2011 Mitsubishi DLP WD-73640 official thread - Page 37 - AVS Forum
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post #1081 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 07:51 AM
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Originally Posted by Magsdad View Post

hey....Very new here...Just bought one of these WD73640's to replace a 4-year-old Toshiba 65HM167 that devloped the dreaded "white dot" issue....Man,they sure weren't very helpful at Toshiba, but I did like the TV until now. So...is there an issue with these 73640's?? I did read through this board, but I'm not really sure what some are having a problem with. Thanks and I hope to be a somewhat regular.

If you don't see any issue you may want to just leave it at that. If not read the previous posts, starting roughly page 25 / Post #749. TTHOWL has documented several issues most likely related to the sets input color processing. Said problems are minimized by leaving Edge Enhancement on and Sharpness setting up.
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post #1082 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 09:56 AM
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Said problems are minimized by leaving Edge Enhancement on and Sharpness setting up.

...but that isn't a workable solution for many of us, as we've stated, because setting Sharpness high introduces other problems which are just as bad: ringing/halos/an unnatural glow around edges.

The best place to start reading, seeing pictures, and download a test DVD for your TV, is here:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...6#post21532626

This defect did not exist in 2009 and 2010 sets. It is something Mitsubishi can fix, and should fix for you for free under warranty.


The artifacts in teeth, lips, and nostrils are very noticeable on the faces of the hosts on ABC Good Morning America (and is not related to that being 720p)

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2011 Mits DLP owners: upgrade firmware to 13.06 to fix picture quality. More here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post21726833
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post #1083 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 01:16 PM
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Thanks...getting it delivered tomorrow.
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post #1084 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 03:17 PM
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Originally Posted by yadfgp View Post

Same here. I originally last night, went back and started deleting my posts of how my TV seems fine, but while doing so, I noticed other people had quoted my comments of my TV being fine.

So all I can say is I tried...!

A new thread would be the best option for those who want to discuss the issues they're having with this set.

This TV blows away my 3 year old WD-65736.

There ain't no shame in not having those problems and you shouldn't feel the need to repeal positive statements about your new set.
It blows away my older 1080p set also and is bigger to boot, and it can do 3d (so I've read).

Did anyone determine if it is only the sub $700 best buy sets that seem to have these issues?
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post #1085 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 04:10 PM
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Originally Posted by Magsdad View Post

Thanks...getting it delivered tomorrow.

I too am going to the WD73640 from the 65hm167 (which I loved) for the exact same issue. It actually happened to me back in October, it just took the warranty company until yesterday to finally do something about, it was a total PITA. I look forward to your input on how they differ in Features and quality!
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post #1086 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 04:14 PM
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Originally Posted by 69mach1-377 View Post


Did anyone determine if it is only the sub $700 best buy sets that seem to have these issues?

My $4K 92" has the same color processing problem. People need to undertand that even given the problem for the most part the clear screen sets are head and shoulders above the previous models. They calibrate well and are nice bright and contrasty with excellent color. But they have a very serious bug in the video processing that causes certain adjacent colors to cross boundaries and be mixed. Various colors of text on various color backgrounds will easily show it. Teeth often look like the people are wearing braces. My viewing distance is very long so it bothers me less than it might. I sit at 14 ft. If I was sitting in the suggested 11-12 ft range, the issues would be much worse for me.


It is is a shame that people pooh, pooh this bug because it is a very ugly and fundamental fault and truly has a major if not massive impact on picture quality. It essentially corrupts almosts every scene. Some of this corruption is easier to spot than others.

One of the easiest ways to see it is with EPSN logo in the right hand bottom corner of the screen. If you look close you will see it shimmer and flutter with dot crawl. Once you recognize it, you will see it is happening in many ways all over the screen, some of it much more obvious than others.

It is a tragedy, because some of use did not buy a a $700 ultra-cheapie special. Some of us bought one of the most expensive Consumer grade TVs on the market.

