2010 Mitsubishi 3D DLP Owners Thread (738/838 series) - Page 37 - AVS Forum
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post #1081 of 8822 Old 09-18-2010, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by vikefan24 View Post

I've had my 65638 for a few weeks.. My g/f has horrible arachnophobia, last night she scream for me to come to the living room, I knew it was to kill a spider.. However, it's inside the set, I have no idea how to get rid of it.. Any tips appreciated...



*crappy phone pics..

I think there should be some easy access panels on the side that allows you to reach in and get the spider. Just don't touch the projector seated on the bottom.
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post #1082 of 8822 Old 09-19-2010, 05:43 AM
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Originally Posted by jsmiddleton4 View Post

"I can't get it to take both the input and FF for some reason."

You don't teach it both commands. You teach it the command that the FF key sends after you hit the Input command. When you hit the input key it tells the remote to send commands from a different section of its internal database. Once you hit input, you teach the harmony what the FF key sends. You aren't teaching the Harmony two commands.

You tell the Harmony setup software the new command you want it to learn, name it whatever you want, get to the actual screen where you teach the Harmony and the Harmony is waiting for the key press on the MIT remote. You hit Input and then quickly point the MIT remote at the Harmony and hit the relevant key for HDMI2, HDMI3, whatever input you are teaching the remote.

I've emailed Logitech support but have not heard back. Why they don't have the proper command in their database is unexplainable.

Thanks for the help on this. Now that it's the weekend and I had a few minutes I was able to get the remote fixed using this method. Much better.

Here's a picture of the Mits in our built-in. Funny, when we built it a couple years ago for our 55" Sony rear projection LCD I measured for the 73" Mits at the time knowing I'd upgrade at some point. It's about as tight a fit as I'd like, but I did not figure on the height factor. At 24" with the Sony LCD it was great. 24" for the larger DLP screen is too high, at least with the height of our couch. If I had it to do over I would make it lower to the ground. I guess I'll survive.

I also messed up a bit with the speakers too. Too high on the L-R and now I've only got room on the bottom for the center channel. Tough to re-route the wires for the L-R at this point and my wife thinks I'm crazy to be concerned so we probably won't be putting any holes in the wall in the near future.

Thanks again to all in the forum who provided help during the purchase and set up process.
LL
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post #1083 of 8822 Old 09-19-2010, 08:14 AM
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Your welcome Dave and very nice....

E.B. White said, "I arise in the morning torn between a desire to improve the world and a desire to enjoy the world. This makes it hard to plan the day."
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post #1084 of 8822 Old 09-19-2010, 08:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Stable Dave View Post

Here's a picture of the Mits in our built-in.

Very Nice!

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post #1085 of 8822 Old 09-19-2010, 07:08 PM
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Originally Posted by Metric View Post

Are people still getting the newer model tv from paulstv website? or was that an error they fixed?

From what I understand that is still happening, but you have to checkout on their website and not through amazon or google.
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post #1086 of 8822 Old 09-19-2010, 07:11 PM
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Originally Posted by gtgray View Post


I know you found it straightforward to set the grayscale in ADV. I would be curious how stable and repeatable the the grayscale settings are? Are you using an eye one pro or something else?

Yes an i1pro. Right now I would definitely expect fluctuation since my tv is brand new and the bulb hasn't settled in yet.
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post #1087 of 8822 Old 09-19-2010, 07:35 PM
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Originally Posted by nicholc2 View Post


From what I understand that is still happening, but you have to checkout on their website and not through amazon or google.

Can Someone PM me the Paulstv deal info?
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post #1088 of 8822 Old 09-19-2010, 11:04 PM
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So I am considering purchasing the 73838 or the 73738. It looks like the only difference is the sound bar. I already have 7.1 speakers set up so I'm wondering what the 838 has over the 738?
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post #1089 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 04:15 AM
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Originally Posted by PRO710HD View Post

Can Someone PM me the Paulstv deal info?

PM sent.
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post #1090 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 08:08 AM
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Originally Posted by spacecowboy_f View Post

So I am considering purchasing the 73838 or the 73738. It looks like the only difference is the sound bar. I already have 7.1 speakers set up so I'm wondering what the 838 has over the 738?

838 also has the auto iris which some folks like and some folks don't. As well as Perfect Color and Perfect Tint. But if you use the ADV mode, those can't be used anyway.

