What's the best VR experience now? - Page 2 - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
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post #31 of 41 Old 07-23-2017, 12:33 AM
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Originally Posted by mpg7321 View Post
in my opinion 4 sensors are a must. Make sure you have enough usb 3.0 ports or if you buy a Pcie Card you get one of the recommended cards
Why? My space is about 9'X9' and I have perfect tracking with 3 in all parts of my space. I guess if someone has a space much larger than that which isn't supported on the Rift...I guess maybe 4 might be better.
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post #32 of 41 Old 07-23-2017, 12:40 AM
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Personally, I think the Touch controllers go a long way in enhancing the experience in most games. Those controllers are just very well made and more interactive than the Vive or PSVR wands. With that said, certain games stick out to me as they are starting to catch up with non-VR experiences. Games like Mage's Tale, Lone Echo, Echo Area, Robo Cob are phenomenal. Then there are older games like The Climb, Project Cars with a Steering Wheel, PinballFX and Chronos among others which I still think are great. Even experiences like The Blu, some of the story experiences, some of the artistry experiences, and social experiences are quite fun. I think we can expect to continue to see some more AAA feeling games in the future similar to the first 4 I listed. Unfortunately I think we are still a ways off until we see games executed to the extent of something like the Witcher 3. I know that Skyrim, Fallout, etc are coming out soon, but I have a feeling that since they weren't built from the ground up with VR in mind, that they wouldn't be as solid as a game built for VR. I guess time will tell.
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post #33 of 41 Old 07-25-2017, 09:11 PM
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Originally Posted by Keithian View Post
Why? My space is about 9'X9' and I have perfect tracking with 3 in all parts of my space. I guess if someone has a space much larger than that which isn't supported on the Rift...I guess maybe 4 might be better.
I play Robo Recall a lot and I have found 4 sensors track better then 3 when t comes to grabbing the guns. With 2 or 3 I found more dead spots in the room. 3 works good, just believe 4 is a bit better.
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post #34 of 41 Old 08-01-2017, 06:44 AM
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I own all the major HMD's: Rift, Vive, PSVR, Gear VR and Daydream. I'm not going to talk about the mobile ones because they are a different league. With PSVR, Rift and Vive they all have strengths and weaknesses and I enjoy all of them. With Rift the room scale now works ALMOST as good as Vive's (but you need at least a 3rd sensor) and the touch controllers are better than Vive wands. With Vive room scale still works better and is easier to setup, and their new Steam home is awesome. Also with Vive the cord is longer so you can get further from your computer, and it doesn't tangle as easily as Rift's either. Between Rift and Vive I usually reach for my Rift though because of the controllers and built in headphones and the fact that it does now have room scale. Plus Rift has more exclusives so far like Lone Echo and Robo Recall. PSVR is just plain fun, titles like Until Dawn: Rush of Blood, Farpoint and Resident Evil 7 are a blast. The one thing that does annoy me is when they release titles on PC that were already on PSVR, because I have a very powerful PC (has a GTX 1080 Ti in it) and games will always look better there. Both because the HMD's are better and my computer is beefy. Basically it's the same as non-VR games in that respect. To summarize I own all of them and enjoy all of them for their strengths and don't regret a single purchase. Unfortunately I guess I am no help for someone only in the market for one of them.
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post #35 of 41 Old 08-13-2017, 02:52 PM
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I have been more focused on the content creation side than the spectator side of the hobby. I also have a limited budget, being retired.

I began work in 360VR with the Giroptic 360 2K 3 camera device and it has been lots of fun. My most aggressive work with it to date has been mounting it on a dji Mavic Drone and doing some high altitude 360 flights.

I purchased my second state of the art 360VR camera in May, a Vuze to shoot 360VR in 3D. To effectively see this properly I had to get a set of goggles, but I was not happy with the image quality any of today's goggles were giving, so I went very low cost with a pair of goggles for my iphone 6+ and this enables me to at least see my work as it should be seen. I am waiting for goggles that are either true 4K or 8K so the window of view can look at least in HD.

I plan to upgrade to the new iphone 8 if that phone can do 4K playback on the screen before I invest in any of the dedicated 360VR goggles. I don't want to be spending between $400 and $800 for the latest with each new release.

I can tell you there are operational disadvantages to viewing with the cheap cell phone goggles but for less than $20, it allows me to see my content for now.

I'll be following you guys to learn what you find "good enough" and then I'll consider investing in a pair of the high end goggles.

For those of you with the better goggles, check out my You Tube channel and let me know how these look in your goggles. Keep in mind, I'm on a learning curve with the shooting and editing 360VR too. So are the developers of the editing tools.

