Samsung 2005 DLP HDTV Discussion --- HLRxxxxW Models - AVS Forum
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post #1 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 11:47 AM - Thread Starter
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Now that CES 2005 is wrapping up, I thought I would start a thread to discuss the new 2005 Samsung HDTV DLP's. I did not attend the show, but summarized my notes from press releases and the comments of other AVSforum members (thanks, to all).


====================================================
PLEASE NOTE: This post is being maintained and updated as new
information is discovered about the 2005 Samsung DLP product line!!!
====================================================


2005 SAMSUNG DLP HDTV


For Offical Samsung 2005 CES Press Releases: CLICK HERE
For Offical Samsung 2005 HES Press Releases: CLICK HERE
For Offical SamsungUSA.com DLP Product Information: CLICK HERE



What we think we KNOW so far:


====================================================
PLEASE NOTE: This information is subject to change as we learn
more and Samsung develops these products. I think Donald Rumsfeld
summed it up best in the following quote.

The Unknown
As we know,
There are known knowns.
There are things we know we know.
We also know
There are known unknowns.
That is to say
We know there are some things
We do not know.
But there are also unknown unknowns,
The ones we don't know
We don't know.

Donald Rumsfeld Feb 12, 2002, Department of Defense Briefing

====================================================


HiRes Gallery ... Thanks TetsujinWave & Daphoid!!!

If you are NEW to this thread or the 2005 Samsung DLP product line, you may want to read the spec's and understand the many models offered before browsing this gallery. The 2005 models and their spec's are described in detail in the sections that follow this gallery. Special thanks to TetsujinWave and Daphoid!!! TetsujinWave attended CES and supplied all of the photos in this gallery. Daphoid provided the web server, software and programming expertise to create the gallery.


For the Full High Resolution Gallery: CLICK HERE!!!


<< 6168 Sample



*** 1080P Models (1920x1080 Screen Resolution) ***
=================================


There will be TWO cosmetic versions of the tabletop models. One version, the 78 series, will have a black lacquer bezel and will be sold by higher-end retailers and custom installers. The other version, the 68 series, will have a floating screen design and is believed to be targeted at larger chain stores like BestBuy. The internals of both lines are equivalent, the case (and offered screen sizes) is the only difference. In fact, Samsung has lead us to believe that the internal components on the 68 series, 78 series, and the 88 series pedestal model are all based on the same technology.



<<>>
Photos by TetsujinWave


TABLETOP MODEL >>> HLRxx78W --- 78 Series --- Black Lacquer Screen Design

HLRxx78W Series Brochure: CLICK HERE


71" -- HLR7178W (October 2005, MSRP guess $6,799) Spec Sheet
61" -- HLR6178W (July 2005, MSRP guess $4,799) Spec Sheet
56" -- HLR5678W (July 2005, MSRP guess $4,499) Spec Sheet
50" -- HLR5078W (July 2005, MSRP guess $3,999) Spec Sheet


PLEASE NOTE - 71" HLR7178W replaces previously listed HLR7078W, the HLR7078W will not be produced. I will leave the photos of the 70" below because they should approximate the 71".

HLR7178W NOTE - The screen on the 71" set is a more reflective than used on all of the other Samsung DLP models ... it is similar to the screen on the 70" Qualia 006.
  • 1080p (1920x1080) Resolution
  • Black Lacquer Screen Design, Anti-glare Matte Screen Finish
  • Cinema Smooth Generation 6 (Light Engine), DNIe (Video Enhancement)
  • Dynamic Black Level - Mechanical Iris to control light and improve Contrast Ratio
  • Inputs: 2 HDMI , 2 Component Video, 1 S-Video, 2 Composite
  • Inputs: VGA/PC (1920x1080@60Hz)
  • Inputs: 2 IEEE 1394 DTV Link (SOURCE)
  • HDMI Supported Inputs: 480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i (1080p will NOT be offered)
  • Digital Audio Out (optical)
  • ATSC Tuner / NTSC Tuner, Digital Cable Ready with CableCARD
  • TV Guide Electronic Program Guide (SOURCE) (GEMSTAR TV Guide + GOLD Demo)
  • AnyNET (A Serial Connection Between Samsung Components That Allows Integrated Control Via Your Remote Control)
  • DNSe (Dynamic Natural Sound), 30 Watts, Internal Speakers
  • DLP Chip: per Samsung, Latest 1080p (xHD4 (.85" 1080p) --- neither Samsung nor TI are discussing chips, this is our best guess given available information)
  • DLP Chip Operation: 960 x 1080 mirrors, each mirror quickly moves to produces 2 pixels displayed on the screen yielding a 1920x1080 final resolution; pixels are diamond shaped and slightly overlap, producing a smooth pixel free image
  • Contrast Ratio: up to 10,000:1
  • Brightness (cd/m-sq): 71"=500, 61"=600, 56"=700, 50"=800
  • Lamp (Standard/Dynamic Display Setting): 71"=(120W/132W); 50", 56", 61"=(100W/120W)
  • Color Wheel: 7 Segment, 10,800 RPM
  • Power Consumption: 230 Watts (Estimated)
  • NO Center Channel Shelf
HLRxx78W Series OWNERS MANUAL: CLICK HERE

Measurements: Thanks Kirk@TVauthority!!!
  1. HL-R5078W 46.5 x 14.0 x 34.3 -- 50" -- 75.6 lbs.
  2. HL-R5678W 52.4 x 15.3 x 37.9 -- 56" -- 84.9 lbs
  3. HL-R6178W 56.9 x 18.4 x 41.6 -- 61" -- 99.2 lbs (includes removable pedestal base)
  4. HL-R7178W 65.8 x 20.4 x 46.8 -- 71" -- 116.8 lbs (includes removable pedestal base)
  5. FOR STAND DIMENSIONS AND WEIGHTS - CHECK SPEC SHEET LINK ABOVE
Measurements (without Pedestal Base):
  1. HL-R6178W 56.9 x 16.5 x 41.6 -- 61" -- 99.2 lbs.
  2. HL-R7178W 65.8 x 18.7 x 45.9 -- 71" -- 116.8 lbs.
Technical Drawings: Thanks Kirk@TVauthority!!!
  1. HL-R5078W - Technical Drawing
  2. HL-R5678W - Technical Drawing
  3. HL-R6178W - Technical Drawing
  4. HL-R7178W - Technical Drawing Not Available Yet
78 Series Photos --- Black Lacquer Design --- Thanks TetsujinWave --- Click on Link

50" -- HLR5078W -- Photo #1 -- Photo #2 -- Photo #3 -- Photo #4 -- Placecard
56" -- HLR5678W -- Photo #1 -- Photo #2 -- Photo #3 -- Placecard
61" -- HLR6178W -- Photo #1
70" -- HLR7078W -- Photo #1 -- Photo #2 -- Photo #3 -- Photo #4 -- Photo #5
70" -- HLR7078W -- Photo #6 -- Photo #7 -- Photo #8 -- Photo #9 -- Photo#10
70" -- HLR7078W -- Photo#11 -- Photo#12 -- Photo#13 -- Placecard -- Poster
Rear Inputs --- CLICK HERE

Background: 1080p vs 720p Comparison -- Series 78 Poster -- Technical Discussion, Screen Shots, Photos
Background: TI DLP Brochure for Winter 2005 -- TI DLP Presentation




<<>>
Photo by TetsujinWave, KyungKim


TABLETOP MODEL >>> HLRxx68W --- 68 Series --- Floating Screen Design

HLRxx68W Series Brochure: CLICK HERE

67" -- HLR6768W (July 2005, MSRP $6,199) Spec Sheet
61" -- HLR6168W (July 2005, MSRP $4,799) Spec Sheet
56" -- HLR5668W (July 2005, MSRP $4,499) Spec Sheet
  • 1080p (1920x1080) Resolution
  • Floating Screen Design, Anti-glare Matte Screen Finish
  • Cinema Smooth Generation 6 (Light Engine), DNIe (Video Enhancement)
  • Dynamic Black Level - Mechanical Iris to control light and improve Contrast Ratio
  • Inputs: 2 HDMI , 2 Component Video, 1 S-Video, 2 Composite
  • Inputs: VGA/PC (1920x1080@60Hz)
  • Inputs: 2 IEEE 1394 DTV Link (SOURCE)
  • HDMI Supported Inputs: 480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i (1080p will NOT be offered)
  • Digital Audio Out (optical)
  • ATSC Tuner / NTSC Tuner, Digital Cable Ready with CableCARD
  • TV Guide Electronic Program Guide (SOURCE) (GEMSTAR TV Guide + GOLD Demo)
  • AnyNET (A Serial Connection Between Samsung Components That Allows Integrated Control Via Your Remote Control)
  • 30 Watts, Internal Speakers
  • DLP Chip: per Samsung, Latest 1080p (xHD4 (.85" 1080p) --- neither Samsung nor TI are discussing chips, this is our best guess given available information)
  • DLP Chip Operation: 960 x 1080 mirrors, each mirror quickly moves to produces 2 pixels displayed on the screen yielding a 1920x1080 final resolution; pixels are diamond shaped and slightly overlap, producing a smooth pixel free image
  • Contrast Ratio: up to 10,000:1
  • Brightness (cd/m-sq): 67"=550, 61"=600, 56"=700
  • Lamp (Standard/Dynamic Display Setting): 67"=(120W/132W); 56", 61"=(100W/120W)
  • Color Wheel: 7 Segment, 10,800 RPM
  • Power Consumption: 230 Watts (Estimated)
  • NO Center Channel Shelf
HLRxx68W Series OWNERS MANUAL: CLICK HERE

