As an aside, I had to call Comcast to provide the CableCard info to them over the phone. Did that trigger the change in what I could get? I get this feeling that perhaps I shouldn't have called them, since they really wanted me to call them...

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post #97 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 12:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tom Koegel View Post

Yeah, I know, I should put my money where my mouth is and buy a Tivo S3. The sheer joy, for a geek like me, of plugging an S3 with terabyte drives might be worth it. But given the cable industry's hatred of the cablecard, I am too concerned about ending up with a box with functionality limited because Comcast decides to mess with data necessary to the (still quite expensive) Tivo box.

The S3 works for me. There's a lot of discussion of this sort of thing over at TiVoCommunity, you'll find a lot of satisfied customers, as well as a few who got p*ssed off.
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post #98 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 12:47 PM
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What do I need to do to get those two channels back (and perhaps FSN_HD also)?

Pay for digital classic.
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post #99 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Koegel View Post

Yeah, I know, I should put my money where my mouth is and buy a Tivo S3. The sheer joy, for a geek like me, of plugging an S3 with terabyte drives might be worth it. But given the cable industry's hatred of the cablecard, I am too concerned about ending up with a box with functionality limited because Comcast decides to mess with data necessary to the (still quite expensive) Tivo box.

No problem with my two S3s. I think the CableCard experiences in this area are better than many other places.
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post #100 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Jerry Gardner View Post

It's so bad that I'm seriously considering getting a Tivo S3 and returning the 3416 to Comcast.

Have they completely phased out the 6412? I would think they would still have a fair number of those boxes around, if only from repairs and returns. You'd be losing 40 MB, but if the SD is really better through HDMI, then maybe that's worth the trade. Lot cheaper than an S3.
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post #101 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 01:17 PM
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Lost FSNBA-HD(720) up here in Santa Rosa today, just a grey screen, no spinning logo. Anyone else in Santa Rosa lose it? Trying to figure out if it's just me or not.
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post #102 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by keenan View Post

Lost FSNBA-HD(720) up here in Santa Rosa today, just a grey screen, no spinning logo. Anyone else in Santa Rosa lose it? Trying to figure out if it's just me or not.

Same here in Novato. I think it's happened before and it came back when there was program to view.
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post #103 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 01:59 PM
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Same here in Novato. I think it's happened before and it came back when there was program to view.

Thanks.
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post #104 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 02:05 PM
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Originally Posted by keenan View Post

Lost FSNBA-HD(720) up here in Santa Rosa today, just a grey screen, no spinning logo. Anyone else in Santa Rosa lose it? Trying to figure out if it's just me or not.

Same in Rohnert Park. This happens quite often. When an event is going on it's fine. I wouldn't sweat it.

Bobby 

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post #105 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 02:07 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Koegel View Post

Have they completely phased out the 6412? I would think they would still have a fair number of those boxes around, if only from repairs and returns. You'd be losing 40 MB, but if the SD is really better through HDMI, then maybe that's worth the trade. Lot cheaper than an S3.

Not at Comcast's Livermore office. They have stacks of 3412 and 3416 boxes eight feet high, but no 6412's in sight. I asked about this and they told me they were replacing all 6412's as they came in with the 3412 and 3416. I specifically asked for a 6412 phase III, but they wouldn't give me one and I got stuck with the 3416 abomination.

$300 HDMI cables? P.T. Barnum would have been proud.
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post #106 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 02:36 PM
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Originally Posted by bobby94928 View Post

Same in Rohnert Park. This happens quite often. When an event is going on it's fine. I wouldn't sweat it.

Strange, down here in the un-upgraded area of SaraMilgatos ( but soon to be upgraded) FSNBA-HD is as always with the spinning 3D logo. Maybe you guy's are too upgraded

Laters,
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post #107 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 02:46 PM
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Originally Posted by Tom Koegel View Post

Have they completely phased out the 6412? I would think they would still have a fair number of those boxes around, if only from repairs and returns. You'd be losing 40 MB, but if the SD is really better through HDMI, then maybe that's worth the trade. Lot cheaper than an S3.

6412s all being collected and sent to non-ADS areas. No door to door recall, but a passive phase out.

But sheeshe - I'd give the customer one if it satisfies them.
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post #108 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 03:00 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jerry Gardner View Post

Not at Comcast's Livermore office. They have stacks of 3412 and 3416 boxes eight feet high, but no 6412's in sight. I asked about this and they told me they were replacing all 6412's as they came in with the 3412 and 3416. I specifically asked for a 6412 phase III, but they wouldn't give me one and I got stuck with the 3416 abomination.