My 3D videos and more
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post #36 of 41 Old 08-13-2017, 10:49 PM
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In my experience, 360 video, or any kind of video in VR really, makes the pixels on the screens (and the video file) much more noticeable. We're not really quite there with regards to resolution, both in capture devices and playback devices (Vive/Oculus/PSVR). Currently for me games and other experiences look more "Real" in VR than 360Video, even those with some 3D implemented.

There are setups being tested that even add parallax to the video, but they're still constricted by the resolution of the final footage. It's an interesting aspect of VR though, for sure. Improvmenets in capture and playback (higher resolution/less stretching) aren't far away I think.
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post #37 of 41 Old 08-14-2017, 11:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mpg7321 View Post
I play Robo Recall a lot and I have found 4 sensors track better then 3 when t comes to grabbing the guns. With 2 or 3 I found more dead spots in the room. 3 works good, just believe 4 is a bit better.
I'm fine with 2, but I'm not hardcore like you...meaning I only played once so far, and my daughter twice.

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post #38 of 41 Old 08-15-2017, 06:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Paganmoon View Post
In my experience, 360 video, or any kind of video in VR really, makes the pixels on the screens (and the video file) much more noticeable. We're not really quite there with regards to resolution, both in capture devices and playback devices (Vive/Oculus/PSVR). Currently for me games and other experiences look more "Real" in VR than 360Video, even those with some 3D implemented.

There are setups being tested that even add parallax to the video, but they're still constricted by the resolution of the final footage. It's an interesting aspect of VR though, for sure. Improvments in capture and playback (higher resolution/less stretching) aren't far away I think.
From what I have seen, the 4K renderings of the Vuze 8 cameras stitched in either 2D or 3D viewing as an equirectangular has the image quality of HD video, ie 720p resolution. However, when you limit your viewing window to a goggles view or a window into the 4K video image the resolution is a fraction of what is expected, that is about 1/8 of the 2K image is viewed which lowers the number of viewable pixels. If true HD quality is to be viewed in a 360 VR window in the goggles or on a flat screen with navigation tool, it should be shot with up to 16000x16000 pixels for the 360 image. Therefore unless you work with a large spherical mounting of many gopro level cameras, a very expensive and cumbersome system, the 360VR is never going to offer that quality today.

But the image quality story gets worse-- Shooting is only half the picture. The display screen also is not high enough resolution. The pixel density should also offer a 16000 pixel density so the window of view has at least an HD or 2K HD resolution. This will also solve the complaint of the window screen artifact. BTW- I find the window screen issue less of a problem than the actual resolution of the image.

We are a long way from any VR system that can satisfy enough image to offer full HD when we are ignoring most of the image at any one time. With VR we should be publishing the effective resolution in the window of view rather than the present practice of claiming the resolution of the entire equirectangular raw image. Then the public not understanding of the technology, would not be so ripped off by the low resolution.

Still, I am willing to sacrifice as a techie guy, the image quality to have the full 360° content. I am having fun with it. I can do things with my new Vuze camera that no other camera can do. So I sacrifice the image quality for now. When a Vuze like camera is released with 8K imagers, and the goggles are 8K displays, it still will not mathematically equal the HD we watch on flat screen but I will be happy to make that upgrade for a noticeable improvement.

As for games, I have to say I am not much into games but I do enjoy watching my grandkids have fun with the race car game and others I have just for them. I even like my bowling game with the Kinect. The games themselves are not the real thing and being able to look around, might add to the experience. My two grandkids ages 5 and 8 love the goggles and 360VR. They don't complain about the fuzzy soft picture. They just accept it for what it is and can do fun and different.

My latest 360VR 3D upload:

My 3D videos and more
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post #39 of 41 Old 08-26-2017, 05:07 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Don Landis View Post
From what I have seen, the 4K renderings of the Vuze 8 cameras stitched in either 2D or 3D viewing as an equirectangular has the image quality of HD video, ie 720p resolution. However, when you limit your viewing window to a goggles view or a window into the 4K video image the resolution is a fraction of what is expected, that is about 1/8 of the 2K image is viewed which lowers the number of viewable pixels. If true HD quality is to be viewed in a 360 VR window in the goggles or on a flat screen with navigation tool, it should be shot with up to 16000x16000 pixels for the 360 image. Therefore unless you work with a large spherical mounting of many gopro level cameras, a very expensive and cumbersome system, the 360VR is never going to offer that quality today.

But the image quality story gets worse-- Shooting is only half the picture. The display screen also is not high enough resolution. The pixel density should also offer a 16000 pixel density so the window of view has at least an HD or 2K HD resolution. This will also solve the complaint of the window screen artifact. BTW- I find the window screen issue less of a problem than the actual resolution of the image.