Measurements: Thanks Kirk@TVauthority!!!
  1. HL-R5668W 52.4 x 15.3 x 37.9 -- 56" -- 80.9 lbs
  2. HL-R6168W 56.9 x 18.4 x 41.6 -- 61" -- 99.6 lbs. (includes removable pedestal base)
  3. HL-R6768W 62.4 x 19.8 x 45.1 -- 67" -- 109.8 (includes removable pedestal base)
Measurements (without Pedestal Base):
  1. HL-R6168W 56.9 x 16.5 x 40.7 -- 61" -- 99.6 lbs.
  2. HL-R6768W 62.4 x 17.8 x 44.3 -- 67" -- 109.8 lbs
Technical Drawings: Thanks Kirk@TVauthority!!!
  1. HL-R5668W - Technical Drawing
  2. HL-R6168W - Technical Drawing
  3. HL-R6768W - Technical Drawing
68 Series Photos --- Floating Screen Design --- Thanks KyungKim, TetsujinWave --- Click on Link

56" -- HLR5668W -- Photo #1 (Good For Depth, Shape) -- Photo #2 -- Photo #3
56" -- HLR5668W -- Placecard
61" -- HLR6168W -- Photo #1 -- Photo #2 -- Photo #3 -- Photo #4 -- Photo #5
61" -- HLR6168W -- Photo #6 -- Photo #7 -- Photo #8 -- Photo #9 (Shows Stabilization Base)
61" -- HLR6168W -- Photo#10 -- Placecard
67" -- HLR6768W -- Photo #1 -- Photo #2 -- Placecard
Rear Inputs --- CLICK HERE


Background: Floating Screen Close-up -- Series 68 Poster
Photos of Internal Components: CLICK HERE
Video: VIDEO (Warning: C/Net's Price and CableCard Comments are in ERROR)
High Resolution PHOTO (1.25 MB, Excellent): HiRes Photo / LowRes Preview Photo





Photo by Samsung


PEDESTAL MODEL >>> 88 Series

56"
-- HLR5688W (July 2005, $5,199) Spec Sheet
  • 1080p (1920x1080) Resolution
  • Cinema Smooth Generation 6 (Light Engine), DNIe (Video Enhancement)
  • Dynamic Black Level - Mechanical Iris to control light and improve Contrast Ratio
  • Anti-glare Matte Screen Finish
  • Inputs: 2 HDMI, 2 Component Video, 1 S-Video, 2 Composite
  • Inputs: VGA/PC (1920x1080@60Hz)
  • Inputs: IEEE 1394 DTV Link (unconfirmed)
  • Digital Audio Out (optical)
  • HDMI Supported Inputs: 480i, 480p, 720p, 1080i (1080p will NOT be offered)
  • ATSC Tuner / NTSC Tuner, Digital Cable Ready with CableCARD
  • TV Guide Electronic Program Guide (GEMSTAR TV Guide + GOLD Demo)
  • AnyNET (A Serial Connection Between Samsung Components That Allows Integrated Control Via Your Remote Control)
  • 30 Watts, Internal Speakers
  • DLP Chip: xHD4 (.85" 1080p)
  • DLP Chip Operation: 960 x 1080 mirrors, each mirror quickly moves to produces 2 pixels displayed on the screen yielding a 1920x1080 final resolution; pixels are diamond shaped and slightly overlap, producing a smooth pixel free image
  • Contrast Ratio: up to 10,000:1
  • Color Wheel: 7 Segment
  • Power Consumption: 230 Watts
  • NO Center Channel Shelf

HLR5688W OWNERS MANUAL: CLICK HERE
Online OWNERS MANUAL: CLICK HERE


Measurements: HL-R5688W, 58.7 x 21.9 x 58.4
Measurements: of the CURRENT HLP5685, 58.7"(W) x 58.3"(H) x 21.9"(D)


88 Series Photos --- Pedestal Screen Design --- Click on Link

56" -- HLR5688W (Photo appears to be of 50" model) -- Photo #1 -- Photo #2
High Resolution PHOTO (1.25 MB, Excellent): HiRes Photo / LowRes Preview Photo





*** 720P Models
(1280x720 Screen Resolution) ***
================================


PLEASE NOTE: The three 2005 Samsung 720p product lines (HLRxx67W, HLRxx77W, HLRxx87W) are currently released and shipping. You can go down to your favorite store and carefully evaluate each of these models. When you go down to take a closer look at the HLRxxxxW models, you may find HLPxxxxW models still on sale. These are units from the 2004 Samsung 720p product line. They can be identified by the P in the model number, HLP5063W for example. 2005 models will begin with HLR. Costco is also selling a couple of models that begin with HLN. These are 2003 models that are still being produced and sold through this discount chain.



Photo by TetsujinWave


TABLETOP MODELS >>> HLRxx67W --- 67 Series --- Floating Screen Design

DLP Product Descriptions on Samsung.com: CLICK HERE
AVSforum HLRxx67W OWNERS THREAD: CLICK HERE

61" -- HLR6167W (April 2005-Revised to first week in May, $3,799) Preliminary Spec Sheet
56" -- HLR5667W (April 2005-Revised to first week in May, $3,499) Preliminary Spec Sheet
50" -- HLR5067W (April 2005-Revised to first week in May, $2,999) Preliminary Spec Sheet
46" -- HLR4667W (April 2005-Revised to first week in May, $2,699) Preliminary Spec Sheet
42" -- HLR4266W (Mid May 2005, $2,499) SamsungUSA.com

HLR4266W has 4 specs which are different from the rest of the 67 series:
1. Does NOT have the super fine screen.
2. Does NOT have the PC/VGA input.
3. Does NOT have the 1394 inputs.
4. Does NOT have the electronic program guide support on the CableCard.
  • 720p (1280x720) Resolution
  • Floating Screen Design, Anti-glare Matte Screen Finish
  • Cinema Smooth Generation 720P (Light Engine), DNIe (Video Enhancement)
  • Inputs: 1 HDMI, 2 Component Video, 1 S-Video, 2 Composite, VGA/PC
  • Inputs: 2 IEEE 1394 DTV Link
  • Digital Audio Out (optical)
  • ATSC Tuner / NTSC Tuner, Digital Cable Ready with CableCARD
  • TV Guide Electronic Program Guide (GEMSTAR TV Guide + GOLD Demo)
  • AnyNET (A Serial Connection Between Samsung Components That Allows Integrated Control Via Your Remote Control)
  • 30 Watts, Internal Speakers
  • DLP Chip: per Samsung, New Generation 720p (HD4 (.55" 720p) --- confirmed from Samsung HLRxx67W brochure below --- TI has not shared the actually naming convention, so we are using HD4 to denote the next 720p chip after HD3)
  • DLP Chip Operation: 640 x 720 mirrors, each mirror quickly moves to produces 2 pixels displayed on the screen yielding a 1280x720 final resolution; pixels are diamond shaped and slightly overlap, producing a smooth pixel free image
  • Contrast Ratio: Up to 2500:1
  • Brightness (cd/m-sq): 61"=600, 56"=700, 50"=900, 46", 42" = 1000.
  • Lamp (Standard/Dynamic Display Setting): 42", 46", 50", 56", 61"=(100W/120W)
  • Color Wheel: 7 Segment
  • Power Consumption: 230 Watts
  • NO Center Channel Shelf
Measurements: Thanks Kirk@TVauthority!!!
  1. HL-R5056W --Not available --50" Table (720p)
  2. HL-R4266W 39.3 x 13.0 x 29.7 --42" Table (720p); 61.7 lbs.
  3. HL-R4667W 42.8 x 13.4 x 32.0 --46" Table (720p); 66.8 lbs.
  4. HL-R4677W 40.6 x 16.1 x 30.0 --46" Slim Bezel (720p); 71.65 lbs.
  5. HL-R5067W 46.5 x 14.0 x 34.3 --50" Table (720p); 72.5 lbs.
  6. HL-R5667W 52.4 x 15.3 x 37.9 --56" Table (720p); 80.9 lbs
  7. HL-R5677W 49.9 x 18.2 x 36.3 --46" Slim Bezel (720p); 93.7 lbs.
  8. HL-R6167W 56.9 x 18.4 x 41.6 --61" Table (720p); 94.5 lbs.
Technical Drawings: Thanks Kirk@TVauthority!!!
  1. HL-R4266W - Technical Drawing
  2. HL-R4667W - Technical Drawing
  3. HL-R5067W - Technical Drawing
  4. HL-R5667W - Technical Drawing
  5. HL-R6167W - Technical Drawing
Measurements: The HLPxx63W Measurements may be helpful because we have technical drawings for these models.
  1. 61" - HLP6163W: 56.9"(W) x 40.7"(H) x 16.7"(D); 99.2 Lbs. - Technical Drawing
  2. 56" - HLP5663W: 52.4"(W) x 37.9"(H) x 15.6"(D); 91.5 Lbs. - Technical Drawing
  3. 50" - HLP5063W: 46.5"(W) x 34.3"(H) x 14.1"(D); 77.2 Lbs. - Technical Drawing
  4. 46" - HLP4663W: 43.1"(W) x 32.0"(H) x 13.3"(D); 69.4 Lbs. - Technical Drawing
HLRxx67W Product Line Brochure (Excellent): Brochure
HLRxx67W Owners Manual: Owners Manual
HLR4266W Owners Manual: Owners Manual
HLRxx67W Quick Reference Guide: Quick Reference Guide


67 Series Photos --- Click on Link (Also, see photos under 68 Series above - same case)

46" -- HLR4667W -- Photo #1 -- Photo #2 -- Placecard
50" -- HLR5067W -- Photo #1 -- Placecard
56" -- HLR5667W -- Photo #1

BACK & INTERNAL COMPONENTS - 50" - HLR5067W - Photos #1 - #8 - NOTE: There are 8 PHOTOS in the SERIES


High Resolution PHOTO (1.25 MB, Excellent): HiRes Photo / LowRes Preview: LowRes Photo




Photo by Samsung

THIN BEZEL TABLETOP MODEL >>> HLRxx77W --- 77 Series --- Thin Bezel Design

DLP Product Descriptions on Samsung.com: CLICK HERE

56" -- HLR5677W (Now Available, $3,499)
46" -- HLR4677W (Now Available, $2,899) 8/9/2005 - Model Discontinued

The HLRxx77W models are based on the HLPxx74W models introduced in November 2004. There has been extensive discussion and evaluation of these model in this forum. For specific information, please refer to the HLPxx74W Owners thread.

