Denver / Colo Spgs GTG - compare two of the best speakers ever made - AVS Forum | Home Theater Discussions And Reviews
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
post #1 of 5 Old 07-28-2017, 01:45 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
John Schuermann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4,848
Mentioned: 56 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1419 Post(s)
Liked: 1469
Denver / Colo Spgs GTG - compare two of the best speakers ever made

Hello all!

Thanks to the powers that be at the AVS Forum, I have been given permission to post about a unique “speaker shootout” / HT get-together to be held mid-August in north Colorado Springs / Monument (about 35 minutes south of Denver). Any and all are welcome to attend this unique get-together, which is not a sales event, but a simple listening test between what can objectively be called two of the very best speakers made at any price – the Revel Salon2 and the JBL M2 Master Reference Monitor. This thread is being set up as a repository for updates on the shootout, plus a place for those who attend to post their comments and impressions.

There are several factors that make this listening test unique:

1. This is a “shootout” between two of the flagship speakers from one parent company, based on all the latest research coming out of Harman labs, still the largest and best equipped audio research facility in the world. Both speakers have earned the utmost respect from not only the audio press, but those who mix and master the content we all so much enjoy (more on this in a moment). In other words, this is not a test of “brand A vs. brand B,” but a test of two flagship speakers from the same parent company, but using different approaches of achieving similar goals.

2. We will attempt to properly blind part of the listening tests and conduct them in a scientifically controlled manner, taking advantage of direct input from Dr. Floyd Toole on testing methodology. (If you are not familiar with Dr. Toole’s work, you must check it out here and
. Dr. Toole literally wrote the book on applying proper scientific methods to understanding what matters when it comes to sound reproduction and loudspeaker design. To say we are honored to have him advising us on how to set up this event would be an understatement).

3. This is an attempt at demonstrating how a speaker listening test should properly be set up, where all factors such as speaker placement, source material, and volume are equalized. In addition, part of the listening sessions will be conducted in a truly blind fashion, with both speakers hidden from view so no one knows which speaker is playing at any given time.

The contenders:

The Revel Salon2: Long a favorite of the audio press as well as those in the professional film and music industries, the Revel Salon2 is unique in that it continues to win the same kind of scientifically controlled, double blind listening tests we are attempting to emulate. Over the years a huge variety of speakers from many different manufacturers have been compared to the Salon2 during these tests, and the Salon2 continues to beat competitors at many times its price point. One can find lots of reviews of the Salon2 by doing a simple Google search, plus it may be interesting to know that one of Dolby Labs’ Advanced Technology Group’s Critical Listening Rooms features nine Salon2s as main and surround speakers. Perhaps even more interesting is the fact that Dr. Toole himself has a set of Revel Salon2s in his own personal home theater 😊

The JBL M2 Master Reference Monitor: While technically a “Pro” speaker, the JBL M2 is also a part of the JBL Synthesis line-up of speakers intended for premium home theater and stereo listening applications (you can find several threads dedicated to this speaker and its brethren right here on AVS). It also has an impressive professional pedigree, with the M2 rapidly becoming one of the reference speakers for film mixing and critical music mastering. Again, a quick Google search will reveal a large number of excellent reviews and endorsements of the JBL M2 – users include such industry professionals as Frank Fillipetti, Kenny Mixx, Joseph Magee, and Bruce Botnick. In fact, DeLuxe Toronto just outfitted all the main theaters in their new mix facility with M2 monitors.

So here you have it – two of the most respected speakers in the world going head to head. Both speakers are the beneficiary of the purely scientific peer-reviewed research undertaken by Dr. Toole and others at Harman Labs.

I am also happy to report that Harman is sending us new JBL SDP75 surround processor / pre-amp as a loaner specifically for this event. More on this later, as details come in.

Again, please note that this is intended to be a fun home theater / stereo listening / scientifically controlled listening test, NOT a sales event. The idea is to keep things fun and fascinating, where you can listen to some great speakers and hang out with fellow home theater / audio geeks, just like us 😊

Here are the tentative dates and schedule (Saturday and Sunday feature the same schedule):

August 11, 12 and 13

Location – my house in North Colorado Springs (PM me for details)

Friday August 11th

6 – 9 pm – casual hangout and listening, snacks and drinks provided

Saturday / Sunday Schedule (same both days, August 12th and 13th):

11 -12 pm - demo of the JBL Synthesis M2 / LSR708i / C763L / SDP75 based immersive audio setup
12 pm – Break for lunch
1 – 1:30 pm – setup of blind listening session (you are welcome to observe or assist)
1:30 – 3:30 pm – Blind comparison between the M2s and the Salons (may run shorter or longer, depending on number of attendees)
3:30 – 4:30 pm – Revel Salon2 stereo listening session
4:30 – 5:30 pm – JBL M2 stereo listening session
5:30 – 6 pm – Requests taken 😊

There will be limited seating for these listening tests, so please contact me via PM to reserve a space.

Here are pics of the contenders, which we are calling “Beauty” and “The Beast.” I’ll leave it up to you to determine which is which 😉



John Schuermann is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
post #2 of 5 Old 07-30-2017, 02:08 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
John Schuermann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4,848
Mentioned: 56 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1419 Post(s)
Liked: 1469
For anyone interested in this speaker shootout, lots of really interesting discussion about these speakers and the challenges of doing a truly blinded listening test in the speaker topic -

Speaker Shootout - two of the most accurate and well reviewed speakers ever made

Some high level discussion about the science there, for those interested
John Schuermann is online now  
post #3 of 5 Old 08-07-2017, 05:47 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
John Schuermann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4,848
Mentioned: 56 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1419 Post(s)
Liked: 1469
Update on the speaker shootout we are holding this weekend - details have been finalized. I think we still have some slots open for those interested in attending. Much discussion about this in this thread (over 10,000 views in only a week!):

Speaker Shootout - two of the most accurate and well reviewed speakers ever made

Remember, this is not a sales event; our goal is for this to be a fun and educational experience.

