92" Mitsubishi DLP @ CES!!! - Page 13 - AVS Forum
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post #361 of 1927 Old 06-25-2011, 01:22 PM
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I will have reflection issues but for 92" I can deal with it (hopefully).
What stand is everyone going to use? I know the 2010 models have a limited vertical viewing angle so a stand at the correct height is critical. Maybe with the new screen the viewing angle is better but the trade off is more reflective surface...?
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post #362 of 1927 Old 06-27-2011, 10:13 AM
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Thank you for your inquiry. Mitsubishi does not have a firm date but the new units should start shipping at the end of July. Please watch our site for updates.

Thank you,
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post #363 of 1927 Old 06-27-2011, 07:06 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gagaliya View Post

man i am having serious second thoughts about getting this vs a projector.

The advantage is daytime viewing when people come over, and no projector mounting and running wires to the back of the living room.

But this thing is 200lbs (vs 15lb) and dimension wise very thick! on top of that it cost 3x as much as a good hd projector.

With the new wireless 1080p video transmitters, running wires is no longer needed for the projector. So it really just come down to if daytime/ambient light viewing is worth all the trouble (and money).



Mitsubishi Big Screen DLP vs Projector
In 2009 I was thinking of a projector vs my 65 inch Diamond DLP and did a lot of reading to come to this conclusion:::

#1 Sharp Edge/Edge Enhance

#2 Dark Detailer

#3 Deep Field Imager

#4 Long term Reliability

#5 The main thing is the bulbs life span. The little bulbs in the projectors have half the life span of the bigger TV's bulb..Not only that but the TV bulbs are cheaper than the projectors bulb..

#6 Repair. It's easier to get a tv repaired than a projector...

#7 Day time viewing.

#8 Wow factor... You are going to get more of a wow from visitors for having a huge tv than having a Projector. Projectors when seen by visitors are seen as "eh it's probably a cheap old projector". But nobody can deny the worth and show power of a huge tv...

#9 Projectors are either right over your head or real close to you. TV's are further away.

#10 Inputs, Inputs, Inputs. TV has more inputs so you won't have to buy daisy chain input switchers.

#11 Multiple Settings on the TV. For each input, your settings are saved. Say you want an input for sports or an input for movies.. The color & Contrasts are saved per input..

#12 Digital TV tunar... Projectors lack this.

#13 USB MP3 playback is nice on the Mitsubishi's too. View Photos even. Why power on the old PC when the TV can do it?

#14 Multi Color Processor. Most projectors do not include Mitsubishi DLP's 6 color Processor. Yellow is very nice, Sky Blue and Purple is always nice to see. I've put my DLP next to regular 3 color tv's and no way am I going back.

#15 Net Command and IR learning.. Features that allows you to use your TV as a Master Intertainment HUB.

#16 To get what you get in a DLP TV, you would need to spend more for a top of the line Mitsubishi DLP projector.

#17 Lasty I asked my self, do I want to wipe the lens on a Projector? What if I scratch it?

So there you go... The benefits of a Mitsubishi DLP big screen out way the compact portability of a Projector. If you can't have both, get the TV you will be glad you did.
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post #364 of 1927 Old 06-27-2011, 08:01 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by overtkill View Post

This might be some new information:

http://www.bigpicturebigsound.com/Ey...2840-DLP.shtml

Says EARLY JULY release date...

Thank you that was very informative. It looks like the bulb issue has been absolutely confirmed. Now the big question is can that bulb power the 92" even with the clear contrast considering it could barely power last years 82"? If the clear contrast screen makes such a big improvement that the bulb goes from barely sustaining 82" to properly lighting 92" than imagine what it would do to the 82" 840!!