If the 6412 really does SD better, I think this means that I should learn to cherish the box that I just denigrated a few posts back . . . .
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post #109 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 04:09 PM
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Or get a Tivo S3, which has excellent PQ on SD from what I've been told...

$300 HDMI cables? P.T. Barnum would have been proud.
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post #110 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 04:15 PM
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I have had my cable card since july 2004 in three different tv sets and have had zero problems with it.Only time it did not work right was when they first installed it back in 2004 as they were very new then.I get all the hd and digital channels with out a hitch.Iam located in cupertino.
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post #111 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 05:42 PM
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My Plasma Tv has a Qam tuner and I have the cable plugged directly into it. I pick up the usual analog Basic and Expanded channels, together with the 6 local stations (KTVU, KNTV...)in HD.
In addition I get a whole bunch of the stations repeated above channel 80, but they all seem to be the same reception quality as the Basic/Expanded. - the channel description shows that they are being received as 480i - am I right in presuming that this is still analog?.
Would I get improved reception of these stations if I installed a Cablecard? I know that if I do so I will have to buy the Digital Classic package, although I don't see much that I would get really excited about in that lineup, and I am sorry to say that I am not a sports enthusiast so ESPN HD is not a "must have". The only real benefit that I see for me is that the HD stations are grouped together numerically instead of being scattered amongst the other stations.
I also have a second HDTV which does not have cablecard capability, again with a Qam tuner and the cable plugged directly in to it. If I put a Cablecard in the other TV and had the Comcast Digital package would there be any change in the channel lineup for this second one? I would not want to instal a STB or DVR.
Thnks
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post #112 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 06:09 PM
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Originally Posted by BELLCH View Post

In addition I get a whole bunch of the stations repeated above channel 80, but they all seem to be the same reception quality as the Basic/Expanded. - the channel description shows that they are being received as 480i - am I right in presuming that this is still analog?.

They'd be SD digital. SD doesn't mean analog, it can be digital as well.

You can tell they'd be digital if its the QAM tuner which is picking them up, alaog would require an NTSC tuner. Also if they have a '-' in the channel number they're digital.
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Would I get improved reception of these stations if I installed a Cablecard?

Cable card wouldn't make a difference to the video quality on these channels. Digital is digital, you may not get these channels anymore if you did get a cable card, Comcast may map you to the analog channels instead. If you did get these channels, the only advantage is you'd get channel number which Comcast advertises, weird random channel numbers. Thats really useful for a DVR, but for a TV may not be worth it.
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post #113 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 07:37 PM
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What channel is the NBC HD channel on in Sunnyvale on QAM?

I have a Tivo series 3 (no cablecards yet), and can't find NBC.. I found Fox, CBS, ABC (IIRC), and a few PBS stations. NBC would be nice, and though I realize it's not using the Tivo as meant to be used, I could actually see using manual programs for a very few things (I already did it for one PBS music show)... I may actually cringe and get cablecards..

(I know this probably sounds weird.. I'm one of the relatively few who got the series 3 *because* of the lifetime service transfer option, and do not actually have HDTV yet and am probably not likely to get it very very soon.. unless my TV dies.)
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post #114 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 09:14 PM
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Originally Posted by btwyx View Post

Cable card wouldn't make a difference to the video quality on these channels. Digital is digital, you may not get these channels anymore if you did get a cable card, Comcast may map you to the analog channels instead.

For what it's worth, after I ditched my 6200 in favor of a CableCARD, PQ on digital SD material was remarkably better (I have a Sony KDF-E42A10, a LCD RP set). On the other hand, however, analog SD material looked slightly worse.

Yes, digital is digital in terms of what's coming over the wire, but not all digital decoders are born equal.
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post #115 of 15305 Old 01-29-2007, 10:34 PM
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but not all digital decoders are born equal.

But a decoder with and without a cable card is born equal with itself.
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post #116 of 15305 Old 01-30-2007, 01:18 PM
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Originally Posted by mattack View Post

What channel is the NBC HD channel on in Sunnyvale on QAM?

I have a Tivo series 3 (no cablecards yet), and can't find NBC.. I found Fox, CBS, ABC (IIRC), and a few PBS stations. NBC would be nice, and though I realize it's not using the Tivo as meant to be used, I could actually see using manual programs for a very few things (I already did it for one PBS music show)... I may actually cringe and get cablecards..

(I know this probably sounds weird.. I'm one of the relatively few who got the series 3 *because* of the lifetime service transfer option, and do not actually have HDTV yet and am probably not likely to get it very very soon.. unless my TV dies.)