Being that I have a 7.1 system and prefer a linear gamma, I went with the 738. The iris affects gamma response.
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post #1091 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 08:11 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by nicholc2 View Post

Yes an i1pro. Right now I would definitely expect fluctuation since my tv is brand new and the bulb hasn't settled in yet.

The reason I ask you about your 2010 is because there seems to be a divergence of opinion on what is the typical range of fluctuation one should expect on tehse sets in average dE from one measurement of the grayscale one day to another measurement on another day on a set with the has a stable "broken in" lamp.

My set seems to "wobble" both on peak Y and on RGB balance beyond what I think should be acceptable. I have described the behavior in the display calibration thread for the Mits set in detail. Another poster who has owned 3 generations of Mits DLP over the last 3 years says he has seen the same behavior on all 3 gens including after light engine replacement.

In my case green seems to go up and down effecting total luminance but also causing color balance to shift from nuetral to greenish while still maintaining close to 6500k average temps. I can set grayscale to have very low dEs and a day later they will have risen, another day later they have fallen back some, but generally they rise until they get to around dE of 5.0 average then oscillate between say 2.5 average to 5.X on any given day.

You can see the difference in grayscale and luminance as it moves toward the more or less accurate. I can adjust back to the low error, but it will go back to the higher range and oscillate regardless. The other forum member claims this is characteristic of Mits DLPs. That is why I was hoping to see jut how the 2010s behave over time.

My set will measure differently on grayscale everyday, despite great care to eliminate variables like set and meter warmup. My visual experience matches what the meter tells me. I recall you mentioned your bad lamp experience, and maybe my expectations are too high but Mits hangs the ISF branding on these sets so I believe we should expect them to calibrate to 3.0 dE or less on grayscale and 1.5 CIE 94 dE on color gamut as those are the standards. The sets should be able to maintain those numbers for a reasonable period of time. A month or two at least on a 500 -1000 hour lamp. Frankly I am completely okay with a 2.0 dE measurement on primaries as long a the Y errors are minimal.

I am using an external VP with full CMS and I have a much more granular set of tools to adjust then what is provided in ADV. People using other display technologies routinely get color down to 0.5 dE and hold it using the Duo VP. Regardless of whether I use ADV and no VP or use the DVDO Duo to set grayscale I still get the same floating green levels.

I have made a service call to Mits. My set has behaved this way since I got it last January. I have no idea what parts they intend to bring on the service call. My guess is that the lamp/lamp power supply and ballast system are not robust enough to run the lamp at bright. The 2010 uses a different part number lamp. I don't know about the lamp power supply and ballast as I a have not seen a service manual but those parts may have been changed as well. I am using a USB powered fan to force additional fresh air into the lamp fan intake vent to help stabilize lamp temps.

I am not so concerned about meeting those ISF dE targets on color gamut as I am with getting the set to maintain grayscale calibration and gamut for awhile. It seems like everytime the set is turned on the grayscale behaves differently even though the settings have not changed. Now I can see and understand some drift over several hours of continuous running but it nowhere near what I see from day to day.

Just another blank signature.
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post #1092 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 08:32 AM
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Well I'm coming from an almost 6yr old 62725 which did not have any fluctuation. The 2010 of course will be new to me in almost every aspect as a permanent owner, so that's something I'll definitely look out for and let you know. It'll definitely be easier to see once the bulb is broken in. I will say, however, that with my 62725, I noticed that one bulb is not equal to another. The 2nd bulb I installed IMHO wasn't very good as it made my color points and grays less accurate, but the 3rd one was exactly the opposite. That could be part of the issue, but it's hard to say.
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post #1093 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 10:30 AM
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Not in the TV itself, just the delivery. Ordered about two weeks ago from Walts. Took today off of work to receive it, and there was a huge tear in the box (screen side, of course) that was about 3 inches wide by 3 feet long. Ripped though the foam that protected the screen. YRC was the shipper.

I'm not sure why they would even waste time delivering it after seeing what happened to the box. The screen had a horrible scuff mark just off of dead center. I tried everything I could think of too remove it, but it was unfixable.