I really want this 92" but I have a REAL hard time believing that bulb will be sufficient. Sadly, those waiting to see the set in person might have a long wait, I live in a pretty big market (South Florida) and would drive quite a ways to see this beast but I just don't think retailers will be carrying it in-store.
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post #365 of 1927 Old 06-27-2011, 09:26 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by caneaddict View Post

Thank you that was very informative. It looks like the bulb issue has been absolutely confirmed. Now the big question is can that bulb power the 92" even with the clear contrast considering it could barely power last years 82"? If the clear contrast screen makes such a big improvement that the bulb goes from barely sustaining 82" to properly lighting 92" than imagine what it would do to the 82" 840!!

I really want this 92" but I have a REAL hard time believing that bulb will be sufficient. Sadly, those waiting to see the set in person might have a long wait, I live in a pretty big market (South Florida) and would drive quite a ways to see this beast but I just don't think retailers will be carrying it in-store.

I went from a 73C9 to an 82738 this past weekend, and I don't notice any change in brightness. It certainly doesn't seem like the 82" model is barely being powered by the bulb it has.

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post #366 of 1927 Old 06-27-2011, 11:59 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by pjb16 View Post

I went from a 73C9 to an 82738 this past weekend, and I don't notice any change in brightness. It certainly doesn't seem like the 82" model is barely being powered by the bulb it has.

It's not brightness, it's contrast and no the 82" does not have the same level of contrast as the smaller sets. You'd be the very first to say they are equal
because they are not.
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post #367 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 06:34 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colour View Post

It's not brightness, it's contrast

You keep "correcting" everyone on this point, but in the context of this conversation, it's moot. A lamp with a given output will produce less luminence when spread over a greater area, and therefore will have less brightness. There will also be less contrast since the absolute black level is relatively fixed. The two are directly related. This is a separate issue from the effect of "brightness" and "contrast" controls on most sets. It's silly to keep bringing up this issue of semantics.

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post #368 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 06:50 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darin View Post

You keep "correcting" everyone on this point, but in the context of this conversation, it's moot. A lamp with a given output will produce less luminence when spread over a greater area, and therefore will have less brightness. There will also be less contrast since the absolute black level is relatively fixed. The two are directly related. This is a separate issue from the effect of "brightness" and "contrast" controls on most sets. It's silly to keep bringing up this issue of semantics.

No and your statement is incorrect and moot.
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post #369 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 07:02 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colour View Post

No and your statement is incorrect and mute.

Audio is also completely irrelevant to the topic.

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post #370 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 07:15 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darin View Post

Audio is also completely irrelevant to the topic.



The bottom line is that at least a few of us are VERY happy with our 82" sets, even if they have a bit less brightness / contrast (and yes, the 2 are most definitely related to each other) than the smaller sets. IMHO, one should make an effort to see these sets in person (even though you'll most likely only see them in some sort of showroom conditions, which won't present them at their best) and make your own decision. I upgraded from a 65" (WD-65835) to an 82" (WD-82838) and also looked at most of the current line of Mits sets (including 65", 73", 82", and LaserView) in a store that has reasonable conditions as stores go. I didn't feel that the 82" gave up much at all and has the obvious benefit of the much larger size. In real world viewing conditions (my home), the 82" has better picture quality than the set it replaced. A few months later, I'm still very happy with my choice and if I have to replace the lamp a bit earlier to keep the picture bright enough it's really not that big a deal as they only cost ~$100 (yes, I'm ignoring the cost of recalibration for those who hire someone to calibrate their display).
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post #371 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 11:12 AM
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I have had just about every 73" Mitsubishi has made. Right now
I have last years 82". The picture on the 82" is every bit as good
and "bright" as the 73's. I have 2 skylights and 3 windows in the
viewing room............unless there is direct sunlight there is no
real problem. " Surprise".. the picture is not as bright or "contrasty" in the middle of the day. At any normal light level for viewing it is fine. I am on my original bulb and have had
zero problems with the set. In a direct comparison with an LCD of say 65" it may indeed appear less brighter. But if you really want a super bright cartoon image why not go right on down
to a 55, or better yet a 46 inch set. My point being if you are
looking for a more theatrical experience the bigger size is what
you want. If the 92 is equivalent to the 82 there is no worry.
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post #372 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 01:39 PM
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Will the 2011 models have the same lamps as the 2010 sets?
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post #373 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 02:41 PM
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I am not 100% sure but I think the same bulb fits both years,
and also the 73 inch model. To be safe check with a more
knowledgeable source. When I got my spare I got it right
from the Mits site, bulb with housing was about $100. The older
models had more expensive bulbs.
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post #374 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 05:42 PM
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I'm not saying the 82" can't look good but there is definitely a loss of contrast as you go up in size in all the sets. With the new screen I think that issue will be remedied. Brightness and contrast are related but reduction in contrast is what I see and that's exactly what the new screens increase.
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post #375 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 06:50 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gsr View Post



