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post #271 of 12164 Old 04-18-2007, 06:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longwong View Post

WFLD-DT is out, which is disgraceful considering it's during their #1 show. Imagine that in 2009, we will no longer have the analog feed to fall back on...

I switched to Milwaukee 6-1. Looks fine there. Definitely something with WFLD.
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post #272 of 12164 Old 04-18-2007, 06:48 PM
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Same here, was watching on 190 via comcast, switche to the analog version
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post #273 of 12164 Old 04-18-2007, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by longwong View Post

WFLD-DT is out, which is disgraceful considering it's during their #1 show. Imagine that in 2009, we will no longer have the analog feed to fall back on...

Anolog looks better than my cable feed

OK, I'M BACK
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post #274 of 12164 Old 04-18-2007, 09:06 PM - Thread Starter
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This Wednesday evening, both WPWR-DT and WFLD-DT's transmitters went out.
As other AVS'ers have indicated it happened during "American Idol". And while WFLD-DT appears to be back at full power (although the picture looks a bit soft on "The Simpsons" right now), WPWR-DT appears to be completely off the air. While I cannot verify directly, I am getting a solid picture on WCFC-CA 51 from Rockford, which never happens anymore; it is also coming in with the antenna pointed towards Chicago, with no visible digital hashing. If they are broadcasting at all, it has to be at extremely low power. Needless to say, the signal strength meter on WPWR-DT 51 (resolving to 50.1) is flat at zero out here.

I don't know the cause, but hopefully their neighbor, WCIU-DT's HVS can do a little legwork for me...or maybe a WFLD-DT engineer can hop aboard here and speak up. Will post anything more when I get it, unless someone (hopefully) beats me to it...

Gilbert
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post #275 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 12:00 AM
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Originally Posted by sebenste View Post

I am getting a solid picture on WCFC-CA 51 from Rockford, which never happens anymore....

Hey, you're right. I just checked, and I'm receiving it too, although it's somewhat snowy here. I think this is the first time I can actually ever recall seeing the station.
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post #276 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 12:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wireman134 View Post

Anolog looks better than my cable feed

I don't doubt that. I've had both cable and OTA analog which blows away my present, cr@ppy E* SD satellite signals.

"Digital" is not always automatically better.
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post #277 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 05:39 AM
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Originally Posted by Rammitinski View Post

I don't doubt that. I've had both cable and OTA analog which blows away my present, cr@ppy E* SD satellite signals.

"Digital" is not always automatically better.

Agree'd. : ) Digital is just a method of transmission (a carrier). You can pipe static into a digital signal and its still digital.

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post #278 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 06:06 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sebenste View Post

This Wednesday evening, both WPWR-DT and WFLD-DT's transmitters went out.
As other AVS'ers have indicated it happened during "American Idol". And while WFLD-DT appears to be back at full power (although the picture looks a bit soft on "The Simpsons" right now), WPWR-DT appears to be completely off the air. While I cannot verify directly, I am getting a solid picture on WCFC-CA 51 from Rockford, which never happens anymore; it is also coming in with the antenna pointed towards Chicago, with no visible digital hashing. If they are broadcasting at all, it has to be at extremely low power. Needless to say, the signal strength meter on WPWR-DT 51 (resolving to 50.1) is flat at zero out here.

I don't know the cause, but hopefully their neighbor, WCIU-DT's HVS can do a little legwork for me...or maybe a WFLD-DT engineer can hop aboard here and speak up. Will post anything more when I get it, unless someone (hopefully) beats me to it...

Initially what I have heard was something in WFLD's DTV path/airchain failed and they borrowed WPWR's DTV path/airchain. Did not hear that from their engineering staff so it may not be creditable info.

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post #279 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 07:08 AM
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My wife is a rabid American Idol fan, so... You would not believe the tongue-lashing I received when WFLD-DT went down last night during American Idol. I was personally cursed out, the Dish Network ViP 622 receiver was cursed out, and there was much stomping around. I believe the 622 would have been "marked for death" had I not later confirmed that it was something wrong on the WFLD side and not on the Dish Network software side.

Sheesh. They need to get their crap together over there at Fox.
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post #280 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 07:22 AM
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The problem is that the stations don't consider ATSC critical at this time, so there's not the same amount of redundancy as when compared to the NTSC system. Hopefully soon they'll realize that there's a bunch of ATSC folks out there and spend the $'s to add the same level of redundancy that NTSC has.
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post #281 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 10:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rad View Post

The problem is that the stations don't consider ATSC critical at this time, so there's not the same amount of redundancy as when compared to the NTSC system. Hopefully soon they'll realize that there's a bunch of ATSC folks out there and spend the $'s to add the same level of redundancy that NTSC has.