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post #1087 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 05:20 PM
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Originally Posted by gtgray View Post

My $4K 92" has the same color processing problem. People need to undertand that even given the problem for the most part the clear screen sets are head and shoulders above the previous models. They calibrate well and are nice bright and contrasty with excellent color. But they have a very serious bug in the video processing that causes certain adjacent colors to cross boundaries and be mixed. Various colors of text on various color backgrounds will easily show it. Teeth often look like the people are wearing braces. My viewing distance is very long so it bothers me less than it might. I sit at 14 ft. If I was sitting in the suggested 11-12 ft range, the issues would be much worse for me.


It is is a shame that people pooh, pooh this bug because it is a very ugly and fundamental fault and truly has a major if not massive impact on picture quality. It essentially corrupts almosts every scene. Some of this corruption is easier to spot than others.

One of the easiest ways to see it is with EPSN logo in the right hand bottom corner of the screen. If you look close you will see it shimmer and flutter with dot crawl. Once you recognize it, you will see it is happening in many ways all over the screen, some of it much more obvious than others.

It is a tragedy, because some of use did not buy a a $700 ultra-cheapie special. Some of us bought one of the most expensive Consumer grade TVs on the market.

So did you call Mitsubishi to complain and schedule a service call?
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post #1088 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 05:35 PM
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If I were him, the pooh poohers would be the last I would inform if I did.

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2011 Mits DLP owners: upgrade firmware to 13.06 to fix picture quality. More here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post21726833
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post #1089 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 05:36 PM
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If I were him, the pooh poohers would be the last I would inform if I did.

What the hell does that mean? I called for service.
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post #1090 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 05:43 PM
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Thhowl, you're take this way to personally, be mad at mitsubishi not your fellow consumers. When you post on a forum expect everyones opinion, not just ones that agree with you.
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post #1091 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 05:45 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtgray View Post

My $4K 92" has the same color processing problem. People need to undertand that even given the problem for the most part the clear screen sets are head and shoulders above the previous models. They calibrate well and are nice bright and contrasty with excellent color. But they have a very serious bug in the video processing that causes certain adjacent colors to cross boundaries and be mixed. Various colors of text on various color backgrounds will easily show it. Teeth often look like the people are wearing braces. My viewing distance is very long so it bothers me less than it might. I sit at 14 ft. If I was sitting in the suggested 11-12 ft range, the issues would be much worse for me.


It is is a shame that people pooh, pooh this bug because it is a very ugly and fundamental fault and truly has a major if not massive impact on picture quality. It essentially corrupts almosts every scene. Some of this corruption is easier to spot than others.

One of the easiest ways to see it is with EPSN logo in the right hand bottom corner of the screen. If you look close you will see it shimmer and flutter with dot crawl. Once you recognize it, you will see it is happening in many ways all over the screen, some of it much more obvious than others.

It is a tragedy, because some of use did not buy a a $700 ultra-cheapie special. Some of us bought one of the most expensive Consumer grade TVs on the market.

gtgray... I've read alot of your posts over the years and have alot of respect for your opinions on alot of things. You seem to be a very knowledgeable guy, especially on RPTV's. But I'm still trying to figure out 1 thing in some of your recent comments here. Like this last 1.

I'm 1 of the ones here who does not seem to see the defects some of you like thhowl are describing. I have yet to check out his demo DVD yet (I promise I will ) , but I'm trying to figure out if you seem to think that this is an issue that is inherent in this model, and not just a random issue that only a few will have. Are you saying that if it is a defect that is in ALL WD-73640's, due to the nature of it's design, or are you saying that some of us just happened to get a bad TV? I ask you this specifically since you seem to be so knowledgeable about these things. And based on your comments, it's tough to know for sure what you're implying.

I keep looking at logos and teeth and various other items on my TV every now and then and I honestly don't see these defects you guys are describing. I'll say it again, the PQ on this TV just blows away my 3 year old WD-65736. Which to me, is to be expected. Since it is a newer version of basically the same TV. If I had bought my WD-73640, and all I had gotten was a bigger screen, and worse PQ, than yea, I'd be pissed like some of you are as well. Thankfully my TV is GREAT.

Just trying to make sense of all these ramblings from some of you guys.