YOU ARE CORDIALLY INVITED TO COMPARE THE REVEL SALON2 VS. THE JBL M2 - FINAL DATES AND TIMES SET!

August 11, 12 and 13

Location – our residential showroom in North Colorado Springs (PM me or email for address, email address at bottom)

Friday August 11th

  • 6 – 9 pm – casual hangout and listening, snacks and drinks provided

Saturday / Sunday Schedule (same both days, August 12th and 13th):

  • 11 -12 pm: demo of the JBL Synthesis M2 / LSR708i / C763L / SDP75 based immersive audio setup, now Synthesis calibrated
  • 12 pm – 1:30 pm: Break for lunch (lots of great places to eat within a short walking / driving distance)
  • 1 – 1:30 pm – setup of blind listening session (you are welcome to observe or assist)
  • 1:30 – 3:30 pm – Blind comparison between the M2s and the Salons (may run shorter or longer, depending on number of attendees)
  • 3:30 – 4:30 pm – Revel Salon2 stereo listening session
  • 4:30 – 5:30 pm – JBL M2 stereo listening session
  • 5:30 – 6 pm – Requests taken (possible Revel F208s, F36)

Any and all are welcome to attend this unique get-together August 11, 12 and 13. There are several factors that make this listening test unique:

1. This is a “shootout” between two of the flagship speakers from one parent company, based on all the latest research coming out of Harman labs, still the largest and best equipped audio research facility in the world. In other words, this is not a test of “brand A vs. brand B,” but a test of two flagship speakers from the same parent company, but using different approaches of achieving similar goals.

2. We will attempt to properly blind part of the listening tests and conduct them in a scientifically controlled manner, taking advantage of direct input from Dr. Floyd Toole on testing methodology. To say we are honored to have him advising us on how to set up this event would be an understatement.

3. This is an attempt at demonstrating how a speaker listening test should properly be set up, where all factors such as speaker placement, source material, and volume are equalized. In addition, part of the listening sessions will be conducted in a truly blind fashion, with both speakers hidden from view so no one knows which speaker is playing at any given time.

I am also happy to report that Harman is sending us new JBL SDP75 surround processor / pre-amp as a loaner specifically for this event.

To RSVP, please PM me or email me at my personal address:

jsmusicsound

at

gmail
John Schuermann is online now  
 
post #4 of 5 Old 08-07-2017, 05:58 PM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
John Schuermann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4,848
Mentioned: 56 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1419 Post(s)
Liked: 1469
Full list of gear available to audition at the shootout, in addition to the speakers listed above:

  • JBL Synthesis SDP75 Surround Processor
  • JBL Synthesis SDA4600 and SDA8300 amps
  • JBL Synthesis S2S-EX subwoofers
  • JBL HTPS400 subwoofers

(Total of four subwoofers, calibrated by the SDP75)

  • JVC DLA-RS4500 Native 4K Laser Projector
  • Stewart StudioTek130 2.35:1 Masking Screen
  • Oppo UDP203 UHD Player
  • Straightwire 12/4 SuperQuad cables

More info on the SDP75 will come, probably tomorrow. I spent the weekend setting it up and getting it calibrated, with Curt Hoyt's extremely valuable input.
John Schuermann is online now  
post #5 of 5 Old 08-11-2017, 10:19 AM - Thread Starter
AVS Forum Special Member
 
John Schuermann's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: Colorado
Posts: 4,848
Mentioned: 56 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1419 Post(s)
Liked: 1469
Busy getting set up for tonight - just got a list of the same program material as Harman uses in their double blind listening tests - also been practicing our "human speaker shuffler" to get the speakers in place as fast as (humanly) possible.

There is extensive conversation about this event and the test protocols in the JBL Synthesis / Revel thread on the Speakers forum - Dr. Toole and other high level members participating. Check it out here:

Speaker Shootout - two of the most accurate and well reviewed speakers ever made

Got direct feedback from Curt at Trinnov on how to get the Salon2 and M2 volume balanced using the SDP75, which lets us tweak to 1/10 of a decibel.

Looks like my crew can get the speakers moved in about 3 seconds.

My right hand man Joel built an acoustically transparent black screen with Dr. Toole's input - here it is.



Final schedule - starts tonight!

August 11, 12 and 13

Location – our residential showroom in North Colorado Springs (PM me or email for address, email address at bottom)

Friday August 11th

  • 6 – 9 pm – casual hangout and listening, snacks and drinks provided

Saturday / Sunday Schedule (same both days, August 12th and 13th):

  • 11 -12 pm: demo of the JBL Synthesis M2 / LSR708i / C763L / SDP75 based immersive audio setup, now Synthesis calibrated
  • 12 pm – 1:30 pm: Break for lunch (lots of great places to eat within a short walking / driving distance)
  • 1 – 1:30 pm – setup of blind listening session (you are welcome to observe or assist)
  • 1:30 – 3:30 pm – Blind comparison between the M2s and the Salons (may run shorter or longer, depending on number of attendees)
  • 3:30 – 4:30 pm – Revel Salon2 stereo listening session
  • 4:30 – 5:30 pm – JBL M2 stereo listening session
  • 5:30 – 6 pm – Requests taken (possible Revel F208s, F36)

E-mail:

jsmusicsound

at

gmail
John Schuermann is online now  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Reply Area Home Theater Meets

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off