The HLRxx77W are identical to the HLPx74W, except the DVI and PC/VGA inputs of the HLPxx74W have been deleted on the HLRxx77W. In addition an ATSC over-the-air digital tuner (can receive HD) and CableCard tuner have been ADDED to the HLRxx77W series. For further information, please check the Samsung web site (CLICK HERE).
  • 720p (1280x720) Resolution
  • Aluminum Thin Bezel Screen Design, Anti-glare Matte Screen Finish
  • Hybrid HLN Light Engine, DNIe (Video Enhancement)
  • Inputs: 1 HDMI, 2 Component Video, 3 S-Video, 3 Composite
  • Digital Audio Out (optical)
  • ATSC Tuner / NTSC Tuner, Digital Cable Ready with CableCARD
  • NO TV Guide Electronic Program Guide (GEMSTAR TV Guide + GOLD Demo)
  • AnyNET (A Serial Connection Between Samsung Components That Allows Integrated Control Via Your Remote Control)
  • 30 Watts, Internal Speakers
  • DLP Chip: HD2+ (.8" 720p)
  • DLP Chip Operation: 1280x720 mirrors, each mirror produces 1 pixel displayed on the screen yielding a 1280x720 final resolution; pixels are rectangular shaped and don't overlap, individual pixels are visible on the screen
  • Contrast Ratio: 2000:1
  • Color Wheel: 6 Segment
  • Power Consumption: 230 Watts
  • Center Channel Shelf Exists On Top Of HDTV
HLRxx77W Owners Manual: Owners Manual




Photo by Samsung


PEDESTAL MODEL >>> 87 Series

DLP Product Descriptions on Samsung.com: CLICK HERE
AVSforum HLRxx87W OWNERS THREAD: CLICK HERE

56" -- HLR5687W (56", Unknown Release, $Unknown) [Little is known about this POSSIBLE model]
50" -- HLR5087W (50, May 2005, $3,899) Spec Sheet
  • 720p (1280x720) Resolution
  • Cinema Smooth Generation 720P (Light Engine), DNIe (Video Enhancement)
  • Anti-glare Matte Screen Finish
  • Inputs: 1 HDMI, 2 Component Video, 3 S-Video, 3 Composite [NO VGA/PC]
  • Input/Output: [NO IEEE 1394]
  • Digital Audio Out (optical)
  • ATSC Tuner / NTSC Tuner, Digital Cable Ready with CableCARD
  • TV Guide Electronic Program Guide (GEMSTAR TV Guide + GOLD Demo)
  • AnyNET (A Serial Connection Between Samsung Components That Allows Integrated Control Via Your Remote Control)
  • 30 Watts, Internal Speakers
  • DLP Chip: (HD2+ (.8" 720p) --- neither Samsung nor TI are discussing chips, this is our best guess given available information)
  • DLP Chip Note: TI has a new 2005 version of the HD2+, we are calling it the HD2++ (.8" 720p); it is not known if this chip is being used in this HDTV, but general feeling is that it is NOT because contrast ratio spec is still 2500:1
  • DLP Chip Operation: 1280x720 mirrors, each mirror produces 1 pixel displayed on the screen yielding a 1280x720 final resolution; pixels are rectangular shaped and don't overlap, individual pixels are visible on the screen
  • Contrast Ratio: 2500:1
  • Color Wheel: 7 Segment
  • Power Consumption: 230 Watts
  • NO Center Channel Shelf

Measurements: HL-R5087W, 53.6 x 20.5 x 54.7

Measurements: of the CURRENT HLP5085W, 53.6"(W) x 54.7"(H) x 20.5"(D), Weight: 125.4 lbs.

HLR5087W Technical Drawing: Technical Drawing
HLRxx87W Owners Manual: Owners Manual


87 Series Photos --- Pedestal Screen Design --- Click on Link

50" -- HLR5087W -- Photo #1 -- Photo #2
High Resolution PHOTO (1.25 MB, Excellent): HiRes Photo


Canada ONLY Models:

The following HLRxx64W models are Canadian ONLY models. They are based on the cosmetics of the USA HLRxx67W series, but have different internal components and specs ... so you can look at the photos above in the HLRxx67W section (and in the HLRxx68W section) for an idea of what the cabinet looks like. In addition, the following 1080p units (specs same as USA versions described above) have been confirmed as being available in Canada. The status of the 56" and 67" 1080p models is currently unclear.

50" -- HLR5078W (August, $3999)
61" -- HLR6178W (August, $4799)
61" -- HLR6168W (August, $4799)
71" -- HLR7178W (August, $6999)

It is currently believed that the HLRxx88W and HLRxx77W product lines will not be offered in Canada.


TABLETOP MODELS >>> HLRxx64W --- 64 Series --- Floating Screen Design

Samsung's Canadian Web Site DLP Area (includes spec's and pictures): CLICK HERE

42" -- HLR4264W (Released, $2499)
46" -- HLR4664W (Released, $2799)
50" -- HLR5064W (Released, $2999)
56" -- HLR 5664W (Unknown, $xxxx) The 56" is shown in the HLRxx64W manual, but we have not confirmed it's sale in Canada, yet.
61" -- HLR6164W (Released, $3799)
  • 720p (1280x720) Resolution
  • Floating Screen Design, Anti-glare Matte Screen Finish
  • Cinema Smooth Generation 720P (Light Engine), DNIe (Video Enhancement)
  • Inputs: 1 HDMI, 1 DVI, 2 Component Video, 1 S-Video, 2 Composite, VGA/PC
  • Inputs: NO IEEE 1394 DTV Link
  • Digital Audio Out (optical)
  • ATSC Tuner / NTSC Tuner, NO Digital Cable Ready with CableCARD
  • NO TV Guide Electronic Program Guide
  • AnyNET (A Serial Connection Between Samsung Components That Allows Integrated Control Via Your Remote Control)
  • 30 Watts, Internal Speakers
  • DLP Chip: HD3 (.55" 720p) --- this is a 2004 TI DLP chip; USA models use a 2005 HD4
  • DLP Chip Operation: 640 x 720 mirrors, each mirror quickly moves to produces 2 pixels displayed on the screen yielding a 1280x720 final resolution; pixels are diamond shaped and slightly overlap, producing a smooth pixel free image
  • Contrast Ratio: 2000:1
  • Brightness (cd/m-sq): 61"=600, 56"=700 (may not be available), 50"=900, 46"=1000, 42" = 1000
  • Lamp (Standard/Dynamic Display Setting): 42", 46", 50", 56" (may not be available), 61"=(100W/120W)
  • Color Wheel: 7 Segment
  • Power Consumption: 230 Watts
  • NO Center Channel Shelf
  • You can turn DNIe ON and OFF, this is a feature that is not available on the 67 series, which requires DNIe to be on all of the time






What we DON'T KNOW so far:

1. What computer resolutions are supported on the 68, 78, and 88 series sets on the HDMI input(1920x1080?)? Specifically, does it support 1080i or 1080p?

2. Will the internal ATSC tuner or CableCard tuner support the future 1080p broadcast format on the 1080p units?

3. What capabilities does the 1394 port have to support 1080p? Specifically, if the internal tuner can support broadcast 1080p/24, can this be output via the 1394 port? Could a 1080p signal be input via the 1394 port?

4. Will Samsung provide any method (USB port/PC, Memory Cards) for customers to apply firmware upgrades to the new 1080p HDTVs? There are two other manufacturers that currently provide this capability for their DLP sets.

5. On the 1080p sets, which inputs have DNIe turned on all of the time. On the HDMI inputs and other inputs (VGA/PC, 1394), is DNIe ON or OFF? Does selecting a specific device type with inputs that have DNIe on all of the time reduce the level of processing (selecting GAME on component, for example)?

6. Will 1080p sets support multichannel audio (5.1) on the HDMI inputs? 720p sets only support 2 channels and this prevents a multichannel pass through to a receiver. This is important to manage sync in some situations.


Items We Would Like To Test, But Need To Wait Until HDTV's Are Released:

1. Do the remote control IR discrete codes work for ALL inputs?

2. Given the increased video processing demands of 1080p, what is the capability of the 68/78/88 series 1080p sets to handle computer/video gaming? Specifically, what is lag?

3. Given the increased video processing required in the 1080p units (68, 78, 88 Series), what steps has Samsung taken to insure that we don't see lip sync issues? Did anyone ask specifically about this concern?

4. Will 1080p be supported on the HDMI input on the 1080p models (68, 78, 88 series)? All of our information collected up to this point indicates that it won't, but it is an important item and many of us hope Samsung will find a way to include it in the final production sets. It should be checked when the sets are released.

5. How will SD broadcasts look on the 1080p sets? How will this compare to SD broadcasts on 720p sets?

6. How will standard DVD's look on the 1080p sets? How will standard DVD's look after being upshifted by the better upshifting DVD players in comparison to standard DVD on the 720p sets? Is there any advantage to the new 1080p sets when playing standard DVD's?

7. In selecting a DVD player, will you get a better quality picture if you send the 1080p HDTV a 480i digital feed and let the TV do all of the processing OR by using a upshifting DVD player to send a 1080i digital signal that is deinterlaced to 1080p?

8. When setting up a given input, such as HDMI or Component 1, does the processing associated with the input change when you select a different descriptive name for the input (such as GAME, DVD, HD STB, etc.)?

9. Can you get 1:1 pixel mapping of a computer input on the PC/VGA input (at 1920x1080)? On HDMI? If so, how exactly is it setup and what picture mode do you use?