1 Mitsubishi WD-82642 82" TV
1 Onkyo TX-NR929 11.4 setup
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post #1092 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 06:29 PM
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Originally Posted by Alaskan_awd View Post

Thhowl, you're take this way to personally, be mad at mitsubishi not your fellow consumers. When you post on a forum expect everyones opinion, not just ones that agree with you.

I couldn't agree with you more. Major chip on his shoulder.
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post #1093 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 06:52 PM
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yadfgp, in answer to your questions:

No, the defect does not affect just a few "bad sets" but most all 2011 models of all sizes and feature sets.

Yet, neither is it inherent to the sets. It isn't due to the nature of their design, like, say, some bowing needing digital geometry correction , some per pixel fuzziness as compared to LCD due to light scattering on the plastic screen - more on my cheap model then gtgrays better model - a unadjustable 5% overscan, and other known DLP limitations.

No the defect is a new defect introduced just this year, not present in the 2009 and 2010 models, and not introduced as part of any new feature, but in a basic component common to all HDTVs: the decoding of the input signal into pixels, each assigned a certain amount of luminosity and a certain shade of color. That assignment is defective, and, sadly, more so in faces and skin tones than other hues!

I hope this helps you understand, and encourages you to watch the DVD ISO, where all the many ways the defect can manifest itself are gathered for you in one video under 3 minutes long. And just to be clear: those defects are not in the AVCHD DVD.

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2011 Mits DLP owners: upgrade firmware to 13.06 to fix picture quality. More here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post21726833
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post #1094 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 09:04 PM
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This is proving my theory on this also that whether you have the 92"840 or the "lowly cheap ass mother****ers like us in the 640 range" :winks at gtgray: it is becoming obvious this is tied to the same light engine that is shared between all these models. wobble wobble......

If I spent between $4K-5K on a TV that has the same parts except for a CC screen, internet, and 16 crappy speakers vs. my "lowly" $1440 73640 I would be on fire calling their asses. Hell, I would return it. Then get my Projector and 100"-120" screen and say the hell with it. Specailly already sitting back 14 ft.

By the time Mits gets done F'n around with this problem, you probably could have everything Perfectly calibrated and setup. Hey, maybe put an addition on for an HT. Build it, wire it, furnish it, and add finishing touches.
About that time....*Ring!* "Hello?" "Hi, its Mitsubishi service, we found the problem and are having someone...." "eehhhh, go #$!? yourselves!" *click*

Whoa...that had to be the Tequilla talking tonight....

Cool Beans.
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post #1095 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 09:05 PM
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Jose??? JOSE??? anyone seen Jose??....

Cool Beans.
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post #1096 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 09:33 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yadfgp View Post


Just trying to make sense of all these ramblings from some of you guys.

If you were "just trying to make sense" then you wouldn't call them "ramblings".

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What the hell does that mean? I called for service.

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Originally Posted by Alaskan_awd View Post

Thhowl, you're take this way to personally, be mad at mitsubishi not your fellow consumers. When you post on a forum expect everyones opinion, not just ones that agree with you.

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I didn't see him ask you these questions. Do you post with two screen names?

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I couldn't agree with you more. Major chip on his shoulder.

Hrmm... wonder where the chip on Howl's shoulder came from. He's been begging you guys to take him seriously for a while now. Even taking the time to make test videos for you... yet for some reason, a few people here just refuse to stop poking at him. I don't get it.

Well, I do get it... it has to do with not wanting to admit that your new purchase is a PoS, and various other psychological underpinnings that would make for a great Psych student study.

I pm'd an old veteran of these boards who's very helpful around these parts... I first became aware of him back in 2007 when he was helping out WITH TVs HE DIDN'T EVEN OWN. Posting service manual codes, explanations, just generally helping out... good dude.

I asked him to take a look at this thread, and mentioned how a group of people were into denying the problem, making light of it, insulting people who were pointing it out... and how different that attitude that is from what I knew of the board back in 2002-2007.