We are a long way from any VR system that can satisfy enough image to offer full HD when we are ignoring most of the image at any one time. With VR we should be publishing the effective resolution in the window of view rather than the present practice of claiming the resolution of the entire equirectangular raw image. Then the public not understanding of the technology, would not be so ripped off by the low resolution.

Still, I am willing to sacrifice as a techie guy, the image quality to have the full 360° content. I am having fun with it. I can do things with my new Vuze camera that no other camera can do. So I sacrifice the image quality for now. When a Vuze like camera is released with 8K imagers, and the goggles are 8K displays, it still will not mathematically equal the HD we watch on flat screen but I will be happy to make that upgrade for a noticeable improvement.

As for games, I have to say I am not much into games but I do enjoy watching my grandkids have fun with the race car game and others I have just for them. I even like my bowling game with the Kinect. The games themselves are not the real thing and being able to look around, might add to the experience. My two grandkids ages 5 and 8 love the goggles and 360VR. They don't complain about the fuzzy soft picture. They just accept it for what it is and can do fun and different.

My latest 360VR 3D upload:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VKSoK4gM__U&t=58s
Dear Don,
You have edited videos of the VUZE camera, the rendering of the VUZE recordings at what resolution does it come out?

Because if the problem is resolution of the glasses, we have 4K glasses. I explain:
To view my 3D videos obtained with the TD30 I edit them at 3840x1080 and without losing any resolution, I project them in my sony Z5 premium of 4K (currently very cheap) held in a glasses "ColorCross" the result is total immersive without grid in the screen.

Affectionate greetings
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post #40 of 41 Old 08-26-2017, 10:40 AM
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Originally Posted by JOAT09 View Post
Dear Don,
You have edited videos of the VUZE camera, the rendering of the VUZE recordings at what resolution does it come out?

Because if the problem is resolution of the glasses, we have 4K glasses. I explain:
To view my 3D videos obtained with the TD30 I edit them at 3840x1080 and without losing any resolution, I project them in my sony Z5 premium of 4K (currently very cheap) held in a glasses "ColorCross" the result is total immersive without grid in the screen.

Affectionate greetings
There are two steps to editing Vuze camera clips for publication:

Since the Vuze does not stitch the cameras in hardware you have to import the 8 cameras as a file set to software on your computer. Here, after you make adjustments to the seams, color balance, add top and or bottom masks or none, and set the opening scene in the view, and set dead zone crops (black ends) if desired, you then set your rendered output for 3D or 2D, aspect ratio, and resolution. The recommended output as an equirectangular frame is 3840x2160, 16x9 for You Tube and Facebook ( my choice). This can be changed with custom resolution settings if you want to experiment.

Early on I made the mistake of rendering to 3840 x 1920 and this had problems. I can only imagine the problem if I used 3840 x 1080.

Vuze tech support has good recommendations on what works best and I try to follow them.


The next step I do only because I like to crop out bad content and add titles and 2D inserts to my projects is import the rendered stitched clip to Adobe Premiere Pro with the Mettle skybox plugin. I won't say this is absent it's share of bugs but I trues these will be worked out soon. Adobe just bought Skybox and it is now included free.
Here I render the same as the file and it has worked. Premiere Pro also adds the meta data so you don't need to add it later. I've tested in both YT and Facebook but Facebook does not seem to support 3D or goggles. If wrong I'm open to how to do it.

I envy you having the Sony as it is still the only screen that is 4K. I am waiting on the iphone 8 and if it is 4K I will upgrade. Otherwise, next year I will see about dedicated goggles with 4K capability. For now my iphone 6+ is about as good as I get with cheap Walmart goggles.

All in all I am still in kindergarten on this 360 video but you are welcome to have a look on my YT site of what I have done so far.

My Mt Rushmore was done with a stitching software that had problems, but also I didn't know that 360 could not be image stabilized. Now I have a GURU360 that is designed to stabilize the Vuze for walk around 360 video shooting. I haven't done a project with that rig yet.

My 3D videos and more
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post #41 of 41 Old 08-28-2017, 06:54 AM - Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JOAT09 View Post
Dear Don,
You have edited videos of the VUZE camera, the rendering of the VUZE recordings at what resolution does it come out?

Because if the problem is resolution of the glasses, we have 4K glasses. I explain:
To view my 3D videos obtained with the TD30 I edit them at 3840x1080 and without losing any resolution, I project them in my sony Z5 premium of 4K (currently very cheap) held in a glasses "ColorCross" the result is total immersive without grid in the screen.

Affectionate greetings

This might be the most polite post on the entire internet. We need more of this!!!!
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