FAQ's:

1. What is the PQ on the new 1080p models?
  1. Comments by KyungKim (CES Attendee)
  2. Generally excellent. There are some surprises here. Ive posted b4 that 1080p will not be the silver bullet for rptvs as there are many other problems with rear projection micro displays. What really floored me at the show was that many of these problems seems to have been greatly eliminated with this generation 1080p product.
  3. The biggest weird thing for me was that the new displays do not exhibit much in the way of SSE, that is silk screen effect. It was clearly evident on the 1080p vs 720p demo display. There was quiet a bit of shimmering in the large white areas of the powerpoint demo on the 720 set. There was little to no shimmering silk screen effect on the newer display. I confirmed this with the rep, who happend to think it was due to the higher rez. Im not sure if i buy it, but the sse on the newer sets is close to non existant. You can see som fine shmmiering when u get close, but at normal viewing distance, this Effect is really not there anymore.
  4. Now to the other shocker. Im super sensitive to RBE. I see them all the time on dlps. It was VERY VERY VERY hard to see them on the new sets. Since they had the 720p ones on the left side, i was easily able to see them on the old chips using the patended darting eyes furisiously method. Maybe this is due to the wobulation effect, who knows. As a side note, i got a splitting headache some minutes after walking away form the samsung booth. Since i did the rbe torture test on both the 1080p and 720p sets for a long long time, i dunno who the culprit was. All i know is that RBE is reduced dramatically on the new sets.
  5. Comments by ViddKid (CES Attendee)
  6. All I can comment on is the PQ and image reproduction of the 1080p sets. IMO, they are some of the best display devices on the show floor. Test patterns displayed at 1080p were flawless, videos and still imges have noticably higher definition and better image reproduction than the side by side 720p set.
  7. Comments By C/Net (CES Media Coverage)
  8. HLR6768W - Awarded Best of Show CES 2005
2. Do the screens on the new models still have the wonderful matte finish of prior Samsung DLP's OR have they started to use more reflective materials? Some photos of the new HDTV's appear to have more glare than one would expect.
  1. Comments by KyungKim (CES Attendee)
  2. Yes ASFAIK the new sets did not exhibit any more or less glare than the "legacy" 720p models. What i think is freaking u out is the super reflective bezel on the higher end model. Not sure if its been discussed already, the pics I posted earlier of the 56 is the "tantus" model, only found in tweeter and upscale av shops. The floating models are the reg ones which will be sold most everywhere. Those models have a matte finish bezel which is much much more pleasing, to me at least. The reps assured me several times that differences in the upscale and non will be purely cosmetic. (KyungKim's photo is below, notice bezel around screen appears more reflective than screen)
  3. PHOTO of HLR6168W (screen finish): PHOTO
3. What kind of color wheels are used in the new models (7 segment or possibly some other approach)?
  1. Comments by KyungKim (CES Attendee)
  2. Seven, according to one rep, says the wheel is larger to accomadate the extra rez. Other than that the wheel is the same.
4. What TI DLP chips are used in the new models?
  1. Comments by KyungKim (CES Attendee)
  2. Unofficialy i believe its called the xhd4. Samsung was mumm on the chip name, other than to assure ppl its the latest n greatest.
  3. Comments by ROGO (CES Attendee)
  4. As for HD2/HD3/xHD3, etc. TI is going away from that nomenclature entirely. They are asking OEMs to do the same. Optoma apparently did not get the memo.
  5. Comments By UCSB (AVS Member):
  6. We have an open issue about what DLP chips are in these new models. It seems that TI (Texas Instruments) and the HDTV vendors have gotten together and decided not to talk about chips, but rather talk about 720p chips and 1080p chips. I can understand this desire on their part. With models coming out at different times during the year, everyone can't have the latest chip and a lot of other things go into the design of these HDTV's (firmware, optics, electronics, screens, etc.) beyond the chips. Part of me says that we should just respect their wishes. But, then part of me says wait, for most of us these are expensive purchases. We have a right to be informed about what we are buying. Could you imagine if Intel decided we are just going to refer to CPU's by their type, Pentium 4's for example.
  7. We have gathered a lot of spec's at CES 2005 and those spec's are clearly documented in the posters, product display cards, and press releases that we have been accumulating. I think some clear patterns have emerged.
  8. It seems to me that Samsung and TI cooperate closely on the introduction of HDTV's and DLP chips. This is to be expected (I thought I saw a press release saying Samsung had 69% or the DLP market). Samsung has stated they are using, or will be using TI's latest chips. So here is my take by model line.
  9. Series 68, 78 - TI xHD4. I don't know if this is the designation they are using internally, but this is the next 1080p chip after the xHD3 shown initially at CES 2004. When the 68 / 78 product arrives it will be mid 2005. Clearly at least one model year removed from the 2004 chip we saw last year. The xHD3 had a contrast ratio of 5000:1, these new chips are claiming 10,000:1. In addition, there was a Zeiss Optics pdf document that talked about compability with the xHD4 chip.
  10. Series 88 - TI xHD3. This 1080p pedestal HDTV was slated for introduction last November with xHD3. It's lower 5000:1 contrast ratio, 2004 develop time table, and early introduction (FEB 2005) led me to believe that it is based on the xHD3.
  11. Series 67 - TI HD4. A couple of vendors, Sharp and Optoma, created product display cards stating that they are using the HD4. So we know this is the latest 720p chip. In addition, Samsung is claiming a 2000:1 contrast ratio just the same as in the Sharp HD4 720p HDTV. Optoma claimed 2500:1.
  12. Series 87 - TI HD2+ or HD4. We do not have a single picture, product display card, press release spec or really anything on this HDTV. My guess is that they just left the HD2+ chip in the unit (ie used current HLP5085W as base).
5. Which models will offer IEEE 1394 ports? What will be the capability of those ports?
  1. Kirk@TVAuthority (CES Attendee)
  2. I defintely agree with Administrator- what you see at the shows doesn't always make it to the final production models. That being said, we checked the input jacks for both the 67 & 78 series- the 78 series had 2 firewire, 2 hdmi and a pc input. The 67 series has 2 firewire, 1 hdmi and 1 pc input. I don't recall if we looking at the inputs on the 68 series but my guess is they will offer the same inputs as the 78 models.
  3. Comments by UCSB (AVS Member)
  4. Samsung posters for 68 / 78 series HDTV's showed IEEE 1394. Therefore, IEEE 1394 have been added to specs for 68, 78, and 88 series HDTVs.
6. What is the contrast ratio spec's for the new models?
  1. Comments by KyungKim (CES Attendee)
  2. 10,000 to 1 as its listed on all of their product tags. The blacks were really incredible. Its blackety black and its black y'all. Comparing to the 720p set, the black levels were noticeably lower on the 1080p sets.
  3. Comments by OrangeKid (CES Attendee)
  4. I am certain the contrast ratio was l listed as 10,000:1. I checked the labels on the Samsung 1080p sets several times.
7. Confirm the number of HDMI inputs shown in the table above. Will there be 1 or 2 HDMI inputs?
  1. Comments by KyungKim (CES Attendee)
  2. Two, so said everyone from samsung.
8. Which of the current models will be continuing? Specifically, what are the plans for the HLPxx74W, Tantus thin bezel models. Many planning to buy in 2005 might want to know the fate of this HD2+ unit.

The HLPxx74W will be updated to a HLRxx77W model that will have integrated ATSC tuner and CableCard support. Unfortunately, the HLRxx77W will not have the DVI and PC/VGA inputs of the HLPxx74W.
  1. Comments by Akastp (CES Member)
  2. HL-R4677 and HL-R5677 appearing on Samsung web site right now.
    46" Model...
    http://product.samsung.com/cgi-bin/n...LR4677WX%2fXAA
    56" Model...
    http://product.samsung.com/cgi-bin/n...LR5677WX%2fXAA
    Info is coming and going so someone must be working on the page in "live" mode.
  3. Brochures available...
    46" Model...
    http://product.samsung.com/SamsungUS...18/hlr4677.pdf
    56" Model...
    http://product.samsung.com/SamsungUS...18/hlr5677.pdf
9. Can the 68 series or 88 series 1080p sets accept a 1080p signal via the HDMI input? The general feeling is that the answer is NO ... but, did anyone ask this specific question?
  1. Comments By HTwaits (AVS Member)
  2. My understanding is that all of the 2005 batch of 1080p HDTV sets have 1080i input capability but not 1080p input capability.
  3. I also have the impression that HD DVD players only output 1080i.
  4. If I remember correctly, de-interlacing directly from 1080i to 1080p should give a very "true to the source" image unless a manufacturer de-interlaces 1080i to 520p instead of 1080p. I think scaling from 520p to 1080p would probably degrade the image.
  5. Comments By Kyungkim (CES Attendee)
  6. Yes I asked this specifically and got the reply that it does not, due to hdcp requirements. This has been pointed out to be bubkus, hdcp does not limit rez.
  7. I asked this question at a number of mfg planning 1080p sets and the most telling came from sony. They said they do not support 1080p (in) since no consumer device is capable of outputing a true 1080p signal. Even the blu ray players sold in japan only output 1080i.
  8. So im not holding my breadth on the digital side of the 1080p input on this generation, i dont think they will be capable of it. Im 99.99 percent positive the hdmi ports will not support 1080p from talking to the reps.
  9. Im holding out against hope that the vga input hasnt been crippled. I know everyone wants digital, but rgb has been the way that g90 projectors have been fed with 1080p for years, so im sure it wont be so awful.
  10. Comments by Richard Paul (CES Attendee)
  11. The Samsung representatives at CES said that the HDMI input wouldn't accept 1080p. Also there is no roadblock but as far as I know no manufacturer has yet to make HDMI chips that can process 1080p. Most likely because none of the CE manufacturers decided to spend the extra money for 1080p HDMI chips.
  12. Comments by UCSB (AVSforum Member)
  13. Today, 01-18-2005, Administrator recieved direct confirmation from Samsung that 1080p will NOT be offered as an input resolution. But, the digital conversion will go DIRECTLY from 1080i to 1080p (avoiding some other less optimal approaches). (Administrators Original Post: POST)
10. Is there a center channel speaker shelf on the 67, 68, or 78 series cabinets? There has been a general feeling in the discussions of this topic that the 67, 68, and 78 series do not have a center channel shelf.

