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post #12001 of 12144 Old 03-09-2014, 04:08 PM
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Originally Posted by veedon View Post

Just out of curiosity, I was looking at a different tool at rabbitears.info, the allocation map that shows all of the stations that are assigned to particular RF channels.

How far apart do full-power stations that share the same RF have to be to prevent interference?
I used 150 km.

There is no minimum distance requirement anymore. The rule is literally that you have to prevent interference, whether that's through distance or power/height reduction or antenna pattern.
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I was also surprised to see that in the pre-transition days, WBBM had its digital signal on RF 3 (and its analog signal on RF 2, of course). When did stations start to shy away from VHF-Lo for digital broadcasting?

As soon as stations like WBBM signed on and everyone realized it wasn't going to work. The FCC assigned the initial channels and a handful of stations, including WBBM, got low-VHF assignments (but, of course, low-VHF was very full, so there weren't many). Most of the ones that were assigned to low-VHF jumped ship at transition time, including WBBM.

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post #12002 of 12144 Old 03-09-2014, 09:39 PM
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Originally Posted by Trip in VA View Post

It's a Google Map. You zoom in using the zoom controls at the top left just like any other Google Map.
Trip, thank you; I swear that the zoom controls were not displayed the second time I went to that page (immediately after reading ProjectSHO89's post insisting that the link had answered my question).  The first time I might possibly just have failed to notice them, but the second time I was actively looking for them and they did not display.

After reading your post I tried the link a third time, and yes, the zoom controls showed up.  While the page still doesn't specify the street address [when one context-clicks a spot on a map at maps.google.com, there is a selection for "What's Here?" that displays a street address, but right-clicking on that map did nothing], zooming in pinpoints it to the east side of Lavergne between Belmont and Fletcher, which would have been an adequate answer for me if Dave73 hadn't already posted the address.
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post #12003 of 12144 Old 03-10-2014, 07:21 AM
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Live in Crystal Lake. I don't even see the signal that WBBM is putting out on new signal. So glad I stuck a second antenna in the attic, and aimed it at Rockford. Can now watch CBS out of Rockford. WBBM TV can't out out a decent signal to save their lives. Just a waste of time. Broadcast a decent UHF signal.. If I we're selling something, I would not waste money on that station.
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post #12004 of 12144 Old 03-10-2014, 11:15 AM
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Originally Posted by snoopy1954 View Post

Live in Crystal Lake. I don't even see the signal that WBBM is putting out on new signal. So glad I stuck a second antenna in the attic, and aimed it at Rockford. Can now watch CBS out of Rockford. WBBM TV can't out out a decent signal to save their lives. Just a waste of time. Broadcast a decent UHF signal.. If I we're selling something, I would not waste money on that station.

looks like the reason the RF26 may not work is Madison ABC is ALSO on RF26. SO maybe WBBM translator doesnt have the same power in that direction?
http://www.rabbitears.info/contour.php?appid=1447507&map=Y
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post #12005 of 12144 Old 03-10-2014, 11:29 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veedon View Post

I was also surprised to see that in the pre-transition days, WBBM had its digital signal on RF 3 (and its analog signal on RF 2, of course). When did stations start to shy away from VHF-Lo for digital broadcasting?

most stations on VHF Low are in smaller markets where it was easier (and cheaper) to stay on their old analog spot and upgrade to digital. There are some exceptions (as in larger markets)
Las Vegas NBC is on RF2 (maps to 3)
Roanoke, VA PBS is on RF3 (maps to 15)
Philly ABC is on RF6 (maps to 6)
Memphis NBC (WMC) is on RF5 (maps to 5)

couple examples of stations on VHF Low but also has a UHF translator
Quad Cities CBS in on RF4 (but now has a translator in Rock Island on UHF to fill in)
WCYB NBC 5 in Bristol, VA/Johnson City, TN is on RF5 but has translator in Bristol on UHF
Des Moines ABC (WOI) is on RF5 (maps to 5) but translator on UHF too

and the oddest ball of the bunch. NBC Nashville WTVF went to RF5 at the conversion. Then they got a translator on RF50 as a fill in. Then they scrapped the whole thing and got a max power UHF on RF25, shut down RF50 and made RF5 a translator
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post #12006 of 12144 Old 03-10-2014, 02:48 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by veedon View Post

I was also surprised to see that in the pre-transition days, WBBM had its digital signal on RF 3 (and its analog signal on RF 2, of course). When did stations start to shy away from VHF-Lo for digital broadcasting?