Anyway, I called Walts and they told me to refuse delivery. They said they would send another out, but I haven't gotten final word from them on timing. I don't know if they do anything additional to protect it during shipping, or if we just all cross our fingers again and hope the second one arrives unscathed.
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post #1094 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 10:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hawkmoon77 View Post

Not in the TV itself, just the delivery. Ordered about two weeks ago from Walts. Took today off of work to receive it, and there was a huge tear in the box (screen side, of course) that was about 3 inches wide by 3 feet long. Ripped though the foam that protected the screen. YRC was the shipper.

I'm not sure why they would even waste time delivering it after seeing what happened to the box. The screen had a horrible scuff mark just off of dead center. I tried everything I could think of too remove it, but it was unfixable.

Anyway, I called Walts and they told me to refuse delivery. They said they would send another out, but I haven't gotten final word from them on timing. I don't know if they do anything additional to protect it during shipping, or if we just all cross our fingers again and hope the second one arrives unscathed.

A really useful bit of information would be people's experience with delivery services for their Big Screen Mitsus. Given the fragility of these sets in transit, having an informed choice of delivery services, whether tied or not tied to Big Screen vendors, would be valuable, and might help guide their purchases. Some shippers offer to deliver these DLPs on pallets.

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post #1095 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 11:38 AM
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I should have mentioned, it was on a pallet.
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post #1096 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 12:20 PM
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Originally Posted by hawkmoon77 View Post

I should have mentioned, it was on a pallet.

Thanks for that. I guess that takes the sheen off of delivery on a pallet. As I suspected, it has a lot to do with how the delivery is treated all the way down the line.

I really think it would be useful to have a poll or some sort of review of shippers. The price of the set means little if delivery is a nightmare.

I wish you luck on sorting it all out, and that you get a perfect set.

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post #1097 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 12:25 PM
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I just purchased a WD-82738. I also have a Samsung C7000 series 63" plasma. The 3D on the plasma (both from Blu Ray and DirecTV) is exceptional, but, so far, I'm not as impressed with the Mits. The image appears to be more fuzzy and the colors more washed out. I used Jaseman's settings as a starting point.

I am using the Mits 3d adapter and both the Mits glasses and Samsung glasses (since they are identical). I tried the XPands but those wouldn't sync up unless I was close to the TV and the image was even worse (they were set up properly as DLP Link with Reverse).

Also, there is a lot of light coming from the back of the tv that is being projected onto the wall. Is this normal?

Any suggestions/input about the 3D issue would be appreciated.

Tim Love
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post #1098 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 03:45 PM
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Larger screens will not be as sharp. This is should not a problem if you are comparing similar size to distance ratios. If you are vewing the 65" at 9 ft and the 82" at 9' you will actually be seeing a much closer view of the 82"


Rear projectors use high gain screens which softens the image to some degree compared to plasmas. What is your comparable viewing distance?

Light leaking out of the lamp air intake areas is normal

Some of us feel that the Jaserman setting are too bright and wash out the display.

Try setting contrast a couple of clicks lower Try 58 instead
Try setting blacks (brightness) especially, several clicks lower Try 33 or 34

Just another blank signature.
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post #1099 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 06:42 PM
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Walts shipped out a new TV, and provided me with the tracking number three hours after my intitial call to them this morning. Same shipper, with delivery scheduled for this Friday. Shipping from Arizona to Florida.
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post #1100 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 06:59 PM
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I received my 73838 from Walt's in August. It came on a palette and did have a rip in the box. It was sent from Tempe Ariz to NYC. Luckily the screen was unaffected and, after a month of settling in, I am delighted with the unit. I have zero interest in 3D, but all the other functions are humming along. The PQ and size just knocks people out and they all leave lusting for one.

I have used a modified set of Jaseman's settings and I cannot imagine a more satisfactory image. I use the bright setting and both daytime and evening images are excellent. The only slight disappointment is in the wireless Internet running via router from Time Warner. There is endless buffering using the Mits wireless device. Soon I will try a hard wired set up and see if things improve.
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post #1101 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 08:07 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by filmgene View Post

I received my 73838 from Walt's in August. It came on a palette and did have a rip in the box. It was sent from Tempe Ariz to NYC. Luckily the screen was unaffected and, after a month of settling in, I am delighted with the unit. I have zero interest in 3D, but all the other functions are humming along. The PQ and size just knocks people out and they all leave lusting for one.

I have used a modified set of Jaseman's settings and I cannot imagine a more satisfactory image. I use the bright setting and both daytime and evening images are excellent. The only slight disappointment is in the wireless Internet running via router from Time Warner. There is endless buffering using the Mits wireless device. Soon I will try a hard wired set up and see if things improve.