None of the 2005 models have a center channel speaker shelf.
  1. Comment By Tetsujinwave (CES Attendee):
    There isn't enough room for a center channel on top of the 68 and 78 sets, from what I saw in the Samsung area. The back tapers from the bottom to the top--there really isn't a lot of room there for anything, much less a center channel speaker.
11. Does stepping up to 1080p affect the optimum screen size and/or my viewing distance?

In general, stepping up to 1080p will allow you view the HDTV from a closer minimum viewing distance than 720p. This will allow you to either move closer or step up to a larger monitor at your current viewing distance.
  1. Comments by schaffer970 (AVSforum Member) (Excellent link on 1080p and 720p viewing distance)
  2. Here is a rather technical article on what you can actually see and how far away you can see it: HDTV and the Resolving Power of the Eye. Basically it says that for HDTV 3 X screen height.
  3. Comments by millerwill (AVSforum Member)
  4. My 1.5xdiagonal as the optimum viewing distance for the 'full hd big screen effect' does come from the reference schaffer970 cites. Since the height of a 9x16 screen is about 0.5 of the diagonal [9/sqrt(337) = 0.49], 3 times the screen ht is ~ 1.5 x diagonal. I agree that this seems awfully close, and I would interpret it to be the CLOSEST one could possibly sit; and with a 720p set one would likely begin to see artifacts at this distance. With my hlp6163 I sit about 10 ft away, i.e., 2xdiag, and will probably stay at about this same distance with the hlr6768 I'm planning on; so this would make my factor 120/67 = 1.8; if I scoot up a ft it becomes 108/67 = 1.6, getting close to the minimum. [If I were to stay at 10 ft away, and were to get a screen that came to the minimal factor of 1.5, I could go up to a screen size of 80 "!
12. When designing my room layout are there any restrictions on the placement of my DLP HDTV?
  1. Comments by UCSB (AVSforum Member)
    DLP HDTV's have excellent horizontal viewing angles. I have not looked this stat up, but perhaps 160 degrees. But, they have rather restricted vertical viewing angles. I don't have a stat on this at this point in time, but think small, perhaps 15 degrees. What this means is you will get your best picture when you are viewing the set from approximately screen height (or from just under the screen height). Place the HDTV to high, say above a fireplace in a smaller room, and your picture quality could be very poor. Picture quality drops off the further below the TV the viewer becomes.
    ADDED LATER: I've been doing a little more planning on my upgrade. Specifically, I have been analyzing vertical viewing angles. The link below is a smaller version of a larger 125MB file (9216 pixel wide). There are six screen shots in the photo. In the original each screen shot is 7.1 MP image and is 3072x2304, shot with a Canon S70 using a Samsung HLN467W. The screen shots show various distances below center line on the screen in degrees. From left to right across the top row is 0 degrees, -5, -10. On the bottom row from left to right is -15, -20, - 23 degrees.

    Viewing angle analysis photo: CLICK HERE

    I'm still analyzing the data, but there is a consistent change is the picture from 0 to 23 degrees. Even in the 0 to 5 degrees below center line there is a noticable difference. I'll get my ideas together and comment more on this later, but one thing is for sure ... the vertical viewing angle is very sensitive to small changes. Look at the black title bar in the lower part of the screen and notice how it consistently lightens with each change in angle.
13. Some HLP owners have reported smudge problems on two layer viewing screens, has this problem been resolved with the screen material and designs being used on the 2005 models?
  1. Comments by Administrator (AVSforum Member)
  2. Steve P. of Samsung says that this is a manufacturing problem and it will be resolved. His entire answer can be found in this post by Administrator POST.
14. Is the CableCard tuner a dual tuner model? Is it capable of PIP? Is the CableCard Tuner a second generation model capable of two way communications to support services like VOD (video on demand)??
  1. Comments by Administrator (AVSforum Member)
  2. Steve P. of Samsung says that the CableCard tuner in the new DLPs will not be one of the new second generation models. His entire answer can be found in this post by Administrator POST.
  3. Comments by UCSB (AVSforum Member)
  4. We have not found any evidence that PIP will be supported or that the model will be a dual tuner setup. All new Samsung plasmas and DLPs supporting do not support PIP and are single tuner CableCard setups.
15. What are the stand part numbers and dimensions for the available Samsung stands?
  1. --Stand Part-- --For:-- --Dims(WxDxH)--
    TR4266X/XAA --HL-R4266W --39.5 x 17.8 x 19
    TR46X3X/XAA --4667 --43 x 17.8 x 19
    TR46L5SX/XAA --4677 --40.6 x 21.9 x 19.9
    TR46X3X/XAA --5067/5078 --46.5 x 17.8 x 19
    TR46X3X/XAA --5667 --52.4 x 17.8 x 19
    TR46X3X/XAA --5688/5678 --52.5 x 17.8 x 19
    TR56L5SX/XAA --5677 --49.9 x 21.9 x 19.9
    TR61X2X/XAA --6167/6168/6178 --56.9 x 17.8 x 17

    TR85X/XAA --HL-R5087W/HL-R5688W --59.6 x 20.2 x 21.8
    TR61X2X/XAA --HL-R6768W --62.4 x 17.8 x 17
16. Is there any information about the differences between the HD3 / xHD3 generation chips and HD4 / xHD4 generation chips?
  1. Comments by Schaffer970 (AVSforum Member)
    I have spent countless hours scouring the internet trying to figure out what the chip scheme is that TI is/will be using. Just lately things have fallen in place for me and I think I have it figured out (of course all of this may be BS too). The most recent developments in chip technologies made by TI are something called Fast Track Pixel (FTP) and DarkChip3. FTP actually changes the chip architecture (there is one less layer and the chip is easier to manufacture, see attachment) while DarkChip3, as I understand it, adds a coating to minimize light scattering from within the chip (I am not completely sure where FTP stops and DarkChip3 starts but it really doesn't matter). What this all results in, is that the HD4 chip is a HD3 chip with FTP/DarkChip3 and the xHD4 is xHD3 with FTP/DarkChip3. I believe that for at least this year, the only new chips we will see will be the wobbulated HD4/xHD4. It would not surprise me to see a non-wobbulated chip in 2006.

    I believe the naming scheme that TI seems to have settled on is the chip diagonal size followed by 720p, 1080p or some other designation such as XGA. So far we have .55 XGA, .8 720p (in the SIM2 HT300E), and rumors of .85 1080p.

    In the mean time, the sets that Samsung is putting out seem to continue to have the existing HD2+ or HD3 chips in them with the inputs updated. Hopefully things will become clear as to when we will see the new chips over the next couple of months (look for the inclusion of DarkChip3 in info from Samsung).

    Chip Diagram: Fast Track Pixel - FTP
17. Will 1080p be supported on the component video inputs on the 1080p units?
  1. Comment by BruiserG (New AVSforum Member)
    The new 1080p products launcing this summer will NOT accept 1080p via DVI, HDMI or Analog Component Video. (See this post for more info POST).
  2. NOTE by UCSB - As far as we know there will not be a DVI input on the 1080p sets, so you might want to disregard that part of the above statement.
18. What information is available on the video processing chips in the new HLRxxxxW models?
  1. Links supplied by Schaffer970 (AVSforum Member)
    Schaffer970's careful inspection of a FCC certification filing found that the new HDTV's are using these chips:
    1080p Video Processing: Genesis GM1601 -- Spec Sheet
    720p Video Processing: Genesis GM1501
19. How do you remove the pedestal base on the HLR series tabletop units?
  1. Comments supplied by LostGator (AVSforum Member)
    Ok, after looking at removing the base a little more, I finally got it. Basically, remove the 2 screws on the back of the unit which hold the base on (you'll see what I mean when you see it). Push down the two tabs on the base until you hear a click or can see they're free of the main unit. Gently tap the the base from the front. This will push the base toward the back and it will just slide off. Even easier than the HLP's 10 screws, once you know how to do it.
20. What cables are required to connect your personal computer to the VGA/PC input on a Samsung HDTV?
  1. Text by UCSB, Technical Solution supplied by Schaffer970 & FlySaab (AVS Members)
    Samsung HDTVs have a VGA/PC input that can be used to connect a personal computer to the TV. This input is an analog input. The cable that you will require will need to have a VGA connector on the HDTV end. On the computer end of the cable you will have two options. The option that you select will depend on the type of output you want to use on your computer's video card. Video cards have two types of outputs: VGA and DVI.

    If you want to use the VGA output on your video card, then you will have to get a standard VGA to VGA monitor cable.

    If you want to use a DVI connector on your video card then the situation is a little more complicated. You will need to determine if the DVI output on the video card is a DVI-I output with analog support. Here is an excellent description of how you can determine if you have a DVI-I (digital and analog support) or DVI-D (digital only) connector: CLICK HERE. If you have a DVI-I connector AND your video card supports analog output through the DVI-I connector, then you can use the DVI output to connect to the HDTV. In that case you will need a cable with a DVI-A connector on the computer end and a VGA connector on the HDTV end.

    You should also check that your video card will support the resolution that you want to use (1280x720 for 720p, 1920x1080 for 1080p) and that you have enough memory on your video card to support your planned configuration.