The short answer is as soon as they could, since VHF-Lo never really worked well with ATSC,. The complete answer involves FCC politics that I don't entirely understand, but remember that for a while most stations had 2 channels (analog and digital), so their options for frequencies were limited. Most stations filed to move to abandoned frequencies after the analog shutdown.

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post #12007 of 12144 Old 03-10-2014, 07:09 PM
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interesting they wanted 11 in the 1st round election with a fallback to 3 if not approved
http://data.fcc.gov/mediabureau/v01/tv/application/1046291.html

then ended up with 12
http://data.fcc.gov/mediabureau/v01/tv/application/1232938.html
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post #12008 of 12144 Old 03-10-2014, 11:05 PM - Thread Starter
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Yep, WBBM on 26 has to allow the 800 kilowatts of WKOW-DT in Madison, Wi to boom in. 23 is wide open now...hmmm...

Gilbert
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post #12009 of 12144 Old 03-10-2014, 11:42 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unclehonkey View Post

interesting they wanted 11 in the 1st round election with a fallback to 3 if not approved
http://data.fcc.gov/mediabureau/v01/tv/application/1046291.html

then ended up with 12
http://data.fcc.gov/mediabureau/v01/tv/application/1232938.html

When WBBM-TV learned that WISN was staying on RF 34, they decided to switch to RF 12, as it allowed them to power up more on RF 12 (8kw) than on RF 11 (1.8kw). RF 11 in Chicago was going to require protecting then WMSN Madison Wisconsin (now on RF 49), WGVU Grand Rapids, & WLFI Lafayette Indiana, & to a lesser extent, WWTO LaSalle, IL on RF 10. So going to RF 12 worked better for them than if they went to RF 11. RF 26 will mainly help those with indoor antennas closest to Chicago. Even though the FCC show some coverage over my area, the shorter tower would make getting RF 26 more difficult than RF 12. I simply rely on the VHF signal. If the FCC were to decide to approve WOCK-CD's request to move to RF 41, then I could move my UHF antenna to the higher point, & move the VHF antenna lower.
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post #12010 of 12144 Old 03-11-2014, 09:45 AM
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DIGITAL TRANSLATOR OR DIGITAL LPTV APPLICATIONS FOR LICENSE TO COVER ACCEPTED FOR FILING
IL WBBM-TV 9617 CBS BROADCASTING INC.
IL , CHICAGO
BLCDT-20140305ABH
E CHAN-26
License to cover construction permit no: BDRTCDT-20090818AAP,
callsign WBBM-TV.
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post #12011 of 12144 Old 03-11-2014, 05:28 PM
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Some of my tv,s pick up both ch 2 while others only grab one of them a feet I did a rescan
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post #12012 of 12144 Old 03-11-2014, 05:44 PM
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Did any to notice TBN channel 35.1 and so on are call signs are now named tbn church Channel enlace (spanish audio) Smile a child ( in that order)
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post #12013 of 12144 Old 03-12-2014, 01:15 PM
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CBS' Moonves: We may go off-air if Aereo prevails
http://www.chicagotribune.com/business/sns-rt-us-cbs-aereo-20140311,0,265563.story

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post #12014 of 12144 Old 03-23-2014, 08:47 PM
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I noticed that WOCH 41.2 is no longer airing the TEST Paterrn-TV Show. It 's now airing Estrella TV.
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post #12015 of 12144 Old 03-23-2014, 09:23 PM
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Thanks for that, Chgo1967.  It's coming in here as well.  Is WESV still airing Estrella on RF40 in addition?  I've never been able to receive (or at least, not to decode) that signal.

On another note, GetTV on 66.2 was dark for a while earlier this evening, while WGBO-HD continued without a problem on 66.1.
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post #12016 of 12144 Old 03-24-2014, 10:20 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dattier View Post

Thanks for that, Chgo1967.  It's coming in here as well.  Is WESV still airing Estrella on RF40 in addition?  I've never been able to receive (or at least, not to decode) that signal.

On another note, GetTV on 66.2 was dark for a while earlier this evening, while WGBO-HD continued without a problem on 66.1.