The bottom line is that at least a few of us are VERY happy with our 82" sets, even if they have a bit less brightness / contrast (and yes, the 2 are most definitely related to each other) than the smaller sets. IMHO, one should make an effort to see these sets in person (even though you'll most likely only see them in some sort of showroom conditions, which won't present them at their best) and make your own decision. I upgraded from a 65" (WD-65835) to an 82" (WD-82838) and also looked at most of the current line of Mits sets (including 65", 73", 82", and LaserView) in a store that has reasonable conditions as stores go. I didn't feel that the 82" gave up much at all and has the obvious benefit of the much larger size. In real world viewing conditions (my home), the 82" has better picture quality than the set it replaced. A few months later, I'm still very happy with my choice and if I have to replace the lamp a bit earlier to keep the picture bright enough it's really not that big a deal as they only cost ~$100 (yes, I'm ignoring the cost of recalibration for those who hire someone to calibrate their display).

Well said.

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post #376 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 08:35 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by colour View Post

I'm not saying the 82" can't look good but there is definitely a loss of contrast as you go up in size in all the sets. With the new screen I think that issue will be remedied. Brightness and contrast are related but reduction in contrast is what I see and that's exactly what the new screens increase.

I found the 73 inch to be brighter and more contrasty than the 82 in all but one AV setting, where the seating and light level created a conducive environment.

I found that if you sit in the sweet spot of that high gain 82 inch
screen it has a lot of punch. The 73 has a bigger sweet spot, IMHO.
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post #377 of 1927 Old 06-28-2011, 11:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post

I found the 73 inch to be brighter and more contrasty than the 82 in all but one AV setting, where the seating and light level created a conducive environment.

I found that if you sit in the sweet spot of that high gain 82 inch
screen it has a lot of punch. The 73 has a bigger sweet spot, IMHO.

Haing lived with a 2009 82" for 18 months now..keep your stand low, your viewing on center and your lamp relatively fresh.

I have a DUO and I am going to automated calibration. That way I can get keep the set looking optimal if that means calbrating twice a month and ditching the lamp at 12 month intervals.

I am serious considering the 92 but I will not be an early adopter. I won't pay anywhere near MSRP.. I will wait, I will probably try to build a 13" custom stand for the big boy to sit on.

Also your source material on the big projectors is important. I have always fooled around with HTPC but could never take it seriously before as the video ouptut was marginal despite what fanatics claimed. At least without magic without magic tricks. What is saw was just not on par with good CE Set Top Boxes.

Madvr the new rendering engine a lot of people are using it look good! While still not appliance simple or comprhensive in the apps that will use it looks superb compared to what you could easily get out of a PC before.

I have gone down the Ceton path and now I am evaluating jRiver Media Center with madvr's rendering engine. Make sure you source is top notch and for goodness sake get your levels and color spaces right.

Oh backlighting is also a plus with these big sets.. makes the blacks appear blacker and so the apparent contrast is higher.