He made a great comment that made sense. Back in '02 and even in '07... this board was for early adopters, A/V enthusiasts, tech-geeks, etc. Now, every Joe-Six-Pack owns an HDTV, you can't even buy a SD TV over 13" if you tried. So this board is now less of a safe-haven for people who truly care about their A/V products... and more just a place for random folks who happen to own HDTV's because that's just is what's available now.
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post #1097 of 1886 Old 02-01-2012, 10:32 PM
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If you were "just trying to make sense" then you wouldn't call them "ramblings".

Hrmm... wonder where the chip on Howl's shoulder came from. He's been begging you guys to take him seriously for a while now. Even taking the time to make test videos for you... yet for some reason, a few people here just refuse to stop poking at him. I don't get it.

Well, I do get it... it has to do with not wanting to admit that your new purchase is a PoS, and various other psychological underpinnings that would make for a great Psych student study.

I pm'd an old veteran of these boards who's very helpful around these parts... I first became aware of him back in 2007 when he was helping out WITH TVs HE DIDN'T EVEN OWN. Posting service manual codes, explanations, just generally helping out... good dude.

I asked him to take a look at this thread, and mentioned how a group of people were into denying the problem, making light of it, insulting people who were pointing it out... and how different that attitude that is from what I knew of the board back in 2002-2007.

He made a great comment that made sense. Back in '02 and even in '07... this board was for early adopters, A/V enthusiasts, tech-geeks, etc. Now, every Joe-Six-Pack owns an HDTV, you can't even buy a SD TV over 13" if you tried. So this board is now less of a safe-haven for people who truly care about their A/V products... and more just a place for random folks who happen to own HDTV's because that's just is what's available now.

I haven't denied the problem, in fact I posted my own video showing it on my tv. Maybe some tv's show it more than others. I can say for a fact that my tv shows VERY LITTLE ERRORS in any of my blu-rays. I posted a video of one very small example of the problem but I have not seen it yet on any of my other movies.

Times change, I was around when avs was on the old format, I changed my screen name and avs disabled my old one for me so it doesn't show.

Are you kidding me, this is a forum where EVERYONE can come and learn. Asking people to go back and edit out their comments and calling them names is not what this board is about.

I don't know what your point is about pm'ing another member?

I am very happy with my purchase, I wanted a big screen with excellent picture quality at an affordable price. That's what I got, don't get your panties in a bunch because some other people also agree with me. Take your problem up with mitsubishi. If this issue starts bugging me enough that's what I'll do.
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post #1098 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 04:19 AM
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If you were "just trying to make sense" then you wouldn't call them "ramblings".

JP, YADFGP made a valid observation that is GTGRAY posted seemingly contradictory information.

I too never denied any of these issues. Once I read HOWL's posts I checked for the issues and uploaded the ESPN logos, which are in my opinion the quickest way for anyone to verify the problem. Furthermore I used HOWL's test image on my PC and again verified multiple artifacts and their removal when de-saturating the test image.This, in my opinion, is the most compelling evidence of a input processing issue with the set. I also scheduled a service call for the issue.

No, their was no denial on my part. However I do disagree with anyone asking other people to delete or edit posts. I disagree with this on principle. And for your comments on early adopters I owned a HLM5065, does that give me some right others don't? I would agree AVS was more "technical" 10 years ago, but that's not the problem here. The problem is HOWL and you as his "robin" want everyone to just agree with you and voice nothing to the contrary, or even ask questions. When I first asked HOWL how he could be certain the issue wasn't a limitation of the set his responses was "I read". AVS HAS NEVER BEEN ABOUT THAT
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post #1099 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 05:44 AM
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There has been no contradiction in gtgrays posts about this TV. Nuance and succinctness paired like hue and luminosity, but no contradiction.

And stop making batty statements about JP32.

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2011 Mits DLP owners: upgrade firmware to 13.06 to fix picture quality. More here: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post21726833
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post #1100 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 08:31 AM
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Originally Posted by yadfgp View Post

gtgray... I've read alot of your posts over the years and have alot of respect for your opinions on alot of things. You seem to be a very knowledgeable guy, especially on RPTV's. But I'm still trying to figure out 1 thing in some of your recent comments here. Like this last 1.