    For further information check this post: CLICK HERE



RELATED PRODUCTS:

HD DVD PLAYERS:
DVD-HD950 ($250, May 2005), DVD-HD840 ($199, March 2005), DVD-V9500
LINK: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...light=dvdhd950
PHOTO: DVD-HD950

AV RECEIVER:
AV-R3000 - 7.1 Channel, All Digital Receiver ($4,999, May 2005)
LINK: http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...71#post4939571
LINK (includes photo): http://www.audioholics.com/ces/CESpr...HXreceiver.php

PLASMA:
HPR5072 - 50 Plasma HDTV (April 2005, $6,999) PHOTO
http://www.samsung.com/PressCenter/P...105_0000089656

CRT:
30" Thin Profile CRT http://ultimateavmag.com/news/010905ces/



CHANGES TO SPECS:

01-10-2005 11:00 AM - Removed reference to IEEE 1394 input / output from both the series 68 and series 88 specs

01-10-2005 11:00 AM - Added question about black lacquer cases to open questions area

01-10-2005 11:20 AM - Reduced the contrast ratio on the HLR5688W from 10,000:1 to 5,000:1 per Samsung press release - thanks administrator

01-10-2005 11:50 AM - Reduced the number of HDMI inputs on the HLR5087W from 2 to 1 per Samsung press release -thanks administrator

01-10-2005 12:07 PM - Added comment about some models being available in an all black lacquer case

01-10-2005 12:20 PM - Removed question about black lacquer cases, since it was answered by pjr - thanks pjr

01-10-2005 12:20 PM - Added a question covering whether 1080p can be sent to the 68/88 sets via HDMI

01-10-2005 12:20 PM - Added a question covering what computer resolutions are supported on the 1080p sets

01-10-2005 12:20 PM - Added question about computer gaming capabilities on the 68/88 series

01-10-2005 04:45 PM - Added comment about possible chip upgrade between 88 and 68 series

01-10-2005 07:50 PM - Added question about VGA / PC Connector

01-10-2005 11:11 PM - Added 78 series info and photos

01-10-2005 11:11 PM - Modified info on black lacquer case

01-10-2005 11:30 PM - Added VGA/PC input to all units

01-10-2005 11:41 PM - Added Photo Link HLR6168W

01-10-2005 11:50 PM - Added 67 series placecard

01-11-2005 09:30 AM - Added HLR6768W photo

01-11-2005 09:30 AM - Added addition info to video gaming question

01-11-2005 01:30 PM - Updated Info on 78 series and moved to top of 1080p section, added disclaimer about accuracy of information

01-11-2005 08:00 PM - Added TV Guide electronic program guide to all models

01-11-2005 08:20 PM - Added IEEE 1394 info in 1080p area, added new pictures

01-11-2005 09:00 PM - Closed out question about the future of HLPxx74W line; closed out question about additional models in 2005

01-12-2005 12:15 AM - Added open issue about center channel speaker shelf

01-12-2005 10:20 AM - Added several photos, fixed a broken link, text editing

01-12-2005 02:30 PM - Closed out question about HDMI digital video resolutions and posted answer in the closed issues area, plus added info to spec area for all 1080p units

01-12-2005 03:45 PM - Added 1080p vs 720p comparison photo

01-12-2005 11:45 PM - Closed open issue about center channel shelf - none of the 2005 models have one

01-13-2005 12:15 AM - Updated DLP chip info with our latest data

01-13-2005 12:30 AM - Updated text in observations area

01-13-2005 09:00 AM - Added "The Unknown"

01-13-2005 09:20 AM - Added audio differences question between 68 and 78 series

01-13-2005 09:27 AM - Added the MSRP for the 78 series question

01-13-2005 12:45 PM - Created FAQ's section, moved open issues up higher in document

01-13-2005 10:00 PM - Deleted HLR6778W entry, can't confirm that it was a real product

01-13-2005 10:15 PM - Added link to Gemstar TV Guide + Gold DEMO

01-13-2005 10:30 PM - Added a description of AnyNet to the spec's

01-13-2005 11:00 PM - Added HLPxx63W series measurements for comparison

01-13-2005 11:00 PM - Added CableCard open issue

01-14-2005 09:47 AM - Added 3 small photos to display within the post to help people quickly understand the difference between black lacquer and floating screen units

01-14-2005 11:00 AM - Updated IEEE 1394 data based on Kirk@TVauthority's excellent information

01-14-2005 12:05 PM - Added additional 70" series 78 photo

01-14-2005 04:30 PM - Updated status on 50", 70" 78 series; closed open issues on 50"/70" and 78 series MSRP

01-14-2005 07:45 PM - Added an additional comment to the FAQ section indicating that there will be not HDMI 1080p input

01-14-2005 11:00 PM - Closed out the two open issues on 1080p PQ, and DLP chips

01-14-2005 11:00 PM - Create new list of items we will want to test once production sets are released

01-14-2005 11:00 PM - Added viewing screen design issue to problems to check area

01-15-2005 07:40 PM - Added warning about errors in C/Net coverage on video

01-15-2005 11:00 PM - Added new 6168 and 7078 pictures

01-15-2005 11:20 PM - Revised layout and small placeholder photos

01-16-2005 10:00 AM - Updated layout and organized text better

01-17-2005 09:00 AM - Added first pedestal model photo - great photo

01-18-2005 01:15 PM - Added link to additional 1080p screen shots and technical info in series 78 section

01-18-2005 02:00 PM - Updated HDMI digital input specs to indicate that 1080p resolution will NOT be offered on 1080p series 68,78, 88

01-18-2005 02:00 PM - Added comments to 1080p input section

01-18-2005 02:10 PM - Change lead in comments on 68 and 78 series to indicate that the internals are the same on both the 68 and 78 series

01-18-2005 02:15 PM - Added a comment about HLPxx74W series production ending in March or April

01-18-2005 03:30 PM - Updated copy per suggestions --- if any other changes or corrections need to be made --- please PM me

01-18-2005 08:45 PM - Added HiRes photos, Samsung press release link

01-18-2005 09:15 PM - Added LoRes previews of HiRes photos

01-18-2005 09:15 PM - Raised guess price on HLR5078W

01-19-2005 10:00 PM - Added additional photos to 68, 67, 87, 88 series

01-19-2005 10:30 PM - New POST photos of 5087 and 5688, plus fixed link to administrators comments in FAQ #9

01-20-2005 04:50 PM - Added additional photos and placecards from gotHDTV

01-20-2005 06:00 PM - Added FAQ # 12

01-20-2005 06:15 PM - Added FAQ # 13

01-21-2005 10:00 AM - Removed stock Samsung photos from some screen sizes after determining the photos were not of those screen sizes

01-21-2005 05:30 PM - Replaced 6768 Photo #1 with a better version

01-22-2005 11:45 AM - Added PR $6,999 price note back in for 67" 68 series

01-22-2005 06:20 PM - Updated Photo #7 in 7078 with higher quality image

01-23-2005 05:45 PM - Added addition information to FAQ #13, including a viewing angle photo

01-25-2005 11:00 AM - Added Photo #8 to 7078 photo area

01-26-2005 03:25 PM - Added Photo #9 to 7078 photo area

01-26-2005 03:35 PM - Moved release date for 87/88 series to Apr 2005

01-30-2005 11:50 PM - Removed all white text from post, AVS white users can now use FAQs without a problem

01-31-2005 10:00 AM - Added photo #10, 70" 78 series

01-31-2005 11:20 AM - Added photo #11, 70" 78 series

01-31-2005 12:40 PM - Added photo #12, 70" 78 series

02-05-2005 10:30 PM - Replaced several 78 series photos with higher resolution versions

02-05-2005 10:40 PM - Added a new photo to 6168 photo section

02-05-2005 10:45 PM - Added a new photo to 7078 photo section

02-07-2005 06:00 PM - Added photo #8 to 6168 photo section

02-07-2005 06:15 PM - Added technical drawing links to the measurements sections of 67, 68, 78 series

02-08-2005 01:45 PM - Fixed HRLxxxxW typo ... now HLRxxxxW

02-08-2005 08:20 PM - Added Photo #9 in 6168 section

02-11-2005 10:15 AM - Added Photo #10 in 6168 section

02-11-2005 10:30 AM - Replaced Photo #4 in 7078 section with larger, clearer version

02-15-2005 02:15 PM - Added 1080p component video and 1080p tuner questions to open issues area

02-16-2005 12:50 PM - Confirmed xHD3 in HLR5688W, updated specs

02-16-2005 01:00 PM - Added TI DLP Brochure in Series 78 section

02-16-2005 02:00 PM - Added TI DLP Presentation in Series 78 section

02-17-2005 09:40 PM - Begin creating the HiRes photo area added 5078, 5678

02-20-2005 09:30 PM - Added 6168 HiRes sample, removed 6768 photo in from of FAQ's

02-22-2005 02:30 PM - Added the smudged screen issue resolution as item #14 in FAQ section

02-22-3005 02:35 PM - Added update about Samsung POSSIBLY not producing the Series 78 product line and going with the Series 68 line alone

02-22-2005 03:00 PM - Added the CableCard issue resolution as item #15 in the FAQ section

02-23-2005 07:00 PM - Added link to high resolution gallery

02-25-2005 10:45 AM - Revised Series 67 release dates to mid MAY

03-01-2005 06:33 PM - Removed TV Guide needs to be confirmed from Series 67, it has been confirmed

03-08-2005 10:00 AM - Added question about 1080p over 1394 to open issues area

03-10-2005 07:45 PM - Added photo of the back of a HLR4667W to 67 Series section

03-10-2005 07:45 PM - Added link to HLR4667W preliminary manual

03-11-2005 09:30 PM - Updated 67 manual link and description associated with BACK photos

03-11-2005 09:30 PM - Increased the number of S-Video and composite inputs on the 67 series to 3 each

03-18-2005 12:21 PM - Updated FAQ #9 to indicate the production of HLRxx77W

03-21-2005 10:30 PM - Add measurements for all units, added HLRxx67W final owners manual link, add FAQ #16 with all stand dimensions

03-24-2005 12:15 AM - Added HLR4266W to 67 series section ... this is a new 42" model

03-24-2005 12:15 AM - Added digital audio output (optical) to all NEW units with CableCard (not 77 series)

03-24-2005 12:30 AM - Added weight in lbs. for the 67 series units, data taken from owners manual

03-24-2005 12:45 AM - Added 77 series units to the 720p section

03-24-2005 12:45 AM - Changed the release dates for the 67 series to mid APRIL, changed the release date for the 87 series to mid APRIL

03-24-2005 08:00 AM - Corrected 77 series pricing

03-24-2005 08:10 AM - Added HLR4266W manual to 67 series area; also added weight to specs area

03-24-2005 08:30 AM - Added preliminary spec sheet links for 67 / 87 series

03-24-2005 09:00 AM - Added FAQ #17 covering chip technology updates

03-25-2005 03:30 PM - Noted in 67 series section that HLR4266W does not have CableCard or TV Guide

03-25-2005 06:30 PM - Removed HLR4266W CableCard and TV Guide statments, they are actually included with the unit

03-26-2005 10:30 AM - Removed the tentative comments from HLR5078W and HLR7078W models in the 78 series section - this is based on Samsung continuing include these models in dealer communications

03-26-2005 09:00 PM - Added more detail to 77 series specs

03-26-2005 11:45 PM - Removed "What we don't know" question about dimensions ... we have them now. Also, removed FAQ about dimensions.