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post #378 of 1927 Old 06-29-2011, 07:47 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtgray View Post


...I have a DUO and I am going to automated calibration. That way I can get keep the set looking optimal if that means calibrating twice a month and ditching the lamp at 12 month intervals...

...Oh backlighting is also a plus with these big sets.. makes the blacks appear blacker and so the apparent contrast is higher.

I never knew that sophisticated auto calibration existed. Doing a little search I found ChromaPure Auto-Calibrate, an add-on to ChromaPure Standard, which can be used with a DVDO Duo or Lumagen Radiance.

The demo is here:
http://www.chromapure.com/demos-autocal.asp

Too bad they don't show a before and after of a display!

So does this kind of thing work as well as professional, manual calibration?

What's the expense for a Duo or Lumagen?

Backlighting is a good idea. On one of these threads there are links to "theatrical" backlights.
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post #379 of 1927 Old 06-29-2011, 08:43 AM
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In very rough terms, the Lumagen costs 1.5-2.0 times a Duo. There is a low end Lumagen that costs about the same as the Duo, but it has severely limited inputs. Many believe the Radience is worth the extra expense. I believe the Lumagen has exceptional support, but it seems ABT (the creator of the DUO) has become part of a new company and I've no idea about their support.

Call AVS for actual prices.
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post #380 of 1927 Old 06-29-2011, 09:04 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by taichi4 View Post

I never knew that sophisticated auto calibration existed. Doing a little search I found ChromaPure Auto-Calibrate, an add-on to ChromaPure Standard, which can be used with a DVDO Duo or Lumagen Radiance.

The demo is here:
http://www.chromapure.com/demos-autocal.asp

Too bad they don't show a before and after of a display!

So does this kind of thing work as well as professional, manual calibration?

What's the expense for a Duo or Lumagen?

Backlighting is a good idea. On one of these threads there are links to "theatrical" backlights.

Maybe not as good as the best "Pro" calibratin... but lamps age.. so the best "Pro" calibration is only a few months away from being day old bread. I can't personaly say I have seen the DUO stuff automated. I use the DUO when I calibrate but it is still a pain manually with the DUO.. all the controls are there and it is easier than fightitng with the built in controls. But with these fast meters you are talking about 5 minutes of setup time and a 10 min auto-calc. So while your set may only be 95 percent of the way to what a top Pro could do.. most of that difference is not visually detectable.

The fact that the calibration can be kept fresh, and you can ditch the lamp any time you want is pretty cool. Paying $500 for a calibration that really is only dead on for a couple hundred hours is only for the well heeled. It is basically burning money up. I have owned a DUO since they were in early beta.. It will survive several TVs. I am going to guess that autocalc would do just about as well as I do. It takes me 2 to 3 hours for me to calibrate my set. I have done it dozens of times. I burned out on it frankly. I already have a ChromaPure 2.0 pro license and I have a Chroma 5 meter. I will get the new faster 3 Pro.. and just send the new meter in once a year for calibration.

I paid about $850 for my DUO... about 2 years ago, so it is pretty well amortized. One thing that is nice about the DUO; if you use an HTPC you can tell it to underscan while you are doing maintenance or desktop operations then in playback you let the TV overscan as it would in 1 to 1. So the DUO adds value in many other ways beyond autocalc capability. When the video driver scales it tends to make a mess of things so it is a pain to resize the desktop for desktop use, then defeat that for content playback.

In my case it is a no brainer to get setup for autocalc. I actually would not need to spend any money to do so. In truth though my meter would need calibrating so I will opt for the new faster meter and maybe ebay my old one.

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post #381 of 1927 Old 06-29-2011, 09:10 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hyrax View Post

In very rough terms, the Lumagen costs 1.5-2.0 times a Duo. There is a low end Lumagen that costs about the same as the Duo, but it has severely limited inputs. Many believe the Radience is worth the extra expense. I believe the Lumagen has exceptional support, but it seems ABT (the creator of the DUO) has become part of a new company and I've no idea about their support.