I'm 1 of the ones here who does not seem to see the defects some of you like thhowl are describing. I have yet to check out his demo DVD yet (I promise I will ) , but I'm trying to figure out if you seem to think that this is an issue that is inherent in this model, and not just a random issue that only a few will have. Are you saying that if it is a defect that is in ALL WD-73640's, due to the nature of it's design, or are you saying that some of us just happened to get a bad TV? I ask you this specifically since you seem to be so knowledgeable about these things. And based on your comments, it's tough to know for sure what you're implying.

I keep looking at logos and teeth and various other items on my TV every now and then and I honestly don't see these defects you guys are describing. I'll say it again, the PQ on this TV just blows away my 3 year old WD-65736. Which to me, is to be expected. Since it is a newer version of basically the same TV. If I had bought my WD-73640, and all I had gotten was a bigger screen, and worse PQ, than yea, I'd be pissed like some of you are as well. Thankfully my TV is GREAT.

Just trying to make sense of all these ramblings from some of you guys.

I have no earthly idea whether this extends across a specific build range or it is spotty across all 2011s. I don't have a 73640. I have the 2011 92" and it has the the problem as thowl describes. I also own a 2009 82" and it does not have this issue.

What I do know for sure is that is not limited to the 73640. I can not and am not arguing with anyone who says they don't have the issue. My point is that the those who can see it and think it is no big deal are not understanding that its impact on picture quality is more impactful than the smearing of the ESPN logo. There is huge loss of picture quality going on.

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post #1101 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 08:33 AM
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Do you guys have a thought as to whether this issue can be fixed via a firmware update?

Brett

I'd give my right arm to be ambidextrous.
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post #1102 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 08:49 AM
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So did you call Mitsubishi to complain and schedule a service call?

As of yet NO!. Sadly I have an elderly mother and my wife is not well. Taking care of both leaves me little opportunity. I only recently became caretaker for my Mom and I only have an hour here and there. Today she goes to the doc, tomorrow physical therapy. I will pursue it with Mits. But just like everyone else I was hoping someone could report a succesful fix.

The things is while I don't question on personal basis the integrity of anyone who reports they are free of the issue, I have my doubts. What I need to do is see a unit personally not exhibiting the problem. Since I have personal experience with Mitsubishi customer service and it was a joke. I am not eager to engage unless I can say with conviction that I personally know that only some units do it.

In my own case I did not want to look for the problem in the begining. I wanted to make sure it was widespread and it was not limited to PC based sources. I have little faith in PC based sources. My eyes and meter tell me that a PC specific calibration is required to get first class video out of a PC. But once I knew all I had to do confirm the problem was look at the ESPN corner logo and the problem seemed widespread I looked for it, found it and then I began to see the issue was really everywhere. I do have a 14 ft viewing distance out of necessity or I would not own the 92". The viewing distance softens the blow so to speak.

I will get with Mits maybe next week but I sure would like conclusive evidence of sets nots exhibiting the problem before I engage. If some set do present the problems and some don't. Mits can fix it. They may not want to, but they can.

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post #1103 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 08:50 AM
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The funniest part of this thread is that even those who are in violent agreement that a particular problem exists, disagree and fight about it quite alot.
Reminds me of my college philosophy class where the teacher would agree with someone's point of view but would then procede to tear him apart just for the sport of it...complete BS!
This is not science anymore, it's AVP (philosophy).
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post #1104 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 09:05 AM
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Easy there, Emp. I'm nobody's sidekick... and the fact that 'robin' springs from your mind is no surprise to me.

You're now on my ignore list... enjoy watching TV in that miniscule hole in the wall.
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post #1105 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by BrettStah View Post

Do you guys have a thought as to whether this issue can be fixed via a firmware update?

Unlikely that this could be resolved via FW. If it could be Mitsubishi likely wouldn't try and write the issue off as a "limitation" of the set.