04-02-2005 10:45 PM - Added FAQ #17, there will be no 1080p component video input on new 1080p units

04-02-2005 10:45 PM - Removed open question on 1080p component video input

04-02-2005 11:15 PM - Added HLR5688W preliminary manual to 88 series section ... this is the first 1080p manual

04-05-2005 02:45 PM - Clarified that 1920x1080 @ 60 Hz will be supported on the PC/VGA input on the 1080p models

04-07-2005 10:45 AM - Reset 67 series release date to mid May

04-08-2005 10:30 PM - Updated 67 Series contrast ratio to read up to 2500:1

04-08-2005 10:30 PM - Add link to Samsung HLRxx67W Series brochure ... excellent

04-09-2005 09:00 AM - Confirmed HD4 in HLRxx67W series

04-09-2005 10:00 AM - Added SamsungUSA.com link for HLR4266W

04-11-2005 10:30 PM - Added HLRxx87W owners manual to 87 series section

04-11-2005 10:30 PM - Added a possible new model HLR5687W to the 87 series section

04-11-2005 11:00 PM - Added FAQ #18 about video processing chips

04-19-2005 03:00 PM - Added comment to 67 CR spec indicating confusion over 2000:1 or 2500:1 --- RESET IT BACK TO 2500:1

04-25-2005 09:00 PM - Added HLRxx67W Quick Reference Guide

04-25-2005 09:30 PM - Added open issue / question about customer firmware updates to "What we don't know yet:" section.

04-29-2005 09:30 AM - Revised 5688 price and delivery date; Revised 5087 price and delivery date

04-29-2005 09:45 AM - Reviese 68 / 78 series pricing and delivery dates

04-29-2005 10:00 AM - Revised Cinema Smooth Generation Light Engine spec from gen 5 to gen 6 on 68/78 series

04-29-2005 10:15 AM - Added dynamic black comment to 68 / 78 / 88 series

04-29-2005 10:20 AM - Added HES press release to top of POST

04-29-2005 10:30 AM - Updated 88 / 87 series specs

04-29-2005 07:45 PM - Added Photo of rear inputs on 68 / 78 series

04-29-2005 11:00 PM - Added 7178, deleted 7078 model

04-29-2005 11:15 PM - Added comment to 1080p intro stating that the internal components of the 68, 78, 88 series are all equivalent

05-02-2005 10:00 PM - Removed text discussing possible non-production of 78 series ... we now know it will be released

05-02-2005 10:00 PM - Simplified PC support question under information that we don't know

05-03-2005 08:30 AM - Revised 67 series availability to first week in May

05-09-2005 10:00 AM - Created a separate 720p Owner's Thread

05-12-2005 09:24 AM - Revised 78 series pricing

05-13-2005 10:00 AM - No VGA/PC, 1394 on HLRxx87W

05-16-2005 11:50 AM - Added link to Samsung.com to 67 series area

05-24-2005 08:30 AM - Added reminder to check the HDMI input on 68, 78, 88 series for 1080p support

05-24-2005 09:45 AM - Updated HLR5688W availability to June

05-24-2005 07:20 PM - Added comment to top of 720p section indicating that all 2005 models are shipping and discussing 2003, 2004 models

05-24-2005 07:45 PM - Added links to SamsungUSA.com in the 77, 87 series areas

05-24-2005 08:00 PM - Added DLP Chip Operation area to each model line

05-24-2005 08:30 PM - Added links to 78 series spec sheets at the top of the 78 series area, excellent doc

05-24-2005 08:40 PM - Changed all 1080p contrast ratio specs to read 'up to 10,000:1'

05-24-2005 09:00 PM - Added brightness spec to 78 series section

05-24-2005 09:15 PM - Updated 78 series dimensions

05-24-2005 09:25 PM - Revised 68 series dimensions

05-24-2005 09:35 PM - Added lamp specs to series 78 section

05-25-2005 10:25 AM - Added brightness and lamp specs to 68 series section

05-26-2005 04:00 PM - Added standard TI chip descriptions in the form (.xx" xxxxp) format

05-26-2005 04:00 PM - Added DLP Chip Note to 87 series section describing the HD2++

05-26-2005 07:45 PM - Confirmed 2500:1 contrast ratio on HLRxx87W

05-26-2005 08:30 PM - Added a link to owners thread in 87 series section

05-26-2005 08:45 PM - Added a link to owners thread in 67 series section

05-27-2005 01:00 AM - HLR4266W spec differences from HLRxx67W models are listed in the 67 series section

05-31-2005 08:30 AM - Confirmed HD2+ in 5087, closed out open issue about DLP chip in unit and updated text in 87 series area

06-01-2005 11:45 AM - Added brightness and lamps specs to the 67 series area

06-01-2005 12:00 PM - Added FAQ #18, instructions for removing the pedestal base from tabletop models

06-06-2005 11:30 AM - Added technical drawings for 67, 68, 78, 87 series, great for installation planning

06-11-2005 06:00 PM - Added two questions to the "tests we will want to make after systems are available" area.

06-14-2005 03:15 PM - Added 68 series spec sheets

06-14-2005 03:20 PM - Removed estimated from 6768 lamp spec, it will be using the 132/120 lamp

06-14-2005 03-25 PM - Updated 6768 brightness spec to 550

06-14-2005 03:45 PM - Added a question about DVD players (to upshift or not) to our items that we will want to test

06-15-2005 05:30 AM - Revised 68, 78 release dates to July

06-18-2005 12:45 AM - Added power consumption specs to all models.

06-19-2005 01:45 PM - Updated the HLR4266W specifications

06-20-2005 11:51 PM - Added Canadian Models ONLY section

06-22-2005 08:30 AM - Updated Canadian Models based on input from Canadian AVS member

06-23-2005 11:30 AM - Added FAQ #20, Cabling to connect HDTV to Personal Computer

06-24-2005 09:15 AM - Updated Canadian Specs

06-24-2005 04:00 PM - Added HLRxx78W series OWNERS MANUAL to 78 series section

06-24-2005 05:00 PM - Added HLR5688 online OWNERS MANUAL to 88 series section

06-24-2005 09:30 PM - Added HLR5688 pdf OWNERS MANUAL to 88 series section

06/25/2005 09:15 PM - Updated VGA/PC spec on HLRxx64W's

07/01/2005 12:15 PM - Updated HLR5688W due date to July

07/04/2005 10:45 AM - Added question #5 about DNIe to open questions

07/05/2005 10:45 AM - Added question #6 about multichannel HDMI audio to open questions

07/05/2005 12:15 PM - Added question #8 about input labels to the thing we want to test section

07/05/2005 01:00 PM - Added HLRxx68W owners manual to 68 series section

07/08/2005 03:00 PM - Added question #9 to items we want to test area, covers 1:1 pixel mapping from computer

07/11/2005 09:00 AM - Added 68 series brochure and created new measurements area for TV without base is 68 series area

07/11/2005 09:00 AM - Added 78 series brochure and created new measurements area for TV without base is 78 series area

07/14/2005 09:45 PM - Added a link to photos of internal components in 68 / 78 series.

07/15/2005 09:30 AM - Added 87 / 88 Spec Sheets

07/16/2005 12:30 AM - Created a separate 1080p Owner's Thread

08/09/2005 11:00 AM - Marked HLR4677W as discontinued

10/06/2005 11:00 AM - Updated HLR7178W release date

10/08/2005 01:45 PM - Updated HLR7178W screen & release date

> Bill
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post #2 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 12:00 PM
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Well, let the debate begin on what chips are really being used in the various dlp sets. There was discussion early on about a page on the Carl Zeiss site that referenced a xHD4 chip. I was looking around there again today and there is a pdf file Zeiss that has a description of their DLP Optical Modules for Projection TV (last page on the right). The description is Best xHD3/xHD4, High Demand HD2/HD2+ and Cost-Effective HD3/HD4. The x chips are listed as 1080p, DVE, Smooth-Picture and Dynamic Black. It is apparent that there really is a xHD4/HD4 chip. What they consist of I have no idea.
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post #3 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 12:25 PM - Thread Starter
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It does seem like there is a new 1080p chip that goes beyond the xHD3. The xHD3 was spec'd with a contrast ratio of 5000:1 and now the new models appear with a contrast ratio of 10,000:1. Plus TI had an additional year to make improvements. The 720p HD3 chips had contrast ratio's of around 1,500:1. If someone at the show could report the contrast ratio's on the new HLRxx67W series units, that would give us an idea if the HD3 had been upgraded / replaced. Below is a press release from Optoma, but basically it says they are using a new HD4 in their 720p units and it has contrast ratio of 2,500:1. I'll bet the new Samsung DLP's have a contrast ratio of 2,500:1 and are using the HD4. If there is new technology in the HD3 yielding an HD4, then certainly they had to integrate this new technology into the xHD3. This would give us something like a xHD4.