Call AVS for actual prices.

The DUO is a pretty mature piece. It does not handle checkerboard very well, at least mine doesn't. I don't see anything else it needs.. SpectraCal and Chrompure are the people adding value these days to a DUO. So yeah, Radience is an ongoing development project and the DUO is not getting much effort from its parent company. My view is that as long as the DUO is supported for warranty and out of warranty repair it should not be a concern that it is not getting lots of minor firmware changes.

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post #382 of 1927 Old 06-29-2011, 09:45 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtgray View Post

The DUO is a pretty mature piece. It does not handle checkerboard very well, at least mine doesn't. I don't see anything else it needs.. SpectraCal and Chrompure are the people adding value these days to a DUO. So yeah, Radience is an ongoing development project and the DUO is not getting much effort from its parent company. My view is that as long as the DUO is supported for warranty and out of warranty repair it should not be a concern that it is not getting lots of minor firmware changes.

So what would be the least expensive way for me to get an auto calibration setup?

Currently I have a CRT RPTV, the Mitsubishi 65813, with the 9 inch cathodes. Great set.

I'm on this thread because of my fascination with the 92 inch, and the evolution of DLP RPTV.
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post #383 of 1927 Old 07-01-2011, 11:53 AM
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Surprised no online retailers are taking orders yet. Maybe an August release now?
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post #384 of 1927 Old 07-02-2011, 08:37 AM
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There is this paltry tidbit...an eyewitness testimony of sorts.

http://bitstream.soundandvisionmag.c...28Bitstream%29
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post #385 of 1927 Old 07-07-2011, 11:52 AM
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Here's a video of the beast in action. http://revision3.com/geekbeattv/mitsubishitv

One thing that really caught my eye was the screen reflection. I have mixed feeling about it. I guess I would need to see one in person.
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post #386 of 1927 Old 07-07-2011, 02:10 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by girdnerg View Post

One thing that really caught my eye was the screen reflection. I have mixed feeling about it. I guess I would need to see one in person.

Noticed that first thing also. Was looking at the 73840 but if its reflective like that I would just assume get the 73640.

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post #387 of 1927 Old 07-07-2011, 02:15 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by girdnerg View Post

Here's a video of the beast in action. http://revision3.com/geekbeattv/mitsubishitv

One thing that really caught my eye was the screen reflection. I have mixed feeling about it. I guess I would need to see one in person.

Man, I am so glad I waited for this instead of going with the 82! The size is great and I am surprised that it looks pretty vibrant and bright too. The reflection is not a big issue, I had a similar screen on my first 65" Mitsu HDTV. Ready to place my order now!

FYI, I have been quoted $5150 shipped for this but am hoping for a better price at Amazon. I was also told they are shipping out in late July and early August but in limited numbers.
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post #388 of 1927 Old 07-07-2011, 02:22 PM
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Thanks for that video Gruson.
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post #389 of 1927 Old 07-07-2011, 03:36 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gruson View Post

Man, I am so glad I waited for this instead of going with the 82! The size is great and I am surprised that it looks pretty vibrant and bright too. The reflection is not a big issue, I had a similar screen on my first 65" Mitsu HDTV. Ready to place my order now!

FYI, I have been quoted $5150 shipped for this but am hoping for a better price at Amazon. I was also told they are shipping out in late July and early August but in limited numbers.

I'm sure it's in torch mode and unless you have no light in the room the reflections are going to be bad.

I also had a 65" with a reflective screen, on a 92" that's a big difference unless you can control the light.
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post #390 of 1927 Old 07-07-2011, 05:12 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jebbj View Post

Thanks for that video Gruson.

I can't get the darn thing to run. No player appears, just a black background.

Hmm
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Reply Rear Projection Units

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Displays , Mitsubishi , Mitsubishi Wd 92840 92 Inch 1080p 3d Projection Tv , Projectors
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