Just my opinion. I may be wrong. Would love it was able to be fixed via FW
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post #1106 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 09:18 AM
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As of yet NO!. Sadly I have an elderly mother and my wife is not well. Taking care of both leaves me little opportunity. I only recently became caretaker for my Mom and I only have an hour here and there. Today she goes to the doc, tomorrow physical therapy. I will pursue it with Mits. But just like everyone else I was hoping someone could report a succesful fix.

The things is while I don't question on personal basis the integrity of anyone who reports they are free of the issue, I have my doubts. What I need to do is see a unit personally not exhibiting the problem. Since I have personal experience with Mitsubishi customer service and it was a joke. I am not eager to engage unless I can say with conviction that I personally know that only some units do it.

In my own case I did not want to look for the problem in the begining. I wanted to make sure it was widespread and it was not limited to PC based sources. I have little faith in PC based sources. My eyes and meter tell me that a PC specific calibration is required to get first class video out of a PC. But once I knew all I had to do confirm the problem was look at the ESPN corner logo and the problem seemed widespread I looked for it, found it and then I began to see the issue was really everywhere. I do have a 14 ft viewing distance out of necessity or I would not own the 92". The viewing distance softens the blow so to speak.

I will get with Mits maybe next week but I sure would like conclusive evidence of sets nots exhibiting the problem before I engage. If some set do present the problems and some don't. Mits can fix it. They may not want to, but they can.

Understand. That is why I initially wasn't looking forward to a service call. I had a very bad experience with Mitsubishi also, way back in the days of CRT based RPTV. Literally sold millions dollars worth of their TV's and bought one. Within a week of my purchase I noticed a defect in the set ( i think it was a 46809 ).They replaced all three CRT's and the Fresnal, somehow the problem persisted and they refused to do anything about it. Were it not for a local servicer agreeing to buy the set at a reduced price I would have been stuck with it.
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post #1107 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 09:21 AM
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I am only an interested amatuer. I have posted wrong information to one degree or other a time or two or three. The information was to the best of my knowledge and understanding at the time but still it was wrong or misleading, never by intent.

I am not alone even the Experts who live in the Calibration thread who develop apps and or master films also present incomplete or incorrect information. I have learned that just because it is written down does not necessarily make it so.

I also have worked in close engagement with Compaq/HP engineers during my days there and and the most brilliant and technical people make statements based on the information available to them at the time which later proves to be totally wrong. Even now there is debate about whether Seal Team Six came through the roof or up the stairs. The President recently spoke about the stairs, but the experts say it was down through the roof, that you never fight your way up a stairs if there is any other way.

Just another blank signature.
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post #1108 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 09:27 AM
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Originally Posted by BrettStah View Post

Do you guys have a thought as to whether this issue can be fixed via a firmware update?

I'm starting to think it may not be because it seems Mitsubishi is fighting the issue and a firmware fix would be pretty easy.
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post #1109 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 11:26 AM
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[quote=gtgray;21586472]As of yet NO!. Sadly I have an elderly mother and my wife is not well. Taking care of both leaves me little opportunity. I only recently became caretaker for my Mom and I only have an hour here and there. Today she goes to the doc, tomorrow physical therapy. I will pursue it with Mits. But just like everyone else I was hoping someone could report a succesful fix.

I am sorry to hear about your personal circumstances. That is very stressful on several different levels and time is only one of them. I had something similar to deal with not long ago and I found it very difficult. Hang in there!
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post #1110 of 1886 Old 02-02-2012, 12:20 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gtgray View Post

As of yet NO!. Sadly I have an elderly mother and my wife is not well. Taking care of both leaves me little opportunity. I only recently became caretaker for my Mom and I only have an hour here and there. Today she goes to the doc, tomorrow physical therapy. I will pursue it with Mits. But just like everyone else I was hoping someone could report a succesful fix.

Dang dude, I hope they both get better very soon!

Mitsubishi WD-73640 3D DLP HDTV | Pioneer VSX-1121-K 7.2 A/V Receiver | BIC America Formula F-12 Sub | JBL Studio 190x2 , 180x2, 130x2 (Rear Surrounds), 120c Speakers | Intel DX58SO | I7 975 @ 3.3Ghz | Windows 8.1 64bit
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