I'm not Chgo1967, but I can answer your question on WESV-LD. Yes, they're still airing Estrella TV on 40.1, & in 720p HD. Since WESV-LD only covers part of Chicago & the south suburbs, having Estrella TV on 41.2 makes it available for those on the north side of Chicago & northern suburbs. Since WOCH-CD went digital, I can no longer get the station, due to being on RF 49, & it's sharply nulled toward Indiana. That is due to WAAA-LP Westville, IN also being on RF 49, & they have a CP to flash-cut to digital on 49, but they haven't done so.
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post #12017 of 12144 Old 03-25-2014, 06:45 AM
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Thank you, Dave73.  I didn't know (having never been able to receive RF40, even when it was analog) that 40.1 was in 720p.  41.2 is in 480i.

For me it's the same for Estrella as for MundoFox: can't receive the 720p signal on 13.1, only the 480i simulcast on 50.3.
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post #12018 of 12144 Old 03-25-2014, 10:12 AM
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Originally Posted by dattier View Post

Thank you, Dave73.  I didn't know (having never been able to receive RF40, even when it was analog) that 40.1 was in 720p.  41.2 is in 480i.

For me it's the same for Estrella as for MundoFox: can't receive the 720p signal on 13.1, only the 480i simulcast on 50.3.

With me being around 30 miles from Chicago, WOCK-CD is not easy to get at only 300 watts. I have an outdoor antenna optimized for VHF-Lo (wish my VHF only antenna were longer, but they're not priorities for the antenna makers anymore), along with a pre-amp, but that weak signal makes it difficult to get parts of the year (much worse when it's 80º F & higher). When they experimented with .81kw & 1kw, I got them better (not great, but pixelated a lot less). I got WBBM-TV the best on VHF-Lo, when they were on RF 3 @ 2.8kw (I wasn't even using a pre-amp at the time). If they went the maximum of 3kw, I wouldn't need a pre-amp, & have little trouble getting. If they get to move to RF 41 (WOCH-CA's former analog channel), I'll move my VHF only antenna down on the pole, & move my 8 bay antenna to the highest point of the pole.
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post #12019 of 12144 Old 04-05-2014, 06:05 AM
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WOCK 13.4 is now carrying TheCoolTV.

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post #12020 of 12144 Old 04-08-2014, 06:15 AM
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My old 23" Westinghouse LCD is mapping rf26 to 26.1. No U for me. Guess it's time for a new TV. I don't want to miss watching my baseball team lose!
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post #12021 of 12144 Old 04-08-2014, 11:28 AM
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Originally Posted by OTA_GUY View Post

My old 23" Westinghouse LCD is mapping rf26 to 26.1. No U for me. Guess it's time for a new TV. I don't want to miss watching my baseball team lose!
Did you check for 27.1 or 27.3 to see whether maybe it put WCIU-HD there?

What some tuners do in cases like that, because RF12 is already using virtual 2.1 when they try to map RF26, is to leave RF26's stream #1 on 26.1; then when they try to map RF27, virtual 26.1 is in use, so they leave WCIU-HD at 27.1 (or maybe it's 27.3), its physical channel and physical stream number.  UToo, MeTV, MeToo, and Bounce might very well still get mapped to 26.2 throgh 26.5.

On the other hand, some tuners happily map both RF12 and RF26 to two different 2.1's and let WCIU-HD have 26.1 as well as 26.2 through 26.5.

A similar thing used to happen when WLS used both RF7 and RF44.  RF7's 7.1, 7.2, and 7.3 blocked RF44 from getting mapped to those positions on tuners with this same design flaw, so they got left at 44.1, 44.2, and 44.3; then WSNS's RF45 signal couldn't get mapped to 44.1 or 44.2 (or while they carried SOI, 44.3 either) and its channels were left at 45.3 and 45.4 (and 45.5 while WSNS carried SOI) respectively.

You might be able to get around it by clearing out the table and adding all active channels back manually.  If you add RF26 back first, it will take virtual 2.1.  Then WBBM on RF12 will be mapped to 12.1, leaving 26.1 open for WCIU-HD.  That wasn't possible with the WLS-WSNS conflict, because if you added RF44 first on a tuner like that and then added RF7, RF7, being physically at channel 7, bumped RF44 to 44 even if RF44 had been added first, and then WSNS, if already added, would get bumped to 45.  Other tuners would happily map both RF7 and RF44 to two 7.1's, two 7.2's, and two 7.3's, letting WSNS have 44.1 and 44.2 (and while SOI was aired, 44.3).
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post #12022 of 12144 Old 04-10-2014, 10:28 AM - Thread Starter
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Thanks, Andy! Added into the OTA lineup at the beginning of this thread.