I get mine on 79-1 here in SJ
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post #117 of 15305 Old 01-30-2007, 04:08 PM
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Tonights Warriors game is scheduled to be on FSN-HD...next is the Sharks on Tuesday (I think)


hey dog. are you getting fsn-hd from dish. i thought you dumped comcast. i'm not getting any fsn from my gold dish package. what's up

neflixis our nemesis
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post #118 of 15305 Old 01-31-2007, 12:23 AM
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But a decoder with and without a cable card is born equal with itself.

Tautology. Stack overflow. Core dumped.
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post #119 of 15305 Old 01-31-2007, 09:11 AM
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Looks like Comcast will be fighting tooth and nail to wiggle out of the upcoming CableCARD mandate deadline (just like the last 2 times) IMO if they are successful a third time, I think CableCARD is pretty much dead. TiVo S3's will have limited value. due to the probable introduction of SDV, something which cable DVRs will not have to deal with because they wouldn't be required to use CableCARD. On the other hand if the mandate stays, then cable DVRs (and STBs) will need to deal with making SDV work on CableCARD 1.0 devices so at least TiVo S3 has a way to piggyback on the solutions and cable companies have an incentive to implement a solution.

Notice the strategy is multi-fold. I don't even think they feel the FCC vote would go in their favor, but once there is a vote, it would allow them to appeal in court, which as we all know is a very speedy process, not!

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...&&#post9631351

Comcast Files FCC Appeal Over Set-Top Box Ruling

01/30/2007
Dow Jones News Services
(Copyright © 2007 Dow Jones & Company, Inc.)



By Corey Boles
Of DOW JONES NEWSWIRES

WASHINGTON (Dow Jones)--Cable giant Comcast Corp. (CMCSA) Tuesday filed an appeal with industry regulator the Federal Communications Commission over its decision to force the company to abide by new regulations regarding set-top boxes.

The FCC rejected Comcast's request for a waiver from the rules in January. At the time, the company immediately announced its intention to appeal the decision.

Comcast is now asking the five politically appointed commissioners at the FCC to vote on the issue rather than for it to be decided by agency staff.

Were the commissioners to hold a vote and still rule against Comcast, then the company would have the right to appeal the matter to the courts, but its hands are tied until the FCC rules on its appeal.

The agency is requiring cable operators to provide set-top boxes to subscribers from July 1 that don't include integrated security features that link the box directly back to the cable provider.

Its goal is to establish a retail market for the boxes and encourage other companies such as mainstream consumer electronic manufacturers into the market.

Currently, the majority of consumers who have boxes rent them from their cable provider and surrender the device to them when they cancel their subscription or move house.

FCC Chairman Kevin Martin strongly believes that cable prices are too high, and has pointed to the cost of renting the boxes as one factor in the price.

The average cost of to rent a set-top box is around $7 a month.

The industry has argued that the technology used in the current generation of set-top boxes will soon be redundant and has asked for time to develop downloadable technology which would replace the current boxes.

The National Cable & Telecommunications Association has asked for two more years for this, but the FCC has rejected this, saying it would want a greater certainty that the technology would be ready by 2009 and that it isn't just a further delaying tactic by cable.

The lobby group has said that rather than save consumers money, the new rules will instead cost consumers an extra $600 million a year as they will have to buy new boxes.

It has filed a separate appeal to Comcast's as has telecommunications company Verizon Communications (VZ), which is making rapid strides in moving into the video service market.

The FCC has yet to rule on either of these appeals, although there has been some speculation it may do so this week.

On its own, the issue of set-top boxes is important to the cable industry, but the FCC's action represents one of several decisions that have gone against the industry in recent months. Martin has been accused of being biased against the industry, although he has publicly denied any rift with cable.

Martin, as well as the other four FCC commissioners, are set to appear before the Senate Commerce Committee on Thursday where, he at least, can expect a grilling from Democratic senators over some of the FCC's actions of late.

No one from the FCC was immediately available to comment on the Comcast appeal.

- By Corey Boles, Dow Jones Newswires; 202-862-6637; corey.boles@dowjones.com


(END) Dow Jones Newswires

01-30-07 1130ET

Copyright (c) 2007 Dow Jones & Company, Inc.
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post #120 of 15305 Old 01-31-2007, 09:29 AM
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Originally Posted by sfhub View Post

FCC Chairman Kevin Martin strongly believes that cable prices are too high, and has pointed to the cost of renting the boxes as one factor in the price.

To me, the cost of the boxes isn't the issue. The real issue is the fact that the Motorola boxes Comcast uses are a steaming pile of dog crap. Forcing Comcast to use CableCards in their own boxes ensures they can't force out other players, such as Tivo, who have quality product and not garbage.

$300 HDMI cables? P.T. Barnum would have been proud.
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