I'm really considering the 73838, based on having seen it at Paul's. It had a perfect picture to my eyes, bright and vibrant. How are you enjoying the soundbar, the iris, and dark detailer....And how's the geometry?

Congratulations on your new set.

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post #1102 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 10:03 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtgray View Post

Larger screens will not be as sharp. This is should not a problem if you are comparing similar size to distance ratios. If you are vewing the 65" at 9 ft and the 82" at 9' you will actually be seeing a much closer view of the 82"


Rear projectors use high gain screens which softens the image to some degree compared to plasmas. What is your comparable viewing distance?

Light leaking out of the lamp air intake areas is normal

Some of us feel that the Jaserman setting are too bright and wash out the display.

Try setting contrast a couple of clicks lower Try 58 instead
Try setting blacks (brightness) especially, several clicks lower Try 33 or 34

Also, checkerboard 3d isn't as sharp as full 1080p 3d, as it's only half the resolution.
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post #1103 of 8822 Old 09-20-2010, 11:14 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theanimalad View Post

Other than the flimsy screen I really like the set. My screen is pretty concave which causes geometry distortion in about a 4 inch border around the screen. Adjusting for it seems to distort the center of the screen somewhat. Touching the screen or frame changes the geometry. Based on the 2009 model thread it seems to be a common issue with the 73s and 82s. Many have reported exchanging sets and getting one with a flatter screen, so I may try that; wife willing.

I wouldn't let that disuade you though. I'm probably overly critical and nitpicky. I imagine most people wouldn't even notice it during normal viewing.

The picture is a bit off-axis, but you can see the upper horizontals curve up at the edges and middle verticals curve out. You'd never see it watching a 16:9 Blu-ray, but I notice it on everything that is letter or pillar boxed, TiVo menus, and on my HTPC.


Let me save you the time...Mitsu. just swapped my 09 73837 for a 10 73838 because the geometry issues could not be corrected. I griped about this for about 8 months and three service calls before they caved and gave me a new tv. Got the 838 today and almost to the millimeter, the geometry lines were exactly the same as the 837. So basically I got a new tv with the same problems. The new tv has a little more adjustability in the service menu, but still pretty much sucks geometry wise.

On a positive note, the 838 seems to have a more "natural" color which I think is good. The old one seemed a little tweaked for lack of a better word. I am using the same settings on the new one as on the old.

Let me know what you end up doing.
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post #1104 of 8822 Old 09-21-2010, 01:36 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morphinapg View Post

Also, checkerboard 3d isn't as sharp as full 1080p 3d, as it's only half the resolution.

In theory you would have to have a set of calibrations created with a meter reading through the glasses as well. I have only seen 3d on an 82" briefly in a completely darkened room at a Fry's. I hope to have the necessary equipment over the next month or so to it determine what it takes to optimize the experience.

Just another blank signature.
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post #1105 of 8822 Old 09-21-2010, 02:00 AM
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Originally Posted by gtgray View Post

In theory you would have to have a set of calibrations created with a meter reading through the glasses as well. I have only seen 3d on an 82" briefly in a completely darkened room at a Fry's. I hope to have the necessary equipment over the next month or so to it determine what it takes to optimize the experience.

True, I never even thought of that. I guess most people will probably be fine with a 2d calibration, unless a majority of what they watch is 3d, but the glasses could potentially mess up your calibration slightly.
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post #1106 of 8822 Old 09-21-2010, 05:23 AM
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gtgray and morphinapg,

Thanks to you both for your comments. Gt, the contrast and brightness adjustments gave the 2D view a bit more image "pop", so thank you for that.

I sit 19 feet from the TV. At that distance, the 63" plasma looked really good, but it was too far away, and not the immersive experience I wanted (I had an old 73" Mits) which is why I got the 82 incher. The 63" is now in another room, with a distance of about 12 feet, and it looks even better now that I'm a bit closer to it.

I also re-reviewed the 3D and it just doesn't compare. It really is a night and day difference to the plasma.

The colors are washed out compared to the plasma, the dimensionality/pop factor isn't as it should be based on other sets I have seen, and the image appears blurry/fuzzy (not halo's around object...the entire image appears hazy).