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post #12023 of 12144 Old 04-10-2014, 04:53 PM
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What's happened to Estrella on 41.2?  Seems WOCH dropped it.
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post #12024 of 12144 Old 04-11-2014, 02:18 PM
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I thought Estrella was on WESV 40.1? On Comcast, it's still on channel 396, assuming the feed is coming from 40.1.

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post #12025 of 12144 Old 04-11-2014, 05:51 PM
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Never having been able to receive 40.1, I don't know whether it's still on 40.1 or not, but it's (also) been on RF49's 41.2 for a while.
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post #12026 of 12144 Old 04-13-2014, 01:14 PM
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New channels coming these summer 2014 Escape and Grit
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post #12027 of 12144 Old 04-13-2014, 10:35 PM
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Anyone having problems with WYCC? I have a problem with the station on my Insignia TV, where the channel locks up when I put it on 20.1 - 20.3, & not be able to change channels at all, once I put it on one of those channels. I also can not shut off the TV when that happens. I bought 2 TV's, an RCA & a Vizio, & did a full scan on those TV's, & neither one would even pick up WYCC on RF 21, but they had no problem picking up all the LPTV stations from Chicago, including WRJK-LD on RF 24 & WCHU-LD on RF 33. I'm wondering if they're sending out a corrupt signal, to where my Insignia locks up on their station, once tuned in, while not allowing any other TV's to pick up RF 21 at all. I ended up returning the RCA TV, because not only doing 5 rescans not bring in the station, but that same TV also doesn't have the ability to do a manual scan of 1 RF channel, like my Insignia does. The Vizio TV at least allows partial scans, but even rescanning for just RF 21 didn't help, & unless my mom wants that TV (it also has streaming options available from Netflix, Youtube, & Hulu), it's going back as well. My nephew started playing with buttons on the remote, to where it shut off with a different button, & even changing the channel with a different button. Once it got off of RF 21, everything started working as it's supposed to. If no one is having the same problem that I'm having, I'm wondering what could be causing the problem.
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post #12028 of 12144 Old 04-14-2014, 04:35 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dave73 View Post

Anyone having problems with WYCC? I have a problem with the station on my Insignia TV, where the channel locks up when I put it on 20.1 - 20.3, & not be able to change channels at all, once I put it on one of those channels. I also can not shut off the TV when that happens. I bought 2 TV's, an RCA & a Vizio, & did a full scan on those TV's, & neither one would even pick up WYCC on RF 21, but they had no problem picking up all the LPTV stations from Chicago, including WRJK-LD on RF 24 & WCHU-LD on RF 33. I'm wondering if they're sending out a corrupt signal, to where my Insignia locks up on their station, once tuned in, while not allowing any other TV's to pick up RF 21 at all. I ended up returning the RCA TV, because not only doing 5 rescans not bring in the station, but that same TV also doesn't have the ability to do a manual scan of 1 RF channel, like my Insignia does. The Vizio TV at least allows partial scans, but even rescanning for just RF 21 didn't help, & unless my mom wants that TV (it also has streaming options available from Netflix, Youtube, & Hulu), it's going back as well. My nephew started playing with buttons on the remote, to where it shut off with a different button, & even changing the channel with a different button. Once it got off of RF 21, everything started working as it's supposed to. If no one is having the same problem that I'm having, I'm wondering what could be causing the problem.

Same problems as you with WYCC. Started noticing it on Friday and nothing has changed. This is the second time in a month or so where I couldn't receive WYCC.
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post #12029 of 12144 Old 04-14-2014, 05:30 AM
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Originally Posted by Mike_TV View Post

Same problems as you with WYCC. Started noticing it on Friday and nothing has changed. This is the second time in a month or so where I couldn't receive WYCC.
Just a thought, could this be related to Daylight Savings Time? What is your box set for? Or maybe the station has a bogus setting in their PSIP?
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post #12030 of 12144 Old 04-14-2014, 06:47 AM
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Quote:
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Just a thought, could this be related to Daylight Savings Time? What is your box set for? Or maybe the station has a bogus setting in their PSIP?

Someone at WYCC must be reading these posts as I come back an hour or so later and now everything is working. ;-)
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