Stations do consider redundancy for ATSC, but its REALLY expensive!! There are several stations here in chicago that have bigtime redundancy. We're in fact finishing up on our Back-up ATSC airchains as I speak. We have a few technical glitches to work out and it will be finished. Although if we ever had to use the backup it would not be HD, but it beats being off the air. We have no backup DTV transmitter yet, but come 2009 that could be a whole different story.

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post #282 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 12:07 PM
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I would be perfectly willing to accept a drop to standard definition, as frequently happens during "severe weather" conditions, where the existing equipment apparently isn't capable of overlaying the ticker on the digital broadcasts. Anything is better than the channel being completely dead!

This is particularly true in my case, since I have the non-HD versions of all the channels hidden in my guide. Basically, I don't want to have anyone in the house accidentally watching the SD versions, but that means that they're hard to get to in the event of some sort of snafu on the HD channel.
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post #283 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 12:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by hvs10trk View Post

We have no backup DTV transmitter yet, but come 2009 that could be a whole different story.

What about the 15 kilowatter you had? Can't that be pressed into service?

Gilbert
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post #284 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 12:51 PM
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I don't understand - was the analog signal off, too? It comes in so well even way out here by me, and even with just an indoor antenna, that sometimes I'll accidently put it on instead of the digital version, and it can be awhile before I even realize it (usually after I notice it on the tuner). Of course, I'm speaking mainly of with SD programming on, but even that looks exceptionally good.
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post #285 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 07:00 PM
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Originally Posted by sebenste View Post

What about the 15 kilowatter you had? Can't that be pressed into service?

Slated for South Bend.

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post #286 of 12164 Old 04-19-2007, 08:44 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by hvs10trk View Post

Slated for South Bend.

You know, I was going to joke about that. And then I realized...that's probably the reason! Whoo hoo! Do I get a free HDTV from WCIU engineering for guessing correctly, even though I didn't guess publicly?

Oh, and Ramm, WFLD-TV and WPWR-TV were both fine. It only affected the digital paths to Sears. And I forgot to post that both are back on and fixed.

Gilbert
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post #287 of 12164 Old 04-20-2007, 03:18 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sebenste View Post

You know, I was going to joke about that. And then I realized...that's probably the reason! Whoo hoo! Do I get a free HDTV from WCIU engineering for guessing correctly, even though I didn't guess publicly?

Oh, and Ramm, WFLD-TV and WPWR-TV were both fine. It only affected the digital paths to Sears. And I forgot to post that both are back on and fixed.

We already give you free HDTV. Its on 26-1. Sorry couldn't resist.

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post #288 of 12164 Old 04-20-2007, 04:52 AM
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Speaking of 26-1, I thought I'd post an interesting thing I've noticed.

We have a lot of fans of the "King of Queens" sitcom in this house, so we watch that a lot on WCIU. For reasons having nothing to do with picture quality, we were, primarily, recording the reruns off of the D* SD feed of 26. However, we noticed something very strange: color shifting. Well, that's not the right term, but I don't know what would be.

Remember on old analog color TVs how some had a "color" adjustment dial? Dialing it up made the colors bright and intense (and, eventually, intolerable) whereas dialing it down muted the colors (and, eventually, eliminated them). Well...watching KoQ on the D* feed is like watching something while your little kid spins the dial up and down periodically. It's terribly distracting.

I started recording the OTA feed off 26.1, and not only is the picture far superior in general, but the colors are much brighter and crisper...and, of course, stable.

Just thought I'd mention it, as that color thing is something I had not seen before.

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post #289 of 12164 Old 04-20-2007, 06:38 AM
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Originally Posted by cheer View Post

Speaking of 26-1, I thought I'd post an interesting thing I've noticed.

We have a lot of fans of the "King of Queens" sitcom in this house, so we watch that a lot on WCIU. For reasons having nothing to do with picture quality, we were, primarily, recording the reruns off of the D* SD feed of 26. However, we noticed something very strange: color shifting. Well, that's not the right term, but I don't know what would be.

Remember on old analog color TVs how some had a "color" adjustment dial? Dialing it up made the colors bright and intense (and, eventually, intolerable) whereas dialing it down muted the colors (and, eventually, eliminated them). Well...watching KoQ on the D* feed is like watching something while your little kid spins the dial up and down periodically. It's terribly distracting.

I started recording the OTA feed off 26.1, and not only is the picture far superior in general, but the colors are much brighter and crisper...and, of course, stable.

Just thought I'd mention it, as that color thing is something I had not seen before.

Hi Cheer,

Great to hear feedback. I too have D* and have noticed our signal isn't what's leaving the building. I would have to say the color shifting your seeing is quite possibly their RX gear. They receive us via analog OTA so anything is possible.