When I try various default settings while watching "Monsters vs Aliens", I get:

Brilliant---way too contrasty...faces are bright orange with greenish hues on cheek bones, (looks horrible)
Bright---about the same as brilliant color wise but dimmer
Natural--dimmer than Bright
ADV-a bit dimmer still and sky isn't blue, it's almost gray (the best way to describe it is it looks like a badly colorized B&W film)

I bought the set for it's 3D size. If the 3D image can't be improved (colors, depth, etc.), I'm not sure it's worth keeping.

I would really appreciate any insight or suggestions. Can anyone else in the forum confirm what I am seeing?

Thanks again for your help.

Tim Love
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post #1107 of 8822 Old 09-21-2010, 07:00 AM
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Taichi:

I do not use the sound bar. I have a Pioneer av receiver and 5 Harman Kardan speakers and a Polk subwoofer. I honestly have no idea what difference the iris and dark detailer make (this is my first DLP set, although I have experience with the 3 chip NEC 1600 theatrical projector. To my eyes, it compares quite favorably to that $75,000 machine - on a much smaller scale of course.)

The geometry seems fine to me, but I am no purist when it comes to that. I see no objectionable bowing of lines. Of course the one thing I do not know yet is the long-time reliability of the unit. Six weeks after installation everything is quite nice.

Gene Stavis
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post #1108 of 8822 Old 09-21-2010, 07:32 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by morphinapg View Post

Also, checkerboard 3d isn't as sharp as full 1080p 3d, as it's only half the resolution.

Is there such a thing as full 1080P 3D, I was under the impression that there was a limiting factor.
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post #1109 of 8822 Old 09-21-2010, 08:13 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by filmgene View Post

Taichi:

I do not use the sound bar. I have a Pioneer av receiver and 5 Harman Kardan speakers and a Polk subwoofer. I honestly have no idea what difference the iris and dark detailer make (this is my first DLP set, although I have experience with the 3 chip NEC 1600 theatrical projector. To my eyes, it compares quite favorably to that $75,000 machine - on a much smaller scale of course.)

The geometry seems fine to me, but I am no purist when it comes to that. I see no objectionable bowing of lines. Of course the one thing I do not know yet is the long-time reliability of the unit. Six weeks after installation everything is quite nice.

Gene Stavis

Thanks filmgene.

You're obviously a film lover, and your satisfaction with the 73838, even after using a 3 chip projector, is good news. When I saw it properly set up I was very much impressed. As I mentioned before, I looked at a lot of sets, Plasma and LCD, in the same afternoon at the same location (Pauls TV), and I kept coming back to the Mits.

I hope your set proves to be eminently reliable.

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post #1110 of 8822 Old 09-21-2010, 08:41 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tclove View Post

gtgray and morphinapg,

Thanks to you both for your comments. Gt, the contrast and brightness adjustments gave the 2D view a bit more image "pop", so thank you for that.

I sit 19 feet from the TV. At that distance, the 63" plasma looked really good, but it was too far away, and not the immersive experience I wanted (I had an old 73" Mits) which is why I got the 82 incher. The 63" is now in another room, with a distance of about 12 feet, and it looks even better now that I'm a bit closer to it.

I also re-reviewed the 3D and it just doesn't compare. It really is a night and day difference to the plasma.

The colors are washed out compared to the plasma, the dimensionality/pop factor isn't as it should be based on other sets I have seen, and the image appears blurry/fuzzy (not halo's around object...the entire image appears hazy).

When I try various default settings while watching "Monsters vs Aliens", I get:

Brilliant---way too contrasty...faces are bright orange with greenish hues on cheek bones, (looks horrible)
Bright---about the same as brilliant color wise but dimmer
Natural--dimmer than Bright
ADV-a bit dimmer still and sky isn't blue, it's almost gray (the best way to describe it is it looks like a badly colorized B&W film)

I bought the set for it's 3D size. If the 3D image can't be improved (colors, depth, etc.), I'm not sure it's worth keeping.

I would really appreciate any insight or suggestions. Can anyone else in the forum confirm what I am seeing?

Thanks again for your help.

Brilliant---way too contrasty...faces are bright orange with greenish hues on cheek bones, (looks horrible)

Brilliant is a preset designed to give the LCD/Plasma look. If Brilliant is is giving you orange cheekbones and greenish hues adjust the settings under Brilliant for color, hue and contrast levels.

There are also sharpness levels that can help a soft picture.
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