Another tip ... Samsung is assuring show attendees, that they are using the latest techology.


===================

Optoma Showcases First Rear Projection HDTV Featuring the Latest HD4 DLP and DarkChip3 Technology from
Texas Instruments

First public display of new digital projection technology from Texas Instruments, the HD504 delivers an astounding 2500:1 contrast ratio and film quality HD image

LAS VEGAS, CES, Jan. 6, 2005 - Optoma Technology, Inc. is raising the bar in the HDTV market by being the first company to introduce rear projection High Definition displays with the newest HD4 DLP and DarkChip3 technology from Texas Instruments. With the introduction of several pioneering solutions for home theater aficionados, including digital projectors, plasma and rear projection TVs, and video scalers, Optoma is sure to make a big splash at the show. Optoma is exhibiting at the Consumer Electronics Show (CES) in Las Vegas (January 6-9, 2005), at the Optoma booth located in the South Hall section 1, #20538.

CES represents the first public technology demonstration of the latest HD4 DLP, DarkChip3, and SmoothPicture technology from Texas Instruments, delivering the world's finest HDTV projection images to date. The HD504 projects a superior 2500:1 contrast ratio with a native resolution of 720p for a film-quality HD image, on a non-reflective, fine-grade screen. The latest technology available from Texas Instruments achieves both higher brightness and deeper black levels by filling in the area where the digital micro mirror connects to its hinge - the so-called dimple. In addition the gap between the mirrors has been further reduced and the backing to the mirrors has become more light absorbent.

The HD504 measures only 14.8-inches deep and weighs only 90 pounds.

> Bill
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post #4 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 12:50 PM - Thread Starter
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If someone at the show could take a close look at the image on the 50" 720p pedestal model and tell us if the unit has distinct pixels (like HD2+ models) or the wobulation effect like HD3 models of the past, it would be useful in understanding if the HD2+ is continuing in this model. If wobulation is present, then they have switched in a HD4.

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post #5 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 01:10 PM - Thread Starter
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This non-production 70" photo gives you some idea of the cosmetics of the new models:


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post #6 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 01:21 PM - Thread Starter
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OK ... here is another photo ... what is going on? We seem to be getting photos of two different cosmetic versions. One with the monitor floating above the pedestal and the other with more of a single unit appearance. This is a 56" set.


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post #7 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:17 PM
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pic of the 61in floating model with matte bezel. again the ones with the shiny bezels are the "upscale" models. Guts are completly identical.
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post #8 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:20 PM
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close up of the "floating" screen.
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post #9 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:24 PM
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comparison pics between 720p n 1080p. cant really tell much, but here they are.
Most were still images.
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post #10 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:26 PM
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How was dithering on these sets?
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post #11 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:28 PM
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with some pc source material, this was where i could really see the lower sse on the new sets.
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post #12 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:35 PM - Thread Starter
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The 1080p unit is being compared to a 720p set in black. Is black going to be an option (or standard) for the 720p case?

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post #13 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:37 PM - Thread Starter
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Did the computer graphics look clear and stable on the 1080p set?

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post #14 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:38 PM
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There is already a thread about Samsung at CES that has discussion of their new release philosophy and more related info.
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post #15 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:42 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by kyungkim
with some pc source material, this was where i could really see the lower sse on the new sets.

Was the PC resolution 1080p on the 1080p set?
Thanks,
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post #16 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 02:48 PM
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I am wondering if it handel 1920x1080p or did they have to do something to get it working

Also how was teh rainbow effect on its, was is noticable.

thanks
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post #17 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 03:01 PM
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They couldnt tell me the pc resolution on the 1080p set. You can tell from the photos that the resolution is higher on the 1080p, since all the materials appear smaller.

This brings us to point number one with these 1080p guys.
No one could tell me if the new sets can take a 1080p signal from the outside. This isnt only a samsung problem. I asked at every mfg of 1080p tvs and all of them confirmed at least the on the digital side, they were cut off from taking a 1080p signal. Only hope is for the vga/rgb input on the samsung and panasonic. Neither of which could confirm whether or not the vga inputs were confined to a lower pc resolution.

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Quote:


Originally posted by kyungkim
This isnt only a samsung problem. I asked at every mfg of 1080p tvs and all of them confirmed at least the on the digital side, they were cut off from taking a 1080p signal.

K

Thanks K for all yor work on this topic.

This is to bad as I was hoping for a 1080p DVI input and use as my primary computer monitor.

This really SUCKS!!!!!

I wonder if it has anything to do with the studios. I really hope not.

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post #19 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 03:34 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by kyungkim
This brings us to point number one with these 1080p guys.
No one could tell me if the new sets can take a 1080p signal from the outside. This isnt only a samsung problem. I asked at every mfg of 1080p tvs and all of them confirmed at least the on the digital side, they were cut off from taking a 1080p signal. Only hope is for the vga/rgb input on the samsung and panasonic. Neither of which could confirm whether or not the vga inputs were confined to a lower pc resolution.

The reason that 1080p is not accepted by HDMI inputs is because all the HDMI chips currently being made only go up to 1080i. Because of this the Sharp 45" LCD could accept 1080p through the DVI input but couldn't accept it through the HDMI input. It will probably take another year or two before a manufacturer decides that the market is large enough to make HDMI chips that can go up to 1080p. Also the HDMI specs do allow 1080p at 60 fps and that includes up to 36 Mbps of PCM audio (8 channels at 24-bit/192-kHz).
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post #20 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 03:37 PM
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I only want DVI for my computer.
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post #21 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 04:03 PM
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Yup, hdcp is capped at a 1080i. The studios sticking it to us again.
RGB has more than enuff bandwidth for 1080p, front pjs have been using this for yrs. So native 1080p could still be possible, if samsung does this right.
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post #22 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 04:14 PM
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I read a while back about the HD3 chip using "wobbling" to achieve 1080i. I was wondering if this is the case with the chips Samsung is putting in these sets (since we don't have a real name to call them yet) to achieve 1080p? Do the chips in these new units actually have enough mirrors to natively do 1920x1080? Sorry if this is redundant, just curious.

I understand there is a fundemental argument over which devices are "REAL" HD devices. Presonally, I'm fine with techniques like wobble as long as there is no perceivable difference. Or better put, if it can display 1080p (good luck finding a source until blu-ray and hd-dvd) and keep up with the big boys for cheaper, then right on.


Cheers,
-Brian
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post #23 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 04:55 PM - Thread Starter
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Cokecan ... you bring up a good point. TI uses 960x1080 chips and each mirror handles two pixels. The topic has been extensively discussed since their introduction about a year ago (720p chips at the time). In the 720p arena, I think people thought that the picture produced was more film like without the screen door effect of prior DLP chips. But, some felt that this lead to a softer picture. For that reason, many perferred the 1280x720 HD2+ chip. Which generated a sharper image.

To bring that discussion up-to-date, I guess we would need to see if the current chips have made any progress in the sharpness and definition area.

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post #24 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 05:40 PM
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Some more notes on pq here, good and bad.

The compter graphics display was very impressive, stable and not "flickery". No hints of the wobulation effect.

These guys retain that very digital, dlp look. False contouring or clay facing was a bit noticeable up close. But at proper viewing distances, this really shouldnt be a problem.

Sammie dlps have always been finicky with what you feed it. I think its gonna count triple with these 1080p's. The source for the demos was a shared voom feed, prob split about a 100 times. It wasnt the best and it really showed on these sets.

Some of the artifcats i saw was the aformentioned false countouring and a bit of ringining. I'd imagine a hdmi source fed 1080i would look much better than what was on display. In fact, some of the other 1080p sammies shown in other areas of CES did look different if not a bit better than the rows in the main room.

I mentioned this before, but blacks were very very impressive on the new sammies. Im very intrested in watching some dark material on this guy to really check out how it handles shadow detail.

K
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post #25 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 05:51 PM
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Quote:


Originally posted by kyungkim
Yup, hdcp is capped at a 1080i. The studios sticking it to us again.

HDCP only encrypts the data and does not reduce the available bandwidth. In fact the DVI input on the 45" Sharp LCD is HDCP compliant and can go up to 1080p at 60 Hz. There is no resolution cap on HDCP connections though there is worry that component video output will be downconverted to 480p for Blu-ray and HD-DVD.
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post #26 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 06:20 PM
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Richard, i belive you're right.
The hdmi dvi ports are more than capable of handling the badnwidth. But the sony rep said for the port to be "compliant with hdcp" they could not accept a resolution through those ports at anything greater than 1080i. I hope he is wrong and they can infact take in unecncrypted 1080p via hdmi.

Didnt see this posted, but heres the placcard on the 56in model.

K
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post #27 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 06:30 PM
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What purpose would it serve in selling a 1080p DLP that cannot take a direct 1080p signal over HDMI??


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post #28 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 06:45 PM
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From what I have read the HDMI/DVI ports can just barely handle 1080p, they can easily handle 1080i (under what is called single link, double link can handle a much higher resolution). There is an article on Toms Hardware that discusses this in great detail with regard to video cards - but never comes out and says whether 1920x1080p really works all of the time. Link: http://graphics.tomshardware.com/gra...129/index.html
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post #29 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 06:51 PM
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check out: graphics.tomshardware.com/graphic/20041129/tft_connection-06.html (excerpt from the above articel)

Not bad reading..

The problems isn't that DVI can't handle it -- but most DVI is single link and not dual-link. Not sure what the HDMI spec says, but I'm off to read that next. Standard DVI tops out around 1920x1200, according to this article.


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post #30 of 6622 Old 01-09-2005, 06:57 PM
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HDMI is a superset of DVI so everything (video wise) DVI can do HDMI can do. Your right, its the single/dual link thing that limits the output. 1920x1080p is right on the edge of what single link can do.
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