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post #290 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 08:33 AM
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i know this is a topic of much debate in lots of places, but do any of the stations in the chicago market use the broadcast flag in their ota signals (or plan on it in the future)?

i am considering using the new digital pci express digital tuner made by hp for use in my laptop and vista mce, and (apparently) if the broadcast flag is present the file is then only available for viewing on the recording pc versus no broadcast flag/full file distribution.

thanks in advance.

tickled to be here
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post #291 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 08:48 AM
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I haven't run across it recording HD OTA broadcast to a Panny ES-10 DVD recorder.
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post #292 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 09:22 AM
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Originally Posted by jcr74 View Post

i know this is a topic of much debate in lots of places, but do any of the stations in the chicago market use the broadcast flag in their ota signals (or plan on it in the future)?

i am considering using the new digital pci express digital tuner made by hp for use in my laptop and vista mce, and (apparently) if the broadcast flag is present the file is then only available for viewing on the recording pc versus no broadcast flag/full file distribution.

thanks in advance.

Negative on 26.1, 2, or 3.

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post #293 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 12:34 PM
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I'm looking at getting a RS VU-190XR antenna for the church I work at in Crystal Lake.

Will we need a preamp to get WBBM-DT?

Thanks!


tim
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post #294 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 02:23 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by timdgibson View Post

I'm looking at getting a RS VU-190XR antenna for the church I work at in Crystal Lake.

Will we need a preamp to get WBBM-DT?

Thanks!


tim

Hey Tim,

Don't do it if it's an outdoor antenna. It will get ripped up in a few years.
Get the Winegard HD8200:

https://www.tselectronic.com/winegard/hd8200.html

At 60' up, with a ChannelMaster 7777 preamp, and by replacing a few bad connectors, we once again peg the signal meter at Willow Creek's satellite church in Crystal Lake with this setup. It is 40' up in the air, though. As for an amplifier, we got it to pick up Rockford and Milwaukee, and it is on a rotor to do so. It gets all the digital channels from each market. You might be able to do it without an amplifier with this antenna.

Gilbert
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post #295 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 02:57 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timdgibson View Post

I'm looking at getting a RS VU-190XR antenna for the church I work at in Crystal Lake.

Will we need a preamp to get WBBM-DT?

Thanks!


tim

Gilbert's right.

With the winds we get up here, the VU-190XR will get demolished in no time.
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post #296 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 02:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hvs10trk View Post

Negative on 26.1, 2, or 3.

Whew!!

That really puts my mind at ease to know that there will never be any problem recording from 26-3.

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post #297 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 03:46 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sebenste View Post

Hey Tim,

Don't do it if it's an outdoor antenna. It will get ripped up in a few years.
Get the Winegard HD8200:

https://www.tselectronic.com/winegard/hd8200.html

At 60' up, with a ChannelMaster 7777 preamp, and by replacing a few bad connectors, we once again peg the signal meter at Willow Creek's satellite church in Crystal Lake with this setup. It is 40' up in the air, though. As for an amplifier, we got it to pick up Rockford and Milwaukee, and it is on a rotor to do so. It gets all the digital channels from each market. You might be able to do it without an amplifier with this antenna.

Thanks for the info. That helps a lot.

If you know Gary Melder or Matt Wentz (both tech people at Willow) tell them I said hi.


tim (tech director right across the tracks at CL EV Free)
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post #298 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 08:54 PM
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I've had a VU-160 up for 6 years. A bird strike took out one VHF element but it still works fine. Pigeons don't see very well directly ahead, especially when fleeing a hawk.

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post #299 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 10:45 PM
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Well, I'm only a few blocks away from him, and that wind that we had a couple of weeks or so back did a number on some of the cheap, Philips antennas I see around me. I noticed more than a few bent and missing elements. I even saw a couple of antennas that were laying sideways on their roofs in town afterwards. One of my E* satellite dishes (the 61.5) kept breaking up on and off. That's the first time that's happened in the 2+ years I've had them.

It can get pretty violent around here at times. The RS might very well withstand it, but I still wouldn't recommend it, based on living in this area for over 12 years. 40 MPH winds are not that uncommon (I'm sure that Tim can confirm this), and I can remember a 60 MPH one which literally bowed the wall on my house. Scared the living s**t out of me (I've told this story to Gilbert before).

And if he's right on the other side of the tracks from Willow Creek, that's all pretty open over there (although, depending on exactly where he's at, there are some trees).
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post #300 of 12164 Old 04-21-2007, 11:09 PM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by timdgibson View Post

Thanks for the info. That helps a lot.

If you know Gary Melder or Matt Wentz (both tech people at Willow) tell them I said hi.


tim (tech director right across the tracks at CL EV Free)

Tim,

Saw 'em tonight. Will do!

Greywolf,

LOL! However, I must say that the current crop of VU-190s made today are nferior than the past. Head to Radioshack.com and do a search on VU-190...then view the stories of the antenna being blown apart after less than 2 years.

Gilbert
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